[ARCHIVED THREAD] - P320 Discharge to the nuts! (Page 3 of 6)
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Quoted: All you handwavers do know that it's very possible to shoot yourself in a vital place no matter where you carry on-body, right? Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: That's nuts I mean, why not? |
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Quoted: All you handwavers do know that it's very possible to shoot yourself in a vital place no matter where you carry on-body, right? Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: That's nuts Appendix carry is nuts! All you handwavers do know that it's very possible to shoot yourself in a vital place no matter where you carry on-body, right? Yeah but I can live without a leg, I can’t live without my dick. |
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Quoted: Yeah but I can live without a leg, I can’t live without my dick. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: That's nuts Appendix carry is nuts! All you handwavers do know that it's very possible to shoot yourself in a vital place no matter where you carry on-body, right? Yeah but I can live without a leg, I can’t live without my dick. I think we need a third party's opinion on which appendage of yours gets the most use. |
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Quoted: Someone should carry witth the gun pointed upwards at their heads. I mean, why not? Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: That's nuts I mean, why not? Because that would be harder to draw? |
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Quoted: Because that would be harder to draw? Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: That's nuts I mean, why not? |
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Quoted: It’s not that hard to figure out. They should make the triggers stiffer. They should stop listening to dumbass customers. People wanted a striker fired trigger that was lighter with no take-up. SIG gave them a striker fired trigger that is lighter with no take-up by pretty much making a single action striker. But with no safety and SIG USA's world class quality control. The results are quite predictable. And in the end, a stock Glock still has a better feeling trigger, and is much less likely to shoot the guy carrying it. This is what happens when you take the mantra of "the customer is always right" too literally. The fact is the customer is not always right, and sometimes the customer is retarded. THAT is why I like Glock. They build a design that works, and don't listen to customers that want to fuck with it too much. Except for the rumored Gen 6 ideas. That is a case of Glock listening to their customers too much. If I was in charge, I would trash their whole Gen 6 concept. |
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Quoted: I’ve put at least 500 rounds through mine in three years and never had a problem. Quoted: Quoted: Don’t worry, the gaslight squad will be along shortly to explain how this happens all the time with other guns. I’ve put at least 500 rounds through mine in three years and never had a problem. I took the same attitude for a long time. I decided it wasn’t worth it though. Since the p320 has been under the microscope lately I now realize it’s a horrible design. |
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Quoted: Carrying a gun in the first place is all about risk mitigation. Why purposely *add* risk to the equation? Quoted: Quoted: All you handwavers do know that it's very possible to shoot yourself in a vital place no matter where you carry on-body, right? Carrying a gun in the first place is all about risk mitigation. Why purposely *add* risk to the equation? Why carry a gun at all, then? The point is having it if you need it and being able to deploy it in time to make a difference. Why add the risk of carrying with a round chambered? Why add the risk of carrying a gun without a safety? You can go deep into that rabbit hole if that's the way you want to take it. |
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Quoted: If it was the fastest most concealed way to carry, would you? Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: That's nuts I mean, why not? If Tuesday were Thursday, would you marry your cat? Because that question makes just as much sense as yours. |
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Quoted: Why carry a gun at all, then? The point is having it if you need it and being able to deploy it in time to make a difference. Why add the risk of carrying with a round chambered? Why add the risk of carrying a gun without a safety? You can go deep into that rabbit hole if that's the way you want to take it. Agreed, but as you well know, some risks are more acceptable than others to attain the desired end state. Just too much can go wrong with appendix carry when people get in a hurry or get careless IMO. Not trying to convert anyone or win hearts and minds, just stating my preference.. especially when the hardware itself exacerbates the risk rather than mitigating it. |
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Quoted: I bought a bunch of P320 magazines before the cut-off here thinking I would get around to getting an M17 someday. Yeah, that’s a big NO unless I find one being off loaded for dirt cheap, which might happen if this continues. Quoted: Quoted: I wanted to buy one, but this is exactly why I wont I bought a bunch of P320 magazines before the cut-off here thinking I would get around to getting an M17 someday. Yeah, that’s a big NO unless I find one being off loaded for dirt cheap, which might happen if this continues. Minds well keep them I put up 10 brand new mags on the EE for cheap & not one offer. |
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Quoted: Agreed, but as you well know, some risks are more acceptable than others to attain the desired end state. Just too much can go wrong with appendix carry when people get in a hurry or get careless IMO. Quoted: Quoted: Why carry a gun at all, then? The point is having it if you need it and being able to deploy it in time to make a difference. Why add the risk of carrying with a round chambered? Why add the risk of carrying a gun without a safety? You can go deep into that rabbit hole if that's the way you want to take it. Agreed, but as you well know, some risks are more acceptable than others to attain the desired end state. Just too much can go wrong with appendix carry when people get in a hurry or get careless IMO. Then don't get careless. Think about it. The biggest risk to appendix carry (unless you carry a SIG 320) is when you holster a loaded gun. Now, you MAY be in a rush to UNHOLSTER a gun, but you are never going to be in a rush to holster one. Keep your finger off the trigger, keep your cover garment bunched up chest high with your off hand and look the gun into the holster. Voila. No shooting yourself in the nuts. |
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Quoted: If Tuesday were Thursday, would you marry your cat? Because that question makes just as much sense as yours. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: That's nuts I mean, why not? If where the gun is pointed during normal carry doesn't matter enough to influence position of carry, you would (be willing to) carry with the muzzle pointed upwards and at your brains. There's nothing wrong and almost everything right with not pointing a gun at your junk and the inside of your leg where your femoral artery is. |
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Quoted: Then don't get careless. Think about it. The biggest risk to appendix carry (unless you carry a SIG 320) is when you holster a loaded gun. Now, you MAY be in a rush to UNHOLSTER a gun, but you are never going to be in a rush to holster one. Keep your finger off the trigger, keep your cover garment bunched up chest high with your off hand and look the gun into the holster. Voila. No shooting yourself in the nuts. Everything you say may be true of TECHNIQUE. Bearing in mind this thread is about the P320 woes, now imagine you *do everything right*, bend over to pick up your kid, and the thing smokes your femoral. No appendix carry + no P320 = much less risk for me personally. Again, just participating in the discussion; nobody here's mind would be changed anyway. |
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Quoted: Then don't get careless. Think about it. The biggest risk to appendix carry (unless you carry a SIG 320) is when you holster a loaded gun. Now, you MAY be in a rush to UNHOLSTER a gun, but you are never going to be in a rush to holster one. Keep your finger off the trigger, keep your cover garment bunched up chest high with your off hand and look the gun into the holster. Voila. No shooting yourself in the nuts. Remember if you never get in a car accident you don't need to wear a seat belt...... Just don't get careless.....ya know.... 
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Quoted: You're not the dullest knife in the box, I think you know what I'm asking that for. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: That's nuts I mean, why not? I do. That's why I'm not falling for your Jedi mind tricks. |
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Quoted: Remember if you never get in a car accident you don't need to wear a seat belt...... Just don't get careless.....ya know.... Quoted: Quoted: Then don't get careless. Think about it. The biggest risk to appendix carry (unless you carry a SIG 320) is when you holster a loaded gun. Now, you MAY be in a rush to UNHOLSTER a gun, but you are never going to be in a rush to holster one. Keep your finger off the trigger, keep your cover garment bunched up chest high with your off hand and look the gun into the holster. Voila. No shooting yourself in the nuts. Remember if you never get in a car accident you don't need to wear a seat belt...... Just don't get careless.....ya know.... Stupid analogy. There are shitloads of other cars on the road. The only one reholstering your gun is you. |
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Quoted: Everything you say may be true of TECHNIQUE. Bearing in mind this thread is about the P320 woes, now imagine you *do everything right*, bend over to pick up your kid, and the thing smokes your femoral. No appendix carry + no P320 = much less risk for me personally. Again, just participating in the discussion; nobody here's mind would be changed anyway. Quoted: Quoted: Then don't get careless. Think about it. The biggest risk to appendix carry (unless you carry a SIG 320) is when you holster a loaded gun. Now, you MAY be in a rush to UNHOLSTER a gun, but you are never going to be in a rush to holster one. Keep your finger off the trigger, keep your cover garment bunched up chest high with your off hand and look the gun into the holster. Voila. No shooting yourself in the nuts. Everything you say may be true of TECHNIQUE. Bearing in mind this thread is about the P320 woes, now imagine you *do everything right*, bend over to pick up your kid, and the thing smokes your femoral. No appendix carry + no P320 = much less risk for me personally. Again, just participating in the discussion; nobody here's mind would be changed anyway. The difference between those two is stark, though. The 320's mechanical woes are beyond your control other than not carrying it. Whether you shoot yourself reholstering a loaded gun in an appendix holster is all on you. |
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Quoted: I do. That's why I'm not falling for your Jedi mind tricks. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: That's nuts I mean, why not? If you wouldn't be willing to point the muzzle of the gun at your brains for normal carry because that's not a safe thing to point a gun at under any conditions, you *have* to admit that others are perfectly within their rights to say it's not smart to point your gun at your leg and genitals. You can't seperate the two. Unless you're going to say it's not deadly-dangerous to point your gun at your leg where you reasonably think it can even *nick* your femoral. What are *your* chances of being able to toruniquet your leg if that happens? |
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Quoted: Unless you're going to say it's not deadly-dangerous to point your gun at your leg where you reasonably think it can even *nick* your femoral. What are *your* chances of being able to toruniquet your leg if that happens? If you carry your gun on your hip and pull the trigger unintentionally while reholstering, you can still put a round through your femoral. |
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Quoted: The difference between those two is stark, though. The 320's mechanical woes are beyond your control other than not carrying it. Whether you shoot yourself reholstering a loaded gun in an appendix holster is all on you. I'm not arguing their similarity, I'm arguing their aggregate benefit, which I think you understand. Fifth period debate is over for me though, so I'll leave it at that. I believe I understand your position, as well. |
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Quoted: Stupid analogy. There are shitloads of other cars on the road. The only one reholstering your gun is you. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Then don't get careless. Think about it. The biggest risk to appendix carry (unless you carry a SIG 320) is when you holster a loaded gun. Now, you MAY be in a rush to UNHOLSTER a gun, but you are never going to be in a rush to holster one. Keep your finger off the trigger, keep your cover garment bunched up chest high with your off hand and look the gun into the holster. Voila. No shooting yourself in the nuts. Remember if you never get in a car accident you don't need to wear a seat belt...... Just don't get careless.....ya know.... Stupid analogy. There are shitloads of other cars on the road. The only one reholstering your gun is you. You can mitigate the probability of an ND when appendix carrying. Using a good holster, only inserting the full holster+gun instead of reholstering, slowly reholstering, not using a 320, etc. You cannot mitigate the severity of the ND while a gun is pointed at your nuts. Some people are ok with that, some people aren’t. For me, I’ve calculated the probability of having a half second of carelessness is higher than needing a .05 second faster draw time. Not because I’m careless, but I’m aware of my own fallibility. Just because you have made a different risk assessment, doesn’t make you wrong. |
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Quoted: You can mitigate the probability of an ND when appendix carrying. Using a good holster, only inserting the full holster+gun instead of reholstering, slowly reholstering, not using a 320, etc. You cannot mitigate the severity of the ND while a gun is pointed at your nuts. Some people are ok with that, some people aren’t. For me, I’ve calculated the probability of having a half second of carelessness is higher than needing a .05 second faster draw time. Not because I’m careless, but I’m aware of my own fallibility. Just because you have made a different risk assessment, doesn’t make you wrong. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Then don't get careless. Think about it. The biggest risk to appendix carry (unless you carry a SIG 320) is when you holster a loaded gun. Now, you MAY be in a rush to UNHOLSTER a gun, but you are never going to be in a rush to holster one. Keep your finger off the trigger, keep your cover garment bunched up chest high with your off hand and look the gun into the holster. Voila. No shooting yourself in the nuts. Remember if you never get in a car accident you don't need to wear a seat belt...... Just don't get careless.....ya know.... Stupid analogy. There are shitloads of other cars on the road. The only one reholstering your gun is you. You can mitigate the probability of an ND when appendix carrying. Using a good holster, only inserting the full holster+gun instead of reholstering, slowly reholstering, not using a 320, etc. You cannot mitigate the severity of the ND while a gun is pointed at your nuts. Some people are ok with that, some people aren’t. For me, I’ve calculated the probability of having a half second of carelessness is higher than needing a .05 second faster draw time. Not because I’m careless, but I’m aware of my own fallibility. Just because you have made a different risk assessment, doesn’t make you wrong. I don't begrudge you the opinion that it's not worth the risk, I'm just arguing that the risk of all other forms of on-body carry is about the same. I mean, sure...it's your balls, or your dick and that involves a visceral response, but shooting yourself through your hip and into your pelvis is just as bad and just as potentially deadly. And I think there's added risk from carrying at the hip or behind it because you cannot look your weapon into the holster, which increases the likelihood that clothing could get stuck inside the holster without you seeing it. |
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Quoted: It is. It's a dumb question asked to make a point that isn't actually a point. Quoted: Quoted: It's not a mind trick. It's literally how we think when we think anything coherent at all. Getting asked a question you don't know how to answer withoug giving up ground doesn't mean you reach for the bag of tools with the label "sophists" on it. You won't lose prestiege or anything of value if you change your position. *shrug* Quoted: Quoted: Unless you're going to say it's not deadly-dangerous to point your gun at your leg where you reasonably think it can even *nick* your femoral. What are *your* chances of being able to toruniquet your leg if that happens? It's ok to take a mulligan. I am not your enemy. Even if I walked around with a gun pointed at my eyeball that still wouldn't negate the question I asked. You know that. |
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Quoted: If you carry your gun on your hip and pull the trigger unintentionally while reholstering, you can still put a round through your femoral. There is a pretty simple technique where you lean your hip out and away to reholster. It works very well and keeps your leg away from the muzzle. Assuming you are taking your time to reholster as opposed to trying to reholster faster than you drew in the first place. |
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Quoted: I think any agency not actively soliciting for replacement, even using emergency funds is open for a lawsuit. Quoted: Quoted: Duty issued firearm? He should sue his department for issuing a known piece of shit. I think any agency not actively soliciting for replacement, even using emergency funds is open for a lawsuit. We are still issuing them. Policy changed to allow a "carry what you want so long as you can qualify with it." |
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Quoted: There is a pretty simple technique where you lean your hip out and away to reholster. It works very well and keeps your leg away from the muzzle. Assuming you are taking your time to reholster as opposed to trying to reholster faster than you drew in the first place. Quoted: Quoted: If you carry your gun on your hip and pull the trigger unintentionally while reholstering, you can still put a round through your femoral. There is a pretty simple technique where you lean your hip out and away to reholster. It works very well and keeps your leg away from the muzzle. Assuming you are taking your time to reholster as opposed to trying to reholster faster than you drew in the first place. And you know what? There's a simple technique when you reholster to appendix where you keep your finger off the trigger and lean back to make sure the bottom of the holster is pointing at the ground. Six of one, half dozen of the other. |
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Quoted: We are still issuing them. Policy changed to allow a "carry what you want so long as you can qualify with it." Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Duty issued firearm? He should sue his department for issuing a known piece of shit. I think any agency not actively soliciting for replacement, even using emergency funds is open for a lawsuit. We are still issuing them. Policy changed to allow a "carry what you want so long as you can qualify with it." Over/under local gun stores running out of Glocks after this video makes the rounds? |
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Quoted: That’s not a lot. I’ve put well over 4k through my Glock in that time frame between training and classes. Quoted: Quoted: I’ve put at least 500 rounds through mine in three years and never had a problem. That’s not a lot. I’ve put well over 4k through my Glock in that time frame between training and classes. They really need a satire emoji on this site. |
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Quoted: Logic is not a mind trick. It's literally how we think when we think anything coherent at all. Getting asked a question you don't know how to answer withoug giving up ground doesn't mean you reach for the bag of tools with the label "sophists" on it. You won't lose prestiege or anything of value if you change your position. *shrug* That's not the question that will cause you to possibly have to change your position. It's ok to take a mulligan. I am not your enemy. Even if I walked around with a gun pointed at my eyeball that still wouldn't negate the question I asked. You know that. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: It's not a mind trick. It's literally how we think when we think anything coherent at all. Getting asked a question you don't know how to answer withoug giving up ground doesn't mean you reach for the bag of tools with the label "sophists" on it. You won't lose prestiege or anything of value if you change your position. *shrug* Quoted: Quoted: Unless you're going to say it's not deadly-dangerous to point your gun at your leg where you reasonably think it can even *nick* your femoral. What are *your* chances of being able to toruniquet your leg if that happens? It's ok to take a mulligan. I am not your enemy. Even if I walked around with a gun pointed at my eyeball that still wouldn't negate the question I asked. You know that. I find it odd the number of people that will just double down on some insane position when obviously backed into a corner during an argument, rather than just concede a valid counterpoint. All over something as inconsequential as how one prefers to carry their own handgun. I don’t get what’s so hard saying, “Yeah, you’re right. There is a very slight added risks to appendix carry. But I’ve weighed that and for me the benefits outweigh the risk.” Instead people feel this need to do insane mental gymnastics and then project a bunch of insecurity. It’s a phenomenon so frequently seen here on this website, when I actually see someone admit they are wrong or that the other person has a valid point, it speaks much more to their intelligence than any counterpoint they could otherwise make. |
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Quoted: I find it odd the number of people that will just double down on some insane position when obviously backed into a corner during an argument, rather than just concede a valid counterpoint. All over something as inconsequential as how one prefers to carry their own handgun. I don’t get what’s so hard saying, “Yeah, you’re right. There is a very slight added risks to appendix carry. But I’ve weighed that and for me the benefits outweigh the risk.” Instead people feel this need to do insane mental gymnastics and then project a bunch of insecurity. It’s a phenomenon so frequently seen here on this website, when I actually see someone admit they are wrong or that the other person has a valid point, it speaks much more to their intelligence than any counterpoint they could otherwise make. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: It's not a mind trick. It's literally how we think when we think anything coherent at all. Getting asked a question you don't know how to answer withoug giving up ground doesn't mean you reach for the bag of tools with the label "sophists" on it. You won't lose prestiege or anything of value if you change your position. *shrug* Quoted: Quoted: Unless you're going to say it's not deadly-dangerous to point your gun at your leg where you reasonably think it can even *nick* your femoral. What are *your* chances of being able to toruniquet your leg if that happens? It's ok to take a mulligan. I am not your enemy. Even if I walked around with a gun pointed at my eyeball that still wouldn't negate the question I asked. You know that. I find it odd the number of people that will just double down on some insane position when obviously backed into a corner during an argument, rather than just concede a valid counterpoint. All over something as inconsequential as how one prefers to carry their own handgun. I don’t get what’s so hard saying, “Yeah, you’re right. There is a very slight added risks to appendix carry. But I’ve weighed that and for me the benefits outweigh the risk.” Instead people feel this need to do insane mental gymnastics and then project a bunch of insecurity. It’s a phenomenon so frequently seen here on this website, when I actually see someone admit they are wrong or that the other person has a valid point, it speaks much more to their intelligence than any counterpoint they could otherwise make. I agree. Like the mental gymnastics of "if you holstered the gun with it pointed at your head, would you do it?' Ridiculous. Glad you're on board. |