[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Are Cain supporters ready to admit… (Page 2 of 5)
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Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? I'm with you- I think we should be talking about eliminating as many taxes as possible. It's time to start starving the Washington beast. I live in a state with the 2nd lowest cumulative tax burden with very high quality of life indices. No need for any new taxes here. |
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I will not vote for Mitt Romney. 'Cause fuck that guy. Seriously.
I can stomach Perry, and I would have no qualms about voting for Cain. But fuck Romney's punk bullshit. Romney helped drive MA into the shitter, and I don't see how he would do the Nation any better. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? The thing to realize is that the national sales tax isn't an additional tax. It's a replacement tax. You take all the hundreds of rules and regulations that call for imbedded taxes in good that we buy every day, and you toss them all out the window. In their place is a single, simple sales tax. All the burdensome rules that required companies to have accountants and tax attorneys on staff are gone. The company saves a ton of money, and it can offer its products for lower prices. Cain is getting my vote because of 9-9-9, not in spite of it. I understand that, and I believe that income tax is WRONG morally. My problem is this: Cain creates a national sales tax to replace some income tax revenue. What is stopping future leaders from upping BOTH the existing income tax AND the national sales tax? Creating an entirely new form of national taxation is too dangerous for me to support. It WILL be abused in the future, of that we are guaranteed. I like the spirit of what he is trying to do, but not the implementation. If it was a national sales tax and the complete eradication of income tax, I would be in support of that.
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Quoted: Quoted: Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? I don't think he'll get it through congress. I'm hoping it morphs into an 18% flat income tax with an exemption of 100% of the poverty level. 9+9+9 = 18+0+9 That kills one of the major advantages of 9-9-9. If you collect the tax in two different places, it becomes almost impossible for people to dodge it. At best, they might be able to dodge one 9, but not the other. Drug dealers, prostitutes, illegals, and other people working under the table all still will have to pay the sales tax when they buy things. |
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All the women in my life still like him. So do most of the men I know. What are you basing your knowledge on? Feelings? Exactly. They see the accusations as what they are. They are coming from unreliable sources. Hell the last one was fired for makeing false claims! |
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Quoted: Quoted: Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? I'm with you- I think we should be talking about eliminating as many taxes as possible. It's time to start starving the Washington beast. I live in a state with the 2nd lowest cumulative tax burden with very high quality of life indices. No need for any new taxes here. 9-9-9 kills hundreds of taxes. |
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Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? The thing to realize is that the national sales tax isn't an additional tax. It's a replacement tax. You take all the hundreds of rules and regulations that call for imbedded taxes in good that we buy every day, and you toss them all out the window. In their place is a single, simple sales tax. All the burdensome rules that required companies to have accountants and tax attorneys on staff are gone. The company saves a ton of money, and it can offer its products for lower prices. Cain is getting my vote because of 9-9-9, not in spite of it. I understand that, and I believe that income tax is WRONG morally. My problem is this: Cain creates a national sales tax to replace some income tax revenue. What is stopping future leaders from upping BOTH the existing income tax AND the national sales tax?
Creating an entirely new form of national taxation is too dangerous for me to support. It WILL be abused in the future, of that we are guaranteed. I like the spirit of what he is trying to do, but not the implementation. If it was a national sales tax and the complete eradication of income tax, I would be in support of that. What is stopping future leaders from upping the current income tax structure? You're against a plan because of something that COULD/MIGHT happen, that could/might still happen under the current structure. I'd rather take the risk, but with a much simpler system. That way if they try to do that, EVERYONE WILL SEE IT PLAIN AS DAY and will vote them out. |
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Ok I can see that I'm in the deep water here. yeah, I'm basing my thoughts on people I talk to who are not arfcom folks. There's a backlash coming and I can see now that Cain supporters don't see it yet. It's OK with me if God blesses Australia and Canada and a few others. 
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? I don't think he'll get it through congress. I'm hoping it morphs into an 18% flat income tax with an exemption of 100% of the poverty level. 9+9+9 = 18+0+9 That kills one of the major advantages of 9-9-9. If you collect the tax in two different places, it becomes almost impossible for people to dodge it. At best, they might be able to dodge one 9, but not the other. Drug dealers, prostitutes, illegals, and other people working under the table all still will have to pay the sales tax when they buy things. That's true, but I'm pretty confident that a national sales tax is a political impossibility. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? You're definitely not alone in not understanding the 9-9-9 plan very much, that's for sure. I am here to learn, seriously, no trolling, can you explain what about the plan I'm missing? The essence of my problem is that it creates an entirely new tax (income tax), without eradicating an existing tax, and in the future what is to stop congress or a rogue president from increasing BOTH the income tax and national sales tax??? I know it does away with many other taxes, but its income and sales tax that are the brunt of what middle class america has on their backs. |
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Ok I can see that I'm in the deep water here. yeah, I'm basing my thoughts on people I talk to who are not arfcom folks. There's a backlash coming and I can see now that Cain supporters don't see it yet. It's OK with me if God blesses Australia and Canada and a few others.
It's a line from a movie that I thought was funnier than it actually is. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? The thing to realize is that the national sales tax isn't an additional tax. It's a replacement tax. You take all the hundreds of rules and regulations that call for imbedded taxes in good that we buy every day, and you toss them all out the window. In their place is a single, simple sales tax. All the burdensome rules that required companies to have accountants and tax attorneys on staff are gone. The company saves a ton of money, and it can offer its products for lower prices. Cain is getting my vote because of 9-9-9, not in spite of it. I understand that, and I believe that income tax is WRONG morally. My problem is this: Cain creates a national sales tax to replace some income tax revenue. What is stopping future leaders from upping BOTH the existing income tax AND the national sales tax? Creating an entirely new form of national taxation is too dangerous for me to support. It WILL be abused in the future, of that we are guaranteed. I like the spirit of what he is trying to do, but not the implementation. If it was a national sales tax and the complete eradication of income tax, I would be in support of that. I had the same concern, but then I realized there was nothing to stop our leaders, present or future, from upping the taxes we pay right now. And the taxes we pay now are largely hidden from us. Raising them doesn't invoke as much of a response, because we don't notice when an orange grower is taxed more on some aspect of his operation and has to raise the price of his oranges by a penny each to make up for it. We pay that higher tax every time we buy anything with oranges in it, but we don't realize it. With this plan, everything is much more out in the open, which will hopefully lead to more pushback whenever raising taxes is considered. |
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Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? You're definitely not alone in not understanding the 9-9-9 plan very much, that's for sure. I am here to learn, seriously, no trolling, can you explain what about the plan I'm missing? The essence of my problem is that it creates an entirely new tax (income tax), without eradicating an existing tax, and in the future what is to stop congress or a rogue president from increasing BOTH the income tax and national sales tax??? I know it does away with many other taxes, but its income and sales tax that are the brunt of what middle class america has on their backs. I don't think Cain himself knows the answer to this question. Seems to me that it opens the door to a Euro style VAT. Scary stuff. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? You're definitely not alone in not understanding the 9-9-9 plan very much, that's for sure. I am here to learn, seriously, no trolling, can you explain what about the plan I'm missing? The essence of my problem is that it creates an entirely new tax (income tax), without eradicating an existing tax, and in the future what is to stop congress or a rogue president from increasing BOTH the income tax and national sales tax??? I know it does away with many other taxes, but its income and sales tax that are the brunt of what middle class america has on their backs. I don't think Cain himself knows the answer to this question. Seems to me that it opens the door to a Euro style VAT. Scary stuff. VATS and sales taxes have very little in common. |
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Quoted: Quoted: The Aquila scandal hasn't even been questioned yet. That's because there is no scandal For a man pushing for Privatized Pension Plans, it's kinda tough to turn a blind eye on helping lose $200+ million dollars from your employees' retirement accounts. |
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Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? I don't think he'll get it through congress. I'm hoping it morphs into an 18% flat income tax with an exemption of 100% of the poverty level. 9+9+9 = 18+0+9 18%? That still works out to about a 9-10% tax increase over what people like me pay now. Our payroll taxes are abut 7.6%. Double my taxes? No thanks. We need a REGRESSIVE tax code. People who create jobs and feed the economy the most pay a lower percentage of their income. People who create nothing and contribute nothing, while consuming the most services, contribute more. |
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The Aquila scandal hasn't even been questioned yet.
That's because there is no scandal For a man pushing for Privatized Pension Plans, it's kinda tough to turn a blind eye on helping lose $200+ million dollars from your employees' retirement accounts. It has already been investigated and shown he had no role in that. Even though his name was listed on the original lawsuit, it was removed later after the investigation. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? You're definitely not alone in not understanding the 9-9-9 plan very much, that's for sure. I am here to learn, seriously, no trolling, can you explain what about the plan I'm missing? The essence of my problem is that it creates an entirely new tax (income tax), without eradicating an existing tax, and in the future what is to stop congress or a rogue president from increasing BOTH the income tax and national sales tax??? I know it does away with many other taxes, but its income and sales tax that are the brunt of what middle class america has on their backs. What will stop this is the fact that EVERYONE pays, making such a move political suicide. Right now, nearly half the country doesn't pay federal income tax, so "fuck the rich" (meaning "fuck the other half of the country") is a viable political platform. If you want to cut spending and cut taxes, you need to get EVERYONE on the same side of the fence. 9-9-9 is a way to do this. |
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Am I the only one for whom a national sales tax is a dealbreaker???? He will not do it. He wants the Fair Tax. He just can't run on it. He's just throwing out other ideas for the sheeple. Cain will not impose a sales tax. Take that to the bank. came here to say this. the 999 plan is just flashy meat and a catchy campaign idea. it wont pass, and the fair tax is his clear goal as stated on his website. not to mention, any tax code change will have to have a constitutional amendment attached with it. |
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I am considering the points about the 9-9-9 plan being an open taxation plan instead of a hidden one. I hadn't really thought about it like that, the national sales tax really scares me, but I'll have to really give some thought to the merits of the plan. Its possible that I have just ran with my initial "no fucking way am I voting for a new tax" reaction without really considering all angles. This is the first election in my life where I have been truly torn and I honestly don't know what the right thing to do is. I am torn between voting my principals (Ron Paul) and voting for pragmatism (whoever has the best chance to beat Obama). Its had me up nights, thinking about it.
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I am considering the points about the 9-9-9 plan being an open taxation plan instead of a hidden one. I hadn't really thought about it like that, the national sales tax really scares me, but I'll have to really give some thought to the merits of the plan. Its possible that I have just ran with my initial "no fucking way am I voting for a new tax" reaction without really considering all angles. This is the first election in my life where I have been truly torn and I honestly don't know what the right thing to do is. I am torn between voting my principals (Ron Paul) and voting for pragmatism (whoever has the best chance to beat Obama). Its had me up nights, thinking about it. Vote for who you want in the Primary and vote for the guy running against Obama in the general election. No need to lose sleep over the decision. |