Does anyone here have this piece of equipment? Looks like a well thought out (like most Velsyt products) design.  While it is indeed beau coup spendy, I'm wondering if anyone has experience with this.  I have seen some reviews complain about the 3/4" buckles on some of the pouches but that's a small gripe.  Looks like a great way to carry a different load out.  

Jungle Kit

I like how their jungle buttpack is identical to an old M1967 “field training pack”

50 years of hindsight/experience/innovation, and it’s turns out the old buttpack is still the best design for jungle usage ever.

$600 f'n dollars? Holy crap. Time to dig out my 1980's LCE and make it rain

They tried to make a modernized LCE somehow trying to copy British belt kits.
I have zero doubts quality is flawless, however i am not a fan of the two row of webbing belt which doesn't cover the whole body of the pouches and i am not a fan of the design of the yoke (the suspenders) either. Also the belt would benefit from some quicker adjustment buckle, like a cobra or a roll pin.
Regarding the pouches design they tried to mimick UK ones, i would have like the reverse buckle even on the GP pouches, they make for an easy one hand closing. They had to retain the buttpack and Alice style ammo pouch design to accomodate for the US clientele, i think the UK way of having 3 to 5 utility pouches is too alien.

The next step would have been having a non modular set that have increased stability and lets pouches sit tighter so the same amount of pouches can be had in a smaller package letting the ammo pouches sit at 3 and 9 o clock. this let the user to go prone easily and allow for a full range of movement (expecially kneeling without having ammo pouches interfering in the front part of the thigh).
Also utility pouches on the back being leveled to use their lids as a rest for the rucksack, worn without a waist belt (again, british style)

The velocity system set costs more than double of the most elaborate UK made webbing sets (that in my opinion, being accustomed to them, are of a better design)

It's a battle belt with pouches and suspenders.  Tactical Tailor and several others make that for much less than $600.

This. I run basically the same for my run n gun events.

Maybe $200.in the whole thing.

Better off just buying a PLCE set from eBay for much cheaper.  Nice concept, poor execution IMO.

Joe-
I always appreciate your input and experience on these matters. can you elaborate on why a setup like this would be better for hot and humid “jungle” use?
(Semi-random pic of a 1-pc British kit)


It seems like you’ve got a LOT more material pushed up against your waistline and hips. Yeah, there’s mesh to help with this, but it still looks like an awful lot.

I totally get your points on the roll-pin belt, some sort of quick-adjust is nice for a setup like this.

The Velocity setup looks like there’s several options, one with the buttpack, and another with multiple canteen/utility pouches - the latter of which would be a closer to the Brit approach of multiple small pouches instead of one larger buttpack- which kinda makes the shelf for a ruck like you mentioned.

I have no dog in this fight, I’m just curious as to your reasons why

Fuck me sideways in the ear if I had to wear that thing in the jungle.

https://www.jayjaysbrecon.co.uk/load-carriage/webbing-sets

Another approach to look at.

I haven't used the VS rig, but I was inspired by it.  I rigged up my own with some surplus gear and a BAE Eclipse belt for cheap.  I got the butt pack from Fire Force Tactical and used some Tactical Tailor suspenders.







joeviterbo is right, its asking a whole lot of two rows of webbing to hold that butt pack, lots of jiggle and wiggle.  The VS butt pack is smaller than the Fire Force one I've got thought, but still.  I'm on the look out for a three row belt, probably a Russian one in my future.  That Fire Force butt pack can fit a shitload of crap, that photo is has plenty of room to spare, and its a comfortable rig, altogether.

You are definitely right in saying ther is more material in contact with your waist and hips. I think however it is a necessary evil to manage the heavy loads (provided you are carrying a heavier load of subsistence items vs. a typical combat load, that to be honest as of today with added electronics a combat load is by itself heavy when confronted with the few extra comfort items added).

Both rigs have jungle friendly materials (no metal, hydrophobic fabrics)
I think the weak link of the velocity system kit is the belt. looks like they only made a mesh warbelt. However with the two row belt about one third of the pouch is devoid of any support and the fact that it's attached to the belt sleeve (so not directly connected to the stiff belt inside) it makes a pivot point for the pouches than when loaded tend to slightly rotate under the belt and creating unwanted movement and discomfort. It is multiplied by the fact that every pouch is indepently attached to the belt. On the other hand the british non modular belt kits make use of the belt as a support point for the pouches that are completely covered by the pad so this unwanted movement is minimized. that is a problem that brits have been trying to minimize since they had their canvas webbing in the 60s.  
It is also why many webbing sets are only partially modular, with fixed back pouches  (albeit full modular belt kits do exist).
There are also 2 extra attachment point in the back from the harness to the belt, which are meant to improve stability. i don't think it was something ever done in US, except maybe FMCO that offered a 8 point alice harness. I think in some cases in the US the older h harness was preferred instead of the newer alice y harness because of the improved stability of having 2 attachment points well distanced.
Again, having back pouches tightly sewn together allow for the ammo pouches to be at 3 and 9 o clock, allowing full leg movement (the US soldiers being more accustomed to having the ammo pouches almost in front, at 11 and 1 o clock, that render acces to ammo while kneeling or prone more difficult). Also the buttpack while being more useful for bigger items it is usually more prone to flopping around (many british makers offer a "buttpack webbing", even if i don't think i have ever seen one worn by a squaddie).

I don't think the UK kit is perfect, the harness could be stripped down more as a lot of weight is on the hips when the belt is properly tightened (many makers tailor the webbing to the soldier body measure, so they can get away with some sizing adjusters). They are also stout in having ammo pouches with only velcro closure with the theory that if you have to access ammo it means that you are in a firefight, while in reality there are times when you can check or resupply ammo and noise discipline is important. I would like ammo pouches with tuck tabs.

Check this reviews of modern jungle webbing as made by C2R fast out of UK vs the Velocity one, to appreciate the differences.
https://thereptilehouseblog.com/2019/08/21/run-through-the-jungle-c2r-fast-hereford-jungle-webbing-overview/
https://redbeardtactical.home.blog/2019/08/09/review-velocity-systems-jungle-kit/

Well, I happen to think the "Brit-style" belt kit is superior to any other I've ever seen or used.  And yes, I've gotten a lot of push-back from that statement, usually from those guys not familiar with or had a chance to try and compare to the old patrol rigs we used to cobble together.  At first blush, you'd think that huge "hippo" belt is totally ridiculous, especially for jungle ops, but once you break it down, it starts to make sense.

But to begin with, I think JoeV is spot on here; the VelSys was a nice attempt to modernize US load bearing equipment, but you can essentially build the same thing, from either issue, or custom kit (Jay Jay's, Dixie's Corner, etc.) for much less money, not to mention much better availability.  I have built/modified several VelSys belt kits for my mates, and the consensus was sure it's nice but also flawed for reasons I will explain.  

So why is a Brit belt kit the best design out there?  I'll take it by the pieces, and then address it as a whole system.  First the hip belt.  These comes in various configs, from 5,6,7, & 8" widths.  The idea being, as Joe mentioned, to spread out the padding to encompass all, or most, of the individual pouches as they contact your body.  If you've ever carried up to 12 mags, and/or frags n smokes on a belt kit, (not to mention at least 2 water bottles + brew kit and so forth) you appreciate this feature.  

Shoulder harness.   I have tried many designs over the years but always come back to this basic design.  Why?  Well I think it has something to do with the fact it has 6 attachment points, with two from the front, and 4 from the back (VelSys reversed this which I think is not as effective).  I think this spreads out a combat load well.  The heavier mags/frags/smokes have extra support.  Also, having a mesh back panel extend further down the back somehow makes the back strap geometry work better.

Mag pouches.  Typically you see old school, fully enclosed flaps, with 3-mag pouches being the norm, although some 2-mag pouches are being seen, even with "flat" top flaps.  The older issue pouches have "Spainish" buckles, however, most custom or newer pouches will either have velcro, SR buckles, or both.  While all of this works, I prefer a "tuck tab" closure, sometimes in conjunction with velcro.
The older pouches will not usually have any retention feature, but some of the newer ones will.  Most are also double-walled for constant wet, abrasive conditions in triple canopy jungles (VelSys went with light weight/highspeed materials which are nice but fiddly to reload).    

Sustainment/canteen pouches.  These are also usually fully enclosed lids (as opposed to the caps sticking out), sized big enough for a 1 qt canteen, plus a canteen cup, and/or other bits such as fold up stoves, "brew kits", coffee/tea, etc.  Most will not have any retention feature but some of the newer ones will at least cinch up a bit around the neck.  In colder climes they are placed upside down, so ice forms on the bottom, not in the neck.  

Extra pouches might be "molle'd" onto the sides of the mag pouches for smokes and frags (frags on front side of front pouch, smoke on back side of back pouch).  Sustainments might be modified to carry MBITR-sized radios.  Shoulder straps might be modified to carry wires/tubing, for PTT's or water bladders.  The right front 2 mag pouches might be replaced with a "commander's pouch" which is basically a 6-mag pouch made for the stuff leaders have to carry, such as notes books, pens, report formats, etc.  Real squaddies will add in a bayonet or sheath knife (jungle style "bolos" are usually carried on a separate, smaller belt that fits under main belt, so it's always on you, even if you ditched belt kit).

Now how does it all fit together, and how is it different from US stuff.  Well first of all the belt pad usually ends at the hip points, rather than wrapped around as most US belt pads do.  This allows you to take a knee or prone out much easier, since the Brits will typically keep the area forward of the pads "slick" or free of pouches.  This is a major change for lots of guys.  But it is much more balanced, especially with a full-sized ruck.  They typically use an adjustable belt buckle, which allows you to cinch the belt kit up snug (as opposed to an old style US pistol belt that has to be sized, and taped in placed).  But most important, each pouch is mounted flush with the top of the belt, which means it creates a nice shelf on back for your ruck to sit on.  As opposed to most other US systems, where the canteen caps stick out above the belt, and interfere with the ruck/frame.  This is a critical difference.  With a nice shelf for the ruck, the ruck waist belt can be taped back/removed, and the belt kit itself becomes the waist belt (which is why an adjustable buckle is required to cinch it down).  Why US designs never addressed this issue is beyond me.

So when you add in a full-sized rucksack, the Brit belt kit has no equal.   It is the solution all us grunts tried to find by modifying all our issue gear, and then some.

Of course this is all one man's opinion, but based on 40+ years of rucking and stitching.  Take it as ye will.

Fwiw I've rucked and patrolled in Okinawa, the Philippines, and Indonesia.

None of that seems appealing to me. An 8" belt? Fuck that.

I'll be honest, the standard pistol belt/h-harness/etc works fine with 550 cord in the heat/jungle.

I'm an outlier that actually likes the usgi lbv.

I have the set, 100% awesome. I think I did swap the shoulder harness IIRC, for no specific reason. I agree with Diz on this, It is a great rig, great concept, VS is great quality no complaints from me.

03RN: hey brother we ran around in the same jungles, probably damn-near the same times (Oki/NTA:'79-80, Korea/MtnWarfare School:'79, PI/JEST:'80 for me).  I started out in std "782" gear like any other grunt.  But very quickly I learned from the vets.  We re-rigged our kit with para-cord, removing any and all metal fittings.  They were then rigged low to clear rucksack frames.  So for us, we had several heavily loaded pouches, slung low, and frequently trying to beat us death, although we were young and dumb, so drive on, right?  The first time I saw Brit kit, we had crossed-trained with the Royal Green Jackets, and their belt kit blew me away.  The way it fit with their "bergens" was a real eye-opener.  From that point forward, it was a journey to try and end up with that set up.  Initially I sewed loops of parachute harness webbing on the back of each pouch, which dropped my issue pouches down level with my belt, which had been cut down, and more webbing sewn on with a parachute buckle used to cinch it up tight.  This was a huge improvement, which allowed the issue ALICE ruck to sit down on top of the canteen pouches.  So the belt kit could be cinched up slightly higher, and the ruck belt taped back (jump rigged) around back.  The only downside to this arrangement is the pouches do ride lower than normal.  So the brits will add bungees to tie them all together, and even add extended belt padding.  Now this is a personal choice, as I've seen everything from 4"-8" pads.  I know a 8" pads sounds crazy, but it's actually very comfortable.  Jay Jays actually uses several layers of open mesh for padding, so it's very light weight, breathable, and drains very well.  If you look at it from another way; say you added the same padding to each individual pouch, instead of the belt; wouldn't that be more comfortable than mags/canteens banging on your bony ass?  That's just essentially what they've done.  

I have been designing and testing out a new jungle belt kit for the last few months, and I have done something very similar to that; removing the padding from the belt webbing and transferring it to the pouch panels themselves.   Since we are doing sewn down webbing, at customer request, I thought why not take advantage of this fact and re-design the thing, from ground up, as a sewn down rig (instead of a converted rig with separate molle belt and pouches).  So I have sort of addressed your objection!

I apologize for the previous post. I was being a little dramatic when I said none of that sounds appealing. It's really just the 8" pad that sounds horrible. I just always try to minimize material. If I'm in the jungle I'll be soaked anyways but I just want stuff as minimal as possible.

Dropping stuff down to form a shelf is what I've always done as well. The metal clips are worse than worthless.

Do you have a website with pics of your stuff?

Come on! You're not nostalgic for some good-'ole 'Meat Hooks'? At 3/75, we'd buy a second harness for TA50 Inspections, and 550 Cord the harness to the belt.

Do you wear all of this in lieu of having a ruck?

No. The kit you see most often now was tailored to conducting short duration raids out of helicopters or working out of vehicles in the modern GWOT. This “jungle” rig being discussed goes back to light fighter roots where units moved through dense jungle canopy away from roads and helicopter landing zones. Ruck was the main form of sustainment, but left at patrol bases or objective rally points prior to actually working on an objective.

Wow knowledge breaking out all over this thread.  I know this is not very common knowledge these days, so for sure, we can back up and explain how things are done, when you don't have a supply chain, with regular re-supply, or even don't need it because you are working from the same base where you return each night (or day as case may be).

With the GWOT, we saw things rapidly change into "modern" ways of doing things.  What that boiled down to is most guys rarely RON'd or remained over night any place outside of the wire (or nowadays the Hescos).  And when they did go out, likely as not it was a mechanized or mounted patrol.  Even if it was a foot or dismounted patrol, re-supply was never far.  So what we saw evolve was a different way of carrying things.  Much of what guys like 03RN, Mick, and myself carried on our belt kit was transferred to a "3-day" pack.  And, with the increased emphasis of body armor, much more was transferred to an "armor carrier", then "plate carriers", and the belt was relegated to some pistol kit and a few odds and ends.  While this has worked well, and for some it will continue to work well, others are exploring kicking it old school ranger style.  With the thinking that with new threats out there, that are peer or near-peer, we won't be able to get away with operating like we did against 5th century goat herders.  

What that means in practical terms is that you may no longer have air superiority, much less own the MSRs or main supply routes, so you might have to think about being more self-sufficient for longer periods of time.  Not to mention the guys out there snoopin' and poopin' (the long range recce guys) who have traditionally always operated this way.  So typically you might be humping a load for 72-96 hours; perhaps even a week before seeing any re-supply.  That might not sound a like a big deal, but when you're used to eating and drinking any time you want, not to mention just strolling down to supply and getting fresh batts and so forth, it's actually a big game-changer.  And sometimes re-supply doesn't show up.  So you have to be ready to improvise.

This is where the Brits are rock stars.  While they will be issued food/supplies for say 3 days, they will ALWAYS carry another 24-48 hours of rations on their belt kit.  Why?  Well anyone who's ever been in the military will know; shit happens.  Not to be unkind, but perhaps the British system is not as robust, or more likely the US system is too good and we get spoiled, but in any case, this is something that might not be as easy to pull off in the next confrontation.  

So to answer the question, this is why you have enough on your belt kit to be self-sufficient for at least another day.  It does not replace wearing a full sized rucksack, it is your last ditch supply when everything on the ruck is gone.  It also lets you carry daily supplies, when the ruck is left at the patrol base, as mentioned.  But it is always topped up, from the ruck, on a daily basis.  That sounds contradictory so let's break it down further.  A long range patrol is broken down into phases (yes I have switched over to "specialist" troops here, but it basically applies across the board).  You have Insertion, Infiltration, Actions in the Objective Area (whatever that might be), then Exfiltration, and Extraction.   As pertains to this here discussion, after insertion, you have to "infiltrate" to your objective.  That means you're carrying all your shit.  So at that point, you have a full ruck and belt kit.  You have the luxury of working off the ruck for food and water.  If you get bumped, you can ditch the ruck and still have supplies on your belt kit (you attempt to circle back and recover rucks if possible, but if not, drive on.  You did pack those bullion, cubes, right?).  But when you establish a base camp, you may have several days of reconnaissance or surveillance,  where the ruck is dumped and you work off the belt kit.  Later, after you've done whatever it was you came to do, you pack back up, and hump everything back out, aka exfil, and get extracted.  

So for sure, a different way of doing things.  You think in terms of being more self-sufficient, instead of taking for granted that Mother Green will take care of you.  As an added bonus, lots of civvies would do well to consider this philosophy.  You may not have a robust supply chain available, so you have to be thinking in terms of carrying everything you can yourself, and/or having your own re-supply/cache points set up, for whatever it is you are up to.  For many this is huge change in how they do things, or how they've seen things done, for past 20+ years.  For all us old school grunts, it's like, well, no shit.

I am liking this thread.

Some other things.  Body armor.  Back in the day, it was not emphasized as much, especially for specialist troops, out there snoopin' and poopin'.  Their role changed to a lot of direct assault, so their kit came to resemble SWAT more than jungle patrol.  That is rapidly changing.  And I know this is a very contentious issue, but, in my opinion, there are times and place where BA is uh "contra-indicated".  I will give you an example, and leave it for you to decide.  My boss is from the Aussie Commando Rgt.  One of his mates is an instructor at their Jungle Warfare Center, where each Rgt must rotate through on an annual basis.  Since the GWOT, some rgts will show up in their kit that was optimized for "Bagdad SWAT", namely PC's, pistol belt kits, and various rucks.  After a week back out in the bush, some come to the conclusion that all that stuff simply doesn't work, and return to old school belt kits, sans armor, and their old "bergens".  This is not to say this is what YOU should do.  Only to illustrate one time and place where I know for a fact, guys are deciding that armored plate carriers covering up their chests just does not work.  This is for YOU to decide what applies to you and your sit.  I am not saying everybody go out and shit-can your BA and get a belt kit.  

I have always just done custom kit for my friends and neighbors.  I have never "hung out the shingle" so to speak and had my own website.  However that may be changing.  The company I presently work for is thinking about working in a limited run of my belt kit design (if the supply chain can be straightened out!), so at some point in the future, you may finally be able to check out my interpretation of the classic belt kit, if you want.  In the meantime, my favs are Dixie's Corner, and Jay Jays of Brecon.  If that's too pricey, then check out Kit Monster for really good surplus kit.  I would stay away from "Brit-style" kit, which frequently is crap.  You want real MOD issue, or custom (bespoke) webbing.

But circling back to the VelSys design.  I think they have the right idea, in coming back to a belt kit design, especially for jungle warfare, but I think the execution was flawed.  It's really nice gucci kit, and WILL work, especially in place of a PC/chest rig set up, but it's just not what I would I have done, if anyone gives a shit about that.  The Brit style shoulder harness works better, IMHO, and attaching to the pouch panel, not the pouch itself, supports the weight mo better.  Then you have their high speed materials.  It's a really good idea, using light weight, water-shedding materials.  But when you are making belt mounted pouches, they are too "flimsy" for lack of better term.  This is why the Brits have used double-walled mag pouches for jungle warfare.  Not only do they stand up to constant wet conditions without falling apart, they have enough "ass" to keep their shape.  This may not sound like much, but, being able to return that canteen to it's pouch, or plus up that mag pouch, quickly, silently, one-handed, at night, can be a very good feature.  Then there's price.  Everything is expensive these days, granted.  But if I'm gonna pay a premium for something, it better perform a lot better than the other stuff.  But again that is for you to decide.

The nicest thing is the Helium Whisper fabric as it doesn't absorb any water at all, made for jungle and wet environments.

Fwiw the only time I've seen someone die due to heat was wearing body armor/helmet in the jungle in July (tomorrow 18 years ago actually.)

Yeah I have rucked with PC in July heat and it's no fun.  I could not sustain that effort.  

Well yeah, but, I think that stuff is optimized for a chest rig/PC type set up, not a belt kit.  Just one man's opinion.  If it works for you, rock it out.

Thank you for the response, I very much appreciate it.   I really don't see this type of kit being something I'd ever need.  Saves me some money for sure.

And that's the whole point here.  You have to take a good look at what you are trying to do, then figure out what skill sets you need to do it, then what equipment is needed to support that effort.  As opposed to just imitatin' the big dogs, whose mission sets may have absolutely nothing to do with your situation.  If you are in triple canopy jungle, you operate a certain way, and the kit and techniques we've been discussing come into play.  If you are in a very arid, open area, then you would probably looking at vehicle mobilty and very different ways of doing things.  

I think jungle kit does have a lot of overlap with those of us living in heavily wooded areas, with hot, humid weather being an added bonus.  And of course some reason to be doing a long range patrol out in it.  Some (still) think this is tin-hat territory, but, I think it is a natural extension of "neighborhood watch" in a more rural setting.  Also again taking a look at YOUR particular sit, BA is may not be necessary at this time.

And again on VelSys, I think their pouches would work much better if some kind of stiffener plate is placed between the layers on the front face.  A piece of thin poly mesh would be nice.  For all the short-comings of our GI 3-mag pouches (courtesy of my favorite vendor, "Arkansas Industries for the Blind"; I shit you not) they did have front (and rear) stiffener plates which helped hold shape.

Here's a lovely pic of me boss out in the bush.  Notice modified VelSys pouches, on Jay Jays belt kit, and how the ruck sits flush on top of them.

Attached File


Another shot showing the interface between pouches and ruck.

Attached File

Diz, I'm a convert to belt kit from yours and others' posts on the LF forum. Good stuff and it got me thinking about being a civilian without a logistics chain. I went Jay Jay's webbing and a Crossfire MKVII. This setup is incredibly comfortable for how much it all can carry. I appreciate the Old school soldiers knowledge and your posts in particular. Good knowledge being shared here.

Seems like a lot of money for the VS Jungle Kit when it's something you could easily custom out for far less.  

Essentially just a battle belt, pouches, and suspenders from what I can tell. $599 seems like a bit much to me.

Considering all of the pouches and overall kit are specifically designed for jungle use (abrasion resistance where needed, lightweight elsewhere, drainage, and low to no water retention, etc) pretty difficult to source pouches and components from other places that will do the same/similar much less in a single place.

This thread really delivered some great insight.

Hope it's made better than their triggers...

We’re talking about Velocity Systems, the armor/soft gear component of Mayflower Research and Consulting

Yep, go price all the pouches from Blue Force Gear and their helium whisper material. It's great stuff: thin, very strong, absorb no water and therefor don't need to dry except a little around stitched areas...but that shit is expensive too.  You can go regular nylon, but the vast majority will absorb and retain water in jungle, swampy, humid, and wet conditions. Some guys tried to spray their kit with water proofing and ended up just trapping heat.  Thin, light, tough and hydrophobic...it's available, it's just not cheap.

ROCK6

This is a good point that has been obliquely discussed. We have fighting loads, minuteman loads, etc., but the logistics piece is really important.  For patrolling around the house, not much of an issue. In the true minuteman concept, most only had enough equipment and rations for a few days where they would link up with the larger organization and their logistics chain. Even long-range patrols would have caches or resupply points. While you can't carry everything for a two week patrol, you can prioritize your kit for covering much more with the right load-out and planning.  

ROCK6

LMFAO!! I still have my rig from 80s too!

Yeah we are light years away from surplus shop gear, cobbled together with para cord.  Like anything else, LBE has gone up exponentially in price.  The kind of kit only specialist troops were issued pretty much became general issue.  And the Jedis pushed it out even further.  I mean the full deployment load out for one dude could easily exceed 50-60 grand.  

But I'm not gonna harp on price here (too much), because it is what it is.  Only to say that if you value the new hi-speed materials enough to pay for them, drive on.  If not, there are very good options out there that still work very well.  And yeah to the point, all that old crap we rocked out back in the day did get the job done.  

Attached File
 

Here I actually have on the old canvas web belt and "H" suspender straps, with M-14 ammo pouches, with a field dressing in the bottom so you could grab 20-rd mags.  Sometimes I even ran canteen pouches, SOG style, with 7 20-rd mags each.  And since it's arfcom, how 'bout that old slab-sided "CAR-15"?

Do you work on the VS rigs at all? I have one that could use some work.

Do you carry a sidearm with this web gear or no?

Is having at least one mag in an open top pouch/ fast mag not really a thing with this type of gear? I get covered pouches for environmental concerns, just a fan of at least one that can be immediately grabbed.

Well pistol is up to you.  There are very good pros and cons, either way.  For weight I'd rather have extra smokes/bangs than a pistol for long range patrols.  Shorter stuff, closer to home, a definite maybe.  Would not recommend a leg strap being worn for deep woodland patrol.  

Do not work much on VelSys or any other stuff these days.  Just don't have the time.

On a ready mag, yeah depending on what you're doing, that's a really good idea.  Maybe even a micro chest rig.  Bearing in mind, this is more a close combat, urban-centric technique, where you don't have a lot of space or cover.  When in deep woodlands, for example, there is a lot more space to run and hide, and get a fresh mag in, than say inside a room.  But that being said, having a ready mag is still a good SOP, especially since many of us live in mixed urban/woodland areas.  Another technique to consider is if you know you are going into a gunfight, then consider something like a Magpul 60-rounder.  

I have always tried to combine the old with the new; using things that still work, and changing to better things when discovered.  So saying does this fit in with this style of rig doesn't mean anything to me.  Use what works, period.  Lots of guys are stuck in the period they trained in.  Whether that's a long time ago, or more recent.  I think the trick is to examine all the T,T,P's and combine the ones that make the most sense.  So if it works for you, I'd find a good holster that works with this style of rig, and use mag pouches suited to your needs; whether that's 3-mag, fully covered, 2-mag, flat top lids, or single mag open top bungees.  Or any combination of the above.  For example, ready mag(s) with a flat (tuckable) lid(s), and back ups in fully enclosed pouches.

We are not active duty, and the Sgt Maj won't mind!      

I always try to incorporate one mag in an open top/fast mag/ready mag configuration. Plus I like the idea of starting off with a D60. If things go hot, it gives you some more time to lay down fire to maneuver.

Generally people don't.  But you can.  I run 4 x triple magazine pouches.  One is for my IFAK with a medical pullout designed for the pouches.  The other 3 pouches let me carry 9 x magazines on the belt.  Or if I want to carry a pistol, I take my kydex IWB holster and run a piece of paracord through one of the grommets on the holster, then down through the drain grommet on the pouch, couple of good knots below that.  Then take velcro one-wrap, run it around the holster so that it comes into touch with the velcro inside the magazine pouch.  This sounds complicated, but it's super simple.  You can close the magazine pouch normally for retention.  Or open it and tuck it behind the holster if you think you might need it quickly.  

This allows you to throw a pistol on your belt line and still carry 6 x magazines + your IFAK.  Or you can leave it behind and go 9 x magazines and IFAK.  Or if you REALLY want to up-load the magazines, throw your IFAK pullout into a fanny pouch and run 12 x magazines on your belt.  

It's kinda like a modular system, but without actually swapping out pouches.  Just design everything to fit the triple mag pouches.  This is in addition to your water, buttpack, whatever else you might have on your kit.

If you want to try this concept out cheap with British PLCE style belt kit, BudK has most of a full kit on sale cheap.  4 x magazine pouches (triple mags), 2 x utility pouches, belt, harness, and a bayonet sheath.  You will need at least 2 more utility or canteen pouches, maybe 3 depending on how you want to configure it.  They are all a bit rough, but in useable condition.  A few pieces came looking brand new.  It's a mix and match.  $40.

https://www.budk.com/Great-Britain-Military-Surplus-Harness-And-Gear-Ba-49842

Hessen Antiques has surplus PLCE canteen pouches, that come with a canteen.  The pouches are decent condition, the canteens looked used, but with new caps put on them.  $10 each.

https://hessenantique.com/british-army-canteen-with-dpm-camo-cover-used/

If you want to go more gucci, try the JayJays and Dixies stuff that Diz was mentioning.

Or you can piece stuff together.  SORD (aussie gear company) has killer clearance deals.  You can pick up a british style MOLLE belt for $20 usually.  They are out of stock of the on-sale ones right now, but here's the regular priced ones.  $36.  They also have harnesses on sale, but they don't have a mesh back.  Otherwise their harnesses are legit comfy and have the 8 attachment points no one else seems to have.  Which I wish more people would do  (Diz, I'm looking at you bro.  8 point harnesses, but with a mesh back.  Just copy the SORD design and put a mesh back into it)

https://www.sordusa.com/belt-pad-patrol-order-sbc~2439537

For the Harness / Yoke, Sportsman's Guide current is selling 3 x Danish PLCE harnesses for $20.  They are brand new.  They would also be a good, cheap upgrade for your old ALICE setups if you guys have one of those you are using.

https://www.sportsmansguide.com/product/index/danish-military-surplus-load-bearing-suspenders-3-pack-new?a=2190648&_br_psugg_q=danish

The SORD harness I mentioned above.  From what I hear, JayJay's harness seems to be the most comfortable harness out there, but they are $$$ to get shipped over here.  I haven't tried it yet.  I wish it had 8 x attachment points like the SORD harness.

Ok, Utility and Canteen pouches.

You can get British (or Dutch / Danish / Czech, they are the same thing, different camo color) surplus MOLLE pouches from various places.  They are out of stock here, but this is the kind of thing to look for.  They have 3 or 4 different utility and canteen pouch types.  They are all cheap and usually brand new.  Usually $10 or so each.

The 'Utility' ones have a drawstring inner cover.
Some of the 'Utility' titled ones are the UGL pouches, designed to carry 40mm grenades.  They say UGL on the label, which is on the back of the pouches, under the MOLLE  They are slightly bigger and don't have the drawstring liner.
The canteen ones are even bigger and don't have the liner.
Most of the above have 2 columns of MOLLE.  Some have 3.  I've seen all the above in the British version of Multicam and in the Brit Desert.
I've seen Dutch utility pouches that are bigger too.  The Dutch pouches are in DPM usually.
The Danish pouches are in Danish Flecktarn but are rarer.  They have a weird LMG pouch that has fastec style buckles on the sides too.  It's like a really tall rifle mag pouch.

https://www.varusteleka.com/en/product/british-osprey-general-purpose-pouch-mtp-surplus/29681

Here's the Dutch Utility Pouch for an example of the Dutch ones.

https://www.varusteleka.com/en/product/dutch-molle-pouch-general-purpose-small-surplus/15894

Note on most of the British / Dutch / Etc. surplus pouches - they do NOT have the D-rings or British style attachment points for the Harness / Yoke to attach to.  You will either have to sew one on  (not hard and less than a dollar each in materials), or plan to attach the harness directly to the belt.  The SORD belt I posted above does NOT have attachment points directly on the belt either, as their harness is designed to weave through the MOLLE under the pouches MOLLE.  Which is kind of a cool idea.  (Diz, you should probably look at it if you haven't yet)  

You can mix and match all the above pouches on your belt, generally 2 x pouches for canteen usage + 2 or 3 utility pouches behind those where the ALICE style buttpack would normally go.  They are all the same height, so they would all work in those places.  The Utility pouches with the drawstring are the best, because they can by cinched closed under the main flap for extra retention.  But they are also smaller and getting harder to find, sooooo.

You can also get a regular buttpack instead.  The Velocity one seems nice, I've never messed with it though.  Fireforce makes a MOLLE buttpack - that's what I've using - that is nice and puts the top of the buttpack at the same height as the British surplus pouches, so that it creates that shelf like Diz was talking about.  It gives you a bit more carrying capacity compared to the British pouches, but flops around a bit more.  Pros and cons.  Also 'MURICA! vs. being a King's Man.  The buttpacks generally take up 6 x columns of MOLLE.  So basically takes the place of 3 x of the British Utility pouches as shown above.

The Fireforce Buttpack DOES have D-rings to directly attach the harness to.  I think the Velocity one does too.

https://www.fireforcetactical.com/molle-field-butt-pack.html

Ok, magazine pouches.  I personally have a set of the Velocity magazine pouches, which I quite like.  Lightweight and do what they need to do.  I agree with Diz, they need stiffeners and I prefer the fabric tuck-in system like UW Gear uses.  The British spanish fly style closure system isn't bad either.  The Velocity magazine pouches have MOLLE on the sides to add more pouches and DO have D-Rings on top for harness attachment.  But they are $$$ and have a wait period.

If you want to go cheap, the Dutch surplus magazine pouches are good.  Nothing at all wrong with them.  Hold 3 x magazines.  Usually $8-10 each.

https://www.varusteleka.com/en/product/dutch-molle-pouch-magazine-surplus/15897

Fireforce also has triple magazine pouches that are designed to run on a belt kit.  I haven't tried them.  My Fireforce buttpack is well made, and I don't see these being and different.  They are double-layered they say, I don't know if they have a stiffener, but with the double layer they will probably stay open?  They look like they will be the same-ish height as the British Utility pouches. I almost got these instead of the Velocity ones.

https://www.fireforcetactical.com/airborne-series-single-pocket-triple-mag-pouch-molle.html


For packs, you need to be careful what pack you will run with these.  You aren't going to use a waist-belt to stabilize the pack on your hips.  You will rest the back of the pack directly on the 'shelf' created by the Utility Pouches / Buttpack.  Not all packs are designed to ride that high.  Oldschool ALICE packs will do it.  Same with various aftermarket ALICE style packs (Tactical Tailor makes one)  SOME of the British Bergen's will do it from what I've read.  You want to find the SHORT backed British bergens.  Which most places (none here in the USA that I've seen) differentiate between them.  I don't know the specifics of how to ID them, so maybe someone else can jump in here.

I use one of the Crossfire packs.  $$$ but they are REALLY nice.  A few people have discount codes for them.  I think Brent on Youtube has one?  

https://www.crossfirepacks.com/product/dg-3-detatchable-lid/

One more thing to thing with the British style pouch setup.  The British PLCE pouches (the non-MOLLE ones) have little loops to attach a bungie cord to to cinch the pouches tight, which makes them more stable.  You can see it in the picture below.  The Velocity magazine pouches have this little feature too.  



I can see how sewing the rear pouches all together before attaching will make them more stable.  Once I am SURE I like my setup, I'm going to do this.

Sewing them directly to the belt - at least the canteen / utility / buttpack pouches - would be even better.  Then you can mix and match the ammo / commander / whatever pouches how you like while having the more stable, lighter setup sewn to the belt.

If you go the cheap route with surplus ammo / canteen / utility pouches above and an on-sale SORD belt, surplus harness, you can put together a whole setup for less than $150 to see if you like the setup.  The surplus non-MOLLE PLCE setup above from BudK and 3 more pouches from Hessen will run you $70 or so.  If you are in the SE part of the USA, where temps are 90-100 degrees in the summer with high humidity, this kind of setup kinda makes sense, that humidity is WAY different than what our troops were dealing with in the middle east with the heat......

hell to the no.

Not for $600.

Not when it's literally the British PLCE kit that you can usually get for like $80-120

https://bulldog-tactical-gear.co.uk/products/rifleman-webbing-set

The Brits really figured out light Infantry gear decades before the US did.

no, this kit is made for infantry fighting in the brush. From the prone, no plates bc it's the jungle and you're gonna die of heat stroke trying to patrol around with armor on. You will be low and/or behind something when reloading. You have time. You will literally never reload standing up in the open... unless you're reloading on the run.

I like mine, but man are those buckles tiny.

I run a bungee to kee0 them all tight.

I have some of the Velocity System Jungle pouches, I may build a LBE version, but use the Jay Jay's Hippo Molle belt/bad. I went with a Jay Jay's sewn Commando's kit (vastly improved version of the PLCE kit). It's extremely light, hugs your bad well when doing dynamic moves, and while it's a wider hip belt, it's tolerable for the hotter, humid summers here in GA. The key is the hydrophobic material that doesn't retain water (like the helium fabric). The only issue is if you want a traditional butt pack (like the Velocity Systems). Here's a great video and review of Jay Jay's kit and how well it does for general patrolling maneuvers



ROCK6

I love the british kit and i am believe it is maybe the best way. I was trained in a similar fashion and when possible carried gear that way (it was possible a few times when i was Active Duty, unluckily).

That say the more i look at it and the more i am convinced that it won't be applied to US military clientele. Doctrine is too different to imagine that ground pounders will carry a british loadout in a british carrying equipment. Special Forces today usually don't carry all that junk.  Maybe it will still work on some Long Range Surveillance or Reconnaissance. Not vehicle friendly and not jumpable when worn (atleast i think so, if i recall correctly from joint training brits jumped their webbing in drop bags).
Alice has a heritage that would be difficult to overcome.

Also, as of today there is a very slim chance that you won't use armor. Brits training jungle starting wearing armor in training.  For Insurance i think.

At the risk of swerving outside my "lane", I'd suggest some folks might find this 420-page book interesting.  While dated, it at least gives some historical context and shows how some good ideas were developed over time and with practical experience. This in not a purely historical book, though.  Submit many valuable "nuggets" can be found within it.

Jungle Snafus--And Remedies

Unfortunately, the book seems to be out-of-print, so hard to get.  Pity.  This book ought to be required reading for any gear designer, as Kearny describes his experiments and testing methods in some detail.

Well-worth finding if you come across it; there may be some hard copies out there, and possibly some pdfs.  Please post them if you find them.

FWIW, an hour+ long speech on the web: https://archive.org/details/JungleSnafusAndRemediesAndUpcomingAnthraxAndFalloutSnafus.Cresson

Wiki Bio, and a link to free pdf of belowmentioned book: Cresson H Kearny Wiki Bio  

Cresson Kearny was a "unique" character, and IMHO, something of a genius in his field(s).  Another of his books is "Nuclear War Survival Skills", and IIRC, that book is available for free pdf download.

Kearny literally invented many items we take for granted today; not his fault that the Mil cheaped-out on some features and ruined some items.