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Posted: 10/19/2023 11:45:46 AM EDT
| What’s the going rate these days? I’m thinking about selling mine. It’s black with I think ten mags. I also have the original box. Only thing I changed was the muzzle device and the grip. I still have the original parts as well. Looking at the EE it seems prices are all over the place. |
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| The reason that prices are all over the place is that there is a big price difference between the original, imported "Made in Belgium" guns and the more recent "Made in USA" guns. How recently did you buy the gun? Does it have white markings on the left side of the receiver, or are they just engraved without white filling? The Belgian made guns have the white markings whereas the US made units have the latter. |
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Originally Posted By cnoteleo: Is there any quality or longevity differences between US and Belgium made? I've got the least desirable model, a black US made 17. I doubt it but I also sought out a Belgian model and probably paid up for it just because I think it’s cool. In order from most to least valuable I’d say it goes. US NRCH, Belgian RCH, US RCH |
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Originally Posted By Mblades: I doubt it but I also sought out a Belgian model and probably paid up for it just because I think it’s cool. In order from most to least valuable I’d say it goes. US NRCH, Belgian RCH, US RCH I disagree with this assessment - the Belgian RCH version will always be the most valuable due to the collector's interest it has garnered being that it is an original, factory-produced weapon made to the original SOCOM specifications. As for RCH vs NRCH, I agree that the market seems to prefer the RCH version (note that there do not exist any NRCH Belgian rifles). Be that as it may however, I personally do strongly dislike the NRCH version and far prefer the original, simple reciprocating charging handle both from a design perspective as well as a shooting perspective (I run it on the right side like a Kalashnikov). I do understand that I am in the minority with that opinion though. |
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Originally Posted By eugene_stoner: I disagree with this assessment - the Belgian RCH version will always be the most valuable due to the collector's interest it has garnered being that it is an original, factory-produced weapon made to the original SOCOM specifications. As for RCH vs NRCH, I agree that the market seems to prefer the RCH version (note that there do not exist any NRCH Belgian rifles). Be that as it may however, I personally do strongly dislike the NRCH version and far prefer the original, simple reciprocating charging handle both from a design perspective as well as a shooting perspective (I run it on the right side like a Kalashnikov). I do understand that I am in the minority with that opinion though. How can you tell where it’s made just from the rifle itself? I really haven’t looked. |
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Originally Posted By Steamedliver: How can you tell where it’s made just from the rifle itself? I really haven’t looked. You could have to look at the markings on the left side of the receiver. The Belgian rifles are marked "FN HERSTAL BELGIUM" whereas the US rifles are marked "FN COLUMBIA, SC USA" Note also that the markings on the Belgian guns are engraved and then filled white, whereas on the US guns, the markings are engraved prior to anodizing with no white coloring. This allows you to tell where the rifle was made instantly even if you cannot resolve the text of the markings. |
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Originally Posted By eugene_stoner: You could have to look at the markings on the left side of the receiver. The Belgian rifles are marked "FN HERSTAL BELGIUM" whereas the US rifles are marked "FN COLUMBIA, SC USA" Note also that the markings on the Belgian guns are engraved and then filled white, whereas on the US guns, the markings are engraved prior to anodizing with no white coloring. This allows you to tell where the rifle was made instantly even if you cannot resolve the text of the markings. they arent filled in white on the belgium guns, thats how the lasering turns out when you surface laser. The US guns are much deeper engraved so it doesn't turn white. |
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Originally Posted By brodband8: they arent filled in white on the belgium guns, thats how the lasering turns out when you surface laser. The US guns are much deeper engraved so it doesn't turn white. Thank you for the correction - my point was mores just that the markings on the Belgian guns appear white which allows you to tell them apart from the US made guns instantly. If the lasered surface turns out white, then could the difference simply be that the US guns are anodized after lasering whereas they laser the markings on after anodizing on the US guns? |
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Originally Posted By eugene_stoner: I disagree with this assessment - the Belgian RCH version will always be the most valuable due to the collector's interest it has garnered being that it is an original, factory-produced weapon made to the original SOCOM specifications. As for RCH vs NRCH, I agree that the market seems to prefer the RCH version (note that there do not exist any NRCH Belgian rifles). Be that as it may however, I personally do strongly dislike the NRCH version and far prefer the original, simple reciprocating charging handle both from a design perspective as well as a shooting perspective (I run it on the right side like a Kalashnikov). I do understand that I am in the minority with that opinion though. Originally Posted By eugene_stoner: Originally Posted By Mblades: I doubt it but I also sought out a Belgian model and probably paid up for it just because I think it’s cool. In order from most to least valuable I’d say it goes. US NRCH, Belgian RCH, US RCH I disagree with this assessment - the Belgian RCH version will always be the most valuable due to the collector's interest it has garnered being that it is an original, factory-produced weapon made to the original SOCOM specifications. As for RCH vs NRCH, I agree that the market seems to prefer the RCH version (note that there do not exist any NRCH Belgian rifles). Be that as it may however, I personally do strongly dislike the NRCH version and far prefer the original, simple reciprocating charging handle both from a design perspective as well as a shooting perspective (I run it on the right side like a Kalashnikov). I do understand that I am in the minority with that opinion though. I see the appeal of the OG Belgian, like I said I sought one out but I think we’re in the minority and market prices reflect that. I found a like new, possibly never fired after leaving the factory for less than I’ve seen any NRCH go for. I don’t have an undying hatred for the RCH like some do and I honestly don’t even notice it on my 20 but if I could snap my fingers and have my 17 go from RCH to NRCH I would. Most people prefer the NRCH, most people don’t care about the country of origin, combine that with the outrageous price for the conversion kit and that’s why the NRCH commands a premium. |
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Another point to bring up is that it is true that they only discontinued the Belgian production units recently, maybe a few years back so the days of being able to pick up Belgian rifles is still fresh in the mind of most buyers. I can assure you that the Belgian guns will be worth a heavy premium come 10 or 15 years. Not saying that's a good or bad thing, but it is more or less inevitable. Look at what happened to the FNC and FS2000 rifles over the years. I would argue moreover that neither of those systems are as iconic as the SCAR and are still commanding insane prices as are pre-ban, factory Belgian FAL rifles. |
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Originally Posted By eugene_stoner: Another point to bring up is that it is true that they only discontinued the Belgian production units recently, maybe a few years back so the days of being able to pick up Belgian rifles is still fresh in the mind of most buyers. I can assure you that the Belgian guns will be worth a heavy premium come 10 or 15 years. Not saying that's a good or bad thing, but it is more or less inevitable. Look at what happened to the FNC and FS2000 rifles over the years. I would argue moreover that neither of those systems are as iconic as the SCAR and are still commanding insane prices as are pre-ban, factory Belgian FAL rifles. It comes down to supply and demand. The other rifles you listed all have very limited supply, how many FNCs were imported? Probably only a couple thousand, the FS2000 was never popular and had a short production run, pre-ban FALs I’d also assume made it over here in limited numbers a long time ago. Compare that to the SCAR 17S which has been available to US consumers for well over a decade and made in huge numbers compared to those other rifles. I think you may be over estimating the number of people who care about having an original Belgian gun vs the latest production with upgrades like the NRCH and high pressure bolt. This thread is clearly full of those people but this forum hardly has any traffic and we are only talking about a handful of individuals and there are tens of thousands of Belgian SCARs to meet that demand. |
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Originally Posted By eugene_stoner: Another point to bring up is that it is true that they only discontinued the Belgian production units recently, maybe a few years back so the days of being able to pick up Belgian rifles is still fresh in the mind of most buyers. I can assure you that the Belgian guns will be worth a heavy premium come 10 or 15 years. Not saying that's a good or bad thing, but it is more or less inevitable. Look at what happened to the FNC and FS2000 rifles over the years. I would argue moreover that neither of those systems are as iconic as the SCAR and are still commanding insane prices as are pre-ban, factory Belgian FAL rifles. Originally Posted By eugene_stoner: Another point to bring up is that it is true that they only discontinued the Belgian production units recently, maybe a few years back so the days of being able to pick up Belgian rifles is still fresh in the mind of most buyers. I can assure you that the Belgian guns will be worth a heavy premium come 10 or 15 years. Not saying that's a good or bad thing, but it is more or less inevitable. Look at what happened to the FNC and FS2000 rifles over the years. I would argue moreover that neither of those systems are as iconic as the SCAR and are still commanding insane prices as are pre-ban, factory Belgian FAL rifles. FS2000s have not appreciated that much. A number have recently sold for well under $3K, including the one I bought earlier this year. They are not in the same league as original FN FALs or FNCs. Would disagree that the FNC is not iconic (to quote GD, "the gun from HEAT"), however note the availability of transferable sears for that gun also increased demand/prices at one point in time. Originally Posted By Mblades: It comes down to supply and demand. The other rifles you listed all have very limited supply, how many FNCs were imported? Probably only a couple thousand, the FS2000 was never popular and had a short production run, pre-ban FALs I’d also assume made it over here in limited numbers a long time ago. Compare that to the SCAR 17S which has been available to US consumers for well over a decade and made in huge numbers compared to those other rifles. I think you may be over estimating the number of people who care about having an original Belgian gun vs the latest production with upgrades like the NRCH and high pressure bolt. This thread is clearly full of those people but this forum hardly has any traffic and we are only talking about a handful of individuals and there are tens of thousands of Belgian SCARs to meet that demand. I've more or less observed this. The used/secondhand Belgian guns I see listed at a premium never sell for the most part, and the ones that do typically sell for less than retail new for a US made NRCH. Belgian guns are only worth more to the people who value that, and those people are not the majority of SCAR owners. |
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Originally Posted By clubmanager1: To clarify for my feeble brain, if I’m only concerned with actual performance, I’m likely best off with the newer US-made version? Especially if one is to suppress? The only difference is going to be reciprocating vs non reciprocating charging handle. |
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Originally Posted By eurotrash: Doesn’t the new US NRCH Scar17 has a higher strength bolt? That makes it more valuable to me. “Clone correctness” for a SCAR is a joke because every variation and optic combo has been spotted in the sandbox. It’s not a higher strength, it’s called the “high pressure” bolt and uses a smaller diameter firing pin to solve the pierced primer problem some 6.5 Creedmoor 20S owners were having. Strength of the scar bolt isn’t something I worry about, in the Henderson defense thread they have an original 6 lug bolt with 80k+ of mostly full auto fire on it. I wouldn’t even be sure all 17 NRCH have the HP bolt as I think the gun came out before the updated bolt. 
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Originally Posted By eugene_stoner: I disagree with this assessment - the Belgian RCH version will always be the most valuable due to the collector's interest it has garnered being that it is an original, factory-produced weapon made to the original SOCOM specifications. As for RCH vs NRCH, I agree that the market seems to prefer the RCH version (note that there do not exist any NRCH Belgian rifles). Be that as it may however, I personally do strongly dislike the NRCH version and far prefer the original, simple reciprocating charging handle both from a design perspective as well as a shooting perspective (I run it on the right side like a Kalashnikov). I do understand that I am in the minority with that opinion though. I added the FN RCH kit to both my Belgian 16s & 17s, so they are out there in that configuration. |
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