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The IWI carmel (Page 11 of 12)
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https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar-15/IWI-Arad-5-launches-in-the-US/126-793522/ Right on cue. Now if they'd update Tavor with the improvements from Carmel and Arad, we'd get WLRN that works :D. Too bad they're CZing themselves by never having parts in stock for what they launch. |
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Originally Posted By DirtDivision: I don’t know man, this may just be my two cents but a guy who works for the company brought the rifle into the states. One that had to be modified to get it to the current US market and it doesn’t align with your desire to have a clone correct rifle hardly seems like he single handedly ruined IWI. Seems like you’re just pouty over it. The Carmel is a solid rifle sorry you’re big sad. The only modification required is to make the lower incapable of accepting a FA trigger pack. All the other changes to the Carmel were down to the personal preferences of a special marketing manager. The extended Mlok forearm is becoming a cliche meme at this point. The Tavor series would seem to be the only rifles in the IWI catalog that have remained unmolested, with no way to ARize them because they're bullpups. |
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Originally Posted By DirtDivision: I don’t know man, this may just be my two cents but a guy who works for the company brought the rifle into the states. One that had to be modified to get it to the current US market and it doesn’t align with your desire to have a clone correct rifle hardly seems like he single handedly ruined IWI. Seems like you’re just pouty over it. The Carmel is a solid rifle sorry you’re big sad. Originally Posted By DirtDivision: Originally Posted By FullAssault: Exactly! yup! Gresham has single-handedly ruined IWI US I don’t know man, this may just be my two cents but a guy who works for the company brought the rifle into the states. One that had to be modified to get it to the current US market and it doesn’t align with your desire to have a clone correct rifle hardly seems like he single handedly ruined IWI. Seems like you’re just pouty over it. The Carmel is a solid rifle sorry you’re big sad. |
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Originally Posted By ARguy: Was it ever determined who was able to cut the Carmel barrels down? I kinda looked back through this thread, and I was not able to figure out for sure exactly what company was able to do them. Pro 2 Customs did mine. Did a great job. Wouldn't hesitate to send them anything else. |
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Yeah. Be careful though. They have a good relationship with IWI. You wouldn’t want someone thinking you’re giving them a reach around. But can confirm that they indeed do great work. |
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Unfortunately, I don't want one even for only $900... https://www.rainierarms.com/iwi-carmel-5-56-nato-rifle-w-side-folding-adjustable-buttstock-16/ ... and the shame of it is I'd pay double or maybe triple for the original and a factory SBR barrel. |
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Yes sir |
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How is the gas with it being cut? @twpayne75 |
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Originally Posted By thehun06: How is the gas with it being cut? @twpayne75 It's my understanding that they open the gas port slightly, how much I have no idea. Shoots as soft as it did new. Have not had any malfunctions suppressed or unsuppressed. It will not cycle on the suppressed setting without a suppressor. So I'm assuming they have it pretty dialed in. |
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Originally Posted By twpayne75: It's my understanding that they open the gas port slightly, how much I have no idea. Shoots as soft as it did new. Have not had any malfunctions suppressed or unsuppressed. It will not cycle on the suppressed setting without a suppressor. So I'm assuming they have it pretty dialed in. IWI Carmel is a soft shooting rifle |
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Originally Posted By Master_Blaster: 5.56 cal is a soft shooting round. Originally Posted By Master_Blaster: Originally Posted By thehun06: IWI Carmel is a soft shooting rifle 5.56 cal is a soft shooting round. To be fair, in a badly designed rifle, any round can be miserable.  I haven’t shot a Carmel but I usually trust IWI to know what they are doing to not design badly shooting guns. A properly tuned piston gun can be extremely nice. |
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The opinions expressed here are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views of my employer or their customers.
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Originally Posted By Findsman: To be fair, in a badly designed rifle, any round can be miserable. I haven’t shot a Carmel but I usually trust IWI to know what they are doing to not design badly shooting guns. A properly tuned piston gun can be extremely nice. Engineering-wise, IWI is very GTG. Product design-wise, they could use some changes. 1 change, to be precise. |
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Originally Posted By Master_Blaster: Engineering-wise, IWI is very GTG. Product design-wise, they could use some changes. 1 change, to be precise. Originally Posted By Master_Blaster: Originally Posted By Findsman: To be fair, in a badly designed rifle, any round can be miserable. I haven’t shot a Carmel but I usually trust IWI to know what they are doing to not design badly shooting guns. A properly tuned piston gun can be extremely nice. Engineering-wise, IWI is very GTG. Product design-wise, they could use some changes. 1 change, to be precise. Attached File OMG It's perfect now!!!!11
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The opinions expressed here are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views of my employer or their customers.
The opinions expressed here are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views of my employer or their customers.
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Originally Posted By Findsman: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/35747/awful_tavor_7_jpg-3803484.JPG OMG It's perfect now!!!!11 Care to bet on whose name is behind this? |
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Originally Posted By Master_Blaster: Care to bet on whose name is behind this? I created this particular abomination.  But you could say I was inspired by someone’s efforts.  The singular gentleman responsible for taking the nicely balanced Galil Ace and giving us the ungainly Ace Gen2. I had hoped his influence would have waned by now, especially with the move to the new TN facility but I suppose he went along with it.
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Support the Firearms Policy Coalition and help save the Second Amendment: https://www.firearmspolicy.org
The opinions expressed here are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views of my employer or their customers.
The opinions expressed here are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views of my employer or their customers.
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Originally Posted By Findsman: I created this particular abomination. But you could say I was inspired by someone’s efforts. The singular gentleman responsible for taking the nicely balanced Galil Ace and giving us the ungainly Ace Gen2. I had hoped his influence would have waned by now, especially with the move to the new TN facility but I suppose he went along with it.Is this the way the T7 will be going forward? |
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Originally Posted By Master_Blaster: Is this the way the T7 will be going forward? No! This was an AI-created joke. The stuff direct from Israel tends to be safe from Gresham’s influence. |
Support the Firearms Policy Coalition and help save the Second Amendment: https://www.firearmspolicy.org
The opinions expressed here are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views of my employer or their customers.
The opinions expressed here are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views of my employer or their customers.
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Originally Posted By Findsman: No! This was an AI-created joke. The stuff direct from Israel tends to be safe from Gresham’s influence. Originally Posted By Findsman: Originally Posted By Master_Blaster: Is this the way the T7 will be going forward? No! This was an AI-created joke. The stuff direct from Israel tends to be safe from Gresham’s influence. Was about to say, that had to be a 24" barrel. |
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Originally Posted By Findsman: No! This was an AI-created joke. The stuff direct from Israel tends to be safe from Gresham’s influence. Originally Posted By Findsman: Originally Posted By Master_Blaster: Is this the way the T7 will be going forward? No! This was an AI-created joke. The stuff direct from Israel tends to be safe from Gresham’s influence. Tempted to make that rail just cause Sven Manticore Arms |
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Originally Posted By Manticore_Arms: Tempted to make that rail just cause Sven Manticore Arms You ever need a questionable idea product designer, I’m your man! 
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The opinions expressed here are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views of my employer or their customers.
The opinions expressed here are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views of my employer or their customers.
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Originally Posted By FullAssault: Grisham is running out of designs to ruin so he’s looking for new way to fubar IWI. IWI has just become really disappointing. The only guns they haven't really fucked up yet are the X95 and the Tavor 7. They completely ruined the aesthetics of the Galil ACE with the Gen 2. It's still a great gun, but now it just looks like another AR/AK hybrid. They ruined the looks of the Carmel and now have changed from a chrome lined barrel to nitride. I was super pumped for the ARAD to hopefully become available since IWI prices their guns really competitively. They release it and it's on their basic Zion lower, and has a basic 4150 CMV barrel. The handguard also looks like shit compared to the original ARAD. |
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Originally Posted By Zeebz: IWI has just become really disappointing. The only guns they haven't really fucked up yet are the X95 and the Tavor 7. They completely ruined the aesthetics of the Galil ACE with the Gen 2. It's still a great gun, but now it just looks like another AR/AK hybrid. They ruined the looks of the Carmel and now have changed from a chrome lined barrel to nitride. I was super pumped for the ARAD to hopefully become available since IWI prices their guns really competitively. They release it and it's on their basic Zion lower, and has a basic 4150 CMV barrel. The handguard also looks like shit compared to the original ARAD. From what I heard they canned the T7 but yeah. The X95 is pretty much the only unmolested firearm they offer now. |
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Originally Posted By thehun06: What is going on with IWI … they aren’t making solid decisions lately. Originally Posted By thehun06: What is going on with IWI … they aren’t making solid decisions lately. 1 individual is what's going on. Originally Posted By FullAssault: From what I heard they canned the T7 but yeah. The X95 is pretty much the only unmolested firearm they offer now. Doesn't jive with my AI & search results. |
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I was over in Idaho and stopped by a shop that had a couple Carmels. I think I gave that thing a fair shake, and didn't see to much to get excited about. Chunky forend, triggers were not good, charging handle was stiff. You want a novelty? Sure, it's at least got that going for it. I'll keep my eyes open for the chance to shoot one- I'll shoot just about anything once- and more options for us consumers is more cooler. |
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I don't know what IWI doesn't get. Sell us the overseas version as closely as possible and don't add anything to it. That is what we want. The gen 1 Galil ACE line is proof of this. IWI can then offer an optional handguard or let the aftermarket take over. That is how the US gun market thrives. Or at least offer the overseas option as an upgraded part. That would be one way to get some follow up sales. Right now, Manticore gets much of my money (& will get more) for aftermarket IWI parts. With that said, I don't hate the Carmel stock handguard. I don't love it, but it doesn't repulse me. I much rather have a version of the overseas version like most of you. I say that without handling a Carmel in person, so I can still learn to hate it.  I will also say I'm a designer by trade (pool & landscaping), so while not related, I appreciate quirky designs. I liked the Beretta ARX-100 rifle, so I think the Carmel is also an interested gun.I have a couple of Tavor-7s (16" & 20") and a TS-12. Those are guns that when I saw them, I knew it was just a matter of time before one came home with me. Luckily I got a deal on all three in separate purchases (lowish bids on Gunbroker between projects at work). I'm in between commission checks, otherwise I would have bought a Carmel that was for sale at a local shop for $899 (under $1K out the door). But another one will cross my path sooner or later. |
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Originally Posted By FullAssault: Just going by hearsay on a couple of IWI boards. Regardless IWI US has got the $ from me until they offer something worth buying again. Originally Posted By FullAssault: Originally Posted By Master_Blaster: Doesn't jive with my AI & search results. Just going by hearsay on a couple of IWI boards. Regardless IWI US has got the $ from me until they offer something worth buying again. I am way closer connected to IWI than Facebook, Reddit, and forum scraping AI and I have not heard anything about the Tavor 7 being discontinued now or in the near future. In fact, as I recall they were assembling them and TS12’s when I was in the factory for a meeting earlier this year. Of course people on those same forums and AI insisted our Tavor 7 Overwatch top rail was discontinued, even though I knew 100% it was still in production, just delayed by an issue with our base extrusion supplier. I literally had people tell me I was wrong, it was hilarious/insane. Even basic logic says they have a pretty captured market with a semiauto 308 bullpup- what other competition is there? Kel Tec? Desert Tech? Sven Manticore Arms |
Your best source for bullpup upgrades including the Hellion, Tavor, and AUG! www.manticorearms.com
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Originally Posted By Manticore_Arms: I am way closer connected to IWI than Facebook, Reddit, and forum scraping AI and I have not heard anything about the Tavor 7 being discontinued now or in the near future. In fact, as I recall they were assembling them and TS12’s when I was in the factory for a meeting earlier this year. Of course people on those same forums and AI insisted our Tavor 7 Overwatch top rail was discontinued, even though I knew 100% it was still in production, just delayed by an issue with our base extrusion supplier. I literally had people tell me I was wrong, it was hilarious/insane. Even basic logic says they have a pretty captured market with a semiauto 308 bullpup- what other competition is there? Kel Tec? Desert Tech? Sven Manticore Arms You should tell them to stop jacking with OG designs. Carmel would have been a WILD success with the OG handguard. |
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Originally Posted By thehun06: You should tell them to stop jacking with OG designs. Carmel would have been a WILD success with the OG handguard. I don’t know about wild success but they would have sold more of them. At least you could rationalize it by saying, well, that’s how it was issued. As currently configured, it’s a football bat. Never going to be used for anything by anyone no matter how “updated” IWI insists on making it. |
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I won’t lie, I definitely agree that the prototype handguard was aesthetically more betterer than the rain spout square tube they ultimately shipped it with. That said, I don’t think the Carmel has been delivered with anything other than that handguard. The Israeli main site has been updated to show it as well. I think the platform has failed to gain any traction or foothold in the market. Which isn’t to say it’s a bad gun or anything, just a commercial flop. There’s zero incentive on IWI’s part to do anything else with it; I suspect we’ll see more from the Arad line instead. |
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The opinions expressed here are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views of my employer or their customers.
The opinions expressed here are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views of my employer or their customers.
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Well. Truth be told the Carmel in its OG design was never issued … so I get it but it is a much better design IMHO asthetically and from the looks of it, ergonomically. I agree. The ARAD is IWIs future system and it is a good one. I personally still feel that the Carmel is an excellent rifle. Especially for the current price! |
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Originally Posted By Manticore_Arms: I am way closer connected to IWI than Facebook, Reddit, and forum scraping AI and I have not heard anything about the Tavor 7 being discontinued now or in the near future. In fact, as I recall they were assembling them and TS12’s when I was in the factory for a meeting earlier this year. Of course people on those same forums and AI insisted our Tavor 7 Overwatch top rail was discontinued, even though I knew 100% it was still in production, just delayed by an issue with our base extrusion supplier. I literally had people tell me I was wrong, it was hilarious/insane. Even basic logic says they have a pretty captured market with a semiauto 308 bullpup- what other competition is there? Kel Tec? Desert Tech? Sven Manticore Arms |
The IWI carmel (Page 11 of 12)
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