Armory Sponsor
Posted: 3/14/2025 11:07:18 AM EDT
|
I have a few mgs and regularly watch gunbroker for new listings. It seems that things might have peeked last year and prices overall are down, or not selling at all. I'd be okay with a market correction on prices overall. But I wonder if you think these are just a sign of the times or something else? For example there are at least a couple m11s going for under 12k without bids and a half dozen finished listings without bids in that same ballpark. Seems like yesterday they were dirt cheap and then boom. Now they're not moving. |
Make your own Exploding Targets!
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=75&t=472752
Make your own Tac-Sling!
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=4&t=233665
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=75&t=472752
Make your own Tac-Sling!
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=4&t=233665
|
Originally Posted By osprey21: I've seen it happen before. When was the last time and circumstances? How long did it last? |
Make your own Exploding Targets!
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=75&t=472752
Make your own Tac-Sling!
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=4&t=233665
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=75&t=472752
Make your own Tac-Sling!
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=4&t=233665
|
Originally Posted By SGT-Fish: I can't recall last time it was down across the board. But I remember M2 50cals dropping way down for a period of time in the 2010s. Prices go up and down, but trend up over time. Roughly mid-2008 through mid-2010 the MG market was down or flat at best. You might recall, this was the era commonly called "The Great Recession"; or "post-Big Short Fallout"; or the "Bear Stearns/Lehman Bros. Failures Aftermath". And FWIW, the current MG pricing proves something I've said all along - there's no such thing as a "Lage Effect". With the recent introduction of Lage's VERSA uppers, according to the mistaken, though popular belief, M10, M11/9, and M11-380 prices are supposed to be rising, not flat or falling. And I do own an M11/380, so my post is not a 'sour grapes' comment. My net worth is getting hit, same as any other MAC owner. MHO, YMMV, etc. |
|
Originally Posted By SecondAmend: Roughly mid-2008 through mid-2010 the MG market was down or flat at best. You might recall, this was the era commonly called "The Great Recession"; or "post-Big Short Fallout"; or the "Bear Stearns/Lehman Bros. Failures Aftermath". And FWIW, the current MG pricing proves something I've said all along - there's no such thing as a "Lage Effect". With the recent introduction of Lage's VERSA uppers, according to the mistaken, though popular belief, M10, M11/9, and M11-380 prices are supposed to be rising, not flat or falling. And I do own an M11/380, so my post is not a 'sour grapes' comment. My net worth is getting hit, same as any other MAC owner. MHO, YMMV, etc. I have to disagree. The Lage effect is there for Mac. My Mac was half the price they are asking now when I bought it a few short years ago. Mine also came with 50 grease gun mags. The Max31 had just hit the market, the Max15 soon after. I think the versa is kinda flat but the other 2 were revolutionary for the Mac. The versa is basically the same thing as the Max31 with different mags. Those who already have a Max31 and mags likely won't buy it. If Lage came out with a belt fed you would see Mac prices jump again. When A&S finally gets the approval for their adapter you'll see Mac prices bump again. There was definitely a very significant bump in "value" in the last 4-5 years in the Mac world. Without anything really new or novel prices will stay relatively flat. When people don't have money prices will stay relatively flat for toys. |
|
Originally Posted By Deerhurst: I have to disagree. The Lage effect is there for Mac. My Mac was half the price they are asking now when I bought it a few short years ago. Mine also came with 50 grease gun mags. The Max31 had just hit the market, the Max15 soon after. I think the versa is kinda flat but the other 2 were revolutionary for the Mac. The versa is basically the same thing as the Max31 with different mags. Those who already have a Max31 and mags likely won't buy it. If Lage came out with a belt fed you would see Mac prices jump again. When A&S finally gets the approval for their adapter you'll see Mac prices bump again. There was definitely a very significant bump in "value" in the last 4-5 years in the Mac world. Without anything really new or novel prices will stay relatively flat. When people don't have money prices will stay relatively flat for toys. There was no drop in MAC prices when Lage discontinued his entire line of .22 LR conversions and uppers - that was an entire caliber elimination. By definition, a Lage effect would have produced an across the board price drop in MACs. What happened was existing MAC .22 uppers and conversions from all manufacturers went up in price, while the MAC pricing was unaffected. When Freedom Ordnance asked MACTalk members about developing a 9mm belt fed similar to their FM9 product they have for the M16, less than 30 people expressed interest. A rising tide lifts all ships, and a down-going tide lowers all ships. MAC prices go along with the entire MG marketplace prices - period. The BATFE registration number is what gives MGs value, not the accessories marketplace. MHO, YMMV, etc. |
|
Originally Posted By SecondAmend: There was no drop in MAC prices when Lage discontinued his entire line of .22 LR conversions and uppers - that was an entire caliber elimination. By definition, a Lage effect would have produced an across the board price drop in MACs. What happened was existing MAC .22 uppers and conversions from all manufacturers went up in price, while the MAC pricing was unaffected. When Freedom Ordnance asked MACTalk members about developing a 9mm belt fed similar to their FM9 product they have for the M16, less than 30 people expressed interest. A rising tide lifts all ships, and a down-going tide lowers all ships. MAC prices go along with the entire MG marketplace prices - period. The BATFE registration number is what gives MGs value, not the accessories marketplace. MHO, YMMV, etc. Macs went from 2500 to 15000 in 12 years, a 6x increase, when M16s and others barely doubled. HK sears and DIAS's only went 2x-2.5x in that amount of time. |
| Yep, machine guns are not a straight line to the moon or a miracle investment like some would have you beleive. During the 2nd Obama term people forget that HK sears hit 40k and M16A2s, colt 639, and DIAS were up to 40-45k before receeding downward back to reality and then the artificial spike in all assets during COVID happened. I don't think things will ever come back down to pre covid pricing, but it did seem like I went to bed and woke up the next day and M16A1 that were 22-24k were 30-35k and HK sear with host that were 25-32.5k were 40-50k. A few crazy auction results for M60, MG42, and a couple shooter grade variants of M16 and MP40 have sent those asking prices to the moon as well, but individual sellers and dealers are having a hard time replicating those results. Just in a year to a year and a half weve seen the 120k MG42 auction guns plummet back down into the 60s where they used to be. The auctions have made it hard to be a NFA dealer these days, as everyone wants the final value realized figure on the latest morphys or rock island auction for their stuff, but what they are missing is that that number includes a 20% buyers premium and a 10% sellers fee (they will wave this if you have something extraordinary, but your run of the mill mac or m16 isnt going to do it) that you will never see in the check they cut you along with a 1099 and the risk associated with sending anything to an auction. Of course potential sellers don't want to hear that. I say all this as someone who has multiple transferables and probably an outsized portion of my "investments" in them. I would love to see the prices slide 20% to put things back in line with a market that reflects "normal" inflation, as there are a few guns I want to buy still but can't/won't justify at current pricing. |
|
Originally Posted By SGT-Fish: Macs went from 2500 to 15000 in 12 years, a 6x increase, when M16s and others barely doubled. HK sears and DIAS's only went 2x-2.5x in that amount of time. Yep, there was absolutely a Lage effect when his uppers were first released. I'm lucky to have gotten in right before. I did miss the pre-Internet $400 macs but I was a poor college student then. |
|
Luxury items are the first things people sell or stop buying when tight on cash. There’s a lot of uncertainty in the economy. The stock market is down, along with other investments like real estate, bit coin, etc… |
"I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery". - Thomas Jefferson
Joined:
Nov 2022
Posts:
318
EE: 100% (16)
SD, USA
|
As with anything on sale, now is the time to buy if you’re in the market. Now that we think the R’s are back in charge, prices will drop. If the election went the other way, it would be the end of the world again and another panic frenzy. It happens all the time and it’s about as predictable as the sunrise in the morning. I saw it coming and we preloaded our retirement accounts for the year to take advantage of the down market. I’m currently not looking for anything transferable, but that’s not to say that I would pass on a good deal. They are a small part of our retirement investments that are tangible and get used for entertainment in the interim. Unlike most Title I guns, they do appreciate over time. |
|
Originally Posted By SecondAmend: There was no drop in MAC prices when Lage discontinued his entire line of .22 LR conversions and uppers - that was an entire caliber elimination. By definition, a Lage effect would have produced an across the board price drop in MACs. What happened was existing MAC .22 uppers and conversions from all manufacturers went up in price, while the MAC pricing was unaffected. When Freedom Ordnance asked MACTalk members about developing a 9mm belt fed similar to their FM9 product they have for the M16, less than 30 people expressed interest. A rising tide lifts all ships, and a down-going tide lowers all ships. MAC prices go along with the entire MG marketplace prices - period. The BATFE registration number is what gives MGs value, not the accessories marketplace. MHO, YMMV, etc. The secondary market for those Lage 22LR kits has compensated. Any 22LR kit for a Mac is crazy money. Why get a belt fed 9mm when you can slap a drum in a Max31? Mac prices doubled in a few years. I didn't see M16 prices double. Rarity gives the base value. Next is what the secondary market can do. Toyota is a perfect example of this. A new Toyota costs X. People flock to it because they can get a lift and angry eyes, and this and that. People don't buy a Suzuki with the same intent. People buy guns with an intent of doing something to them. With the Mac now not being a bullet hose due to available uppers values have gone up. They are still the cheapest thing in the game that has M16 like caliber compatibility. |
|
Originally Posted By SGT-Fish: Macs went from 2500 to 15000 in 12 years, a 6x increase, when M16s and others barely doubled. HK sears and DIAS's only went 2x-2.5x in that amount of time. That was all Mr Lages doing. I bought my M11 as soon as the Max11/15 announced. I had no desire to own an Max11/15 (and still don’t) but knew the prices would shoot up with the ability to shoot rifle caliber cartridges and parts comparability with the AR15. It’s been a fantastic investment and the 9mm max11k upper is a blast to shoot. |
"I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery". - Thomas Jefferson
|
Originally Posted By SecondAmend: And FWIW, the current MG pricing proves something I've said all along - there's no such thing as a "Lage Effect". Proves? Current market lag and or an overall price-correction doesn’t change the fact that Richard transformed the platform with quality, innovative products that ACTUALLY came to market and improved the guns’ shootability/versatility/collectibility, which subsequently created more demand (and thus higher prices) for MAC-style receivers. That increased demand is the Lage Effect. |
|
I don’t see a market correction in the most desirable items. I know of two recent transferable FN 240 sales. HK sears and Colt M16s are still selling, just not at pie in the sky asking prices. Lower hanging fruit like Macs have been a little sluggish for awhile. Uzis have also been staying around $18k for a few years now. FNCs have been stagnant at the low 20s for a few years too. I suspect the availability of spare bolts will result in a jump. |
|
MGs are both a luxury toy and an investment. I find that GENERAL pricing mirrors returns from more conventional investments. And almost every time the MG market surges, some investment (Dow, NASDAQ, Bitcoin, gold, and/or commodities) is surging even more. The Lage Effect is real. So is/was the Forgotten Weapons Effect; any time Ian did a video on a specific MG, values for that gun went up for a few weeks to a month. We’re heading into uncertainty. The stock markets are queasy, Bitcoin is down, gold is relatively flat… The overall employment market also seems “nervous” right now. Not saying this is Great Recession II, but I think we’re going to see some stagnation and calming. And yes, it IS possible to lose money on transferable MGs. I know; I was forced to sell a M16 RR at a loss in 2010. It was only a few hundred bucks, but it can and does happen. |
“Don't post anything here or send anything you aren't willing to defend in court.”
-Notcalifornialegal
-Notcalifornialegal
|
Originally Posted By prebans: MGs are both a luxury toy and an investment. I find that GENERAL pricing mirrors returns from more conventional investments. And almost every time the MG market surges, some investment (Dow, NASDAQ, Bitcoin, gold, and/or commodities) is surging even more. The Lage Effect is real. So is/was the Forgotten Weapons Effect; any time Ian did a video on a specific MG, values for that gun went up for a few weeks to a month. We’re heading into uncertainty. The stock markets are queasy, Bitcoin is down, gold is relatively flat… The overall employment market also seems “nervous” right now. Not saying this is Great Recession II, but I think we’re going to see some stagnation and calming. And yes, it IS possible to lose money on transferable MGs. I know; I was forced to sell a M16 RR at a loss in 2010. It was only a few hundred bucks, but it can and does happen. I am going to disagree with part of your assessment..Gold closed over $3000 today and silver is over $33 .. Gold is up $900 in the last year. Silver is up as well.. |
RIP Jeff Reed. Tennessee Squire, Ga. Carry member, NRA,Non-puking 72 ounce drinker 2 of 6 Norcal call sign, Forgotten.
|
Originally Posted By whiskerz: I am going to disagree with part of your assessment..Gold closed over $3000 today and silver is over $33 .. Gold is up $900 in the last year. Silver is up as well.. Fair point, and I agree with your correction. My personal knowledge on gold and silver isn’t great. But I’ll stand by my original overall point that the MG market seems to rise when more conventional investments rise and stagnates to falls when more conventional investments fall. THANK YOU for the info about silver. I recently inherited a pile of silver and have no idea what it’s worth or what to do with it. ETA: Holy hell, just checked silver’s spot price. I thought it was in the high teens to low $20s/oz. Looks like it’s around the mid-$30s now. WOW. At this rate, it can continue sitting for a while longer! 
|
“Don't post anything here or send anything you aren't willing to defend in court.”
-Notcalifornialegal
-Notcalifornialegal
Joined:
Nov 2022
Posts:
324
EE: 100% (16)
SD, USA
|
Originally Posted By prebans: ETA: Holy hell, just checked silver’s spot price. I thought it was in the high teens to low $20s/oz. Looks like it’s around the mid-$30s now. WOW. At this rate, it can continue sitting for a while longer! If I were you, I’d cash it out while it’s high and put the money into your IRA mutuals while they’re low (on sale). You’ll be that much more ahead when the market starts going back up. |
| So, buying my M11-9 for $650 in 1996 was a pretty good deal, eh? Should have bought a few more...I couldn't afford the $$$$ for an M16 (was it $5K then? Or was that for an MP5?)...but I could afford a Mac, right out of college, bought my first house, first machine gun....fun times!!! |
|
Originally Posted By Captain_Buddha: So, buying my M11-9 for $650 in 1996 was a pretty good deal, eh? Should have bought a few more...I couldn't afford the $$$$ for an M16 (was it $5K then? Or was that for an MP5?)...but I could afford a Mac, right out of college, bought my first house, first machine gun....fun times!!! I bought my first MG in my mid-20s. Had the whole dual income no kids thing going on. Now I’m just thankful if I can afford ammo to go shooting. |
"I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery". - Thomas Jefferson
|
Originally Posted By Captain_Buddha: So, buying my M11-9 for $650 in 1996 was a pretty good deal, eh? Should have bought a few more...I couldn't afford the $$$$ for an M16 (was it $5K then? Or was that for an MP5?)...but I could afford a Mac, right out of college, bought my first house, first machine gun....fun times!!! Originally Posted By Captain_Buddha: So, buying my M11-9 for $650 in 1996 was a pretty good deal, eh? Should have bought a few more...I couldn't afford the $$$$ for an M16 (was it $5K then? Or was that for an MP5?)...but I could afford a Mac, right out of college, bought my first house, first machine gun....fun times!!! I still kick myself for what I didn’t buy in the 90s.  My first was a presample Uzi for $2,450 shipped in 2005. It was one of the guns which went transferable and was a 1969 import, so it has been an excellent now-C&R purchase. My first transferable was a Jap 99 LMG DEWAT in 2006 for less than your Mac.  But after buying parts and paying for help to rid it of its last DEWAT gremlins, it didn’t stay that cheap. Still a fine purchase though.Originally Posted By Dakota_Don: If I were you, I’d cash it out while it’s high and put the money into your IRA mutuals while they’re low (on sale). You’ll be that much more ahead when the market starts going back up. I don’t think stocks have reached bottom yet. We’ll see how it all plays out. |
“Don't post anything here or send anything you aren't willing to defend in court.”
-Notcalifornialegal
-Notcalifornialegal
|
Originally Posted By Captain_Buddha: So, buying my M11-9 for $650 in 1996 was a pretty good deal, eh? Should have bought a few more...I couldn't afford the $$$$ for an M16 (was it $5K then? Or was that for an MP5?)...but I could afford a Mac, right out of college, bought my first house, first machine gun....fun times!!! Colt M16A1 were around $2500-3k in 96. RRPP mp5 were about $5k. HK sears were around $2k iirc. I remember seeing m11/9 for sale from RPB in Shotgun News for $650 each, as low as $450 each if you bought 20. I didn’t buy, because I was in college and $650 was about 3/4 of my monthly expenses including rent at the time. |
|
Originally Posted By Captain_Buddha: Those numbers sound right....it washed enough to afford the MAC! I really wanted both an M16 and MP5 at the time. Had no idea how crazy prices would get!! LOL!! There was an M16 next to my Mac for $14k when I bought my Mac. Passed on it because it was too expensive. I should have done it. Just a few years later it's now a $30k gun. Ridiculous. |
|
Originally Posted By Deerhurst: There was an M16 next to my Mac for $14k when I bought my Mac. Passed on it because it was too expensive. I should have done it. Just a few years later it's now a $30k gun. Ridiculous. Probably got a better ROI on your Mac |
"I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery". - Thomas Jefferson
|
Originally Posted By Spartikis: Probably got a better ROI on your Mac No, actually. Percent rise in price has actually been less. Then again, my Mac came with 47 grease gun mags so that probably skewed things a little. And now it has more than $4000 in uppers with another hopefully on the way soon. |
|
Originally Posted By Captain_Buddha: So, buying my M11-9 for $650 in 1996 was a pretty good deal, eh? Should have bought a few more...I couldn't afford the $$$$ for an M16 (was it $5K then? Or was that for an MP5?)...but I could afford a Mac, right out of college, bought my first house, first machine gun....fun times!!! I paid $2400 plus stamps for M11/9 and Bowers CAC-9 in '12. I'm still pretty tickled by that, but while it's a respectable subgun, at the end of the day it's a toy. Attached File Attached File |
"Whisky for the gentlemen that like it. And for the gentlemen that don't like it - Whisky!" -Alec Guinness as MAJ (acting Colonel) Jock Sinclair, D.S.O., M.M. "Tunes of Glory"
|
Originally Posted By Bklyn_Irish: I paid $2400 plus stamps for M11/9 and Bowers CAC-9 in '12. I'm still pretty tickled by that, but while it's a respectable subgun, at the end of the day it's a toy. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/33069/1000012715_jpg-3501057.JPGhttps://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/33069/1000003485_jpg-3501058.JPG Very nice!! Yes, at the end of the day - they are just toys! Fun toys though LOL!!! |
Joined:
May 2024
Posts:
708
EE: 0% (0)
PA, USA
|
Originally Posted By Spartikis: Probably got a better ROI on your Mac Whenever there is a pool of collector items, it is assured that the cheaper end will increase in value the most. I'm talking about where there is a decent supply, not some one-off sales. Like the Hope Diamond. It comes down to the size of the pool of buyers. Almost anyone can afford a $3,000 MAC10. For the price of that to double, you only need to add another $3000. The pool of buyers pushing the prices up is literally: any guy who is making decent money. On the other hand, if BARs are going for $60k, for that to double you got to add another $60,000 to the price tag. Now your pool of buyers is rich guys only. You might point out that the supply of MACs is 10 times the supply of BARS. Or even 20 times. But the number of guys who can afford to buy a MAC is literally 1,000 times bigger than the number of guys who can slide BAR money out of their joint checking account with their wife. |
Joined:
May 2024
Posts:
709
EE: 0% (0)
PA, USA
|
Originally Posted By Deerhurst: No, actually. Percent rise in price has actually been less. Then again, my Mac came with 47 grease gun mags so that probably skewed things a little. And now it has more than $4000 in uppers with another hopefully on the way soon. One data point doesn't mean anything. Since I started buying MGs, the price of MACs has gone up about 350% and the price of M16s has gone up 250%. Which is to be expected. |
Joined:
May 2024
Posts:
710
EE: 0% (0)
PA, USA
|
Originally Posted By ggllggll: I have a few mgs and regularly watch gunbroker for new listings. It seems that things might have peeked last year and prices overall are down, or not selling at all. I'd be okay with a market correction on prices overall. But I wonder if you think these are just a sign of the times or something else? For example there are at least a couple m11s going for under 12k without bids and a half dozen finished listings without bids in that same ballpark. Seems like yesterday they were dirt cheap and then boom. Now they're not moving. OP, In the old days, most people didn't even know you could own an MG. Then the internet came along and all the sudden you have youtube videos of guys doing mag dumps, and forums like this one explaining how to buy them. And then MGs became the pinnacle of gun collecting. There is no way on earth that anyone could ever get gun collectors to think of a Luger as being more valuable than a MP-40 again. MGs are a permanent north star in the sky of gun collecting now. This will definitely happen in the future: 1. The price of all these guns will continue to rise until almost all of the new buyers are priced out of the market. When an UZI is $100,000, the pool of buyers will be rich guys only. And then the price will flatline. One rich guy will get a divorce and need the $100k, another rich guy will buy it. No more doubling in price. 2. Whenever there is really bad economy, the price of these guns will dip, maybe even dip hard. The less money there is around, less demand for Hemi Cudas and UZIs. This has been true for forever. This might happen in the future: 3. Your fellow citizens will vote for a pack of despicable socialist scum to run the USA, and they will pass some law that says that you can own an MG, but not sell it. Like they did in Canada. At which time the monetary value of your guns will be zero. I'm not going to worry about it. My dad went to the doctor because of a persistent sore throat. Turns out he had a rare form of cancer and was literally a walking dead man, stone dead a few months later. Don't spend your money like a moron, but remember that there are no guarantees, you might not be here next year. I say this as a guy who has been genuinely responsible and careful with money my whole life. I've been putting 15% of my pay into my 401k like clockwork since the day I started my first job. My wife asked me if I wanted a Rolex, now that we have some money, I told her NO. I don't spend money just for the sake of spending it. My next door neighbor just bought a $80,000 Bronco. I bought a $40,000 Chevy SUV and a $28,000 M16 clone. He lost more money driving that Bronco off the lot than I would lose if my M16 clone gets confiscated by The People's Glorious Revolutionary Democratic Party. So buy what you can reasonably afford, and burn some ammo. Don't worry about it. |
|
Originally Posted By sleestakwhisperer: This might happen in the future: 3. Your fellow citizens will vote for a pack of despicable socialist scum to run the USA, and they will pass some law that says that you can own an MG, but not sell it. Like they did in Canada. At which time the monetary value of your guns will be zero. Alternatively and optimistically, maybe the Hughes amendment will get removed. Then only rare, non-production ones would retain some value. |
Joined:
May 2024
Posts:
715
EE: 0% (0)
PA, USA
|
Originally Posted By LonghornAR: Alternatively and optimistically, maybe the Hughes amendment will get removed. Then only rare, non-production ones would retain some value. The only real job that any politician has is to get re-elected. That's all they actually care about. Politically, machine guns are a radioactive thermonuclear dumpster fire. Guns in general are a radioactive political topic. Remember when Saint Obama the Rock Star President of Sainthood had control of the house and senate? Even though he is a neo-marxist scumbag, he didn't even mention gun control. That's because Senator Porkbelly in Idaho or wherever said to him, "You mention guns and I'm out of a job, because I only won by 1,472 votes last time." What politician is going to walk up to a woman in a supermarket and say, "Hi, I'm Senator Jones! I make a shitload of money for doing nothing, and I almost lost my last election. You know those big scary army guns that spray bullets, that you see in movies all the time, blowing the living f-ck out of people and making cars explode in a gigantic fireball? Well, I want to make it possible for anyone who has $900 to own one! Just anyone who can pass a background check! Won't that be neato? I know that you, as a mother of 3 children, who has never fired a gun before, and who thinks that Kamala seems like a nice person, is really psyched to see a row of gleaming new M16s at your local gun shop, with $900 price tags on them. Vote for meee!" America is a nation of centrist voters and there are no politicians who are going to risk their job so that you and I can have more fun at the range. Has any big-name politician ever even mentioned repealing Hughes at all? Nope. The only way that you'll ever have the Hughes struck down is if the average American voter wants it. And just look at who 50% of the public thought would be a swell president: a marxist, alcoholic DEI hire. |
|
Originally Posted By sleestakwhisperer: ... 3. Your fellow citizens will vote for a pack of despicable socialist scum to run the USA, and they will pass some law that says that you can own an MG, but not sell it. Like they did in Canada. At which time the monetary value of your guns will be zero. ... I was under the impression that at the time the Canadian law was passed, the issuance of new machine gun purchaser licenses was frozen. That meant that machine guns could only be sold to someone who was already licensed as a machine gun purchaser. Ultimately, as licensees pass away, one person in Canada could/would own all the civilian owned machine guns. But they would have had to be at least 21 YO on the date the law went into effect (Aug. 1, 1978??). I'm pretty sure that there is or was at least one Canadian who has/had, over the years, acquired a fairly large Thompson collection (at reasonable prices) which likely will/were ultimately be destroyed when he passes away. MHO, YMMV, etc. |
|
Originally Posted By SecondAmend: I was under the impression that at the time the Canadian law was passed, the issuance of new machine gun purchaser licenses was frozen. That meant that machine guns could only be sold to someone who was already licensed as a machine gun purchaser. Ultimately, as licensees pass away, one person in Canada could/would own all the civilian owned machine guns. But they would have had to be at least 21 YO on the date the law went into effect (Aug. 1, 1978??). I'm pretty sure that there is or was at least one Canadian who has/had, over the years, acquired a fairly large Thompson collection (at reasonable prices) which likely will/were ultimately be destroyed when he passes away. MHO, YMMV, etc. That was my understanding as well, but maybe MGs got lumped in with all handguns under Trudeau’s last gun laws..? |
“Don't post anything here or send anything you aren't willing to defend in court.”
-Notcalifornialegal
-Notcalifornialegal
|
Originally Posted By sleestakwhisperer: The only way that you'll ever have the Hughes struck down is if the average American voter wants it. And just look at who 50% of the public thought would be a swell president: a marxist, alcoholic DEI hire. The same could be said about suppressors yet here we are. |
Joined:
Nov 2022
Posts:
331
EE: 100% (16)
SD, USA
|
Originally Posted By sleestakwhisperer: OP, In the old days, most people didn't even know you could own an MG. Then the internet came along and all the sudden you have youtube videos of guys doing mag dumps, and forums like this one explaining how to buy them. And then MGs became the pinnacle of gun collecting. There is no way on earth that anyone could ever get gun collectors to think of a Luger as being more valuable than a MP-40 again. MGs are a permanent north star in the sky of gun collecting now. This will definitely happen in the future: 1. The price of all these guns will continue to rise until almost all of the new buyers are priced out of the market. When an UZI is $100,000, the pool of buyers will be rich guys only. And then the price will flatline. One rich guy will get a divorce and need the $100k, another rich guy will buy it. No more doubling in price. 2. Whenever there is really bad economy, the price of these guns will dip, maybe even dip hard. The less money there is around, less demand for Hemi Cudas and UZIs. This has been true for forever. This might happen in the future: 3. Your fellow citizens will vote for a pack of despicable socialist scum to run the USA, and they will pass some law that says that you can own an MG, but not sell it. Like they did in Canada. At which time the monetary value of your guns will be zero. I'm not going to worry about it. My dad went to the doctor because of a persistent sore throat. Turns out he had a rare form of cancer and was literally a walking dead man, stone dead a few months later. Don't spend your money like a moron, but remember that there are no guarantees, you might not be here next year. I say this as a guy who has been genuinely responsible and careful with money my whole life. I've been putting 15% of my pay into my 401k like clockwork since the day I started my first job. My wife asked me if I wanted a Rolex, now that we have some money, I told her NO. I don't spend money just for the sake of spending it. My next door neighbor just bought a $80,000 Bronco. I bought a $40,000 Chevy SUV and a $28,000 M16 clone. He lost more money driving that Bronco off the lot than I would lose if my M16 clone gets confiscated by The People's Glorious Revolutionary Democratic Party. So buy what you can reasonably afford, and burn some ammo. Don't worry about it. Too fukn funny. The wife unit wanted me to upgrade in vehicle from my ‘93 Wrangler. Funk that, I have rebuilt almost everything on it and it’s running perfectly. I told her that I’d rather have an M16. She said no right away. Having bought a newish vehicle for her previously and replacing it a decade or so later, helped her decide my way. We sold her newish vehicle for around 10% of what she paid for it. I have kept her in the loop on the appreciation of my MGs since buying them. I made her a bet for $5K that the $25K spent on my M16 vs. the $27K we spent a few years prior for her Jeep would go up in value compared to hers. I drove it home by reminding her what I paid for the others compared to what they’re selling for at that time. She thought about it for five seconds and said do it. Ultimately, I’m not keeping them forever and they’re a sliver of our retirement portfolio. It helps that she likes shooting them too. If you have the disposable income, go for it. If you’re maxing out a credit card or don’t have at least a year’s worth of income in savings, pay off your debt(s) and get your financial house in order first. Whatever you do, don’t confuse mass produced Title I shit with MGs as investments. Those stupid $200 Norinco AKs that are selling for $2K now haven’t even kept up with inflation. |
|
I have a friend who is a MG dealer and hang out with him at shows. Sale prices are down a little across the board and but not tremendously so. Don’t expect the bottom to fall out. Sellers, unless they are desperate, will just take their guns off the market until prices tempt them again. Most transferable MG owners are NOT “desperate” to sell and MGs will always be desirable. There is always far more demand than supply. That being said, “investing” in Government regulation is always a risk. MG dealers price their inventory based on what it will cost them to replace it. It is not a bad time to buy but don’t expect a market crash unless the Hughes Amendment is ever vacated (not likely). |
I will fear no evil: for thou art with me; thy Glock and thy AR15, they comfort me.
Armory Sponsor