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Posted: 8/18/2026 10:14:10 AM EDT
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NFA victory does not apply to PA residents. Just was approved for 2 Form 1's yesterday. Never went through this process before. Took around 2 business days. My questions are: 1. Do I now have to drop copies in the mail of the entire forms (3-4 pages each) to my CLEO (county sheriff)? 2. Do I only need to mail them to CLEO if/when I complete the SBS's assembly? In other words, once I saw the barrel of my sxs. Or since it was approved, automatically need to mail the form to CLEO? Thanks! |
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Originally Posted By willi3d: You were supposed to send the CLEO copy after you submitted it. That’s why the pdf that’s included with the in process/submitted email includes the CLEO copy pages. So.... accompany the approved forms with a dozen donuts and an apology note or ?? |
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Originally Posted By Emt1581: So.... accompany the approved forms with a dozen donuts and an apology note or ?? If you send anything at this point, send the submitted version of the form, just the copy that says "CLEO Copy" at the bottom of each page. It was in the email you got when you submitted the form, the one with the cover letter as well. |
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Originally Posted By D_Man: Don't send the approved forms, they have mor info than the CLEO is entitled to. If you send anything at this point, send the submitted version of the form, just the copy that says "CLEO Copy" at the bottom of each page. It was in the email you got when you submitted the form, the one with the cover letter as well. Didn't realize that. Thanks for sharing! |
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Originally Posted By triode: Most CLEO's do nothing with them (except shred). Really? I would think they would either scan them into a system, then shred (might technically be illegal as a registry but maybe NFA is a different ballgame) or file them in a drawer. What makes you say most shred? |
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Originally Posted By Emt1581: Really? I would think they would either scan them into a system, then shred (might technically be illegal as a registry but maybe NFA is a different ballgame) or file them in a drawer. What makes you say most shred? Originally Posted By Emt1581: Originally Posted By triode: Most CLEO's do nothing with them (except shred). Really? I would think they would either scan them into a system, then shred (might technically be illegal as a registry but maybe NFA is a different ballgame) or file them in a drawer. What makes you say most shred? Title 2 firearms are required by law to be on a registry. It is illegal for the Federal government to maintain a registry of Title 1 firearms, though for all practical purposes they have a mostly complete registry of the first purchaser of all Title 1 firearms made since 1968. |
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Originally Posted By Emt1581: Really? I would think they would either scan them into a system, then shred (might technically be illegal as a registry but maybe NFA is a different ballgame) or file them in a drawer. What makes you say most shred? Because they have no use for them. The only reason they get them is because the regs say you have to notify them that you’re buying or making a NFA item. The concept is that the CLEO can look to see if you’re a prohibited person, but the reality is that no one is going to spend the resources investigating every single application. It’s just a pile of useless paper, plus it could potentially be used against them if the person that was prohibited committed a crime and they were notified and did nothing. |
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It's an antiquated requirement. The original requirement for CLEO approval was to give them an opportunity to prevent "those people" from getting NFA firearms legally. Ninety years ago, long before NCIC, the local sheriff or police chief knew the local trouble makers. They also knew who was Black or Irish Catholic or whatever other prejudices were in style locally. |
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Originally Posted By networkguru: I just had 2 F1's approved today. Filed on Friday afternoon. My Cleo notifications havent even arrived yet LOL. The CLEO Copy was part of the pdf file attached to the email from ATF that I received within two hours of submitting my application on eForms. Has that changed? |
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Originally Posted By OwO: The CLEO Copy was part of the pdf file attached to the email from ATF that I received within two hours of submitting my application on eForms. Has that changed? |
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I had the same issue with Form 1 I filed on Sunday afternoon. I got up Monday morning and the approval was in my inbox. I have been busy at work this week but plan to drop the CLEO portion off in the mail today. Sort of dumb to notify the CLEO after the application is already approved but it is what it is. |
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Originally Posted By D_Man: He means the ATF approved the form so fast that he probably snail mailed the CLEO copies to his CLEO and they're still in the mail. Originally Posted By D_Man: Originally Posted By OwO: The CLEO Copy was part of the pdf file attached to the email from ATF that I received within two hours of submitting my application on eForms. Has that changed? Yes, that is what I meant. I could have been clearer. |
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Originally Posted By para_frame: My county has an email address to send CLEO Notifications, I just do that. Yeah, it leaves a permanent digital trail but the feds already have the form, I don't really care if the Sheriff does too and it gives me a way to prove I sent them if it ever comes up. (Can't imagine how or why though.) |
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Originally Posted By ScottS: I never will understand why people are so nonchalant about sending their CLEO notifications to local LEOs. The chances the AG or Head of the State Police keep some random Form 1/4 is a lot less than a nosy Sheriff or CoP who decides to "keep tabs on his county." My CoP and Sheriff are good guys, but I'm not interested in sharing my NFA inventory with them. I can only speak for myself, but for 25+ years I had to go to the Sheriff office and get a signature from the Sheriff prior to being able to even send the form in the BATFE. I would guess I went to the local Sheriff office maybe 75-ish times between the late 90s to mid 2010s to drop off and pick up paperwork in person for a CLEO signature prior to 41F changing the requirement to CLEO notification. I was there so often that I was on a first name basis with the Sheriff's administrative assistant. At this point am I really cloak and dagger hiding something from the local Sheriff office if I don't mail the 130th-something NFA form to them and instead send it to the State AG? My guess at this point is probably no. |
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Originally Posted By Emt1581: Really? I would think they would either scan them into a system, then shred (might technically be illegal as a registry but maybe NFA is a different ballgame) or file them in a drawer. What makes you say most shred? Originally Posted By Emt1581: Originally Posted By triode: Most CLEO's do nothing with them (except shred). Really? I would think they would either scan them into a system, then shred (might technically be illegal as a registry but maybe NFA is a different ballgame) or file them in a drawer. What makes you say most shred? Besides the direct feedback people have received confirming they are destroyed upon receipt, it is the logical answer. Despite what people think about government organizations and their sinister plans, they are just bureaucratic organizations filled with people just doing their narrow job responsibilities to meet the minimum requirements. They are typically resource constrained. Also, by law, they need to be careful with any documents that have personally identifiable information (PII) - there are special rules for storing either hard copy or electronically (which get inspected for compliance and violations are taken seriously). Plus there is no reason to keep them - they are just to inform the CLEO so they can alert the ATF not to approve someone if the CLEO had some adverse information. In today's digital world, that adverse information is already shared with the central databases. It is an unneeded step in an archaic process, and from direct feedback, most (if not all) CLEOs do nothing with them. They do not have the need or the resources to invest in scanning or even taking up file space, especially since they need to be protected. Therefore the easy answer is the bureaucracies shred upon receipt (doing the minimum and avoiding the need to store PII). Is there the occasional Dr. Evil CLEO planning to toss all NFA owners in jail the second the laws change? Maybe one or two with delusions of grandeur. |
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Originally Posted By scottrh2: I got a email 1 word reply from my SO when sent "received". Kept the email. Didn't send them till they were approved though. Just box checking at this point. Originally Posted By scottrh2: I got a email 1 word reply from my SO when sent "received". Kept the email. Didn't send them till they were approved though. Just box checking at this point. CERTIFICATION: Under penalties imposed by 18 U.S.C. 924 and 26 U.S.C. 5861, I certify that, upon submission of this form to ATF, a completed copy of this form will be directed to the CLEO shown in item 10... |
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Originally Posted By ScottS: I never will understand why people are so nonchalant about sending their CLEO notifications to local LEOs. The chances the AG or Head of the State Police keep some random Form 1/4 is a lot less than a nosy Sheriff or CoP who decides to "keep tabs on his county." My CoP and Sheriff are good guys, but I'm not interested in sharing my NFA inventory with them. I am in Vegas, it seems much more likely AG Ford would make a registry than our sheriff. |
Joined:
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Posts:
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PA, USA
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OK, so what's the consensus? I have 2 form 1's approved in the last 5 days....does it matter at this point to send in "submitted" copies of form 1's that are already approved? It seems silly. Also of note my most recent approvals do NOT have the note saying "engraving required". Is it required even if it doesn't say "see note: engrave. " ? |
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Originally Posted By AK74-U: OK, so what's the consensus? I have 2 form 1's approved in the last 5 days....does it matter at this point to send in "submitted" copies of form 1's that are already approved? It seems silly. Also of note my most recent approvals do NOT have the note saying "engraving required". Is it required even if it doesn't say "see note: engrave. " ? And at this time, yes engraving is still required, whether the approval conditions on the form mentioned it or not. |
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Originally Posted By D_Man: You were never supposed to send your CLEO any approved forms. You are supposed to send the submitted form to them at the same time you submitted it to the ATF. If you failed to do that then you already perjured yourself when you signed the form so damage is done either way, might as well just skip it I guess. And at this time, yes engraving is still required, whether the approval conditions on the form mentioned it or not. It doesn't specify a time, it just says upon submission. It would only be perjury if he never intended to send it at all, forgetting to send it or something causing a delay is not perjury. ATF approvals are wildly all over the place. If I submit in the evening on Monday, and get an approval back on Wednesday, the same day I mailed the notice to the CLEO because i needed to get stamps etc is that perjury? I don't think so. Even if it would have went in the mail on Tuesday the CLEO wouldn't haven't received it before approval. If they expressly want to make sure the CLEO has it prior to approval, then they should contact the CLEO listed on the form, and confirm they have received it prior to approval. |
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Originally Posted By dtw13: It doesn't specify a time, it just says upon submission. It would only be perjury if he never intended to send it at all, forgetting to send it or something causing a delay is not perjury. They have no way to check. They don’t want to check. ATF isn’t interested in creating any way to check if notification(s) ever got sent (or received). They wouldn’t even know which CLEO would be the intended recipient (and they won’t ask you either) because they don’t want to know. As far as what a CLEO’s office may do when they receive them, here are the commonly chosen options, in order of popularity:
When I made this decision on behalf of my CLEO’s agency, it was Option 3 (unless they requested a reply), but a new CLEO got elected, removed me from the decision process, and switched to Option 5 with all the forms being filed in his #2’s office. I don’t believe the state has outlawed a local registry here, but I’d prefer if they did. |
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Originally Posted By jbntex: I can only speak for myself, but for 25+ years I had to go to the Sheriff office and get a signature from the Sheriff prior to being able to even send the form in the BATFE. I would guess I went to the local Sheriff office maybe 75-ish times between the late 90s to mid 2010s to drop off and pick up paperwork in person for a CLEO signature prior to 41F changing the requirement to CLEO notification. I was there so often that I was on a first name basis with the Sheriff's administrative assistant. At this point am I really cloak and dagger hiding something from the local Sheriff office if I don't mail the 130th-something NFA form to them and instead send it to the State AG? My guess at this point is probably no. I had the same experience. His admin assistant was awesome and got everything signed and mailed to me within a week. |
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