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Anyone loaded the RMR 69gr bullets? (Page 2 of 6)
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Originally Posted By Strikefirst: In going to try shooters world match rifle first. Specs say 2.45 oal 25.3 gr max. Thoughts on the OAL at 2.45? That's not going to fit in an AR mag. IIRC you're limited to ~2.300" when using stamped metal mags. If that powder is extruded stick like Varget/Re15/IMR4166 you'll likely end up compressing it @ 25.3 & 2.300". If you want to single load, measure your max coal to the lands, back off .010-.020" and see what that gets you, go from there. |
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Originally Posted By Sebspeed: That's not going to fit in an AR mag. IIRC you're limited to ~2.300" when using stamped metal mags. If that powder is extruded stick like Varget/Re15/IMR4166 you'll likely end up compressing it @ 25.3 & 2.300". If you want to single load, measure your max coal to the lands, back off .010-.020" and see what that gets you, go from there. I believe he meant 2.245. MATCH RIFLE FIREARM CALIBER PROJECTILE COL ST LOAD ST VEL MAX LOAD MAX VEL MAX PSI Rifle 223 Remington 69 GR. SIERRA HPBT 2.245 22.0 2,683 25.3 2,998 54,960 ETA: Trying to reformat |
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Originally Posted By Strikefirst: Yep just a typo! I'm curious to know how it goes. I've got SW Match Rifle, Tactical Rifle, and AR Plus. I was planning on using the MR with 75 gr Hornady bullets as I have 2k of them and only 1k RMR, and 8# of MR. Planning on TR as a replacement for H335 in plinking rounds, and AR+ for this and some 60 gr vmax. Tempted to test all 3 powders with all 3 bullets, but I haven't had much time to load or shoot since my son was born. Don't see that changing a while lot anytime soon. |
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Originally Posted By spyderboy03: I'm curious to know how it goes. I've got SW Match Rifle, Tactical Rifle, and AR Plus. I was planning on using the MR with 75 gr Hornady bullets as I have 2k of them and only 1k RMR, and 8# of MR. Planning on TR as a replacement for H335 in plinking rounds, and AR+ for this and some 60 gr vmax. Tempted to test all 3 powders with all 3 bullets, but I haven't had much time to load or shoot since my son was born. Don't see that changing a while lot anytime soon. I am in the same situation. I also have ar-plus and Precision. I will get to those eventually. Using ar plus for 55 and 62 right now |
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From James at the Shooters World Facebook Forum. Some folks asked about Match Rifle behind 69 gr SMK's and poor groups. He said you need to run them at 5.56 pressure and even recommended 26.2 grains which is still a full grain under match rifle 5.56 max charge. Another guy used his recommendation and settled at 26.4. I am going to go run up to 26.2 in .5 grain increments and top out at 26.4. I don't think anyone else is using this powder in this thread but it is similar to A2520 and CFE223 n characteristics. I will report back when I can on my loads. SO...Work up your own loads, start 10% below max...as Johnny says don't blow your face off! |
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I’m about to load some of these for a Savage Axis and I’ll be using BL-C(2). Probably be lucky to get out to 300, most will be limited to 100 yards. This is my first time with a bolt 223, but I’ve loaded for AR’s for years mainly just 55 grain and some SS109. I have 50 loaded with 10 each at 25.1, 25.3, 25.5, 25.7, and 25.9 at 2.25”. Does this sound like a reasonable starting point? Any recommendations if something looks out of line here? I only have 1# of Varget, 1# of H335, but 8# of BL-C(2). |
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Ok, some data for you folks. Let me preface by saying I’m am not SubMOA shooter very often. I shake too much these days to be able. It’s why I don’t enjoy shooting pistols anymore. On to data. Doing load workup I settled on 25.6gr of Varget since I have an 8lb jug to work with. Decided to play with seating depth and here are today’s results, I need to go back in a few days to confirm results. Forgot to add these are CBTO lengths. First one is 2.260 (mag length) then 2.245( I think ) then 2.230. Attached File |
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Originally Posted By Shiftyk5: Ok, some data for you folks. Let me preface by saying I’m am not SubMOA shooter very often. I shake too much these days to be able. It’s why I don’t enjoy shooting pistols anymore. On to data. Doing load workup I settled on 25.6gr of Varget since I have an 8lb jug to work with. Decided to play with seating depth and here are today’s results, I need to go back in a few days to confirm results. Forgot to add these are CBTO lengths. First one is 2.260 (mag length) then 2.245( I think ) then 2.230. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/158484/CD83296A-0358-4960-9463-1BFD65977E52_jpe-1962581.JPG Man, I really need to start experimenting with seating depths more often. |
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Originally Posted By Shiftyk5: Ok, some data for you folks. Let me preface by saying I'm am not SubMOA shooter very often. I shake too much these days to be able. It's why I don't enjoy shooting pistols anymore. On to data. Doing load workup I settled on 25.6gr of Varget since I have an 8lb jug to work with. Decided to play with seating depth and here are today's results, I need to go back in a few days to confirm results. Forgot to add these are CBTO lengths. First one is 2.260 (mag length) then 2.245( I think ) then 2.230. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/158484/CD83296A-0358-4960-9463-1BFD65977E52_jpe-1962581.JPG |
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Originally Posted By Shiftyk5: Feel like I should clarify the results in the pic a little more. The green dots in the middle are the 69gr rmr seating depth test. The top pink is some 22-250 The bottom pink is 6.5 grendel Interesting the higher pressure better group. Right now my test loads are set to 1.890 base to ogive which is right at 2.255 oal SW Match Rifle 25, 25.5, 26, 26.2 and 26.4 Hopefully I can get to the range soon |
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Originally Posted By Shiftyk5: Ok, some data for you folks. Let me preface by saying I’m am not SubMOA shooter very often. I shake too much these days to be able. It’s why I don’t enjoy shooting pistols anymore. On to data. Doing load workup I settled on 25.6gr of Varget since I have an 8lb jug to work with. Decided to play with seating depth and here are today’s results, I need to go back in a few days to confirm results. Forgot to add these are CBTO lengths. First one is 2.260 (mag length) then 2.245( I think ) then 2.230. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/158484/CD83296A-0358-4960-9463-1BFD65977E52_jpe-1962581.JPG That last group above the green dot (1.8550) is pretty damn impressive. |
She looks like she could do more tricks on a six inch dick than a monkey on a 50 foot rope
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Originally Posted By Strikefirst: Did you try 5.56 pressures with cfe223? Originally Posted By Strikefirst: Originally Posted By AeroEngineer: I tried test loads using CFE223. Accuracy was underwhelming. Did you try 5.56 pressures with cfe223? I would say in the 5.56 range. I still have sone room to increase the charge, so I may try that. |
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Originally Posted By TGE: Very windy this morning but this was my chance to shoot this week so I took it. Shot the nearby steel target a few times, thus the spall marks in the photos. I shot the 24.7,25.0 and 25.3gr loads again a couple weeks ago and didn't feel conclusive between the two higher charges so I ran them back today. Same load info as above wrt primer, brass, OAL, etc. I was sort of hoping for a little more velocity but still think I'll stick with the 25.3gr charge of CFE223 for now. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/384595/IMG_20210425_105035_jpg-1918498.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/384595/IMG_20210425_105029_jpg-1918499.JPG @TGE I’m getting similar groups with these bullets snd CFE223. Gave you shot the 25.3 load over a chrono? |
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Shot the 69rmr bullets yesterday. Over a ladder of 8208 at 2.255ish. Lc brass and i think cci magnum sr 24-25grn in 0.2 increments. Attached File Attached File 24.0 shot the best, 25.0 was good except that flier that just creased the edge. I am very happy with these. Im going to buy 2k at least to replace sierra blem 77smk as my bulk lr plinking load. |
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Originally Posted By AeroEngineer: @TGE I'm getting similar groups with these bullets snd CFE223. Gave you shot the 25.3 load over a chrono? Originally Posted By AeroEngineer: Originally Posted By TGE: Very windy this morning but this was my chance to shoot this week so I took it. Shot the nearby steel target a few times, thus the spall marks in the photos. I shot the 24.7,25.0 and 25.3gr loads again a couple weeks ago and didn't feel conclusive between the two higher charges so I ran them back today. Same load info as above wrt primer, brass, OAL, etc. I was sort of hoping for a little more velocity but still think I'll stick with the 25.3gr charge of CFE223 for now. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/384595/IMG_20210425_105035_jpg-1918498.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/384595/IMG_20210425_105029_jpg-1918499.JPG @TGE I'm getting similar groups with these bullets snd CFE223. Gave you shot the 25.3 load over a chrono? Attached File |
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Originally Posted By shelbysguns: Shot the 69rmr bullets yesterday. Over a ladder of 8208 at 2.255ish. Lc brass and i think cci magnum sr 24-25grn in 0.2 increments. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/246951/6722C9C5-8574-44C2-8C94-014997B2BE13_jpe-1973318.JPGhttps://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/246951/1098FB6C-815E-43E7-A918-1AA92EEA935F_jpe-1973319.JPG 24.0 shot the best, 25.0 was good except that flier that just creased the edge. I am very happy with these. Im going to buy 2k at least to replace sierra blem 77smk as my bulk lr plinking load. Nice, that 24.0gr load looks good. And I'm same, these will mostly replace the 77gr Noslers I've been shooting. I need the rain to knock off so I can get out and shoot some hogs with em, see how they do on game. I'd like to punch the velocity up for that though, even if accuracy falls a little. |
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Originally Posted By TGE: @AeroEngineer yep, here's my chrono data. You can ignore the group sizes in column L, I wasn't shooting from a steady position. I still keep thinking I should try the 25.6 and 25.9 gr loads again. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/384595/69_RMR_jpg-1892579_JPG-1973397.JPG Originally Posted By TGE: Originally Posted By AeroEngineer: Originally Posted By TGE: Very windy this morning but this was my chance to shoot this week so I took it. Shot the nearby steel target a few times, thus the spall marks in the photos. I shot the 24.7,25.0 and 25.3gr loads again a couple weeks ago and didn't feel conclusive between the two higher charges so I ran them back today. Same load info as above wrt primer, brass, OAL, etc. I was sort of hoping for a little more velocity but still think I'll stick with the 25.3gr charge of CFE223 for now. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/384595/IMG_20210425_105035_jpg-1918498.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/384595/IMG_20210425_105029_jpg-1918499.JPG @TGE I'm getting similar groups with these bullets snd CFE223. Gave you shot the 25.3 load over a chrono? https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/384595/69_RMR_jpg-1892579_JPG-1973397.JPG Thanks for posting! It’s very useful to see real world velocity numbers. I’m shooting with a 16” barrel, so my numbers will be lower but still in the same ballpark. Attached File Attached File 25.6 gr opened up on me last trip. I’m going to load 25.3 and 25.6 then shoot again. I’ll probably load an extra 6 of one charge to shoot over the chrono for a reference point. I don’t shoot for groups over the chrono, as my fear is that’s how I’ll kill my chrono 
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Originally Posted By AeroEngineer: Thanks for posting! It's very useful to see real world velocity numbers. I'm shooting with a 16" barrel, so my numbers will be lower but still in the same ballpark. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/314595/E53CBC95-672B-4EF7-A423-C80C94BEA188_jpe-1973549.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/314595/FA22225C-4A60-42D1-A77A-20303F4A4DD5_jpe-1973550.JPG 25.6 gr opened up on me last trip. I'm going to load 25.3 and 25.6 then shoot again. I'll probably load an extra 6 of one charge to shoot over the chrono for a reference point. I don't shoot for groups over the chrono, as my fear is that's how I'll kill my chrono Originally Posted By AeroEngineer: Originally Posted By TGE: Originally Posted By AeroEngineer: Originally Posted By TGE: Very windy this morning but this was my chance to shoot this week so I took it. Shot the nearby steel target a few times, thus the spall marks in the photos. I shot the 24.7,25.0 and 25.3gr loads again a couple weeks ago and didn't feel conclusive between the two higher charges so I ran them back today. Same load info as above wrt primer, brass, OAL, etc. I was sort of hoping for a little more velocity but still think I'll stick with the 25.3gr charge of CFE223 for now. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/384595/IMG_20210425_105035_jpg-1918498.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/384595/IMG_20210425_105029_jpg-1918499.JPG @TGE I'm getting similar groups with these bullets snd CFE223. Gave you shot the 25.3 load over a chrono? https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/384595/69_RMR_jpg-1892579_JPG-1973397.JPG Thanks for posting! It's very useful to see real world velocity numbers. I'm shooting with a 16" barrel, so my numbers will be lower but still in the same ballpark. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/314595/E53CBC95-672B-4EF7-A423-C80C94BEA188_jpe-1973549.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/314595/FA22225C-4A60-42D1-A77A-20303F4A4DD5_jpe-1973550.JPG 25.6 gr opened up on me last trip. I'm going to load 25.3 and 25.6 then shoot again. I'll probably load an extra 6 of one charge to shoot over the chrono for a reference point. I don't shoot for groups over the chrono, as my fear is that's how I'll kill my chrono  Your 25.3 looks similar to mine, yup. I know my barrel is capable of better with the Nosler CCs, but if I could squeeze down to 1" I'd be happy. If you think to post back results on the 25.6gr I'd love to see them. If it's dry enough and I can shake this head cold then I'll try to load another couple sets and get out this weekend and try the same, plus maybe even bump up to 25.9gr just to see. It's gonna be hot too, so might run a few over the chrono again and see what a 40 degree temp swing does. After that I guess it'll come down to tweaking OAL a little and see if that does anything for me. |
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Ok update with some pics for you all. I will come back when I have time to edit in more info and answer questions. All these groups have been shot over several days. On to pics. The dots are 3/4”. Rmr 69gr bthp load is 25.6gr Varget Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached File |
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Attached File Main gun being used for RMR 69gr stuff. Pieced together Frankenstein. Aero lower,unknown upper, magpul prs, Geissele National match trigger, Geissele rail, Bartlein 18” SPR barrel, Crimson trace 3-24x50 series 5 scope Attached File |
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Originally Posted By mjmjr1312: I ordered a couple thousand to try with 8208 and TAC. If i can get these to group out of my 12” AR, especially with TAC I will order a bunch more. At <15 cents they can be loaded at damn near plinking ammo prices and might replace the 62gr hornady’s I was working up for bulk loading. -Mike @mjmjr1313 Did you ever shoot these with your 12” AR? I’d be interested to see your results |
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Originally Posted By tronco15: @mjmjr1313 Did you ever shoot these with your 12” AR? I’d be interested to see your results Originally Posted By tronco15: Originally Posted By mjmjr1312: I ordered a couple thousand to try with 8208 and TAC. If i can get these to group out of my 12” AR, especially with TAC I will order a bunch more. At <15 cents they can be loaded at damn near plinking ammo prices and might replace the 62gr hornady’s I was working up for bulk loading. -Mike @mjmjr1313 Did you ever shoot these with your 12” AR? I’d be interested to see your results Unfortunately, not yet. Been in and out of the country for work and haven’t had a chance to work up loads. -Mike |
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Ok, another update. These bullets have me so frustrated, they shoot stunning groups and then shoot not so great groups. So here are the results from my last range trip. RMR 69gr bthp loaded with 25.6gr Varget and seated to 2.230” First 5 shot group, the cold bore shot went pretty low. The next 4 stacked right in. Attached File Next group, kinda crappy but it is what it is. Attached File This group is a thing of beauty, shot a few groups like this with this bullet so I’m not sure what to think. Attached File I’d really like to see what someone like Molon could do with this bullet. Wonder if he would be interested if we sent him some bullets. Pretty sure he had better things to do, that guy is a treasure here. @Molon |
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Adding some 69gr Sierra match king groups for comparison, shot on the same day with the same charge. 69gr SMK, 25.6gr Varget, loaded to mag length 2.260” Attached File Attached File Attached File |
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Originally Posted By HighpowerRifleBrony: Anyone have a side-by-side photo of the RMR and SMK? I’m guessing they may be quite similar. I use a 1.855BTO with my 69gr smk load and I expect it to be in the sub 3/8moa range. Testing of a new lot from the other week.  And from a week prior before I adjusted the charge to account for the lot to lot variation on bearing surface. 
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Have you run any with a different charge to see if you are over or under for the RMR bullet? Your load is toward the high end, so I'm suggesting maybe look a little slower? Maybe try 24.5 or 24.8 and see if they tune in? Your sample size is a little small, but you are probably going to find that the inexpensive RMR won't keep up with the SMK. What the potential of the RMR would be is hard to say at present. |
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I think once your shoot enough to create statistically significant sample sizes, the RMR isn’t going to show the same precision as the SMK bullets, because the RMR manufacturing process just can’t keep every bullet within as tight tolerances as Sierra does. Not saying the RMR is a bad bullet, but after shooting a couple hundred of them, I personally don’t feel like my batch of RMR 69 gr bullets is the same as “half priced SMKs”. I shot some over Reloder 15 today and my barrel shoots tge RMR 69 gr bullets better with Re15 than CFE223 Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached File All in Federal brass and 2.26” COL. I had planned to try 24.8 gr as the high load, but there was going to be a lot more compression in the Federal brass with that much Re15 than I wanted to fool with. |
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Originally Posted By AeroEngineer: I think once your shoot enough to create statistically significant sample sizes, the RMR isn’t going to show the same precision as the SMK bullets, because the RMR manufacturing process just can’t keep every bullet within as tight tolerances as Sierra does. Not saying the RMR is a bad bullet, but after shooting a couple hundred of them, I personally don’t feel like my batch of RMR 69 gr bullets is the same as “half priced SMKs”. I shot some over Reloder 15 today and my barrel shoots tge RMR 69 gr bullets better with Re15 than CFE223 https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/314595/B7E339F5-013A-4D0C-95AC-B403D013D5A3_jpe-2000478.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/314595/5D322F98-05BE-4F07-90E7-B9CE87F02437_jpe-2000479.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/314595/D8302C11-A991-4E6F-BF24-CB9774644433_jpe-2000480.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/314595/1EF6C14B-CF7C-4FA5-A188-11C39425BDEB_jpe-2000481.JPG All in Federal brass and 2.26” COL. I had planned to try 24.8 gr as the high load, but there was going to be a lot more compression in the Federal brass with that much Re15 than I wanted to fool with. This is great data. Thank you. So nominally this appears to be ~1.5 MOA performance, sometimes a little better, sometimes a little worse. I agree, that's not really 69 SMK performance. For a lot of usage, that's still plenty good. For some, maybe not. As to CFE223 vs RE15. Just my experience, but I find that pretty everything shoots better than CFE223. Where CFE223 shines, is it's a well engineered powder to run at near 5.56 pressure to give you substantially higher velocity than most other powders - I guess it's got some kind of tuned burn cycle for that. But I've never been able to make that powder sing as a precision powder. In all fairness, that's just me - others have been able to do real good with it. |
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Ok adding some more groups to the others here. Info on the load. Federal brass- on 6th firing CCI400 primers 25.6gr Varget 69gr RMR BTHP COAL: 2.235” CBTO: 1.8550 15-shot string chrono data 2877 FPS 9.5 SD Gun is a Frankenstein AR15 with 18” Bartlein SPR 1-7.7 with CLE chamber. First group of the day. Attached File Next group felt a little more settled. Attached File Third group had the rear bag really settled to the gun and everything felt perfect. Attached File I really think this bullet can shoot well for my gun, it just takes me getting a little less shaky and the reticle on my scope isn’t very helpful for precise shooting. Don’t buy the crimson trace series 5 scope the reticle sucks |
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Originally Posted By Shiftyk5: Ok adding some more groups to the others here. Info on the load. Federal brass- on 6th firing CCI400 primers 25.6gr Varget 69gr RMR BTHP COAL: 2.235” CBTO: 1.8550 15-shot string chrono data 2877 FPS 9.5 SD Gun is a Frankenstein AR15 with 18” Bartlein SPR 1-7.7 with CLE chamber. First group of the day. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/158484/31F173D1-B3FC-4A37-B86F-3EF5F9147E8D_jpe-2003073.JPG Next group felt a little more settled. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/158484/D331D359-59DA-463A-8183-C1282887DA23_jpe-2003076.JPG Third group had the rear bag really settled to the gun and everything felt perfect. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/158484/D4E8C997-0EF9-4A79-B222-D98A2221A15D_jpe-2003077.JPG I really think this bullet can shoot well for my gun, it just takes me getting a little less shaky and the reticle on my scope isn’t very helpful for precise shooting. Don’t buy the crimson trace series 5 scope the reticle sucks I loaded some LC brass with 400's, 25.0 of varget, 69smk, 2.255" and shot a match on Sunday. The cases were only once fired and I found a case that was cracked most of the way thru about in the middle. When I got home I checked all of them and ended up trashing about a dozen that were starting to show a crack forming. I'm amazed that your cases are holding up w/ 25.6 ETA: 20" Kreiger barrel w/ a CLE chamber, AR platform |
She looks like she could do more tricks on a six inch dick than a monkey on a 50 foot rope
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Originally Posted By garbageman: I loaded some LC brass with 400's, 25.0 of varget, 69smk, 2.255" and shot a match on Sunday. The cases were only once fired and I found a case that was cracked most of the way thru about in the middle. When I got home I checked all of them and ended up trashing about a dozen that were starting to show a crack forming. I'm amazed that your cases are holding up w/ 25.6 ETA: 20" Kreiger barrel w/ a CLE chamber, AR platform Dunno, I’ve had a couple split necks(3-4). That’s the only failures I’ve seen. Primer pockets are just now starting to to loosen up a little. Sierra lists 26.1gr as max load for Varget. I stayed under that with no issues. It almost sounds like a weird case head separation issue you have. |
Anyone loaded the RMR 69gr bullets? (Page 2 of 6)
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