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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Airsoft grade IR devices on real guns? (Page 21 of 36)
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Quoted: A happy guinea pig! There you go with my initial review of the InvisibleSight NGAL & LA5: (For now, I can only do the testing in the basement, where it's dark enough. Will take more night-time shots outside later) NGAL: - Housing construction feels very sturdy and solid, def quality aluminum; all the gaps appear to be fully potted, looks waterproof and strong enough to take some abuse (not gonna torture test it though). - Elevation and windage adjustments work, haven't zeroed, further testing needed. - IR illuminator adjustment works as advertised (will further test outside at 100-yard distance) - Works well with crane plug. I'm using the Modlite modbutton for NGAL, but Surefire switch works too. Some cosmetic inaccuracies for future improvements: - Laser diffuser cap missing the "ND" marking (real one supposedly to be a Neutral Density filter). I already told the IS guy about his, he said this plastic mold was not made by him, and he'll try to add it in the future. - Missing the sticker (the one with QR code and DOM info) on the lower left https://i.imgur.com/7AWN8zV.jpg" target="_blank">https://i.imgur.com/7AWN8zV.jpg https://i.imgur.com/piZMlz1.jpg https://i.imgur.com/Xz0mqnh.jpg https://i.imgur.com/ykDOHO9.jpg https://i.imgur.com/HBnGk2b.jpg https://i.imgur.com/dHMBl11.jpg https://i.imgur.com/A1FTp7X.jpg https://i.imgur.com/SawVp3E.jpg Looking sexy on my 12.5 build. https://i.imgur.com/Z9mXbNc.jpg When it gets dark enough for you to test outside, please let us know how far the illuminator is useful. |
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So here are the images I took at different distances to test the NGAL's ir illuminator, compared w/ atpial-c. IS NGAL vs ATPIAL-C - 50 yds  IS NGAL vs ATPIAL-C - 75 yds  IS NGAL vs ATPIAL-C - 100 yds (1)  IS NGAL vs ATPIAL-C - 100 yds (2)  IR Illuminator Beam Divergence Adjustment  InvisibleSight NGAL IR Illuminator Beam Divergence Adjustment https://youtu.be/_R8-OtFJ1K8 Please excuse the poor image quality, I was taking pics with a phone behind the tube with one hand and holding the lasers with another, hard to keep it steady and focused. An issue I've noticed so far is that both the NGAl and LA5 burn through batteries extremely fast at high power, especially the NGAL. After only a minute or so constant on, the hp laser and illuminator waned by a lot. It's too fast that it does not seem normal. I'm using the regular surefire cr123a (red one), the IS guy recommended using the rechargeable surefire LFP123A batteries (white), claiming they "maintain the most consistent voltage under load". I ordered the white batteries, and will test them out when they arrive. |
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Quoted: That ngal looks really good. Can you please inluce a tight spot and the widest flood it can do in the review? I've included a youtube video. But it seems that the link I inserted doesn't work. Here's the video link: https://youtu.be/_R8-OtFJ1K8 |
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Quoted: Disappointed to hear that it chews through batteries so fast. Illuminator looks good at 100 yards. What is the max you expect it could be useful at? With peak battery performance, with a tighter beam, I’d say it’s good for 150 yds at least. Can’t say for sure. Needs more time to put some rounds thru it to make sure it holds zero. I’ll ask the IS guy about the battery drainage issue. One factor I could think of that could result in shorter battery life is temperature, it's like 40F tonight. But still abnormal. L3 listed the NGAL's battery life is 3.5 hrs at dual high. |
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Quoted: With peak battery performance, with a tighter beam, I’d say it’s good for 150 yds at least. Can’t say for sure. Needs more time to put some rounds thru it to make sure it holds zero. I’ll ask the IS guy about the battery drainage issue. One factor I could think of that could result in shorter battery life is temperature, it's like 40F tonight. But still abnormal. L3 listed the NGAL's battery life is 3.5 hrs at dual high. Get the Charger with the SF LiFePO4 batteries (Or a Nitecore UMS) - they take a different charging scheme than Lithium Ion. If Nitecore, you need to manually place it in LiFePO4 mode - it's in the instructions. mAh is a lot lower though, than disposables, so I don't know... |
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Quoted: With peak battery performance, with a tighter beam, I'd say it's good for 150 yds at least. Can't say for sure. Needs more time to put some rounds thru it to make sure it holds zero. I'll ask the IS guy about the battery drainage issue. One factor I could think of that could result in shorter battery life is temperature, it's like 40F tonight. But still abnormal. L3 listed the NGAL's battery life is 3.5 hrs at dual high. |
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Quoted: Ask him about using the rechargeable 3.7v Li-ion version rcr123 (16340) batteries. I noticed in my Somo Perst that it had weird flickering and power up issues sometimes with regular 123s, but with the li-ion it's run stable. The li-ion batts are able to provide more consistent current before the voltage sags, but you'd want to be sure the circuitry can handle the 3.7v load. He specifically warned not to use the 3.7V Li-ion rechargeable cr123a batteries, fully charged voltage is 4.2V, which can possibly damage the laser diodes. |
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Quoted: Get the Charger with the SF LiFePO4 batteries (Or a Nitecore UMS) - they take a different charging scheme than Lithium Ion. If Nitecore, you need to manually place it in LiFePO4 mode - it's in the instructions. mAh is a lot lower though, than disposables, so I don't know... Yes I have ordered the LFP white rechargeable batteries and they’re coming today. I did read online that the capacity is lower than regular 123a. |
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Quoted: What would be the benefit of the LiFePO4 batteries? SureFire states that they will have “significantly less run time” than their disposable batteries. The IS guy claims they "maintain the most consistent voltage under load", I guess it means it won’t dim as suddenly but more gradually, |
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Quoted: He specifically warned not to use the 3.7V Li-ion rechargeable cr123a batteries, fully charged voltage is 4.2V, which can possibly damage the laser diodes.  It all depends on how they do the power handling and voltage regulation circuit design. For some of these Chinese units, I wouldn't be surprised if they use common/cheaper power controller chips meant for 3.7v systems due to the widespread use of li-ion rechargeable batteries in a bunch of cheap electronic do-dads. |
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Quoted: The IS guy claims they "maintain the most consistent voltage under load", I guess it means it won't dim as suddenly but more gradually, |
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Quoted: LiFePO4 battery chemistry is able to deliver more current than lithium primary cells at comparable voltage, so it sounds like those units are pulling on the high side of the current draw capacity of a regular cr123a, which leads to rapid voltage sag. Thanks man, yea that does make sense. The LFP batts arrived, will see how they perform. |
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Quoted: Hopefully the LFP batteries stay at peak brightness for longer otherwise I will have to seriously consider whether I should cancel my order. So I didn't have time to test last night, but just tested it with the LFP batt for 15 mins in basement, and didn't notice any dimming with dual high constant on. Will try to test more in the yard tonight. |
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Quoted: NGAL: - Housing construction feels very sturdy and solid, def quality aluminum; all the gaps appear to be fully potted, looks waterproof and strong enough to take some abuse (not gonna torture test it though). - Elevation and windage adjustments work, haven't zeroed, further testing needed. - IR illuminator adjustment works as advertised (will further test outside at 100-yard distance) - Works well with crane plug. I'm using the Modlite modbutton for NGAL, but Surefire switch works too. Some cosmetic inaccuracies for future improvements: - Laser diffuser cap missing the "ND" marking (real one supposedly to be a Neutral Density filter). I already told the IS guy about his, he said this plastic mold was not made by him, and he'll try to add it in the future. - Missing the sticker (the one with QR code and DOM info) on the lower left https://i.imgur.com/7AWN8zV.jpg" target="_blank">https://i.imgur.com/7AWN8zV.jpg https://i.imgur.com/piZMlz1.jpg https://i.imgur.com/Xz0mqnh.jpg https://i.imgur.com/ykDOHO9.jpg https://i.imgur.com/HBnGk2b.jpg https://i.imgur.com/dHMBl11.jpg https://i.imgur.com/A1FTp7X.jpg https://i.imgur.com/SawVp3E.jpg Looking sexy on my 12.5 build. https://i.imgur.com/Z9mXbNc.jpg Another missing function with the NGAL is the rear led indicator light, which doesn't work. This might not be a problem for most people. According to L3 website, the NGAL indicator light should be "tri-color". I asked the the IS guy and he said he could make it work by adding in a small led (not sure if he could achieve the tri-color function, or just a green, like the peqs). But I don't wanna have it sent back for such a small add-on. |
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Quoted: With the backlog of the IS LAMs why not just wait until March of 2023 when the EOTech LAM is supposed to come out? Because everything in the NV world is vaporware until it's actually out. You could be waiting till March of 2023 or December of 2024. Or like the PSA MP5, forever. Not to mention there have been more discrepancies on price making it ~$2000 instead of the estimated $1300. |
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Quoted: Just my opinion from owning full power lasers. I would never pay a dime for a commercial unit. VCSEL civ lasers are on par or better than your normal FP LAMs these days. MAWL and Designate IR-V are the only ones I know of right now. The EOTech is supposed to change that, though. |
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Quoted: VCSEL civ lasers are on par or better than your normal FP LAMs these days. MAWL and Designate IR-V are the only ones I know of right now. The EOTech is supposed to change that, though. Learning every day. Mawl performs well but i hate the form factor and it costs nearly 1.5x what i paid for a fp atpial. Ive never heard of the IR-V, looks cool. I like the RAID-X as well, i think that uses vcsel no? |
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Good news with the IS NGAL. I switched to the SureFire LFP123 rechargeable battery, and turned on the DH mode and walked around my yard for at least half an hour, the brightness level hasn't changed at all. Here are the pics taken  " /> I also took a few new vids to demonstrate the mode selection and spot-flood adjustment.  InvisibleSight NGAL Modes Selection https://youtu.be/T8KDfIt-yyQ  InvisibleSight NGAL IR Illuminator Spot-Flood Adjustment https://youtu.be/DbLROF9bzpg This def proves that the IS ngal w/ lfp batt is good to go. Illuminator is super clean, hp is very powerful. I do believe it's using VCSEL. Edit: adding a vid of another angle for the mode selection https://youtu.be/kWrnbso990k |
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Quoted: Good news with the IS NGAL. I switched to the SureFire LFP123 rechargeable battery, and turned on the DH mode and walked around my yard for at least half an hour, the brightness level hasn't changed at all. Here are the pics taken https://i.imgur.com/xf3c90N.jpg" target="_blank">https://i.imgur.com/xf3c90N.jpg https://i.imgur.com/8kJwZqF.jpg I also took a few new vids to demonstrate the mode selection and spot-flood adjustment.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8KDfIt-yyQhttps://youtu.be/T8KDfIt-yyQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbLROF9bzpghttps://youtu.be/DbLROF9bzpg This def proves that the IS ngal w/ lfp batt is good to go. Illuminator is super clean, hp is very powerful. I do believe it's using VCSEL. Edit: adding a vid of another angle for the mode selection https://youtu.be/kWrnbso990k What battery life are you getting now? |
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Quoted: Because everything in the NV world is vaporware until it's actually out. You could be waiting till March of 2023 or December of 2024. Or like the PSA MP5, forever. Not to mention there have been more discrepancies on price making it ~$2000 instead of the estimated $1300. Well, I agree with you on the first point, everything is vaporware in the NV world until it actually comes out. However, regarding price right now the only statement we have from an EOTech employee is $1300, the $2K thing is purely and firmly rumor based off one second hand report online with all due respect to the poster. I mean I've got video of an EOTech employee holding the thing in his hands telling me it's going to be $1300 versus someone online who says they heard from a retailer $2K. |
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Quoted: Well, I agree with you on the first point, everything is vaporware in the NV world until it actually comes out. However, regarding price right now the only statement we have from an EOTech employee is $1300, the $2K thing is purely and firmly rumor based off one second hand report online with all due respect to the poster. I mean I've got video of an EOTech employee holding the thing in his hands telling me it's going to be $1300 versus someone online who says they heard from a retailer $2K. For me, it is partially because of the vaporware problem and partially because it isn’t an either/or. The IS NGAL is something I can order right now and have fun with. The NGAL is cool, full power is cool, but not $6000 cool in my mind. I can have something fun for $900 to use right now while I wait for the EOTech OGL to be released. When the OGL releases, assuming it is anywhere near the price and performance suggested, I will buy one of those two. The locations of the controls and overall size look appealing to me. That laser may release early next year, or not at all. I’m not going to hold off on buying something to use until it becomes available and I’m really not interested in any of the other LAMs on the market. At least not at the price for units worth using. The IS is something I can get within a few weeks (if the quoted three week lead time for my purchase turns out to be correct) and start using it. Or, it will take so long to ship that the OGL will release first and then I can just cancel my order for the IS. |
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Quoted: Good news with the IS NGAL. I switched to the SureFire LFP123 rechargeable battery, and turned on the DH mode and walked around my yard for at least half an hour, the brightness level hasn't changed at all. Here are the pics taken https://i.imgur.com/xf3c90N.jpg" target="_blank">https://i.imgur.com/xf3c90N.jpg https://i.imgur.com/8kJwZqF.jpg I also took a few new vids to demonstrate the mode selection and spot-flood adjustment. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8KDfIt-yyQhttps://youtu.be/T8KDfIt-yyQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbLROF9bzpghttps://youtu.be/DbLROF9bzpg This def proves that the IS ngal w/ lfp batt is good to go. Illuminator is super clean, hp is very powerful. I do believe it's using VCSEL. Edit: adding a vid of another angle for the mode selection https://youtu.be/kWrnbso990k Thanks for the videos great job! That looks pretty slick. Holy smokes its $999.99 Link to site To rich for me on a import laser like that. You are a brave man. |
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Quoted: What battery life are you getting now? I haven't pushed it to the limit yet. You're looking at 30mins of constant full power (dual high) w/ the lfp white batt, and the power output hasn't declined at all, I'd say that's more than enough for most, because few would keep full power on all the time when they "operate". Will keep testing and give an estimated total hrs on batt life. |
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Quoted: Thanks for the videos great job! That looks pretty slick. Holy smokes its $999.99 Link to site To rich for me on a import laser like that. You are a brave man. Thanks man. It's $990 on website but you can negotiate with the guy. It was a risky bet, but turned out to be well worth it. Or perhaps it's too early to tell. It's "life-time warranty" so if it breaks, the guy promises to fix or replace it, and so far he's been keeping his promises. |
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Quoted: Good news with the IS NGAL. I switched to the SureFire LFP123 rechargeable battery, and turned on the DH mode and walked around my yard for at least half an hour, the brightness level hasn't changed at all. Here are the pics taken https://i.imgur.com/xf3c90N.jpg" target="_blank">https://i.imgur.com/xf3c90N.jpg https://i.imgur.com/8kJwZqF.jpg I also took a few new vids to demonstrate the mode selection and spot-flood adjustment. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8KDfIt-yyQhttps://youtu.be/T8KDfIt-yyQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbLROF9bzpghttps://youtu.be/DbLROF9bzpg This def proves that the IS ngal w/ lfp batt is good to go. Illuminator is super clean, hp is very powerful. I do believe it's using VCSEL. Edit: adding a vid of another angle for the mode selection https://youtu.be/kWrnbso990k Also confirming that co-alignment is good to go. https://youtu.be/_JnKD1cgORg |
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Quoted: Where did it ship from? China or USA? Hong Kong. Shipping can be finicky, check my previous posts. It's free shipping via post office/HK express/EMS, but if you want it sooner I'd recommend upgrade to "pro couriers" (FedEx, UPS, DHL), not sure how much more he'd charge because I added another la5 to my order and he did combined shipping at no additional cost. The FedEx priority express pkg took around 4 days (2 days held at origin facility after he dropped it off, only 2 days for actual shipping and delivery) |
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You should try confirming at distance and with rounds on target, to see if there is a shift between the two aiming points. Room distance pointing doesn't really show visible/Ir deviation well (if any) I've been skeptical of Hk/China lasers from the past. I've seen some examples where the Somo version visible / Ir were wildly off from each other.(Granted, they were older units.) However, it is a trip seeing recent improvements. Keeping an eye on this thread for more feedback, would love to save a couple bucks for the 22lr build. |
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Quoted: Thanks for the videos great job! That looks pretty slick. Holy smokes its $999.99 Link to site To rich for me on a import laser like that. You are a brave man. To be fair - still cheaper than the PERST 3 was even pre-war. Half the price of a decent FP PEQ, 1/5 the price of an NGAL, and 1/4 the price of a MAWL. While it seems expensive, it’s still even less than a shitty civ i2 at retail. |
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I think we are rapidly approaching a point of actual quality vs price. For so long it has only been full (and I do mean FULL) price, and too cheap. If 1K is too dear, then SG is coming in at 250-400. This guy seems to be doing much better QC (as in hand-building everything himself; probably used to work for them ha) so you are seeing what that is possibly worth. I would like to see someone split the difference between the two; give me good quality at 5-600. And 50 cent gas. And world peace. |
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Quoted: You should try confirming at distance and with rounds on target, to see if there is a shift between the two aiming points. Room distance pointing doesn't really show visible/Ir deviation well (if any) I've been skeptical of Hk/China lasers from the past. I've seen some examples where the Somo version visible / Ir were wildly off from each other.(Granted, they were older units.) However, it is a trip seeing recent improvements. Keeping an eye on this thread for more feedback, would love to save a couple bucks for the 22lr build. Yup ideally of course, will test later at the range. Somogear units are not co-aligned and they acknowledge that on their website. IS market itself as "perfectly co-aligned", the guy wouldn't be so confident if it's not the case. That said, we def should keep a scientific mind and verify to confirm. |
[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Airsoft grade IR devices on real guns? (Page 21 of 36)
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