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Posted: 8/1/2025 1:11:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: BoomBoom][Edited]
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I don’t understand the concept of a .22 conversion kit and it never really made sense in my mind. Here is the dilemma. You have a 556 rifle that is zeroed (POA POI for whatever distance) and you understand that well. Throw in a conversion kit and now what? Your POA and POI is not going to be the same as your 566. If you zero your sight/optic for .22 now your 556 is off. Also, the conversion doesn’t mean you just install the kit (to be reliable anyways) you have to add a pressure plug and a bolt catch adapter like a Catch 22. Then you still have twist rate that is not optimal and carbon /lead messing up your gas tube. I don’t get it, by the time one goes through dealing with all the hassle one would have been better off buying a dedicated 22 upper or build a dedicated .22 given how cheap a lower is. One would end up with a more accurate and reliable gun too. |
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I had a conversion kit when dedicated uppers where not cheap or available. Now I have a few uppers. Back then when I just had conversions it was more for "muscle memory" training that still went "bang" on the cheap |
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Tac Sol M4 .22lr. because it's fun, and does a nice job on squirrels, skunk, whatever needs attention within .22lr capabilities.  Attached File |
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| Dedicated upper is the way to go. |
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Have a ciener that only came with a 10rnd mag. 30 round mags were $200ish. Many many thousands of rounds with no issue.Now, you get a kit with a few mags for under $200. Where you getting a complete upper and duplicating your current upper for that money? Never heard of this plug or bolt catch thing before, or "the hassle" of swapping bcgs. 22 hits "close enough" to 556 poi up to 100m. The kit isn't for making a precision rifle, it's for shooting cheap. If you're off 4" at that clay pigeon, kentucky windage solves that problem. As far as gas port/ barrel leading, that was debunked decades ago. Fire some 556 and it removes any residue. |
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Originally Posted By lew: Dedicated upper is the way to go. This. Lowers are dirt cheap Upper + Lower = kick ass little AR that is cheap to shoot all day long plus a good trainer for new shooters too. Bigger_Hammer  |
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Figure out the sight adjustments, use a piece of masking tape to write the clicks needed for each caliber and place it somewhere on a mag or the rifle. Or with my one AR, I have the iron sights adjust to .22 and the Trigicon set to the 5.56 rounds. [1/12 A1 with handle and see thru scope mount. ] |
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I got into AR-15’s in the 90’s and my first AR-15 had a 1:9 twist barrel with A-2 style carry handle. The only options for 22 LR AR-15 was a Ceiner/Atchisson, M261, Colt or Air Force conversion kit. Bushmaster had the Carbon 15 22 LR polymer style AR-15. Rick Kuehl (Kuehl Precision Firearms) was one of the first to adapt a Ciener conversion kit to a dedicated 22 LR barrel with 1:16 twist. DPMS introduced their Gen 1 22 LR uppers and rifles during the AWB in the late 90’s. Cz also had a V-22 upper imported which was a medium weight barrel with side charger and aluminum free float tube. The Ciener appeal was you could get 30 round mags whereas the others were restricted to ten round mags. With the sunset of the AWB the 22 LR AR-15 flourished and Black Dog Machine started selling 25 round AR-15 mags. Spike’s jumped into the 22 LR AR-15 market with a conversion kit, dedicated 22 LR uppers and rifles. Up to that time 1:12 twist barrels and 1:9 twist were very common which provided decent accuracy with 22 rimfire conversions. The 1:8 tends to produce less fliers than 1:7 but for CQB training you can still use a 1:7 twist barrel with a 22 LR conversion. The preference for 1:7 twist 5.56 barrels and the cheap availability of dedicated 22 LR uppers has reduced the use of 22 conversions by many shooters. For a training aid the 22 LR conversions still have a use. I got to where I was shooting way more 22 LR ammo than 5.56/223 ammo so I have moved to dedicated rimfire AR-15’s. One downside rarely discussed is how addicting shooting 22 LR in AR-15’s can be. I shoot a lot of rimfire at my rural residence which means more trigger time, less noise for my neighbors and less down range hazard. I just really enjoy shooting 22 LR at steel plates. I currently have a Ciener and Colt 22 LR AR-15 conversion kits plus five dedicated 22 LR AR-15’s in different configurations. I conducted a test a few years ago comparing the accuracy of 22 conversions kits to dedicated AR-15 uppers. The test is in the ARFCOM archives but can still be viewed at the link below. https://www.rimfirecentral.com/threads/ar-15-22-rimfire-conversion-test.754849/?post_id=7117985#post-7117985 |
| While I agree a dedicated upper is the way to go for the most part, I do find that having a conversion kit is handy. You do NOT need a pressure plug in all cases, at least not in my conversion, which I did with a 1:7 twist 5.56 barrel for the sole purpose of shooting Aguila 60 gr. SSS ammo, which does need a faster twist than my dedicated .22 LRs which are all 1:16. At least that was the plan when I built it. The problem I have is that I have not been able to find any Aguila 60 g.r SSS ammo for over a year so I have have never shot it with the ammo I built to shoot. I have, however, shot a lot of standard velocity and CCI Subsonic ammo through it and it works just fine, no pressure plug needed and the pop in bolt hold open trip works fine and is quickly put on and taken off. I did put the pressure plugs in the dedicated uppers though. |
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Originally Posted By BoomBoom: Also, the conversion doesn’t mean you just install the kit (to be reliable anyways) you have to add a pressure plug and a bolt catch adapter like a Catch 22. Then you still have twist rate that is not optimal and carbon /lead messing up your gas tube. Don’t forget the Conversion kit was designed for the M16A1. My Ciener is plug & play without mods and reliable like any other semiauto .22lr. POA/POI and group size are the same when installed in my M16A1 upper. A few rounds of 5.56 will take care of the carbon build up. When used in 1/7 barrel it’s still good for plinking within 50M |
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Originally Posted By BoomBoom: I don’t understand the concept of a .22 conversion kit and it never really made sense in my mind. Here is the dilemma. You have a 556 rifle that is zeroed (POA POI for whatever distance) and you understand that well. Throw in a conversion kit and now what? Your POA and POI is not going to be the same as your 566. If you zero your sight/optic for .22 now your 556 is off. Also, the conversion doesn’t mean you just install the kit (to be reliable anyways) you have to add a pressure plug and a bolt catch adapter like a Catch 22. Then you still have twist rate that is not optimal and carbon /lead messing up your gas tube. I don’t get it, by the time one goes through dealing with all the hassle one would have been better off buying a dedicated 22 upper or build a dedicated .22 given how cheap a lower is. One would end up with a more accurate and reliable gun too. Thank you for pointing out the huge conspiracy that CMMG, and other manufacturers have been perpetrating on the AR15 gun owner communities. If it wasn't for your keen investigative work, this conspiracy would have never been uncovered, and millions of gun owners would have fallen for this scam. It's good to know that people like you are ready to point out the shortcomings of the .22 conversion kits, and we all applaud you for showing the world this information. You are a true American, and an AR15.com internet hero. . ....Actually, I'm kidding, and really don't care about what you posted |
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Originally Posted By BoomBoom: I don’t understand the concept of a .22 conversion kit and it never really made sense in my mind. Here is the dilemma. You have a 556 rifle that is zeroed (POA POI for whatever distance) and you understand that well. Throw in a conversion kit and now what? Your POA and POI is not going to be the same as your 566. If you zero your sight/optic for .22 now your 556 is off. Also, the conversion doesn’t mean you just install the kit (to be reliable anyways) you have to add a pressure plug and a bolt catch adapter like a Catch 22. Then you still have twist rate that is not optimal and carbon /lead messing up your gas tube. I don’t get it, by the time one goes through dealing with all the hassle one would have been better off buying a dedicated 22 upper or build a dedicated .22 given how cheap a lower is. One would end up with a more accurate and reliable gun too. Why I am using a 'conversion ' bolt? To allow me plenty and cheap trigger time at short distances <50 yds with the same gun I use in matches Why burn up full power 223s at 10-50 yds double tapping when .22 will give me 80% of that practice time and effectiveness at less than 25% of the cost. Most people don't like running lead down the pipe but I don't, these rifles are not safe queens.' POI differences are miniscule at these short ranges. Particularly head shots at <10 yds, the offset hold over is exactly the same. My conversion bolt runs in 2 match rifles without any added plugs in the buffer tube, the key to reliability I found is the trigger hammer energy, 100% reliable with Hiperfire Eclipse match triggers. All others such as JP, Trigger Tech, Timney, etc...did not yield that level of reliability with .22 rimfire ammo (yes, I am an AR trigger snob and I do have most of them). I do have dedicated .22 uppers but they are set up to mimic only 1 match rifle and others are just generic plinking. Bottom line, I am being true to ARFcom mentality, I have both dedicated .22 ARs and .22 conversion bolts
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Originally Posted By BoomBoom: I don’t understand the concept of a .22 conversion kit and it never really made sense in my mind. Here is the dilemma. You have a 556 rifle that is zeroed (POA POI for whatever distance) and you understand that well. Throw in a conversion kit and now what? Your POA and POI is not going to be the same as your 566. If you zero your sight/optic for .22 now your 556 is off. Also, the conversion doesn’t mean you just install the kit (to be reliable anyways) you have to add a pressure plug and a bolt catch adapter like a Catch 22. Then you still have twist rate that is not optimal and carbon /lead messing up your gas tube. I don’t get it, by the time one goes through dealing with all the hassle one would have been better off buying a dedicated 22 upper or build a dedicated .22 given how cheap a lower is. One would end up with a more accurate and reliable gun too. You’re describing old tech. Now it’s cheaper and easier to get a dedicated upper. Next thing you know, you have a cheap lower for it. I pieced together a dedicated upper for my ‘16 as opposed to using a drop in conversion. |
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Originally Posted By ark-and-spark: I zero my 5.56 at 100 yards. At 50 yards my conversion kit hits at the same spot. Your results may be different. Same here. No difference |
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I just picked up a Colt .22 conversion kit for my 6920. I haven't even taken it out of the wrapper yet, but it says I should lube it and cycle it a little before beginning. I have never had a .22 before, but I want to get some trigger time, and not shoot up my good defensive ammo. What kind of ammo is best for this, and what bullet weight would do best in a 1:7 barrel? Also, is there anything else I might need to know before installing and shooting the Colt branded kit in a Colt rifle? I also have a PSA SBR that I built, but it has a single stage PSA trigger. I have heard that light strikes are a thing with anything less than a mil spec trigger. Again, I am totally new to all of this, so any advice at this point would be welcome. TIA. |
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If the conversion is they type that uses the mag itself as the ejector, understand that it needs to be in place for it to eject a spent round and if you get a malf and drop the mag, it can sometimes get fiddley. Carry a little pick with you. All semi .22's have ammo they like and ammo they don't so buy a couple boxes of different manufacturers. CCI tends to work pretty decently. 1/7, to clean the barrel, use an old bore brush with all COPPER choir boy [not cheapo chinese copper coated shit] wrapped around it, it'll clean the barrel really quickly. I have several .22 conversion kits, a Colt and a Army M261, I run then in a 1/12 barrel twist A1 upper. |
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| mine was so I could use THE SAME rifle as I used in competition. A think barrel JP with good comp recoils like 22lr anyway, so I got to use the optic, trigger, weight, etc of my "real" gun for practice. 95% the same, just less loud. Inside 30 yards it was more than accurate enough for everything I needed it to do. |
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Originally Posted By ark-and-spark: I zero my 5.56 at 100 yards. At 50 yards my conversion kit hits at the same spot. Your results may be different. Pretty much the same here |
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Now days it's easy and fairly cheap to build a dedicated upper. But I can see why some want to use a conversion kit for training purposes if they aren't worried about good accuracy or they just plink with it. I used the M261 conversion kit quite a bit when I was in the Army. A conversion kit will never be as accurate as dedicated upper but they work fine. The M16A1 was more accurate with the conversion kit due to the 1-12 twist compared to the M16A2 with 1-7 twist. |
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Originally Posted By Stretchman: I just picked up a Colt .22 conversion kit for my 6920. I haven't even taken it out of the wrapper yet, but it says I should lube it and cycle it a little before beginning. I have never had a .22 before, but I want to get some trigger time, and not shoot up my good defensive ammo. What kind of ammo is best for this, and what bullet weight would do best in a 1:7 barrel? Also, is there anything else I might need to know before installing and shooting the Colt branded kit in a Colt rifle? I also have a PSA SBR that I built, but it has a single stage PSA trigger. I have heard that light strikes are a thing with anything less than a mil spec trigger. Again, I am totally new to all of this, so any advice at this point would be welcome. TIA. I have good results with the Federal auto match and cci stingers. Most 40gr copper washed bullets will function well. Keep the kit well lubed. |
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Its cheap practice. At 50 yds, my .22lr is less than an inch lower than 5.56. Not enough difference to make a difference. No, you dont need all those add ons to make it run. I get about the same accuracy as a stock 10/22. My cmmg bolt / mags has been very reliable. I have killed woodchucks with head shots at less than 50yds. |
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I picked up one one of the .22 conversion kits for my AR's...and it's awesome! Just drop it in any one of my uppers, and now I can shoot it all day for cheap. Also, it allows me to put my .22 suppressor on any of my AR's just to keep things quite. For what it is....it's pretty awesome. |
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Because sometimes you can’t buy the version you want in a dedicated upper. I started with a Rare Breed FRT in a dedicated CMMG M4 carbine. Got it running very well. Then wanted to shoot .22LR in my M16A1 clone. So I ordered the conversion kit, Bore Buddy weight kit and a CornFire MARC. It is an absolute blast to shoot in FRT mode. I probably shoot it more than about anything else I have now.Attached File |
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I've owned a couple of the drop in kits with a couple of magazines. It was simple. There was no whatever you called it in the kit nor was it necessary. 1. Pull rear pin. 2. Open action. 3. Pull out BCG 4. Drop in .22lr kit. 5. Close action. 6. insert rear pin. 7. Shoot and have fun. When done. 8. Pull pin. 9. Open action 10. Pull out .22lr conversion 11. Put in BCG 12. Insert 5.56 magazine 13. Fire a round to clean barrel and gas port 14. Either shoot it or put it back up. I could have stated that in about 10 steps, and it takes less time to do it than it does to type it. |
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I just decided to get a CMMG conversion to use in my 556 guns. I already have a decided side charging 22LR upper but for less than $150 with one black dog mag, and the fact I already have several other black dog mags why not? 556/223 is getting expensive and unfortunately so is everything else. I am lucky to have my own backwoods range ~100 yards so I have the opportunity to shoot as much as I want whenever I want. I don't have the funds to shoot 556/223 as much as I want. I was one of those guys who bought a couple 550 bulk packs every other week back in the day, so I have plenty of 22LR, and even if I have to buy some more, I can afford it easier than centerfire. Most of us aren't arfcom millionaires, and at least some of us don't pretend to be. I have a few other 22lr guns but as others have stated, ringing steel with 22LR in the AR platform is more fun. I usually get sick of loading 22 into mags before I get sick of shooting
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Originally Posted By ar-jedi:
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Its a 'gateway' drug and if your goal with it is to save money, or use your 556 at an indoor 25yd range, then conversion kit is the way to go... you may not want to build a dedicated 22lr upper/rifle having to buy two lights/lasers/premium optics to get 1:1 feel. at 50 yards and in, your 556 -> 22 zero doesnt matter much (especially with the lack of accuracy of bulk pack + incorrect diameter + incorrect twist + 2 inch smoothboore jump to rifling). People are usually stuffing these kits in <=16" red dot carbines... not their SPR. Now I also recognize and think a dedicated 22-AR rifle is "better" (reliability, accuracy) in the long run. But if you buy the conversion kit and get hooked, a mere $40 barrel collar gets your conversion kit ready to be a dedicated bolt, just add el-cheapo upper & 22lr barrel. I only have dedicated 556 or 22lr ARs, but they are setup all different to do very different things, and I have an outdoor range. and yes conversion kits are less reliable...but for practice with your 556 who cares if its 98% reliable thats good enough. Now if you have an AR-based rimfire steel challenge gun... it better be 99.9% reliable and weigh nothing, so dedicated is the only way different legitimate use cases. |
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Buddy of mine had a Ciener kit for a mini-14 back in the '90s. Ammo was cheap and more fun. If you removed the disconnector, it would run full-auto. Oh what fun. Sucked only having one magazine. The drawback was the gas port clogging up. I'll add that this was in Minecraft even though it didn't exist in the '90s. |
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