AR Sponsor
The Unscientific Plastic Magazine Test - Videos pg15 - Part 2 pg16 -(mobile users/56k do not click) (Page 10 of 13)
|
As a bump.....
Lancers on sale....Transulcent $15, Opaque $12 LINK Pmags also onsale for 20-30% off (search pmag on the above website) |
|
Originally Posted By WI57:
Ok just an update. I am trying to gather some things together to do some more tests, and to make some fixtures to increase repeatability. Looking into doing the cement mixer test too... I will start an entire new thread with the next series. Thanks again all for following.  A lot of us have subscribed to this thread. Can you please post a link to the new thread when you post it? Thanks again for the hard work and expense you've put into this. |
"I have always believed that real political discourse in the houses should involve fisticuffs. Otherwise, you have a bunch of co-conspirators or apathetic mouth breathers." - ValleyGunner
Stay in a Round Room You'll Never get Cornered
Joined:
Nov 2002
Posts:
9554
EE: 100% (1)
NV, USA
|
Originally Posted By splogan:
I have read through this whole thread and it really has been great. I never considered a lancer mag but now want a few lancers and some Troys. I do wish the thermold mags made it to round 2. Keep it up this is entertaining and informative. I quit buying Lancers because they will not fit into my Eagle Industries M4LE chest rig  . The Troys I have fit in my "tight" lowers very well, and they are very easy to draw from my chest rig, but the follower will allow a lot of tilt. That being said, I still have not had any malfunctions with them.
What surprised me most in this test was the Tapco mag. People hate on them, but the truth is their stuff isn't absolute garbage like some people think. |
If you are in the Huntington, WV area check out Herd Tactical. www.herdtactical.com 304-302-0509
|
I have almost exclusively GI metal mags, except for a couple of PMags I got during some trading, and some Orlites that I picked up when they were REALLY cheap.
When the Troy mags came out I picked up two, just to try them out and see how they worked. After this thread originally finished, I saw both TangoDown mags and Lancer Mags (the 20 rounders) on sale at prices too good to pass up after seeing how they performed during this test. So I grabbed some of each. Thanks again for your time and efforts in doing this. I also would have loved to see a 5.45 included in the test, as that is one of the variants I have. Oh well, maybe in round 3... 
|
"If God doesn't destroy San Fransisco, he should apologize to Sodom and Gomorrah..."
13.1 miles is a LONG way to run...
A closed mouth gathers no foot.
13.1 miles is a LONG way to run...
A closed mouth gathers no foot.
|
Originally Posted By lazyengineer:
Say, any chance we can see some renewed testing with the new MagPul M3 version. Which is reported advertised to have improved impact strength. http://www.magpul.com/assets/images/blogImages/M3%20Release/MAG557_BLK_02.png |
| I've primarily used USGI and PMags and been happy with them. I just got 10 Lancer 20s and a couple Troys to try out too. My initial impression is good of both. |
-"The truth does not require your belief in it to function."
-Genuine science is about gathering evidence and testing the veracity of theories, not cheerleading for a particular ideology.
-Genuine science is about gathering evidence and testing the veracity of theories, not cheerleading for a particular ideology.
|
I am soo watching for the next round of tests. I also will donate a mag or two for testing.
I'd like to see how they fit in standard mag carriers, but i realize that would mean multiple of each mag type. |
....They will find the streets are guarded by United States Marines
|
just saw this on youtube, the description is interesting, and the USGI mag jam is wierd because it looks like it almost made it, as in the mag did its job but the carrier was out of energy or something.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQxYXTYohPI&feature=em-subs_digest-newavtr&list=TLZLsVAgiRRfA I am really jealous of you btw, nice gear, when you're not punishing it. |
|
Originally Posted By lazyengineer:
Say, any chance we can see some renewed testing with the new MagPul M3 version. Which is reported to have improved impact strength. http://www.magpul.com/assets/images/blogImages/M3%20Release/MAG557_BLK_02.png I'm kind of holding off doing anything else for a little while to incorporate this new magazine. Because I know for a fact if I run these through the next day Magpul will start shipping the new M3's... 
Originally Posted By maggiethecat:
I am soo watching for the next round of tests. I also will donate a mag or two for testing. I'd like to see how they fit in standard mag carriers, but i realize that would mean multiple of each mag type. Thank you and thanks everyone for the magazine offers, but I have all the ones I need for now. I'd suggest trying your own tests on one of your favorite mags and seeing what happens. (That's how this whole thing started )
I am going to see what happens but this might turn into a cold weather test before too long. 
|
Its not the guy that walks in with a gun and says he is going to start shooting that you have to worry about.
Its the guy that just walks in and just starts shooting.
Its the guy that just walks in and just starts shooting.
|
Originally Posted By ARMATAC:
just saw this on youtube, the description is interesting, and the USGI mag jam is wierd because it looks like it almost made it, as in the mag did its job but the carrier was out of energy or something. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQxYXTYohPI&feature=em-subs_digest-newavtr&list=TLZLsVAgiRRfA I am really jealous of you btw, nice gear, when you're not punishing it. But but but its only a sample size of one... 
|
Its not the guy that walks in with a gun and says he is going to start shooting that you have to worry about.
Its the guy that just walks in and just starts shooting.
Its the guy that just walks in and just starts shooting.
|
Originally Posted By WI57:
Originally Posted By ARMATAC:
just saw this on youtube, the description is interesting, and the USGI mag jam is wierd because it looks like it almost made it, as in the mag did its job but the carrier was out of energy or something. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQxYXTYohPI&feature=em-subs_digest-newavtr&list=TLZLsVAgiRRfA I am really jealous of you btw, nice gear, when you're not punishing it. But but but its only a sample size of one... And there was no controlled method used for that drop test,like a chute. How do we know that the feedlips hit at exactly the same angle 
|
|
Originally Posted By WI57:
Originally Posted By ARMATAC:
just saw this on youtube, the description is interesting, and the USGI mag jam is wierd because it looks like it almost made it, as in the mag did its job but the carrier was out of energy or something. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQxYXTYohPI&feature=em-subs_digest-newavtr&list=TLZLsVAgiRRfA I am really jealous of you btw, nice gear, when you're not punishing it. But but but its only a sample size of one... 
All that talk about controlled scientific experiments and they used dummy rounds, talk about confounding an experiment. Cool video though, wish I had a camera that could do 5000fps. 
|
|
Originally Posted By cletussd:
Originally Posted By WI57:
Originally Posted By ARMATAC:
just saw this on youtube, the description is interesting, and the USGI mag jam is wierd because it looks like it almost made it, as in the mag did its job but the carrier was out of energy or something. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQxYXTYohPI&feature=em-subs_digest-newavtr&list=TLZLsVAgiRRfA I am really jealous of you btw, nice gear, when you're not punishing it. But but but its only a sample size of one... And there was no controlled method used for that drop test,like a chute. How do we know that the feedlips hit at exactly the same angle
We actually use an impact tester to test multiple batches of magazines during production. The video clearly states this is a one off drop test to demonstrate in a real world manner what we see in the lab fixtures. This drop was controlled by a hook and release fixture and impact angle confirmed in the high speed video. A chute would give a less accurate angle of impact along with robbing drop energy in the form of friction as the mag side down the shoot. |
|
Originally Posted By cletussd:
Originally Posted By WI57:
Originally Posted By ARMATAC:
just saw this on youtube, the description is interesting, and the USGI mag jam is wierd because it looks like it almost made it, as in the mag did its job but the carrier was out of energy or something. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQxYXTYohPI&feature=em-subs_digest-newavtr&list=TLZLsVAgiRRfA I am really jealous of you btw, nice gear, when you're not punishing it. But but but its only a sample size of one... And there was no controlled method used for that drop test,like a chute. How do we know that the feedlips hit at exactly the same angle
How do you know what angle the mag will hit when you fling it from you gun. I didn't see one mag in any of these tests that I wouldn't trust. They had the crap pounded out of them and they all kept working. And lets be real "if shtf and you had no way to replace mags and your magpul mag crack" you would drill a hole at the end of the crack so the crack wouldn't run, then you would hot knife (melt) the crack together again. OP, awesome job. Your tests have shown me that you can put a hell of a pounding on these mags, even the USGI ones that I thought would be the undisputed losers. |
Keep your swords sharp and your guns loaded.
Job well done to the O/P.  This is one of the few 20 page threads I've ever read front to back. 
I think ultimately in the end it isn't about which mag is "best", but rather "wow, those mags went through a lot!" I'd like to see some sort of stress test on having the weight of the rifle rest on the mag while inserted and see if the mags feed reliably. Oh, and I too would have liked to have seen Thermolds go through the testing, I think they are better mags than most people give them credit for. I have a new respect for Tango Down and Tapco mags. Nothing has changed my opinions of the Lancer, USGI, Troy, or Pmag magazines. Nothing is absolute in this world and mags are no different, all things mechanical break down. FWIW, this fellow will be sticking by his "3rd gen" USGI and Lancer mags. I've been %100 satisfied with them and see no reason to drink another flavor of kool-aid
|
|
Originally Posted By Magpul:
Originally Posted By cletussd:
Originally Posted By WI57:
Originally Posted By ARMATAC:
just saw this on youtube, the description is interesting, and the USGI mag jam is wierd because it looks like it almost made it, as in the mag did its job but the carrier was out of energy or something. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQxYXTYohPI&feature=em-subs_digest-newavtr&list=TLZLsVAgiRRfA I am really jealous of you btw, nice gear, when you're not punishing it. But but but its only a sample size of one... And there was no controlled method used for that drop test,like a chute. How do we know that the feedlips hit at exactly the same angle
We actually use an impact tester to test multiple batches of magazines during production. The video clearly states this is a one off drop test to demonstrate in a real world manner what we see in the lab fixtures. This drop was controlled by a hook and release fixture and impact angle confirmed in the high speed video. A chute would give a less accurate angle of impact along with robbing drop energy in the form of friction as the mag side down the shoot. That why I love MAG-PUL and WI57 you did a great job. |
|
First, that was absolutely outstanding.
I was very impressed with how all of the magazines fared. I wouldn’t feel too concerned about using any of them quite honestly. The GI magazines did much better than I expected and lasted longer than expected. The Lancer magazine appears to be very impressive, but I caveat that with the fact that this test was a sample of one, and very unscientific. Of the synthetic magazines, I think the PMAG is still a very solid bet regardless of what you see there. No it’s not invincible, but it’s pretty darned tough; especially when you consider the cost. Add to that the fact that there are oodles of them being used in war zones every day, so we have a good idea of how well they fare in the real world. No, they won’t last forever, but they’ll serve you well and won’t break the bank when you have to replace them. (just need to figure a way to get them into Afghanistan convenience stores so soldiers can just run to the Afghan equivalent of a 7-11 if he needs a replacement) At the end of the day though, I have to say I’ve yet to see ANY mag out-perform a Bulgarian synthetic circle 10 waffle AK magazine; to me, that remains the gold standard. Not a fair comparison, because the design of an AR mag well precludes the thickness afforded to the AK mags, since original steel AK mags had reinforced feed lips. Still, the Bugarian mag and perhaps some anecdotal evidence from this test show to me at least that a combining of steel and synthetics seems to be the best bet. While my Bulgarian synthetic mags may last a LONG time, they’re nowhere near as inexpensive for replacement as a PMAG; which remains a damn decent magazine. MESSAGE TO MAGPUL 1 – I’m still a fan, given the BIG picture which includes cost; you make a VERY good product. 2 – There’s always room for improvement. Perhaps a model incorporating a steel reinforced feed lip similar to the Lancer is worth looking at. Maybe even Tenifer coat said steel part for ultimate corrosion. View windows are always nice...would be cool to find a clear synthetic that can really take the rough stuff. And of course, in light of recent announcements, make it more M249 friendly. 3 – Did I mention I’m a fan of MAGPUL? Keep doing what you’re doing. |
|
Originally Posted By 3030ai:
First, that was absolutely outstanding. I was very impressed with how all of the magazines fared. I wouldn’t feel too concerned about using any of them quite honestly. The GI magazines did much better than I expected and lasted longer than expected. The Lancer magazine appears to be very impressive, but I caveat that with the fact that this test was a sample of one, and very unscientific. Of the synthetic magazines, I think the PMAG is still a very solid bet regardless of what you see there. No it’s not invincible, but it’s pretty darned tough; especially when you consider the cost. Add to that the fact that there are oodles of them being used in war zones every day, so we have a good idea of how well they fare in the real world. No, they won’t last forever, but they’ll serve you well and won’t break the bank when you have to replace them. (just need to figure a way to get them into Afghanistan convenience stores so soldiers can just run to the Afghan equivalent of a 7-11 if he needs a replacement) At the end of the day though, I have to say I’ve yet to see ANY mag out-perform a Bulgarian synthetic circle 10 waffle AK magazine; to me, that remains the gold standard. Not a fair comparison, because the design of an AR mag well precludes the thickness afforded to the AK mags, since original steel AK mags had reinforced feed lips. Still, the Bugarian mag and perhaps some anecdotal evidence from this test show to me at least that a combining of steel and synthetics seems to be the best bet. While my Bulgarian synthetic mags may last a LONG time, they’re nowhere near as inexpensive for replacement as a PMAG; which remains a damn decent magazine. MESSAGE TO MAGPUL 1 – I’m still a fan, given the BIG picture which includes cost; you make a VERY good product. 2 – There’s always room for improvement. Perhaps a model incorporating a steel reinforced feed lip similar to the Lancer is worth looking at. Maybe even Tenifer coat said steel part for ultimate corrosion. View windows are always nice...would be cool to find a clear synthetic that can really take the rough stuff. And of course, in light of recent announcements, make it more M249 friendly. 3 – Did I mention I’m a fan of MAGPUL? Keep doing what you’re doing. When designing the current M3 magazine we looked at all design variations during our R&D to include metal inserts. In our evaluation the benefits of adding material as support were far outweighed by the negatives across the whole gamut of requirements. PMag M3 test videos |
|
OP, thanks for the extended testing you did on the other caliber rounds with the different mags. Based on your testing, I put an order in last night directly to Lancer for a few AWM mags anticipating a future 458 SOCOM build. Who knows what's going to happen in the near future, and I was glad to be able to get these when I did. Thanks.
|
|
Originally Posted By 3030ai:
I was very impressed with how all of the magazines fared. I wouldn’t feel too concerned about using any of them quite honestly. The GI magazines did much better than I expected and lasted longer than expected. The Lancer magazine appears to be very impressive, but I caveat that with the fact that this test was a sample of one, and very unscientific. David Fortier's test had pretty much the same exact conclusions. (GI mags did better than expected, couldn't break the Lancer) I wouldn't say this test was VERY unscientific. You could argue it could be more scientific with a larger sample size but it is hard to argue that two similar test showing basically the same results is not meaningful. I know of no similar tests using large numbers of magazines under "controlled scientific" conditions. |
|
Originally Posted By Magpul: Originally Posted By 3030ai: First, that was absolutely outstanding. I was very impressed with how all of the magazines fared. I wouldn’t feel too concerned about using any of them quite honestly. The GI magazines did much better than I expected and lasted longer than expected. The Lancer magazine appears to be very impressive, but I caveat that with the fact that this test was a sample of one, and very unscientific. Of the synthetic magazines, I think the PMAG is still a very solid bet regardless of what you see there. No it’s not invincible, but it’s pretty darned tough; especially when you consider the cost. Add to that the fact that there are oodles of them being used in war zones every day, so we have a good idea of how well they fare in the real world. No, they won’t last forever, but they’ll serve you well and won’t break the bank when you have to replace them. (just need to figure a way to get them into Afghanistan convenience stores so soldiers can just run to the Afghan equivalent of a 7-11 if he needs a replacement) At the end of the day though, I have to say I’ve yet to see ANY mag out-perform a Bulgarian synthetic circle 10 waffle AK magazine; to me, that remains the gold standard. Not a fair comparison, because the design of an AR mag well precludes the thickness afforded to the AK mags, since original steel AK mags had reinforced feed lips. Still, the Bugarian mag and perhaps some anecdotal evidence from this test show to me at least that a combining of steel and synthetics seems to be the best bet. While my Bulgarian synthetic mags may last a LONG time, they’re nowhere near as inexpensive for replacement as a PMAG; which remains a damn decent magazine. MESSAGE TO MAGPUL 1 – I’m still a fan, given the BIG picture which includes cost; you make a VERY good product. 2 – There’s always room for improvement. Perhaps a model incorporating a steel reinforced feed lip similar to the Lancer is worth looking at. Maybe even Tenifer coat said steel part for ultimate corrosion. View windows are always nice...would be cool to find a clear synthetic that can really take the rough stuff. And of course, in light of recent announcements, make it more M249 friendly. 3 – Did I mention I’m a fan of MAGPUL? Keep doing what you’re doing. When designing the current M3 magazine we looked at all design variations during our R&D to include metal inserts. In our evaluation the benefits of adding material as support were far outweighed by the negatives across the whole gamut of requirements. PMag M3 test videos I keep watching the videos and am amazed at the amount of movement between the upper and the fore end, the mag catch, the mag itself. |
It didn't sound stupid until I said it out loud...
The Unscientific Plastic Magazine Test - Videos pg15 - Part 2 pg16 -(mobile users/56k do not click) (Page 10 of 13)
AR Sponsor