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Posted: 12/16/2025 11:31:17 AM EDT
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contemplating getting another upper... this time something in big bore, either .50 Beowulf, .450 Bushmaster or .458 SOCOM.... I dont do a lot of huntin, but it may happen in the future. We DO have a lot of javelina in the area as a nuisance though. What are the pros/cons to the big mamma-jammas? |
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I am looking at 450BM. Its straight wall, so it's legal to hunt with in all the straight wall states. 458 socom is not. For this reason, it seems that 450BM is taking off in a little mote popularity. I've always wanted a 50 baowulf, but for some reason it just doesn't seem all that popular. Not many cheap guns for sale in it. Ruger makes a bolt action in 450bm, and an AR, and plenty of others make 450bm guns. I am very interested in building a 450BM rifle with the specific goal of subsonic suppressed big game hunting. There will be a ton of drop, but anything standing in front of 400gr slug should die. Even better if i can do it from an sbr. Still some more research to be done, but I think this is a fun idea. 45-70 and 450bm seem to be nearly identical. 45-70 is neat, but putting a suppressor on most of the rifles makes for a really large rig. |
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I built a 450 BM (16') upper just for fun, an OG Bushmaster brand factory upper without handguard. I put an MLOK handguard on it and it runs like a champ with my big bore suppressor (Rex Silentium). I bought a bunch of the Hornady FTX 250gr (LINK ) and then some subs (395gr Hornady) My observations is that it hits like a hammer out to about 200 then drops like a rock from there. Magazines - I bought like 10 followers and used metal mags and those work fine - you can get something like 10 or 11 in a 30 rounder and 6 in a 20 rounder). I have a few OG Bushmaster 450 mags that work great and then some ASC's that work well also. I put a Bushnell "special" scope on it, a 3-10 on a 1" tube, standard mil-dot (they made it with Midway at LOW, so Japanese glass) and have taken it out to 300Y on steel successfully. I'm going to sell it since the last time I used it was to blow up a ceramic toilet about a year ago. Worked like a champ. PM me if interested :). I've got a pretty big stash of ammo too that I think I bought at under $1/round (it looks like it's $1.50 or more now). It's a great cartridge if you know it's limitations. Great in heavy woods and out to 200Y (and where straightwall is a requirement). I satisfied my itch with it |
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I have one in 458 Socom that I have fired. I have just put together one in 450 Bushmaster, but I have not fired it yet. As has been mentioned, the 450 is a straight walled case, which is required for hunting in some states. The 458 is a bottleneck case. The cases have about the same case capacity. But, the 450 uses smaller, lighter pistol bullets. Though you can get some that are relatively heavy.. Because the bullets are lighter, velocities are usually higher. If you’re a reloader, the 450 uses pistol powders. The 458 uses rifle size bullets, and they are usually heavier. Basically, the 458 picks up where the 450 leaves off. Because the bullets are heavier, velocities are lower. The 458 usually uses rifle powders on the quicker burning side, though some pistol powders are suitable. Think of the 458 as a light 45-70. |
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Hey! Big bores are my area of enthusiasm at the moment. All around, I think 450 Bushmaster is the superior cartridge for "general purposes." It's legal in more places than 458 SOCOM, and easier and faster to handload ammo. Inexpensive .452 bullets (450) are all over the place, in comparison to .458 ones. I think 458 and 450 are both superior in concept to 50 Beowulf, though I do not own a 50 myself. My reasoning is that there are a lot more silencers on the market appropriate for mid sized 45 caliber rifle rounds than 50 caliber. I'm sure it's a formidable round in its own right, but silencers are a priority for me. All that said, if I could only choose one big bore round to keep, it would be the 458 SOCOM. There's just something about it. I think the tapered/bottlenecked case is better for semi auto feeding. So to sum up, 450 is more accessible for new buyers, but 458 holds my heart. https://imgur.com/Gek7i3Y They're also fun with an FRT. 
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I have the .50 Beowulf and the .458 SOCOM. I love them both and after shooting some hogs and deer I can't say one is better than the other. IMO if you want one of these, /50 BW or .458 SOCOM, you really need to reload your own ammo. If you're not a reloader, you might want to consider making a small investment in just the stuff needed to load for one of these cartridges. It won't cost that much to get set up to make your own ammo. My .50 BW slings the 334gr Rainer HP at 1900 FPS. My .458 SOCOM literally stacks the 325 FTX on top of each other at 50 yards. IMO these are 150 yard and in guns.   I will say if you decide on a .458 SOCOM, don't screw around, go with a TROMIX upper. They are fantastic. |
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I had the same dilema years ago, and went with 450 bushmaster for reasons mentioned above as well as one big one that i haven't read yet, but highly influenced me. Factory ammo. There is more factory ammo available for 450 bushmaster than the other two. Edit, since we're doin pics and all. 
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| thanks for the info guys. I used to reload about 15 years ago, before the great primer scarcity..... I really should get back into it, especially with the big bores.... not that reloading for .45ACP and others cant save a BUNCH over factory ammo..... About all factory ammo is good for in my eyes is as a source of once fired brass.... :D |
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You guys are making me feel better. I just put this together last week, but was already wondering if I really wanted it, or if I should repurpose for something else. I'll stick with the 458 SOCOM setup, just gotta get busy reloading. Attached File |
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Originally Posted By Vapor_Man: You guys are making me feel better. I just put this together last week, but was already wondering if I really wanted it, or if I should repurpose for something else. I'll stick with the 458 SOCOM setup, just gotta get busy reloading. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/413923/1000011457_jpg-3676834.JPG Nice looking! |
| I can get 450 Bushmaster almost anywhere. At the time I got it, I didn't reload so that was a big plus. Con it uses .452 bullets for 45 pistol not .458 like the 45 70 govt. So bullet selection especially subsonic can be an issue although Hornady makes a Subsonic 450 BM now. It's also straight wall for states that it matters. It's also not proprietary like the 50 beuwulf is. |
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Originally Posted By jd2395: sweet! how do you like that Steiner? I could not decide what optic for the 450BM so as stated above I used what I had lying around (3-10 SFP). Nice looking! The Steiner's nice, has a better 8x than any others I've tried. Reticle combined with a ton of resolution at 8x makes it a nice SPR type. Glass at 1x is great, but people dog on it for reticle brightness. Being SFP makes reticle still "fast" for aiming at 1x. It's just a different set of 1-8x tradeoffs than I think the market expected, and it helps it fill a niche. Thx
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Seeing .308 cases after being fired in a .30-'06 chamber, I looked for a .45-08 wildcat but came up empty. Do y'all know of any such effort? ETA: Seems .45 Raptor with magazine insert is the ticket. |
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458 SOCOM uses standard mags and followers but will also work with dedicated followers. A dedicated follower means your mag will not work with 5.56 so mag capacity meets round count requirements in lefty states. A very flat nose bullet MAY require a bit of dremel work at the front of the mag. |
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I have a few 450bm and the round has been here for about 15+ years or so now, there are plenty of rifle bullets designed for the speed of the 450bm. You dont have to use pistol bullets, but you can for cheap practice if desired. You can get 180gn - 395gn out of the 450bm.....but most of the offerings are around 250-300gn. I run a 200gn Barnes bullet at 2550fps for deer hunting. I also have a 10.5 sbr with hybrid 46 can that I've been playing with....a 395gn bullet is challenging to make accurate hits with the rainbow trajectory. If you plan on using factory ammo the 450bm will be hard to beat for availability. If you like a lot of 300+ gn bullets the SOCOM has more selection. |
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| Following with interest… I live in hog country now and it seems like a good excuse to put together a SBR upper. I started out looking at 8.6 BK and now I’m reading up on .458 SOCOM and .450 Bushmaster, too. I’d like it to be capable both with suppressed subs and suppressed or unsuppressed supers, but it would probably be shot mostly unsuppressed initially since I don’t have a large bore can and don’t know much about them. |
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I finally built and then got my 458 SOCOM to shoot. I originally bought the stripped upper 5 or 6 years ago. It took a while to function - Faxon barrel I think, maybe BCA. Went with Tromix bolt (and random carrier). I might look at the complete Tromix upper now, they have an occasional blem and a budget option now. I did not have factory ammo to shoot (I am too cheap), and struggled to get reloads to function. Fire yes, function, no. Last trip to the range, with a stronger reload and well oiled bolt, everything is great and functioning. Wish I had only changed 1 thing on that trip, because I still do not know why it would not function. I think my barrel extension is cut horribly, I should post pics sometime. I likely should have gone with 450 BM, I think they are a little easier to build/ find quality parts for, and give good options for reloads. They would also give me a better option for hunting in nearby areas. The SOCOM means standard mags work, and certainly will work well for hunting here in NY. If I hunt elsewhere I can always buy another rifle! No bad choice, and I am happy with mine! arfcom always says get both! |
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Maybe it's just the bullet, but I'm unimpressed with .450 on deer. Federal blue box 300 grain softpoints, two deer out of three solidly hit and zero blood trail. Meanwhile every deer I've seen hit (8-9)with .350 Legend has been down within sight of the shot. Lots say they see the exact opposite trend, so I'm not saying don't buy one. |
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Originally Posted By shack357: Maybe it's just the bullet, but I'm unimpressed with .450 on deer. Federal blue box 300 grain softpoints, two deer out of three solidly hit and zero blood trail. Meanwhile every deer I've seen hit (8-9)with .350 Legend has been down within sight of the shot. Lots say they see the exact opposite trend, so I'm not saying don't buy one. I’ve killed a lot of deer over the last 10 years with the 250 grain Hornady factory loads. Pass thru on all and great blood trails. |
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Originally Posted By glock23c: I’ve killed a lot of deer over the last 10 years with the 250 grain Hornady factory loads. Pass thru on all and great blood trails. Good to know. That load is accurate in my gun too, I bought the Federal when I couldn't find Hornady. |
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Originally Posted By DeltaEliteMan: What is the scope of choice for big bore AR-15's these days? I have a Trijicon Ascent 1-4 on my 458 SOCOM. It's a damn fine scope. On my 16" 450 I have a generic 3-9, I think it's a Vortex.  " /> " />On my 338 ARC and short 450, I have 1.5-4x Leupolds. |
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I look at the 450BM vs 50 Beowulf kinda similar to how I look at the S&W 460 mag vs the 500 mag. If you just have to have the biggest hole puncher out there, then get the 50, but the 450BM is more popular, ammo is more readily available (if you don't reload), ballistics, while still a potato lobber, are in favor of the 450 in terms of distance (it's flatter shooting...but flat in this case is subjective). The SOCOM is another good choice, but if you want it to hunt with, be sure it's legal anywhere you intend to hunt as some states only allow straight wall carts. In terms of power, they're all similar, but the 450BM is actually slightly ahead of the 50 and a bit more than the SOCOM. The SOCOM does well for suppressed subsonics if that's your game. All are sub-200 yard rounds...and arguably 150 or less. All three will put a whompin on critters. |
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Originally Posted By EDL: I look at the 450BM vs 50 Beowulf kinda similar to how I look at the S&W 460 mag vs the 500 mag. |
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Originally Posted By jimhoff: Interesting. I went .50 Beowulf to "match" my .500 S&W magnum. I haven't shot it in 10 years but got it out today. I need to make up a few reliable magazines--they were a bit of a problem a decade ago with my wide, flat-nose boolets. I was casting those 405 grain bullets for it back then and have a bunch still. Shooting trash with it is a rollicking good time. I bought it for picnic bench overwatch while camping in Alaska. That’s pretty darn funny ^^^ For hunting, convenience, basic utility, the more popular 450BM wins. For more versatile performance, and custom heavy loads, the 458 offers many more choices. I got a Tromix barrel +bolt in .458 for the base of a 100% reliable carbine. It will make gravel from melon sized rocks with 500gr bullets at subsonic velocity. Switch mags to a 325gr Attached File Hornady jelly tip for fun and easy practice. Either load would drop any game I care to hunt. Well, maybe not the biggest pik-nik basket bandits! |
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Originally Posted By Wandell: ALWAYS BEEN CURIOUS ABOUT BIG BORE AR 15S WHAT IS A GOOD SERVICABLE BIG BORE COMPLETE UPPER FOR MIL SPEC LOWERS THAT WONT BREAK THE BANK? Bear Creek makes some pretty good stuff, if you're willing and able to do some troubleshooting. I have a 16" barreled 450 Bushmaster from them, as well as a 10" bolt action upper with their parts. If you want to have higher confidence that it will work out of the box, buy Tromix. Still pretty reasonable, and they are the gold standard in big bore ARs. |
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If you want one that is good to go guaranteed out of the box, from the guy who knows more about building .458 SOCOMs than just about anyone in the country, and a hell of a lot more than BCA knows or will ever know, and you want a rifle that is accurate, then go with the original designer of the .458 SOCOM TROMIX. And you won't need to send it back to correct poor QC problems like many have had with BCA and Radical. If you need to pinch pennies, then look at their Builder's Specials and economy line series. Honest to God, you cannot do better for a .458 SOCOM (or any big bore AR) anywhere at any price than with anything from TROMIX. By the way, with the .458 SOCOM, it uses standard magazines. PMags can cause a problem with rounds loaded to full 2.250 length because of the rib down the front of the magazine, but Lancer or just about any milspec magazine will do without any modifications at all. If you shoot wide melplat bullets, you might need to cut a half moon in the top front of the magazine. If shooting something like a round nose or semi-spitzer (like the Barnes 300 gr. TTSX or the Hornady 250 gr. Monoflex or the 325 gr. FTX) the half-moon cut is not needed, at least not with a TROMIX upper. |
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Originally Posted By ELittlefield: Bear Creek makes some pretty good stuff, if you're willing and able to do some troubleshooting. I have a 16" barreled 450 Bushmaster from them, as well as a 10" bolt action upper with their parts. If you want to have higher confidence that it will work out of the box, buy Tromix. Still pretty reasonable, and they are the gold standard in big bore ARs. Originally Posted By ELittlefield: Originally Posted By Wandell: ALWAYS BEEN CURIOUS ABOUT BIG BORE AR 15S WHAT IS A GOOD SERVICABLE BIG BORE COMPLETE UPPER FOR MIL SPEC LOWERS THAT WONT BREAK THE BANK? Bear Creek makes some pretty good stuff, if you're willing and able to do some troubleshooting. I have a 16" barreled 450 Bushmaster from them, as well as a 10" bolt action upper with their parts. If you want to have higher confidence that it will work out of the box, buy Tromix. Still pretty reasonable, and they are the gold standard in big bore ARs. This. With Bear Creek, the customer is the QC department. My .450 is accurate but came with the gas port undersized. If you buy from Tromix it will work. |
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Originally Posted By ScottinAZ: contemplating getting another upper... this time something in big bore, either .50 Beowulf, .450 Bushmaster or .458 SOCOM.... I dont do a lot of huntin, but it may happen in the future. We DO have a lot of javelina in the area as a nuisance though. What are the pros/cons to the big mamma-jammas? |
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