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Posted: 12/4/2024 8:53:26 PM EDT
| I just bought a 10.5" .223 pistol upper. Is the volume and blast from the shorter barrel noticeably greater to the shooter and area than a 16" rifle upper outdoors? |
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Sure it is. Is it awful? Not with decent hearing protection. I rarely shoot anything under 12.5 without a can, but I will now and then. I think where the short stuff really shines is when you want to run a suppressor. They are considerably more handy than, say a 16" (also suppressed). Doesn't mean they can't be used without them. If you're not running a suppressor, do yourself a favor and don't buy into the latest and greatest muzzlebrake idea. It'll make it much worse. Run a simple flash hider, linear comp or blast can. |
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Originally Posted By AR-Admirer: I just bought a 10.5" .223 pistol upper. Is the volume and blast from the shorter barrel noticeably greater to the shooter and area than a 16" rifle upper outdoors? Outdoors? Not a lot if no overhead or adjacent cover. I have a 10.5, and tried a linear comp when I first put it together. It was loud. I didn't like the look and went to a 3-prong, still loud but looks a lot better. The muzzle is closer to the ear, and while a linear comp will help a little, it will still be loud. Just don't put a muzzle brake on it, for the love of gawd. You will need "ears", regardless 
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Originally Posted By AR-Admirer: How much louder? Twice as loud? With what muzzle device? Decibel-wise, with the same flash hider or linear comp on both, it wouldn't be nearly twice as loud. Perhaps 10%, but that would be a guess as I don't have a meter to measure. |
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The secondary impulse from a Mk18 unsuppressed is 30% worse than a 20” .308. The initial impulse of a 10.3” Mk18 is equal to a 20” .308. See Fig 2B: https://pewscience.com/sound-signature-reviews-free/sss-6-51-research-supplement-unsuppressed-rifle-and-mk18 It’s a double whammy, muzzle blast followed by flash-bang. They occur virtually concurrently so your ear hears as a single concussive event. |
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Originally Posted By KalmanPhilter: The secondary impulse from a Mk18 unsuppressed is 30% worse than a 20” .308. The initial impulse of a 10.3” Mk18 is equal to a 20” .308. See Fig 2B: https://pewscience.com/sound-signature-reviews-free/sss-6-51-research-supplement-unsuppressed-rifle-and-mk18 It’s a double whammy, muzzle blast followed by flash-bang. They occur virtually concurrently so your ear hears as a single concussive event. I have a half dozen 5.56 guns from 20" down to 10.5", all with A2 or 3-prong MD's. I downloaded a decibel meter ap to my phone and am going to do a test next time I have a chance to take them all to the range. That might be a while now tho, winter. |
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I fired my new 10.5” Aero pistol upper this afternoon. I used ear plugs and didn’t notice the blast seeming louder than my 16” rifle. I didn’t have a way to measure the sound. The landowner said it seemed loud from his house when I asked. The upper has a standard A2 flash hider. I probably will use a blast deflector when I find good one for a good price. BTW, the upper is a complete Aero built upper. It came with a new Toolcraft nitride BCG. The pistol ran smooth and reliably out of the box with a heavy dose of lubricant applied to the BCG. Evidently, Aero got the carbine gas port right since it was barely able to cycle .223 level ammo with an H2 buffer. The same .223 ammo cycled well with a carbine buffer. I think using an H buffer will be the sweet spot. I hope someone can chime in with loudness data between the short barrel upper and longer barreled upper. |
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I have a 12.5" 5.56 and I added a extended flash hider from KAK, it really cut own on the blast and redirects everything forward. I liked it so much I had it P/W to the barrel and tossed the brace and added a stock, turned it into a rifle. Here is what I used. https://kakindustry.com/retro-4-inch-extended-flash-hider It made it a very handy light carbine, shoots and handles very well. |
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They are pricey but I love my Witt Machine SME's. https://wittmachine.net/sound-mitigation-equipment/ |
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Originally Posted By panthermark: I probably have a dozen flash cans and linear comps and stuff. Shorties are always loud. Best you can do throw sound forward when outside. And here is an example, KAK Micro Flashcan for about $25. Attached File |
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Originally Posted By livinfree: And here is an example, KAK Micro Flashcan for about $25. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/273029/IMG_1345_jpeg-3488915.JPG I have several of those micros, plus few of the non micro versions. I started off with those on everything. I've been slowly switching over to exterior threaded muzzle device with blast shields or linear comps over them. Basically, I'm trying homebrew versions of Surefire Wardens. Everything centerfire is still ear splitting loud, but without the sonic crack and pushing the sound forward, standard velocity .22LR isn't too bad. Indoors, everything bounces back. |
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Originally Posted By panthermark: I have several of those micros, plus few of the non micro versions. I started off with those on everything. I've been slowly switching over to exterior threaded muzzle device with blast shields or linear comps over them. Basically, I'm trying homebrew versions of Surefire Wardens. Everything centerfire is still ear splitting loud, but without the sonic crack and pushing the sound forward, standard velocity .22LR isn't too bad. Indoors, everything bounces back. Originally Posted By panthermark: Originally Posted By livinfree: And here is an example, KAK Micro Flashcan for about $25. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/273029/IMG_1345_jpeg-3488915.JPG I have several of those micros, plus few of the non micro versions. I started off with those on everything. I've been slowly switching over to exterior threaded muzzle device with blast shields or linear comps over them. Basically, I'm trying homebrew versions of Surefire Wardens. Everything centerfire is still ear splitting loud, but without the sonic crack and pushing the sound forward, standard velocity .22LR isn't too bad. Indoors, everything bounces back. Show us some pictures of your exterior threaded devices. I'm not familiar with the Surefire stuff as it has always been out of my price range. Are some of you shooting without hearing protection? With good quality hearing protection, I hear no difference. I never shoot any gun, center-fire or 22LR without hearing protection. However, I do not shoot in indoor ranges. |
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I have a ton of these Breek Arms MD's now: (From the Breek Arms site).  I also have a few ebay specials that came with heavy ass STEEL blast shields. So it is a muzzle device with an external thread for a blast shield or some type of linear comp. I have short medium and long flash hiders and brakes, just trying different combinations, but they are still really loud (and I really only shoot 22LR and 300blk). Witt Machine has their SME https://wittmachine.net/sound-mitigation-equipment/  And there is the old SureFire Warden that goes over their own MD's. https://www.surefire.com/warden/  There are a bunch of others floating around, but I didn't want to get locked into a certain type of mount. I think the Breek Arms MD's have a fairly common outside thread of 13/16x16. But in the end, shorties are loud and these things are not silencers. Example of a comp over a brake. 
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Originally Posted By panthermark: I have a ton of these Breek Arms MD's now: (From the Breek Arms site). https://cdn11.bigcommerce.com/s-rz2257vzjw/images/stencil/original/image-manager/all-muzzle-device-category-picture-4-done.jpg?t=1702628949 I also have a few ebay specials that came with heavy ass STEEL blast shields. So it is a muzzle device with an external thread for a blast shield or some type of linear comp. I have short medium and long flash hiders and brakes, just trying different combinations, but they are still really loud (and I really only shoot 22LR and 300blk). Witt Machine has their SME https://wittmachine.net/sound-mitigation-equipment/ https://wittmachine.net/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/prod4.jpg And there is the old SureFire Warden that goes over their own MD's. https://www.surefire.com/warden/ https://cdn11.bigcommerce.com/s-fecqh2764q/images/stencil/1920w/products/905/1258/WARDEN-DE-isoL__63026.1684169014.jpg?c=2 There are a bunch of others floating around, but I didn't want to get locked into a certain type of mount. I think the Breek Arms MD's have a fairly common outside thread of 13/16x16. But in the end, shorties are loud and these things are not silencers. Example of a comp over a brake. https://aim7tac.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/12/2970.jpg Very cool. I haven't seen these before. Thanks for your time and info. |
| My suggestion would always be a suppressor. However, if you’re looking for a QD style blast can and are planning to get a suppressor down the line, it might be a good idea to get one that’s HUB threaded. That way you can play with different mounting systems and see what you like, and you’ll already have the hardware when you buy a can. |
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