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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Wolf M193 Bad Day (Page 2 of 2)
Im sure thats part of it but they are also commited to satisfied customers, thats why they back their ammo with a 100% guarantee |
I hope that is true. If so, it would put them in the minority among businesses in America where "the customer is always right" has been replaced by "fuck the customer, NEXT!". If they could just combine their great customer service with a good reliable product, we'd all be beating a path to their door. They have some hurdles to overcome. |
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800 rounds fired. Zero popped primers. Quick note: a LULA is worth every penny! Accuracy is on par with other M193 loads. Upper #1 Colt M16 with Bushmaster 16" superlight barrel 1/9. Colt M16 bolt carrier group. Upper #2 Bushamster A2 with Bushmaster 20" A2 barrel 1/9. Colt M16 bolt carrier group. Upper #1 & #2 were used on the same lower - Bushmaster A2. Rifle #3 WASR3 NHMTG mags for the AR and Weiger mags for the WASR. Results: Upper #1 functioned flawlessly up until it short stroked at round #55. Cycling became increasingly erratic the more the upper was shot. Sometimes I'd drop the hammer to find an empty chamber. Mostly the upper was failing to feed from the right side of the magazine no matter which mag was used. Could be a burr on the barrel extension which has gone unnoticed while shooting other ammo. By the time I got to 200 rounds I was manually chambering every other round. Brass from upper #1   Upper #2 functioned flawlessly up until a short stroke at round #225. Things looked unusually dry so I pulled the bolt carrier group and placed two drops of CLP through the carrier vent holes. Reassembled and fired another 175 rounds with another 2 short strokes (chamber empty - pull trigger - click) and an occasional (3) failire to return to battery. One or two raps on the forward assist and all was good to go. Brass looked so normal I didn't snap any pictures. Recoil was VERY light for the entire 400rounds so I topped off the 20" test with 15 rounds of Federal XM193. For the first 5 rounds there was no change in recoil. For the final 10 shots there was a noticable increase in recoil - back to what I would call normal. Thinking back, I should have done the same with upper #1, but 5 hours in the sun does things with your desire to keep shooting. WASR3 - No failures of any kind for 200 rounds. Brass was getting ejected 25 feet. brass from the WASR  |
Yes - but limited. *Some* brass flow should be expected on a hot .mil pressure round like M193 spec stuff. He also shows a little primer flow into the bolt face, but also limited. Nothing in that brass screams dangerous.... but there are just the starting signs of high pressure. However, givent his short stroking.... I'd say he is having the same issue as so many of us with this stuff. |
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QUESTION ABOUT P.P. 5.56mm M193 P.P. has been makeing this round for years now? it seems 2004? DONT REALLY know? They must be selling this stuff to OTHER COUNTRIES or military I wonder if it was meant to be fired out of AK`s OR OTHERE WEAPONS BESIDES THE ar15/m16 platform? |
Could the brass itself be too soft/inferior? I know that shouldn't explain blown primers or leakage around the primers, but maybe soft brass might give signs of overpressure prematurely. I know that wasn't the case with my rounds but maybe those above? I love my ARs, but compared to a FAL or an AK, they are finicky buggers. |
My A1 Shorty Bushmaster has shot ABOUT everything This AR15 is not PICKY at all. and has never Hic Up EVER IMI M855 Lake City M855 Winn M855 Santa Barbra SS109 S&B SS109 SA M193 IMG M193 Win Q3131 Win Q3131A /IMI federal/Lakecity xm193 P.P./Wolf M193 Fake S&B M193 PMC M193 brown Box 223rem AMMO Wolf 55 Federals AE 55 REM UMC 55 Win 55 Win 45 Federal 69bthp Black Hills Blue Box 77gr Black Hill Blue box 75gr PMP 55 wish I had more pretty accurate out of the bushwhacker I might of left some out 
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Mine are probably like school girls, still tight and not broken in. If I still had some I'd send you some of my hand grenade Wolf to try in your invulnerable rifle. Only probs I have ever had have been with Wolf (excepting the old lacquer stuff which shot fine), go figure. Some rifles are just particular I guess. |
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My quick review: I finally was able to get some range time, Weapons are as follwed NEW 20inch model 1 HBAR upper chrome lined chamber/bore 1/9 twist enhance carrier/w bushy bolt stag arms lower Slightly used from EE forum 16 inch bushy HBAR chrome lined chamber/bore 1/9 twist CMT M16 carrier/used bushy bolt eagle arms lower I started the day with slow fire to warm up the barrels wolf fmj and hollow point 62gr followed by some WWB 55gr. Then proceded to dump 6 30rd mags of wolf 62 gr hp for pure fun threw each upper. Once fun time was over set up 2 rifle targets at 50 meters using wolfs new m193 "nato spec 55gr" Zeroed both rifles with in 12 shoots, accuracy was on par with any other nato spec ammo I have fired. zero problems keeping all rounds in the x and 10 ring at 50 meters. I later went from slow fire to all out mag dumps to see if I would have any issues with this ammo. Zero issuse of FTF OR FTE. Not one blown primer, both my 16 and 20 rifle fired this ammo with out a hiccup. All in all a little over 200rnds of wolf m193 were fired threw both weapons, not to include sevral hundred rnds of cheap 62 grn fmj and 62grn hp wolf and about 100rnds of WWB. All brass was headstamped 2005 lot ppu 0503-02. I really am impressed so far with this ammo, and will be ordering another 1000rns form sportsmansguide this week. Hopefully I will continue to have the same good results Hvae a nice day 
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I've never had a problem with lot 44 head stamped 2005. Can't wait until they come out with 75gr rounds as mentioned by Gunwrtr. I will be stocking up on that! My guess is that 2004 stuff has problems. I would like to get some '06 just to verify my luck so far... |
On the side of hte rim, it also looks like the extraxtor bent the rim back a bit? Hard to tell conclusively from the images. If those marks are there, then they would be classic signs of overpressure conditions. |
It's not just your eyes. That conclusion has been reached on previous pages. Ammo has gone back to Wolf and I am waiting for a refund check. Sounds like 2004 may have been an off year for this stuff and that 2005 headstamps work fine. Personally, I've moved on to Radway and Guat. We'll see how well they work. Should be no probs. |
really its NNY No Joke |
RADWAY SOUNDS GOOD |
| Just found this thread after trying to shoot with the 2004 marked ammo. It would not cycle a new round into the chamber. I would fire the 1st shot than click. no round. I thought i was safe the first box was the 2005 stuff and it worked fine. Lesson, dont use any of the 2004 stuff. |
Or just avoide Wolf M193 altogether until they issue a statement that they have taken the information, and resolved the problem. 
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I HEAR THAT!! I had GREAT RESULTS but wont buy it anymore? |
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Well I purchased 1k rounds from ammoman about 3 weeks ago. I shot about 400 rounds of it with only 3 fail to fire with light hits on the primer. This was when attempting to bump fire. Otherwise no issues. Now I must say Im a noob to rifles and did not look for signs of high pressure that you guys noticed. In fact I did not know to look for them until this post. (Thx for the info -- I will definitly keep my eyes open from now on) Since they appeared to work so good for me I ordered another 1k about a week ago. I look at my ammo and it apears to all be 2005. I plan on going to the range later this week and will post a report/pics when I get back. I shot a S&W MP15. Thx again for the info guys ... |
You got to give them credit for taking back the problematic ammo. I took the same rifle (that I shot the Wolf M193 2004 headstamp that started this thread) to the range today and burned through some Radway and some Guat. and it ran like a sewing machine. Wolf is just going to have to eat the bad ammo and try to do better. When they start making true mil-spec ammo, I may risk it again. Not until they get a rock solid rep on a product line though. If Federal can make "budget" AE223 that runs well in AR-15s, why the Hell can't Wolf get their shit together? |
Cratered primers are just another sign of over pressure. |
The only thing I can think of to explain it is that there must be "relatively" tight chambers and "loose" chambers within the normal tolerance range for rifles. Both mine (Armalite and CMMG) are chromed NATO chambers and neither of them like Wolf. The M855 is made specifically for the M4/M16 and undoubtedly has undergone a great deal of testing prior to being fielded in these weapons. I get the sense that Wolf is using us as beta testers for their ammo. When they earn the right to put the NATO cross on their cases, I'll belly up and try some more, until then, I'll stick to what I KNOW works. BTW, there was a little dimple in the tip of my firing pin caused by the blow outs and I did replace it. |
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Took 100 rounds of 2005 stamped Wolf M193 and my Colt 6721 to the range today for a quick test. My 6721 is 100% factory and I used GI 20 Round Colt mags with metal follower. The first 2 magazines went through without a hitch. The 3rd, 4th and 5th magazine had one FTF each for a total of 3 FTF for the 100 rounds. I simply pulled back the bolt and chambered a round each time and kept going. All of the casings had the extractor impression on the back. Several of the spent casings had darkened areas around the primer. No FTE or duds ..... For me I'll be using the rest of my Wolf as plinking rounds .... Wondering if the problem has to do with the brass? I picked up some spent 5.56 shells that were laying on the floor from somebody before me. I didn't have a scale or anything but while inspecting the non-Wolf casing it felt heavier. Has anybody weighed the a Wolf empty casing and see how it compared to an Lake City casing? |
I'm on my second 1000 round lot of (2005) Lot#46,47,48. Both were purchased from Ammoman. I had no issues with the first 1000 rounds. Now it's time to have some fun with the second case. |
| I have 2000 rounds of the 05 wolf M193. Have shot 500 rounds of it . 1st 3 mags no prob. after that FTF 1-3- per mag. Rifle is new RRA , may be having gumming up issues. We are shooting today and my brother in law has DPMS. I'll have him shoot some and see what happens. Otherwise no blown primers or indications of overpressure problems. |
[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Wolf M193 Bad Day (Page 2 of 2)
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