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Quoted:
It is frustrating, you come right an inch and up an inch, and it goes a half inch left.  Quoted:
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The Caliber must be incredibly frustrating to you and your group Mark, as your used to stacking them in there with ease. But in my experience with the few rifles I have shot with it (AAC, ccouple of home builts), and factory ammo---its not a hole stacker. Its a 100 yard capable deer dropper. It is frustrating, you come right an inch and up an inch, and it goes a half inch left. Mark, What you mentioned above is EXACTLY what I experienced today at the range. Just mounted a new scope (Leupold VX-R 1-4) on top of my Noveske 8.2 SBR with a SpecWar 7.62 can. Was shooting handloads: Barnes 110 Tac Tx over 19.0 grains of H110. All shots were from 50 yards. I let the barrel cool between each shot. I'd shoot a 1.5/2.0 MOA group and one would be a flyer. I'd make a adustment (go 4 clicks right for example and the next impact would be left!). I wasn't satisfied with the consistency of my groups and was really getting frustrated as the accuracy wasn't to what my normal standards are. I was shooting at 50 yards so I was expecting at lease 1/2 MOA! Now this set up is for our upcoming Missouri deer season where my max shot may be 80 yards. I took the can off to see if that was the problem. Same issue. Then I started thinking it was the scope. Maybe not tracking. My Daniel Defense 16" upper with no can did shoot a little better. I'm not sure of the twist rate difference betweeen the two but that Noveske should shoot better than that. Based on what i've read here on this thread my 1.5 to 2 MOA at 50 yards may be something to be happy about. 
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Quoted:
Mark, What you mentioned above is EXACTLY what I experienced today at the range. Just mounted a new scope (Leupold VX-R 1-4) on top of my Noveske 8.2 SBR with a SpecWar 7.62 can. Was shooting handloads: Barnes 110 Tac Tx over 19.0 grains of H110. All shots were from 50 yards. I let the barrel cool between each shot. I'd shoot a 1.5/2.0 MOA group and one would be a flyer. I'd make a adustment (go 4 clicks right for example and the next impact would be left!). I wasn't satisfied with the consistency of my groups and was really getting frustrated as the accuracy wasn't to what my normal standards are. I was shooting at 50 yards so I was expecting at lease 1/2 MOA! Now this set up is for our upcoming Missouri deer season where my max shot may be 80 yards. I took the can off to see if that was the problem. Same issue. Then I started thinking it was the scope. Maybe not tracking. My Daniel Defense 16" upper with no can did shoot a little better. I'm not sure of the twist rate difference betweeen the two but that Noveske should shoot better than that. Based on what i've read here on this thread my 1.5 to 2 MOA at 50 yards may be something to be happy about. Quoted:
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The Caliber must be incredibly frustrating to you and your group Mark, as your used to stacking them in there with ease. But in my experience with the few rifles I have shot with it (AAC, ccouple of home builts), and factory ammo---its not a hole stacker. Its a 100 yard capable deer dropper. It is frustrating, you come right an inch and up an inch, and it goes a half inch left. Mark, What you mentioned above is EXACTLY what I experienced today at the range. Just mounted a new scope (Leupold VX-R 1-4) on top of my Noveske 8.2 SBR with a SpecWar 7.62 can. Was shooting handloads: Barnes 110 Tac Tx over 19.0 grains of H110. All shots were from 50 yards. I let the barrel cool between each shot. I'd shoot a 1.5/2.0 MOA group and one would be a flyer. I'd make a adustment (go 4 clicks right for example and the next impact would be left!). I wasn't satisfied with the consistency of my groups and was really getting frustrated as the accuracy wasn't to what my normal standards are. I was shooting at 50 yards so I was expecting at lease 1/2 MOA! Now this set up is for our upcoming Missouri deer season where my max shot may be 80 yards. I took the can off to see if that was the problem. Same issue. Then I started thinking it was the scope. Maybe not tracking. My Daniel Defense 16" upper with no can did shoot a little better. I'm not sure of the twist rate difference betweeen the two but that Noveske should shoot better than that. Based on what i've read here on this thread my 1.5 to 2 MOA at 50 yards may be something to be happy about. Try something other than the Barnes bullets for accuracy? Im leery to invest the $$ into these because reports have shown mixed results for accuracy, just like you are seeing. Ive gotten my best accuracy with 125gr bullets in this platform. My previous post shows that. 150gr bullets shoot OK, maybe 2" at 100 yards. 110gr shoots right around 1.5" at 100 yards, but admittedly I have not done alot of load testing with these. |
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I replied to the poll with 1-2 moa results. [edit] these results are from previous trips and different ammo
I will be heading to the range tomorrow evening (indoor 100yd range, its awesome and 10 minutes from the house) to confirm zero with three 300blk AR's. A 16 inch, 15 inch, and 8.25 inch (suppressed) all with 4x max power optics. We will be shooting 110 ZMAX bullets loaded over 20gr of H110 and seated to 2.15, mixed brass, and Federal 205 primers I will also shoot some of my sub sonic 194 Max Expansion Lehigh Bullets and 208 AMAX bullets loaded over 11gr of A1680 through the suppressed SBR. Good or Bad I will post pictures of the results so you can continue to add to the collection. |
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I did go to the range but did not get any pics, sorry. Guess I will have to go back.
The 110 zmax bullets were holding right around 1.5 MOA and I believe those groups would shrink some if I put some higher power optics on. The subs were holding about 2 MOA groups. I think the ammo/gun combos could do a bit better but that was as good as I could achieve with no contacts and a ton of stress. ETA: that was at 100 yds |
Mark, not exactly what you wanted but here is the best group I got when doing load development. When finalizing my load, especially for hunting, I generally shoot 10-20 round groups when doing load development because I have been burned with less consistent loads and fewer shots per load. In this case it is 19.8 grains of H110 with 110 grain Lehigh Defense. This is out of a Wilson Combat 11" upper that came with a sub MOA 3 shot test target that was labeled as shot with 220 grain OTM subs of unknown origins. My 16" Wilson upper also had a sub MOA test target and seems about the same as the 11" to me. I am generally pretty happy to get close to 1 inch in these or my PWS 300s. I would be happy to have a LT upper with similar accuracy
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Quoted:
Mark, not exactly what you wanted but here is the best group I got when doing load development. When finalizing my load, especially for hunting, I generally shoot 10-20 round groups when doing load development because I have been burned with less consistent loads and fewer shots per load. In this case it is 19.8 grains of H110 with 110 grain Lehigh Defense. This is out of a Wilson Combat 11" upper that came with a sub MOA 3 shot test target that was labeled as shot with 220 grain OTM subs of unknown origins. My 16" Wilson upper also had a sub MOA test target and seems about the same as the 11" to me. I am generally pretty happy to get close to 1 inch in these or my PWS 300s. I would be happy to have a LT upper with similar accuracy
https://b-white.smugmug.com/LaruePic/i-jDLj5MT/0/X2/IMG_2935-X2.jpg IIRC your load and my load are the same except for the bullet brand. MAHA |
| Ok, I am having the same accuaracy issues with my 9" AAC MPW. I just started shooting for groups as I have had this rifle for about a year and a half and the fun of dumping subsonics has worn off. My main concern is the 110 Tac TX Barnes bullets as I wanted to use this for hunting out to 250-300 yards or so. I have tried 19gr of H110, 19.5, 18.8, 20, and 20.5 grains behind them in LC brass with a CCI primer. I cannot get this rifle to group under 2 MOA at 100. I have a 16x vortex, bipod, and rear bag. I can consistently shoot 1/2-3/4 MOA in my other precision rifles but this just just won't group. I have also tried 125SST and 150FMJ with the same results. My subs are 2.5 MOA, which I am fine with as I only slap steel from 160 yards and in with it. Anybody have any better luck with the 110 Tac TX? |
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Aero Precision build, Ballistic Advantage 16" nitride barrel w/ pistol length gas, Spikes ST-T2 buffer, Nikon P-300 2-7x scope, Geissele SDC trigger, shot off of bipod and FTW rear bag Barnes factory ammo, Tac-TX 120gr, 5 shots, 100yds (indoor) Hornady Z-Max 110gr, 5 shots, 100yds (indoor) |
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This is about average for my cast load. This is a cast hollow point 130 grain, powder coated doing 2180fps out of a 16" 1/7 twist CMMG. Nothing to brag about, but it will keep them on a pie plate at 200 yards. That is as far as I have taken it.I load these in bulk 400 at a time for a practice round that could be used on small game. By comparison the jacketed speer tnt's only group two tenths of an inch better on any given day. This barrel will however shoot the 110 Barnes tac tx's just under an inch. Out of the three blackouts this rifle, and an 8.5" CMMG pistol barrel in a SBR shoot about the same. This caliber is no one hole'r like the 6.5 Grendel is, but it has its place, and does well at short ranges.I count it as a 1-2" caliber for an experienced shooter. Regular sub MOA is an anomaly from my observation, and if you have the load, and barrel that do it count your lucky stars. For someone who is inexperienced I find 4" to be standard.
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Mark;
Have you been playing with seating depth on the bullets your using? My DD 16" carbine is right at group sizes of 1.25-1.5". I'm going to seat the bullets a bit longer in increments of .01" to see if that has a positive impact on accuracy. BTW, I'm using Hornady 125 grain SSTs, H110, and LC stamp converted brass with CCI #41 primers. |
Here are (2) 3 shot groups at 100 yards using an 8" Noveske with 1:8 twist, Aimpoint T1, 110gr V-max reloads, using a sandbag. 1 group in-suppressed, and the lower group with an SDN-6. I don't have measurements, but IIRC, they were just under an inch. Only 3 shots, and I didn't use a magnified optic, but they are the only groups I have checked with my SBR.
ETA: Those look over an inch. I need to put a scope on it and try again. |
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9" AAC 1-7" barrel here: For 10 shot groups at 100 yards, with supers 1.5" is a good group with most being closer to 2". Subs typically between 2 and 3". Voted 2-3 MOA in the poll because the average of my better super/sub loads is in the low 2's.
Suppressed or unsuppressed doesn't make a noticeable difference except for a couple of 190 grain sub loads that shoot about 2.5 MOA suppressed and about double that unsuppressed. The only time I shoot unsuppressed is to test a new load for stability.
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Mark,
I've owned a few barrels that would group around 1 MOA unsuppressed. Various manufacturers and 9-16". My girlfriends daughter currently shoots an 8.5" suppressed 300 build (She's tiny so it had to be the shortest barrel around, for weight purposes) and we are in the 1-2" range. Definitely averages closer to 2 I would say but has made smaller groups on occasion. It's not a quality barrel by any means in comparison to yours, but it does its job well. This is with factory Nosler 220gr match stuff I believe. I reload for it but I have a bunch of the factory stuff around so we shoot that first. If you end up releasing barrels in the near future I would love to switch her build to one of those. She's getting into precision shooting with my 5.56 rifles but her build is so light and tiny and so soft shooting that she always goes back to it. |
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I am always late to the party, but here are my findings, based on very little shooting with this caliber.
I built an Aero Precision based AR using the cheapest .300 barrel I could find. Ar Stoner 16" for about $90. I loaded a handful of 110 grain Vmaxs with converted LC brass and 19.6 grains of Lil Gun. Also loaded a few 125 grain TNTs with 18.0 grains of H110. I was only shooting 3 shot groups, and shot most of my rounds siting in at 100 yards. For the first loads, and the first few rounds through the barrel, think this shows alot of promise. 
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Quoted: It is frustrating, you come right an inch and up an inch, and it goes a half inch left. Quoted: Quoted: The Caliber must be incredibly frustrating to you and your group Mark, as your used to stacking them in there with ease. But in my experience with the few rifles I have shot with it (AAC, ccouple of home builts), and factory ammo---its not a hole stacker. Its a 100 yard capable deer dropper. It is frustrating, you come right an inch and up an inch, and it goes a half inch left. http://www.ar15.com/ammo/project/Three_Shot_Groups/The_Trouble_With_3_Shot_Groups.htm#_Toc412927269 |
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Quoted: Mark, What you mentioned above is EXACTLY what I experienced today at the range. Just mounted a new scope (Leupold VX-R 1-4) on top of my Noveske 8.2 SBR with a SpecWar 7.62 can. Was shooting handloads: Barnes 110 Tac Tx over 19.0 grains of H110. All shots were from 50 yards. I let the barrel cool between each shot. I'd shoot a 1.5/2.0 MOA group and one would be a flyer. I'd make a adustment (go 4 clicks right for example and the next impact would be left!). I wasn't satisfied with the consistency of my groups and was really getting frustrated as the accuracy wasn't to what my normal standards are. I was shooting at 50 yards so I was expecting at lease 1/2 MOA! Now this set up is for our upcoming Missouri deer season where my max shot may be 80 yards. I took the can off to see if that was the problem. Same issue. Then I started thinking it was the scope. Maybe not tracking. My Daniel Defense 16" upper with no can did shoot a little better. I'm not sure of the twist rate difference betweeen the two but that Noveske should shoot better than that. Based on what i've read here on this thread my 1.5 to 2 MOA at 50 yards may be something to be happy about. Quoted: Quoted: It is frustrating, you come right an inch and up an inch, and it goes a half inch left. Mark, What you mentioned above is EXACTLY what I experienced today at the range. Just mounted a new scope (Leupold VX-R 1-4) on top of my Noveske 8.2 SBR with a SpecWar 7.62 can. Was shooting handloads: Barnes 110 Tac Tx over 19.0 grains of H110. All shots were from 50 yards. I let the barrel cool between each shot. I'd shoot a 1.5/2.0 MOA group and one would be a flyer. I'd make a adustment (go 4 clicks right for example and the next impact would be left!). I wasn't satisfied with the consistency of my groups and was really getting frustrated as the accuracy wasn't to what my normal standards are. I was shooting at 50 yards so I was expecting at lease 1/2 MOA! Now this set up is for our upcoming Missouri deer season where my max shot may be 80 yards. I took the can off to see if that was the problem. Same issue. Then I started thinking it was the scope. Maybe not tracking. My Daniel Defense 16" upper with no can did shoot a little better. I'm not sure of the twist rate difference betweeen the two but that Noveske should shoot better than that. Based on what i've read here on this thread my 1.5 to 2 MOA at 50 yards may be something to be happy about. Please read my post above. There's nothing wrong with your rifle of scope. You can't use three-shot groups for sighting in. |
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Quoted: Roger that and I see somebody claimed sub-moa ... wonder if they meant under an inch at 50 ? Quoted: Quoted: tag for results nobody at my club shoots a 300 much past 50 yards and I haven't seen any amazing groups yet.  I would add that almost all shoot subsonic suppressed.Roger that and I see somebody claimed sub-moa ... wonder if they meant under an inch at 50 ? 10.5" MAS barrel and I get 2" @ 100 yards now that I put a 4 power scope. I shot a 3" group at 100 yd with a 3.5MOA dot on it once. Does that make it sub moa? |
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