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Went to a Bonnie & Clyde Dallas Historical Society brown bag lunch lecture today at the Hall of State in Fair Park today. I was in a hurry to get in on time and I did not notice the following signs posted on various entrances. I only noticed them when I was leaving.

http://i1179.photobucket.com/albums/x383/pjphilp/IMG_20130611_132942_812.jpg

I realize these are not the required 30.06 signs and since I was on my way out, I wasn't worried about being arrested, etc. But I am upset that they even have the signs up.

The Hall of State is owned by the city of Dallas and leased to the Dallas Historical Society. There were no school events going on there at the time of the lecture. So I believe that concealed carry at the location is permitted and that signs need to come down.

I'm looking for help, in the form of advise in follow on posts, for when I contact the Dallas Historical Society and ask that the signs be taken down.

Wasn't there a bill this session in Austin that permitted fining violators of this part of the Texas concealed carry statutes?

Thanks for your assistance in advance.

I am writing in regards to the beautiful new Convention Center your City recently opened. I was fortunate to attend an event there recently, and noticed the many postings of the Texas 30.06 sign at the center. This is a sign that references Texas Penal Code section 30.06. This is a section that makes it unlawful for a CHL holder to carry a handgun on the property of another if the person is given notice that entry with a handgun is forbidden.

The signage meets the requirements of the code; however, section 30.06 of the penal code specifically states, “e) It is an exception to the application of this section that the property on which the license holder carries a handgun is owned or leased by a governmental entity and is not a premises or other place on which the license holder is prohibited from carrying the handgun under Section 46.03 or 46.035.”

It appears to me that the convention center is owned by the City of Irving, making 30.06, and the signs not applicable to those with a CHL. Penal Code section 1.07 defines the elements of a crime as; “(22) "Element of offense" means:
(A) the forbidden conduct;
(B) the required culpability;
(C) any required result; and
(D) the negation of any exception to the offense.”

To have probable cause to arrest, an officer would need to negate the exception listed in 30.06. My specific question is; does the City of Irving intend to arrest a CHL holder who carries his concealed handgun license and concealed handgun of the proper category inside of the new Convention Center?

I do realize that the center is managed by an independent company, but I do not see how that affects subsection (e) of penal code section 30.06.

I am a Licensed CHL instructor, and I eagerly await your answer. As you are probably aware CHL holders are, as a group, a highly law-abiding people. I wish to be sure to teach my students properly, and advise them on what type of treatment they will receive by the City of Irving in regards to this. I also am a member of several internet message boards, and this is a topic of great interest of the citizens of Irving, Dallas County, and Texas.

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Looks like they are defaulting to the 30.05 sign instead of 30.06

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Looks like they are defaulting to the 30.05 sign instead of 30.06

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OK - understand now. 30.06 is for private property, and 30.05 applies to public buildings.

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Not exactly.  

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Since the sign is meaningless..........

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I figured that your's would be the 1st response.

I thought that I'd start with the Dallas Historical Society (DHS) as they manage the facility, and cc the city attorney.

I looked at HB 508 (which I believe passed and only awaits the governor's signature and 9/1 before becoming law) and I also believe it applies as long as the city of Dallas is considered a "political subdivision of the state". It allows for a first offense fine of $1000 and subsequent offense fines of $10000 for wrongly displaying a sign such as the one I saw. And each day the sign is displayed constitutes a desperate offense.

I'll copy you on my complaint, maybe post it here.

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Did HB 508 indeed pass?

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I experienced a similar situation 2 years ago at the Arlington Convention Center with properly formatted 30.06 signs that were not enforceable.  I wrote an email to the Chief of Police and copied the City Manager, Convention Center Manager and someone else (cannot recall who).  4 days later I received a response from the City Attorney (who I should have addressed) very nicely written telling me the signs would be removed. A subsequent trip proved they were removed.

Be polite and inquisitive for the best response.  

Below is the email I sent;

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I figured that your's would be the 1st response.

I thought that I'd start with the Dallas Historical Society (DHS) as they manage the facility, and cc the city attorney.

I looked at HB 508 (which I believe passed and only awaits the governor's signature and 9/1 before becoming law) and I also believe it applies as long as the city of Dallas is considered a "political subdivision of the state". It allows for a first offense fine of $1000 and subsequent offense fines of $10000 for wrongly displaying a sign such as the one I saw. And each day the sign is displayed constitutes a desperate offense.

I'll copy you on my complaint, maybe post it here.

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check here

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The search function on that site is a clusterfuck.

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Select the 83R session, click the box for bill number, enter hb508.  

I just did it, and it seems easy.