User Panel
Posted: 3/28/2006 1:52:11 AM EDT
I believe 99.9% of legit firearm owners would report lost or stolen firearms as soon as they find there stuff missing anyways. So how is this going to aid in illegal gun trafficking?
edited: the words I misspelled 5:30 in the morning. |
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It won't.
That's the whole point. The State Police, the Governor and the Judiciary Committee WANT to arrest gun dealers and gun owners. It's all about coming down on us. We are the easy scapegoats in a politically charged press time competition. They have NO desire to fight crime; that's too dangerous and requires real work. They'd rather invent a whole list of technicalities hoping to snare unlce Ned trading his skeet gun at the fish and game club, or a dealer on interpreting a gun's features instead. Then they can go to the press and say what a great job they've done "stemming the flow of guns on our streets to protect our children". Meanwhile, gang members continue to shoot up neighborhoods every night; police in New Haven are getting shot at almost every day; Wild car chases in Hartford, Waterbury, New Haven, etc continue; convenience stores still get robbed and elderly apartment tennants still get their doors kicked in and beaten to within inches of their lives. They can't figure out where these guns are coming from the past few years?? Simple - even State Police has noted in the past few years problems due to illegal immigration have exploded across the country. When you have a half million illegals protesting legislation to make them felons for being here - - did it ever occur to these F-ing geniuses that maybe illegal guns are coming into the country along with the illegal people and drugs?? |
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Their public reasoning is...
When they find a firearm on the "street", they trace it back to the original owner who they sometimes suspect may actually be a straw purchaser. Since there's no manditory reporting of stolen firearms, the potential straw purchaser can say "Oh, that gun I bought last year? It was stolen." In actuality, the firearm was traded for drugs or cash. Since there's no law to require them to report if it was stolen, then it's a closed case. I don't so much disagree with the merits as I do with the fact that they left it so open ended. What if you don't look in your safe but once every month. What if something is stolen and you don't know? The text of the bill...
...is so open ended that a lawyer could certainly make the case that you "should" have known your firearm was stolen and you "should" have checked on them. None of these timeperiods are defined aside the 72hrs. Throw this law into the mix with some liberal judges and you've got a real problem. You might as well hang a clipboard on your gunsafe and do an inventory every morning. |
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State Police bascially admitted to CCS that there is a problem with background checks and (alluding to without actualy saying the term:) illegal immigrants.
They used the term directly in an e-mail response to Bob Crook at CCS "due to the changes in society over the past four to five years" ... they will now require birth certificates and US PASSPORTS for any pistol permit application OR RENEWAL. Given that the State of CT Dept. of Motor Vehicles made NATIONAL NEWS last year over issuing thousands of fake drivers' licenses to illegal immigrants (and we still have about 750 of those UNACCOUNTED for)....It was a known fact among illegal immigrants, want a drivers license, come to CT and ask for so-and-so at DMV. $3,500 - you have a drivers license. I would bet that a few gun permits slipped through the cracks as well and there might be a few straw purchasers out there, but the greater problem is illegal immigration and the flow of drugs, guns and gang activity it supports. Fifteen years ago ONE THIRD of all convicted felons serving prison sentences were illegal immigrants. FIFTEEN YEARS ago! Imagine the numbers today? This is where the problem is, and if it isn't addressed and corrected SOON we will all be in deep shit This is a real problem and very serious. However, our molly coddle panzie ass state gov't won't address it because it's too much of a political hot potato and not only will they piss off the illegals who are here for the free ride WE pay for, but the "Lexus Liberals" will be out there calling for lynch mobbing any elected official who suggests going after illegal immigrants - as long as they don't build a section 8 house for that immigrant next door to their home on Fluffy Flower Terrace in West Hartford or Weston, CT. |
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Letter from CT State Police (SLFU) to Bob Crook of CCS - Bob sent out to the CCS e-mail list:
Dear Mr. Crook, Several sections within Chapter 529 of the Connecticut General Statutes place not only the issuance of temporary state permits with the local authority, but also place both issuance and revocation authority and responsibilities on the Commissioner of Public Safety regarding state permits to carry pistols and revolvers. The Special Licensing & Firearms Unit is tasked by the Commissioner of Public Safety to carry out those responsibilities under his authority. With the many societal changes and public safety security concerns that have occurred nationwide during the past four to five years, the Special Licensing & Firearms Unit has been taking a closer look at past procedures involved in the issuance of such permits. This has resulted in the realization that some informational/security gaps needed to be closed. Thus, the requirement for holders to provide proof of citizenship or legal residency in the United States when renewing their permit was imposed. Since state permits must be renewed every five years, this is requirement is considered temporary, and should no longer be necessary in the future. Statutory authority can be found in section 29-29, subsection (d) C.G.S., which states "The commissioner may investigate any applicant for a state permit and shall investigate each applicant for renewal of a state permit to ensure that such applicant is eligible under state law for such permit or for renewal of such permit." Sincerely, The Special Licensing & Firearms Unit |
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#1 I have a 800lb Liberty safe that houses all my firearms (Hopefully safe from thiefs).
#2 I don't plan on straw purchases. (I have some sense left) #3 I quess I have to live with the new ruling. (Just Another day in CT.) |
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The reason that there is so much gang activity with all the attending crimes is simple. IT was even predicted. The bad guys, ring leaders of the gangs, have all served the bulk of their time in prison. It was about 10 years ago when these guys were all finally convicted after a huge crackdown by all of the services: LEOs, FBI, and ATF. They ATF had an actual office right in Hartford. I know because my Mom worked for them for a number of years. I visited there a number of times and got to know a lot of them on a first-name basis. They had their hands full but they did the job of stemming crime by gangs at that time. There were a lot of arrests and crime actually plummeted in the cities.
During all this it was discovered that, unlike other cities, the gang members lived quietly in the suburbs from Enfield, to Colchester. They bought nice houses and drove nice cars and literally commuted to "work " in Hartford just like anyone else. They had organized very well indeed and it took the efforts of all those law-enforcment times to corral those bad guys and put them in jail. Some went away for a long time but the seconds-in-command got shorter sentences. Now, they are back and with a vengance. And there is no ATF office in Hartford any longer. I believe there is one in the New Haven/Bridgeport area but I'm not sure anymore. I agress with SteveinCT about this bill. It is simply a way to make us....the victims of crime, defendents in a crime. And I whole-heartedly agree that 99.99% of any of us who find something stolen would most certainly report it ASAP. My one, recurring nighmare is that my car is stolen on the way home from the range and that my weapons are taken and put on the street. I literally wake up with a knot in my gut. To assume that anyone one of us would treat this in any other way is ludicrous. There are bad guys out there, however, and that fact alone says that they could care less about straw purchase laws or filing the proper paperwork. Bad guys don't do paperwork or file claims. That's why they're bad guys. We are not the bad guys, however, and we jump through the endless chain of hoops just to stay that way. Like Steve says, this new law is a bogus attempt at making it look like they've done something. If they really wanted to do something concrete, enact the law that demanded/required a minimum 1 or 2 year sentence, not to be served concurrently with any other sentence, if a crime is commited with a firearm, period. That would give the procecutors time to investigate crimes more throughly while these bad guys are cooling their heels because of the gun charge. Nope. That won't get done, however. Don't want to deny those bad guys their rights after all. Rome |
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Very well put Steve. |
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Very true it is, excellent viewpoint. |
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PocketG your rationalization is too simplistic and makes sense.
That isn't the problem. Your rationalization is what 99% of people would assume. The problem is, let's say you sold a second hand long gun to another person. Perfectly legal under existing state law. No reporting required. a year later that person, in turn, sells it to someone else, who has the gun stolen from him. Let's say for argument's sake, you bought the gun from a store like Hoffman's, for instance where Sp-3s are done on long gun sales voluntarily. Someone else in the chain of transfer has the gun stolen from them and it ends up used in a crime. The police recover the gun. YOU become an automatic felon, EX POST FACTO (unconstitutional) because the police recovered the gun and assumed you still owned it because the state police illegally maintain registration files of SP-3s Now handguns are another story. You are required to report them and get the NICS clearance number anyway, but not for long guns. And long guns are traded like baseball cards among acquaintences at gun clubs every day. It is the guilty until proven innocent (no defense) clause in the bill that makes it a totally communist smelling piece of shit and is EXACTLY what is going to be used against people like us going forward It's not the label on the bill that is bad, it's the WAY IT IS WRITTEN that no one paid attention to |
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http://www.cga.ct.gov/2006/TS/H/2006HB-05818-R00JUD-CV115-TS.htm
Here is the link to the 40 yea; 30 nay and one absent and not voting This bill passed COMMITTEE it has NOT passed the general floor vote yet. We can still fight it. We need to let our reps and the governor know, WHY we are opposed to this bill |
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Here is my column on the matter, let me know what you guys think:
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Time to make another call to Mother Governor. keep the call rolling........................ |
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Wobblin-Goblin, submit that ASAP! Looks like we need to open even more eyes to this crazy law. Your column just may do that.
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Hi all. If you'd like to see the testimony for and against this bill, go here. It's bill 5818.
http://www.cga.ct.gov/asp/menu/CommDocTmy.asp?comm_code=JUD&date=03/24/2006 Most interesting is the argument that Bruce Stern, our NRA director from CT provides. It's one that I had not considered. Bruce develops the argument that a "straw purchaser" would buy and then illegally sell these firearms to the bad guys. He's paid well. Then, after a short period of time, all this guy would do is file a phony police report of a bogus theft that had happened "yesterday" and actually provide the police with the serial numbers and descriptions. Voila! He's off the hook. Eventually, if one of the firearms shows up during the commission of a crime, the straw man can wave the police report in everyone's face proving that he's done his job by reporting the "crime" way back when. He keeps his money and gets off scott free. This is one scenario that I had certainly not considered. While this particular bad guy would be hard pressed to repeat the process, it does not stop other bad guys from repeating it time and time again. Since they would have purchased the firearms legally from the outset and would have reported the "theft" of their firearms, they would be free and clear of any prosecution. Simply amazing. Bruce goes on to describe the situation where a true victim of a crime does not know that the old 1911 his grandfather had put into the closet was stolen during a recent theft. When it turns up and very possibly traced back to him house, that would be considered "prima fascia" evidence and he would be an instant felon having to prove himself innocent. Talk about feel good legislation! Rome |
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Well put... |
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Thanks 2005army, It must be done. |
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first time I ever called the governor's office....sure it's not the last! |
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Keep the pressure on. I doubt many of the police depts. and civic groups supporting the face value of this bill realize its true intent to incriminate gun owners and ignore the real problem.
If the liberal groups knew what language was in there and could be related to an example they could identify with (i.e., if their kid gets caught with drugs while driving daddy's or mommie's lexus SUV, send MOMMY AND DADDY to jail as felons because of "prima facia" evidence. They'd change their tune really FAST If the lexus SUV gets stolen or used by a friend of their kid, then MOMMY and DADDY go to jail for failure to "secure" their vehicle in an "appropriate manner". |
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No more fishing accident excuses in Connecticut! Mass has had penalties for not reporting missing/stolen guns for a long time. Gives the police an avenue if they see in your records you have a gun, and you claim you lost it.
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Great letter Wobblin-Goblin!!!
I called the Govenor's office last week to let them know I'm opposed to this bill. I just asked my wife, and she agreed to call the Govenor tomorrow.
Also, you can call you Legislators. Not sure who they are or know how to contact them? Go here: www.cga.ct.gov/maps/townlist.asp |
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My letter to Gov. Rell
Dear Governor Rell: I am writing to express my vehement opposition to the "Lost & Stolen" firearms bill proposed by the Judiciary Committee. While at face value, one may easily conclude this legislation appears "reasonable", it contains language that is both vague and dangerously contrary to the principle of law under the Constitution. Specifically, the lack of definition of what constitutes "secured" firearms and the alarming notion that a citizen would be considered automatically "guilty" of a felony if police recovered a firearm once owned by that citizen conjures images of life in police states of the former Eastern European Soviet bloc. No exaggeration is intended there. That is plainly how glaringly contrary this bill is to both the State and US Constitution. It's author should be ashamed and removed from any legislative drafting responsibilties. With the many tens of thousands of legally owned and legally transferred firearms in the state, some with de facto SP-3 registration and some not as permitted under circumstances in existing state law, this bill is also unenforceable to any practical extent. I firmly believe this bill represents a deliberate attempt by its author(s) to make criminals out of law abiding gun owners, while simultaneously failing to support measures to enforce existing laws and funding for proven anti crime solutions such as the stolen gun and gang task forces which have the support of all citizens and those citizens who comprise our community of law abiding gun owners. |
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here are the links to the public hearing testimony held on Friday, March 24th
Please note the link takes you to a page with ALL bills heard that day. You must scroll down to the HB 5818 entries which are about 2/3 way down the page Link to Testimony presented to Judiciary Committee 03/24/2006 on H.B. No. 5818 (RAISED) AN ACT CONCERNING LOST OR STOLEN FIREARMS http://www.cga.ct.gov/asp/menu/CommDocTmy.asp?comm_code=JUD&date=03/24/2006 H.B. No. 5818 (RAISED) AN ACT CONCERNING LOST OR STOLEN FIREARMS. http://www.cga.ct.gov/asp/cgabillstatus/cgabillstatus.asp?selBillType=Bill&bill_num=5818&which_year=2006 This procedure pertains to any bill heard in public hearing and any committee. Click on appropriate Committee at top of pa |
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It should come as no surprise that all the public office figureheads are in favor of it.
The testimony from the CAGV, the local chapter of the Brady Bunch wannabes plainly state that this bill is a "first step" toward a "solution". That should come as no surprise either |
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Interesting info from the DPS testimony on page two of this document: www.cga.ct.gov/2006/JUDdata/Tmy/2006HB-05818-R000324-DPS%20-%20Commissioner%20Leonard%20C.%20Boyle-TMY.PDF
The document is a PDF of a scanned document, otherwise I would cut-and-paste the text here. The document acknowledges that there is problems with the bill because prior to October 1, 1994 paperwork was not required when selling a handgun. Further "investigation" would be needed in these cases. |
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I just love how Commissioner Boyle refers to "owners" as "violators" being charged as felons.
It's time to RALLY |
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So, what's this? He considers us LAW ABBIDING gun/owner/citizens as "violators". What a crock of crap that is........... |
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Final draft was sent out last night:
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I called today, to voice my opposition to the bill. The person at the governors office said that they've been recieving a lot of calls today about the bill, and asked if I supported or opposed it. After I said I opposed it because I thought it was unconstitutional, she said she'd let the governor know.
The only thing I'm wondering is, if she didn't take my name (my last name is difficult to spell correctly), is my call actually going to count? ETA: I just spoke to Tom Reynolds office (House rep. for my district), and left a message with the person there. Then I called Edith Prague (state Senate for my district), and left a meesage on the voicemail there. |
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Yes. It will count. Rell's office is being asked to track call volume. This is normal during "hot" issues.
The # again is: 1-800-406-1527 Pass it on OPPOSE HB 5818 Call your reps again on Monday during business hrs. Make sure they know you called |
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Thanks Steve.. |
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