I've been thinking of getting a Ham radio license and I'm wondering if there are any local Arfcommers out there with licenses.  I'm in SE WI (Kenosha) but interested to hear from any WI Hams (or other lurkers).

KB9ZCx (Tech class)

Feel free to grab me one of these days and I'll answer the Q's I can.
ETA: slight redaction (I forgot about the FCC public lookup)

Quoted: KB9ZCx (Tech class) Feel free to grab me one of these days and I'll answer the Q's I can. ETA: slight redaction (I forgot about the FCC public lookup)

Don't think I won't bend your ear!

Quoted: Don't think I won't bend your ear!

You got my number...

BTW, I can talk radios almost as well as guns, so come prepared with a notebook and pad.

Quoted: Quoted: Don't think I won't bend your ear! You got my number... BTW, I can talk radios almost as well as guns, so come prepared with a notebook and pad.

and bring your own research since the advice given here will probably be wrong

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Don't think I won't bend your ear! You got my number... BTW, I can talk radios almost as well as guns, so come prepared with a notebook and pad. and bring your own research since the advice given here will probably be wrong

Ow.  Verbally tazed.  

Raven Jeff  is WV9X (Extra class)

former MOS 18E

Jeff

Quoted: Raven Jeff  is WV9X (Extra class) former MOS 18E Jeff

I dunno what the MOS is (guessing radioman), but that "Extra class" means you'll want to to him a whole helluva lot more than me, Drawcut!

Jeff; Any idea about what's going on with the restructuring?  I've been waiting for someone to tell me that 10M has opened up to the peons without code (like me).

Quoted: Quoted: Raven Jeff  is WV9X (Extra class) former MOS 18E Jeff I dunno what the MOS is (guessing radioman), but that "Extra class" means you'll want to to him a whole helluva lot more than me, Drawcut! Jeff; Any idea about what's going on with the restructuring?  I've been waiting for someone to tell me that 10M has opened up to the peons without code (like me).

I thought they cut the code requirement?

BuzzWindrip, ARS WE9K since 1988. Sold most of my ham gear recently to buy guns tho'. I'll get back on the air when the solar cycle is on the upswing again.

Just got my general ticket (1/7/06)

KD9MJ*

Quoted: I thought they cut the code requirement?

They did for the Tech class, and they are talking about doing it for the rest...

Quoted: Quoted: I thought they cut the code requirement? They did for the Tech class, and they are talking about doing it for the rest...

Hence my question on the restructuring.  The code is the only thing preventing me from getting my General (long story).

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I thought they cut the code requirement? They did for the Tech class, and they are talking about doing it for the rest... Hence my question on the restructuring.  The code is the only thing preventing me from getting my General (long story).

Take the general test. I would think that once the code is no longer required your ticket would me upgraded. I'm not sure when the decision is supposed to be made but I think it is pretty soon. From what I read it sounds like the FCC wants to drop the code but some of the "clubs" are resisting it... Let me see if I can find some of the links for ya...

Edited to add link.  FCC Notice of Proposed Rule Making and Order

I have a long story on how I ended up with a general ticket I was only going to do the Tech (because of the code).

Wow.  More WI HAMs than I expected.  Off to look at the used gear market.......

Quoted: Wow.  More WI HAMs than I expected.  Off to look at the used gear market.......

Make sure you know what the gear is going for new first... Most of the USED ham stuff on ebay goes for more than I can buy it new online...

Here's an example for ya...

ebay auction

Brand New

$286 used...$249 New...

Drawcut, we've got one of the biggest retailers in the country right here on the North Side:

AES Ham

I'd also be willing to part with a 2M HT that I've got... I want to upgrade to a cross-band capable unit.  I'll bring it this weekend, and we can talk.

RE: Code requirement / restructuring

It was my understanding that under the restructuring program, all current "no code techs" would be reclassified as "General", or at least given acess to a spectrum that included 10M Voice (without taking  a new test).  A new class (similar to the old "novice" classification) would be implimented with relaxed standards to introduce folks to the hobby.  General and higher were to be bumped up in classification as well, IIRC.

Edit: Just read the document.  Looks like the FCC wants to keep the three tiers, and remove only the CW test from everything but Extra.  Looks like I'd have to study for that 35 Q General test after all.

The technical/written part of General wouldn't be a problem, and I probably could have nailed it when I took my Tech test:  My issue stems from being slightly dislexic going from audible to verbal/writing.  What I hear as dah-dit-dit gets scrambled in my head, and comes out as as dit-dah-dit.  As you can guess, this presents a bit of a problem with transcription... even at 5WPM.

Bottom line, even without taking the General test, if restructuring happens, I'll have access to the part of the spectrum that I'd like (10M Voice).  Then my only problem is upgrading equipment.

ETA: Congrats 91101!  You grab an elmer from one of the local clubs, or do it on your own?

Quoted: ETA: Congrats 91101!  You grab an elmer from one of the local clubs, or do it on your own?

I did it on my own.. NOW I gotta find an Elmer, because I know I don't know sh!t.

ETA: The link in my post above explains the proposed changes. If ya can read "goverment"...

Quoted: Quoted: ETA: Congrats 91101!  You grab an elmer from one of the local clubs, or do it on your own? I did it on my own.. NOW I gotta find an Elmer, because I know I don't know sh!t. ETA: The link in my post above explains the proposed changes. If ya can read "goverment"...

I edited my post.

I did mine on my own as well (actually took the test from a VE in Indiana while I was on a road trip).  Iffn you find an Elmer...

Jeff, are you available for online Elmering?

Quoted: Edit: Just read the document.  Looks like the FCC wants to keep the three tiers, and remove only the CW test from everything but Extra.  Looks like I'd have to study for that 35 Q General test after all.

Go to hamtestonline.com and take the general practice test... If you didn't have much problem with the tech I'll bet you'll get the general real quick... I didn't "study" for the general I just took the practice test a bunch of times untill I had most of it memorized... I did it kinda as a "what the hell I'll give this a try" and got only 3 wrong on the test...

YMMV

A friend and I did an all night cram with the Extra class question pools before taking the exam, and scored well enough for the ticket. The 20wpm code part was a breeze at the time as you got real good at high speed code when chasing DX for awards. I didn't care how I got the ticket, just as long as I got the bottom 25 KHZ of the CW sub bands, which is where all the really good DX usually is.
For anyone wanting to talk radios on a weekly basis, and find elmers, there is always the Miller Valley group that meets Tuesdays at the Miller brewery clubhouse/radio station.

I've been pondering getting a HAM radio for a couple years, I have a couple questions if it's okay.

#1- What is the minimum cost for a basic setup used to talk around wisconsin? (I'm only interested in talking to you guys :P )

#2- Do you have to be 21? I'm 18, is that okay?

#3- How often do you guys talk? :)

Thanks
-David

Quoted: I've been pondering getting a HAM radio for a couple years, I have a couple questions if it's okay. #1- What is the minimum cost for a basic setup used to talk around wisconsin? (I'm only interested in talking to you guys :P ) #2- Do you have to be 21? I'm 18, is that okay? #3- How often do you guys talk? :) Thanks -David

David, a 2 meter handheld radio would be a logical starting point for the newly licensed technician class op. That would get you into any of the major repeaters and give you good coverage in most of the SEWIS area. I think my last Amateur Electronic Supply (they have a store on Good Hope road in Milwaukee) catalog still showed a few 2M handhelds (HT's) for $100 or slightly less. You can shop eBay and the ham websites for used gear as well, or visit a swapfest and take your chances there.
There is no minimum age limit that I know of; there are kids way younger than you that have their tickets. As far as how often these guys talk, don't have that answer. Listen in on some of the local repeaters though and you'll find out that some people are just talking too damn much (without much to offer). Go for it!

Quoted: Listen in on some of the local repeaters though and you'll find out that some people are just talking too damn much (without much to offer). Go for it!

What Buzz said.

Re: 2M and repeaters, there are clubs that run repeaters.  I have/had about 6 programmed into my hand-held, and depending on which one I used, could talk from Delavan, Lake mills, Kenosha, and West Bend...all from my home on a hill in Waukesha.  I even got a contact from someone in Grand Rapids when I was driving down to Chicago (freak atmospheric thing), but you can rely on roughly a 30 mile radius of whatever tower you're hitting.

As far as content, think of it as CB without the dirty talk.

Quoted: Quoted: I've been pondering getting a HAM radio for a couple years, I have a couple questions if it's okay. #1- What is the minimum cost for a basic setup used to talk around wisconsin? (I'm only interested in talking to you guys :P ) #2- Do you have to be 21? I'm 18, is that okay? #3- How often do you guys talk? :) Thanks -David David, a 2 meter handheld radio would be a logical starting point for the newly licensed technician class op. That would get you into any of the major repeaters and give you good coverage in most of the SEWIS area. I think my last Amateur Electronic Supply (they have a store on Good Hope road in Milwaukee) catalog still showed a few 2M handhelds (HT's) for $100 or slightly less. You can shop eBay and the ham websites for used gear as well, or visit a swapfest and take your chances there. There is no minimum age limit that I know of; there are kids way younger than you that have their tickets. As far as how often these guys talk, don't have that answer. Listen in on some of the local repeaters though and you'll find out that some people are just talking too damn much (without much to offer). Go for it!

$100 are you sure that's all that is needed to get started? How many miles would that give me from point of origin? Because some of these guys are like 4 hours away. I think the average is 2.5-3.

Now, I am seriously interested could you give me information on how to get my license? Where to study, how much it costs, where I can take it, etc..?

Thanks

Quoted: Quoted: Listen in on some of the local repeaters though and you'll find out that some people are just talking too damn much (without much to offer). Go for it! What Buzz said. Re: 2M and repeaters, there are clubs that run repeaters.  I have/had about 6 programmed into my hand-held, and depending on which one I used, could talk from Delavan, Lake mills, Kenosha, and West Bend...all from my home on a hill in Waukesha.  I even got a contact from someone in Grand Rapids when I was driving down to Chicago (freak atmospheric thing), but you can rely on roughly a 30 mile radius of whatever tower you're hitting. As far as content, think of it as CB without the dirty talk.

30 miles? That isn't very far. How much for something to reach Waukesha/Milwaukee/Racine/ from Appleton?

-Davod

Quoted: Drawcut, we've got one of the biggest retailers in the country right here on the North Side: AES Ham I'd also be willing to part with a 2M HT that I've got... I want to upgrade to a cross-band capable unit.  I'll bring it this weekend, and we can talk.

Unfortunatley, I'm not going to be able to make it this weekend.  Family stuff.  I better post over in the other thread and let BC know.

Quoted: 30 miles? That isn't very far. How much for something to reach Waukesha/Milwaukee/Racine/ from Appleton?

It's not really a question of cost-to-distance.  There's a limit to what certian frequencies can do.

I was speaking of roughly a 30 mile radius from the tower with a tiny hand-held unit.  Call it another 30 miles Line of sight on the other side.  Think about that for a second:  You with a FRS sized radio talking to someone an hours drive away with a similar setup...far enough away that due to the curvature of the Earth, you wouldn't be able to see them.  That's a lot of capability in a small package.

There are some places that link their tower repeaters (Indianapolis, for instance).  I've had mobile to mobile contacts there in excess of 80 miles.  Still not the range your looking for, but I would guess that with a better antenna on both ends, that could be extended to 100 miles or so.

I think what you would be interested in is something along the lines of 10M (Hams, I know I just skipped 6M, but bear with me) comms.  That can get you almost worldwide with the right atmospheric conditions.  David, that's something that you have to remember...this isn't cellphone technology...it's communication of distance with other enthusiasts*.  The time of the day, the cloud cover, even if there is a solar storm going, effects how far (or how well) you can get a signal from point A to point B.

Good 10M setups can run into multiple thousands of dollars, tend to be bulky, and you (for now) must have a General licence to work the band.  Start small, get into the hobby, get on the local repeaters, and then think about talking to the guys a couple of hundered miles away.

A good place to start is to get to a Radio Shack store and pick up "Now You're Talking".  It's a book that will introduce you to amateur radio, and help you study for the test.
*Okay, Ham guys can get freaky with stuff just like us gun owners.  They get thrills talking in morse code half the world away with a radio they built themselves from tinfoil and and some dental floss. It's like taking your Ruger 10/22, and shooting a nice 1" group with it...from 1/2 mile away.

Quoted: Quoted: 30 miles? That isn't very far. How much for something to reach Waukesha/Milwaukee/Racine/ from Appleton? It's not really a question of cost-to-distance.  There's a limit to what certian frequencies can do. I was speaking of roughly a 30 mile radius from the tower with a tiny hand-held unit.  Call it another 30 miles Line of sight on the other side.  Think about that for a second:  You with a FRS sized radio talking to someone an hours drive away with a similar setup...far enough away that due to the curvature of the Earth, you wouldn't be able to see them.  That's a lot of capability in a small package. There are some places that link their tower repeaters (Indianapolis, for instance).  I've had mobile to mobile contacts there in excess of 80 miles.  Still not the range your looking for, but I would guess that with a better antenna on both ends, that could be extended to 100 miles or so. I think what you would be interested in is something along the lines of 10M (Hams, I know I just skipped 6M, but bear with me) comms.  That can get you almost worldwide with the right atmospheric conditions.  David, that's something that you have to remember...this isn't cellphone technology...it's communication of distance with other enthusiasts*.  The time of the day, the cloud cover, even if there is a solar storm going, effects how far (or how well) you can get a signal from point A to point B. Good 10M setups can run into multiple thousands of dollars, tend to be bulky, and you (for now) must have a General licence to work the band.  Start small, get into the hobby, get on the local repeaters, and then think about talking to the guys a couple of hundered miles away. A good place to start is to get to a Radio Shack store and pick up "Now You're Talking".  It's a book that will introduce you to amateur radio, and help you study for the test. *Okay, Ham guys can get freaky with stuff just like us gun owners.  They get thrills talking in morse code half the world away with a radio they built themselves from tinfoil and and some dental floss. It's like taking your Ruger 10/22, and shooting a nice 1" group with it...from 1/2 mile away.

Thanks, I'll check it out before I jump into it :)

BTW- I already shoot .5 MOA at 4 miles with my 10/22 so...

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Listen in on some of the local repeaters though and you'll find out that some people are just talking too damn much (without much to offer). Go for it! What Buzz said. Re: 2M and repeaters, there are clubs that run repeaters.  I have/had about 6 programmed into my hand-held, and depending on which one I used, could talk from Delavan, Lake mills, Kenosha, and West Bend...all from my home on a hill in Waukesha.  I even got a contact from someone in Grand Rapids when I was driving down to Chicago (freak atmospheric thing), but you can rely on roughly a 30 mile radius of whatever tower you're hitting. As far as content, think of it as CB without the dirty talk. 30 miles? That isn't very far. How much for something to reach Waukesha/Milwaukee/Racine/ from Appleton? -Davod

Hmm, Appleton to Milwaukee metro might be tough with an HT even with repeaters. Your next best bet would be a 2m mobile rig, which has a higher output power, and then a gain antenna which *might* allow you to get into some of the metro area repeaters. A basic 2m mobile rig is going to be about $150 - $170ish, plus antenna for whatever station setup you will have (mobile and/or fixed), plus a 12v power supply of some sort, capable of delivering at least 15 amps, which is going to add considerably to the startup cost.  If you just want to get into radio and keep the startup cost low, go for the handi-talkie and check out the many fine repeaters the Fox Cities Amateur radio Club has to offer. You will find plenty of people to chat with. I am sure if you contacted someone from that club about getting you started they would hook you up. There is a book that the ARRL puts out called "Now You're Talking" that is a good start for the basics of ham radio. We have it in our public library; check yours for that title. Amateur Electronic Supply has that book and other study material that you can order online. If it is a must to hook up with guys in the Milwaukee area, or work around Wisconsin using your example of " 4 hours away", then your going to have to see if there is an Echolink system to use (amateur radio/internet devil spawn) or wait till you get HF privileges so you can work close in on 40 or 80 meters.

ETA: Doh, I see FMD answered while I was typing this out. Sorry if it's redundant

ty for the info!

FMD and All,

I would be happy to Elmer anyone.  As you might guess somebody mentored me many years ago.

I sympathize with those struggling with code.  During my military training I had a good friend wash out when it was discovered he was tone deaf and couldn't hear the difference between a dit and dah.  What helped me was learning the characters as one single sound.  Such as.............

W  didadah  rather than Dit Dah Dah
V  didididah  or Dit Dit Dit Dah
9  dadadadadit
X  dadididah

Hams also practice a form of short hand much like text messaging today.  They remove most or all the vowels.  Here is an example:  Fck Jm Dyl

For anyone looking for reliable but insecure line of sight communications you should try the GMRS family of radios.  I have one for my SO that she keeps in her car.  In includes the National Weather Service channel and she doesn't need a license.  This works well when / if cellular fails.  It is limited to line of sight (qo miles or so).  I think everyone should have one as a backup to your cell phone.  

For longer distance (excluding satellites) voice or data you need the lower bands such as 10, 17, 20, 40 meters etc.   I thought the Technicians could use a segment of the 10 meter  band.  When the sunspots are active enough you can communicate around the world on 10 meters including Africa and Asia.  A good multi Band rig with 10 meter capability cost about the same as a good handgun.  You need an antenna and some other bits as well.

AES is a great source of gear, they have everything.  Just remember, like any gunshop, their objective is to sell you something.  They may give you great advice or maybe not.

Please let me know if you have specific questions or interests.  

73

Jeff

Quoted: I thought the Technicians could use a segment of the 10 meter  band.

I believe anything lower than 30 Mhz requires code.

Jeff, thanks for the Elmer offer.  Maybe it'd be possibe to get a local net going?

FYI: RadioShack does not seem to carry 'Now You're Talking' anymore.  Local RS manager told me they haven't had it for a few years now.  (Don't feel bad, FMD.  I read that same advice other places too.)  I was able to find the Tech Q&A book at a local electronics shop, but looks like I'll have to order online or make a trip up to the North side.

OK, I give in, tag because I keep thinking about some sort of commo with ~75 mile range.  Having just read the thread, is there anything available I could mount in a car that would go 60-75 miles without needing a repeater?

(Last thing I need is some more gear cluttering up the place)  

Quoted: FYI: RadioShack does not seem to carry 'Now You're Talking' anymore.  Local RS manager told me they haven't had it for a few years now.

Tells you how often I go to Rat Shack, now that they'r a cellphone store instead of an electronics hobby place.  I'm sure you can find and order one off the internet.  Hell, the info is still the same, with the same (or similar) pool of questions...I'll let you borrow my old one.

Quoted: ...I keep thinking about some sort of commo with ~75 mile range.  Having just read the thread, is there anything available I could mount in a car that would go 60-75 miles without needing a repeater?

Glenn, IIRC: 30 miles is about the absolute max range you'd get with line-of-sight comms (no repeater, no sattelite, no moon bounce, if you lived in the desert, etc.) due to the curvature of the earth. This would basically be using anything with a freq. from 30Mhz to Microwave comms (VHF/UHF).

Using GBPPR's handy-dandy LOS map generator, here's the coverage you'd have with from vehicle mounted antenna to vehicle mounted antenna (center of radiation @ 10' AGL), if one vehicle was were parked in the middle of your AO:



As you can tell, without the use of repeaters, you coverage area is quite small.  To get out any further, would require your own repeater, or a lower frequency (HF, which requires a General class or higher "ticket") and/or would rely on atmospheric "bounce".  Gen/Adv guys, please correct me if I'm wrong here.

From a mobile (vehicle mount) perspective, you might want something that will be able to recieve dispatch/car to car comms for your department as well (that might be possible, depending on what frequencies your local/county uses).  If you had your General ticket, then something like this HF/UHF/VHF unit might meet your needs.

Just for sh!ts and giggles, I plugged in what a coverage map would look like if we put an 80' repeater tower on our mutual friend's western hilltop:



Note that both the maps are showing LOS only (imagine a lightbulb on the tower - you'd be able to see that light bulb from any green area).  Due to something called "the Fresnel effect", many of the "dark" areas in the valleys (especially closer to the tower) would actually be covered by the radio waves, but with somewhat degraded reception.  Like the cell phone companies state "actual coverage area may vary".

Quoted: Quoted: FYI: RadioShack does not seem to carry 'Now You're Talking' anymore.  Local RS manager told me they haven't had it for a few years now.   Tells you how often I go to Rat Shack, now that they'r a cellphone store instead of an electronics hobby place.  I'm sure you can find and order one off the internet.  Hell, the info is still the same, with the same (or similar) pool of questions...I'll let you borrow my old one.

Thanks for the offer but the Q&A book says it came out in 2003.  Since you got your license in 2001, I would guess that the questions have changed.  I'm going to stop at another bookstore on the way home tonight anyway.  If no luck there, I'll just order one.  Besides, I'd like to have one of my own.

Sorry I keep coming in late.  

FYI Tech Plus has voice privileges from 28.300 Mhz - 28.500 Mhz.  That will take you around the world providing you have the right atmospheric conditions.  Even under poor conditions it is good for several hundred miles during daytime.  I have talked many times to Japanesee business men on their way to work with a very simple set up.  It has been a while since I counted but I have talked to people in at least 200 different countries using the 10 meter band.

As has been mentioned its impossible to get more than about 30 mile range reliably with any  typical VHF (144Mhz) / UHF (440 Mhz) equipment.  It is a matter of physics.  There are exotic methods but the key word is reliable.

Those who need / want longer distance privileges need to study and pass the General license test.  If I can do it anybody can, seriously!  Most folks simply memorize the questions and answers and score well enough to pass.  The code can be a bit of a challenge but most overcome.

Jeff

Quoted: ... Tech Plus  has voice privileges from 28.300 Mhz - 28.500 Mhz.

Is that still part of the structuring?

Quoted: Quoted: ... Tech Plus  has voice privileges from 28.300 Mhz - 28.500 Mhz. Is that still part of the structuring?

Found 'Now You're Talking' at Barnes and Noble bookstore.  According to that and the ARRL website, Tech Plus is still a license class (Pass the Tech test and 5 wpm Morse).

If anyone is interested in code practice done locally on 2m, here is some info from a message I got recently on the latest on air practice.






The group is meeting at 19:00 (local) on 144.050 Mhz for CW practice.  They are coordinating their efforts on 446.000 Mhz simplex or the 442.000 Mhz repeater (PL 127.3).

Listen for N9xxx (Danny), KC9xxx (Frank) or KB9xxx (Jim).  They tend to be the regulars.  Danny and Frank are in Kenosha and Jim is in Racine.

73,
W9xx
Bob
*****************************************

ALSO, THE MILWAUKEE RADIO AMATEURS'CLUB HAS TEACHING SESSIONS using MCW on the club repeater, 145.39 - Monday and Friday at 6:00 p.m. CST, with an advanced group on Wednesdays at 6:00 p.m.

A little late to the party here, but got my Tech ticket about 2 years ago.  KC9Dxx.  I've got a Yaesu VX-7R and a FT-8900 in the truck.  Lots to learn yet.  Taking the time to do more with the hobby is just way down on the priority list right now.