SP89 clone? - AR15.COM

Posted: 10/8/2004 8:02:11 AM EDT

Hello,

I live in Washington state (so no FA or SBR) and am interesed in a regular plain old SP89 pistol. I know that BW seems to be working on something, and that there are rumors to the effect that ORF is building a receiver (not sure if it is the K version or not..) I would prefer to have the 3 lug barrel so if I was to have my hands on a supressor I could use it if I wanted to.

So the questions are: Do I need to be careful with the US parts count for a pistol? What if I register it as an AOW? How hard is would this be to put together? I have the tooling/experience of putting together ARs but am new to HK. Are BW and ORF the only two sources for either a complete pistol and/or receiver? My FFL has requested info from BW but has not heard anything back yet.

Thanks

Posted: 10/8/2004 2:50:30 PM EDT

[#1]

I don't know of anyone making, or planning to make, a quality SP89 clone. I personally would stay far away from anything made by Bobcat/Speshul Wepons. If it were me, I'd save up the money and buy a real HK.

You don't need to worry about the US parts count on a pistol. Building a HK clone is a far different animal than putting together an AR-15. It requires a fair amount of welding, and you need a high pressure press to attach the barrel.

One option you might consider is an RF94 by Ohio Rapid Fire. They have a very good reputation, and are soon going to begin making an MP5 clone. One of the options they are offering looks like an MP5 without a buttstock, and it is classified as a pistol. It has a 3-lug barrel. For pictures, read the Group Buy thread in the Equipment Exchange.

Posted: 10/12/2004 6:21:46 PM EDT

[#2]

OTF is doing a group discount on ORF-94 receivers and you can get one of the short ones designated as a pistol and have it build as an SP89... I'm considering it.

Posted: 10/13/2004 6:28:18 AM EDT

[#3]

My understanding is that the group buy is for the 94 receiver and not the 94k shorty
receiver. If I am wrong, please correct me.

Thanks.

Posted: 10/13/2004 6:37:55 AM EDT

[#4]

Quoted:
My understanding is that the group buy is for the 94 receiver and not the 94k shorty
receiver. If I am wrong, please correct me.

Thanks.

I believe you are incorrect, they changed the buy to include the k receiver. Go read the tacked thread on this, think the original post on page one was edited to include the k receiver.

Posted: 10/13/2004 6:51:36 AM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:
OTF is doing a group discount on ORF-94 receivers and you can get one of the short ones designated as a pistol and have it build as an SP89... I'm considering it.

And it's going to be under 50 ounces? Or are you planning on moving?

Posted: 10/13/2004 7:01:10 AM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:
OTF is doing a group discount on ORF-94 receivers and you can get one of the short ones designated as a pistol and have it build as an SP89... I'm considering it.

No sir.

Some of the full sized ORF HK94 recievers are being papered as pistols (with the A1 cap) so you don't have the goofy barrel or fake can while waiting for your SBR paperwork to clear.

The only SP89 option is to buy a HK94 reciever from ORF, and get it chopped to SP89 specs and built up that way. I do not know if Todd at ORF will do this, you can ask though (he might be busy with all his stuff). I do know that Jayson at IGF will do it (I almost did it a year ot two ago before my money dried up), but it costs more. You've got to buy SP89 parts, and the reciever has to be cut.

I suggest dropping IGF an email about it.

Posted: 10/13/2004 7:11:11 AM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:
Quoted:
OTF is doing a group discount on ORF-94 receivers and you can get one of the short ones designated as a pistol and have it build as an SP89... I'm considering it.

And it's going to be under 50 ounces? Or are you planning on moving?

Yes Bullet, I have posted in the other thread that I would have to check with the smith to see IF it could be brought in under 50 ounces, and THAT would be the determining factor. Several people mentioned to me that Speshul Weaponz was able to make a "post-ban" legal SP89 pistol and bring it in under 50 ounces, so it should be possible if you for example omit the forward handguard and go with a plastic lower instead of a metal lower (or whatever you call the portion of the pistol that holds the trigger group). The law says 50 ounces unloaded, and that does not include mag weight. The weight of a standard SP89 pistol is 4 pounds 4 ounces WITH a 30 round unloaded mag. Not sure what the mag weights. So it might be possible to go from 68 ounces to 50 ounces if you lose the forward handguard and exclude magazine weight. I don't know.

Thanks for brining this issue to everyone's attention. I was aware of the NY requirements but other NYers might not have been. You may have just saved somebody an awful big headache Bullet, thank you.

And spade, you are correct, I misread it.

Posted: 10/13/2004 7:41:45 AM EDT

[#8]

Quoted:
Quoted:
My understanding is that the group buy is for the 94 receiver and not the 94k shorty
receiver. If I am wrong, please correct me.
Thanks.

I believe you are incorrect, they changed the buy to include the k receiver. Go read the tacked thread on this, think the original post on page one was edited to include the k receiver.

The first 2 lines of the group buy read like this:

This group buy is for RF94 (full size) receivers only. Parts sets are available from POF and ORF. Note: The pistol/rifle receivers are the same except for the markings.

I am intending to build a pistol. On the "long" or i should say STANDARD MP5 receiver.
Such a pistol will look like THIS

I think it looks pretty cool and should definately make the neighbors crap their pants. Its not a TRUE MP5K, but its pretty dang close. Put the AOW vertical foregrip on it and few people will know the difference.

Posted: 10/13/2004 7:46:35 AM EDT

[#9]

what would it cost to build the one pictured above

Posted: 10/13/2004 9:34:14 AM EDT

[#10]

Receiver from ORF $350, there's a group buy going on for $235.
MP5 Parts kit from POF $475
MP5A1 endcap $40
Thats your expense on parts.

However the assembling services will get you. (estimated prices, will vary with smithys)
Assemble it all and make semi-auto ~$350
Refinishing to match ~$200 (or DIY)
This will get you a working PISTOL.

If you want to go RIFLE you will need to buy US made parts, and a 16" barrel or mock suppressor to bring the barrel up to 16". These parts will increase the cost of the project of course.

I am told the conversion to semi-auto only is doable WESCOG style, but I have not actually found documented procedures yet.

Posted: 10/13/2004 9:44:13 AM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:
Hello,

I live in Washington state (so no FA or SBR) and am interesed in a regular plain old SP89 pistol. I know that BW seems to be working on something, and that there are rumors to the effect that ORF is building a receiver (not sure if it is the K version or not..) I would prefer to have the 3 lug barrel so if I was to have my hands on a supressor I could use it if I wanted to.

So the questions are: Do I need to be careful with the US parts count for a pistol? What if I register it as an AOW? How hard is would this be to put together? I have the tooling/experience of putting together ARs but am new to HK. Are BW and ORF the only two sources for either a complete pistol and/or receiver? My FFL has requested info from BW but has not heard anything back yet.

Thanks

Correct, ORF is NOT doing the shorter reciever for the SP89, YET. USA made part counts does not apply to pistols. AOW, is just like going through the SBR process, visit the M-16 section in the AR side of the forums for more knowledgable people on that aspect of this.

POF has all of the correct parts for the SP89, three lug barrel, etc.

but you need to check laws, there may be the 50oz(unloaded weight of the pistol) restriction for you there. The Hometown forums should have people who know the state requirments better than me.

Posted: 10/13/2004 11:28:19 AM EDT

[#12]

The MP5 "long" receiver is a good place to start anyway. Parts are plentiful and you can go rifle or pistol with it.

The MP5K and PDW series use a shorter receiver which would require a different parts kit or modification of the MP5 kit and i'm pretty sure its only marked "pistol"

Posted: 10/13/2004 11:42:55 AM EDT

[#13]

Well I think I'm out. I need compliance parts because SBR is not an option in NY and we have a 50 ounce rule. The cost of compliance parts would make this completely unaffordable.

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