Clip ejecting early (2 rounds left)

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Clip ejecting early (2 rounds left)

Posted: 9/27/2011 1:05:11 PM EDT

My M1 is having some premature clip ejection. After firing round #6, the clip trys to eject.
I can push the clip and remaining two rounds back in and finish shooting with no problems. when empty, the bolt locks and the clip ejects perfectly fine.

I have replaced the springs with the Orion 7 spring kit, p/n G98a.

The problem was happening before the rebuild, so thats what prompted it.
The Op-rod spring was broke, but it has been replaced.

Anyone have any suggestions?

thanks
Nate

Posted: 9/27/2011 1:33:23 PM EDT

[#1]

It could be several things, possible for clip latch to be worn but not usually. I would look eleswhere for issues
If you have already replaced the Clip latch spring the next most likely is the lobe on the bullet guide is worn. Also check that the cutout on the stock for the clip latch is cut deep enough and there is no interference. Is it a commercial or USGI stock?

Posted: 9/27/2011 5:10:53 PM EDT

[#2]

7th round stoppage?
Old AR15.com thread on 7th round stoppage

19. Malfunction

A malfunction is a failure of the weapon to operate satisfactorily. Some of the common malfunctions are discussed below.

(a.) The clip may jump out on the seventh round. This is usually caused by a bent follower arm or bullet guide and can be corrected by replacing them.

Taken from: FM 23-5

Posted: 9/28/2011 4:04:31 AM EDT

[#3]

Good info guys thanks.
The stock is a USGI and the gun has work flawlessly for the past 5 years(that i have owned it) and 4 spam cans, up until this past summer.
I will look into the area of question.

thanks again

Posted: 9/28/2011 2:20:00 PM EDT

[#4]

First, replace the operating rod spring
If that doesn't correct the issue, replace the bullet guide.

This issue is almost never caused by the clip latch.

Posted: 9/28/2011 2:28:00 PM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:
First, replace the operating rod spring
.

He stated that the Op Rod spring has been replaced

Posted: 9/29/2011 1:04:01 PM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:

Quoted:
First, replace the operating rod spring
.

He stated that the Op Rod spring has been replaced

Then install a new bullet guide

Posted: 9/29/2011 3:34:13 PM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:
My M1 is having some premature clip ejection. After firing round #6, the clip trys to eject...
Nate

It could just be getting over excited. Perhaps tell it to think about football scores.

Sorry, I couldn't resist.

Posted: 9/29/2011 3:41:24 PM EDT

[#8]

Quoted:

Quoted:
First, replace the operating rod spring
.

He stated that the Op Rod spring has been replaced

Then install a new bullet guide

Yup, already suggested that

Posted: 9/29/2011 7:22:33 PM EDT

[#9]

Quoted:

Quoted:
First, replace the operating rod spring
.

He stated that the Op Rod spring has been replaced

Then install a new bullet guide

Yup, already suggested that

Why is that suggested? Last time the topic came up and I questioned the diagnosis, it damn near started a fight.

The bullet guide has no primary interaction in the clip ejection cycle. I proved this to myself by removing it from a rifle and ejecting an unloaded clip. It has everything to do with releasing the bolt when a fresh clip is inserted though.

Posted: 9/29/2011 8:27:11 PM EDT

[#10]

GREASE anything that moves first.

Posted: 9/30/2011 4:55:23 AM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:

Quoted:
First, replace the operating rod spring
.

He stated that the Op Rod spring has been replaced

Then install a new bullet guide

Yup, already suggested that

Why is that suggested? Last time the topic came up and I questioned the diagnosis, it damn near started a fight.

The bullet guide has no primary interaction in the clip ejection cycle. I proved this to myself by removing it from a rifle and ejecting an unloaded clip. It has everything to do with releasing the bolt when a fresh clip is inserted though.

I cant explain it but it works, measure the bullet guide lobe should be .179 to .175 .
If .175 replace it. I have also seen a BG that was bent that made the same problem, once replaced rifle functioned fine

Posted: 9/30/2011 5:15:21 AM EDT

[#12]

Really more than I want to type about to explain, but the "bullet guide" provides the shelf for the accelerator which is attached to the operating rod catch which is also attached to the clip latch and also rests above the follower arm and the bullet guide.
When the bullet guide projections wears down it throws all the other parts out of acceptable alignment and allows the operating rod catch to apply more and more downward pressure on the clip latch arm.
When the bullet guide wears to a certain point the rifle begins to eject partial clips because of the incresed pressure on the clip latch arm and this is a good indicator it is time to start replacing some parts

I hope that helps explain it without going into some long ass blah blah about the fundementals of John Cs design.

Posted: 9/30/2011 6:51:23 AM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:

Really more than I want to type about to explain, but the "bullet guide" provides the shelf for the accelerator which is attached to the operating rod catch which is also attached to the clip latch and also rests above the follower arm and the bullet guide.

When the bullet guide projections wears down it throws all the other parts out of acceptable alignment and allows the operating rod catch to apply more and more downward pressure on the clip latch arm.

When the bullet guide wears to a certain point the rifle begins to eject partial clips because of the incresed pressure on the clip latch arm and this is a good indicator it is time to start replacing some parts

I hope that helps explain it without going into some long ass blah blah about the fundementals of John Cs design.

Perfect explanation.

I've experienced this very thing. I also had an M1 that I measured and replaced necessary components and still had issues. I tracked it down to a very loose clip latch pivot pin hole. It was so wallered out that it was allowing the clip latch to come disengaged with the clip enough to eject it. I wound up reaming out the hole and bushing it. Problem solved.

Posted: 9/30/2011 8:08:02 AM EDT

[#14]

Quoted:
Really more than I want to type about to explain, but the "bullet guide" provides the shelf for the accelerator which is attached to the operating rod catch which is also attached to the clip latch and also rests above the follower arm and the bullet guide.
When the bullet guide projections wears down it throws all the other parts out of acceptable alignment and allows the operating rod catch to apply more and more downward pressure on the clip latch arm.
When the bullet guide wears to a certain point the rifle begins to eject partial clips because of the incresed pressure on the clip latch arm and this is a good indicator it is time to start replacing some parts

I hope that helps explain it without going into some long ass blah blah about the fundementals of John Cs design.

Normally I would associate the parts and places described above with the release of a bolt as a fresh clip is pressed into the rifle. Does the malfunction you describe happen more because of the stresses and flexing the gun undergoes when firing? I'm pretty sure what you describe would be impossible to demonstrate while manually cycling the action.

Posted: 10/1/2011 10:02:57 AM EDT

[#15]

In place of stress and flex, the reason would be more about tension and angles.
Same thing that caused the early clip ejection on early rifles that forced a redesign of the action and the addition of a relief cut as well as making sure the cartridges were loaded into the clips so the first round fed from the left and the last round fed from the right.
It was only in the late fifties or early sixties that it was determined that increasing the height of the shelf on the bullet guide pretty well solved the flaw.

I doubt one could recreate the malfunction hand cycling the action, but if one had a shootable cut-away and a high speed camera,,,,

Posted: 10/1/2011 12:04:53 PM EDT

[#16]

Thanks for the explanation!

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Clip ejecting early (2 rounds left)

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