Been looking around some more (really can't seem to find a pack I like in the price range I'm staying in), and found a site with a couple of the Arc'Teryx packs on it.  The Charlie seems to really fit what I want, and within what I'm willing to spend...I just can't find any for sale.  All of the few websites I found listing it show it's either sold out, no backorder, or out of stock, no expected availability date.  Nothing on ebay at all.  Any chance of still picking one of these up, or should I just keep looking for something else?

The assault pack and main pack that are issued items in the Marines don't really do it for me, personally.  If it was me, I'd find something else.  Then again, I'm only a beginner in the hiking/camping arena, so for all I know, the things are the cat's pajamas for those 'in the know' or somesuch.  All I know is that I don't much care for the main pack.  The day pack is alright, though.

I haven't seen any expedition/week-long bag by any of the popular vendors in this forum that I like.  $500 for a Kifaru is a little steep, considering some of the other, true expedition packs I could get for the money.  The Charlie looks like it'd be a pretty solid 3-4 day pack for long weekend flights home and things like that.



 

Which one's the Charlie?  I again emphasize that I'm only familiar with the issued main pack and day pack.  As a forewarning on price, Arc'teryx's Gortex trousers are, like, $500.00.

The Charlie is I think the mid-sized one, about 1700ci.  Retail is ~$130 on the one site I found that listed them - which really surprises me.  My Arc'Teryx softshell was $250 on sale, and it's not even their upper-end one, just the midrange.  Their gear is tougher than hell, though.





I've found that the prices on military-style oriented stuff is always stupid expensive.  $50 for a 6x6 pouch from some of the "favored" vendors on here is asinine, at least to me.  It's a damned pouch.  Likewise, take a set of waterproof mountaineering pants, color them ACU, and you can up the price $150 and no one will blink.  +$225 if it's multicam....evidently that pattern is harder to make.  













 
 

I own both the Charlie (assault pack) and the Echo (medium ruck, ~3000CI). (I managed to have my top pouch for that ruck stolen within a week of purchase. )

I purchased mine from www.leoadventures.com, which offers an aggregate of a bunch of mil/LEO discounts for popular outdoor brands. Membership is $20 annually, which paid for itself in savings when I bought the pack. Now the bad news: they stopped their purchase agreement with Arc'Teryx a few months back.

The Charlie is a little small for an assault pack, but it is covered in PALS webbing, so it is more customizable than comparable offerings, I believe. My only other means of comparison, the issue MOLLE assault pack, is not any bigger, and has a far worse layout, IMO. I prefer the Charlie. There are other more capable options out there probably (needs more radio/hydration ports, for example) but not in that price range. I paid ~$125.

The Echo has also been very nice, when I've been able to use it (everybody has to look the same! ). The top pouch (when I HAD a top pouch ) detaches from the main pack and has a waist belt to make a pretty handy butt pack. The main pack even comes equipped with webbing straps so that the pack can be jumped (not a feature I use, but it is thoughtful). The pack bag is covered in PALS as well, and it has top and side access. You won't lie in the prone with it (nor will you in a MOLLE ruck, I argue), but maybe that is apples and oranges...the MOLLE ruck is external frame after all. Paid ~$350 for the Echo, IIRC.

Best of all, they don't even offer an ACU pack––because Canadians recognize better camo than ACU, while the Army does not.  

ETA: important note: the issue gear for the USMC is made by Propper International, under license from Arc'Teryx. All the ones I have seen on ebay are the USMC ones, and either they use them harder, or Propper didn't follow the original, because they always seem to have blowouts (yanked shoulder straps, blown zippers, etc). I bought mine through Arc'Teryx, and have not had any of these issues, yet.

Are there any specific channels you have to go through to purchase directly from Arc'Teryx?  I've found one site with an "estimated" in-stock date of Sept. 15th; however, I shot militarymorons an email and he said he believes the Charlie has been discontinued, and that if he heard back from Arc'Teryx on it, he'd let me know.  My previous email experiences with Arc'Teryx have, unfortunately, not been too good.



Being a little small isn't a big issue, as I can always reconfigure the exterior with different pouches based on what I'm doing - long weekend at home, couple days doing a work job site visit, whatever.  It's one reason I really like the PALS setup over anything the non.mil market has - it really allows one pack to fulfill a whole lot of functions.



I'm going to be pretty bummed if the pack is actually discontinued and I can't pick one up.  






 

That was another good point, it would have been nice to have a little loop to clip my camelbak bladder onto; when it gets empty it just falls to the bottom of the mesh pouch...but anyway, it sounds like the A'T pack meets your requirements, which matches my own, and I concur with your research, there's not a lot out there that meets that intended use. It's either go $500 whiz-bang tactical or get a bookbag.

I'll also concur their customer service needs work. Somehow, they could not offer me a replacement top lid for my Echo for sale...apparently they are in such low rate production they can't afford to make an extra one?!

A'T's web site links to their retailers...good luck not paying full retail.

here

ETA: yeah, their web site no longer shows the Charlie pack...damn.

Well, you're probably better at packing than I am, from the sound of it.  It's not a bad pack––it just isn't outstanding, either.  For your intended purposes, it'll probably work rather well.  I don't know exactly what you plan on packing, but I'd imagine that 15 lbs. would fit in their fairly well.  Have you checked out any of the Maxpedition packs?  They seem to be in about the same price range.  Not sure if they're as big as you need, though.  No firsthand experience with 'em.

Where are you guys looking where all you can find is a $500 pack or a book bag? There's plenty of choices out there and alternatives to the Kifaru mountain humping packs. Eagle Industries, Maxpedition, Camelbak, Tactical Tailor, HSGI, Blackhawk, just to name a few offer great bags from small man purses to full on rucksacks and its rare to find one thats $500. Plenty of other companies as well.

The ATS Cobra pack is the only other thing close.

I love the propper made ILBE-Day Pack units, but it's still beyond me why they aren't being made in Coyote.

Did you check out the Condor II by Maxpedition?  Here's a link to Maxpedition's webpage.  MSRP is less than the Arc'teryx pack in question, and I'd be surprised if you couldn't find it for slightly less elsewhere.  While SKD doesn't stock the Condor II, they do have killer prices on all their other packs.  They're selling Camelbak/Mystery Ranch Tri-Zips for $195.00!

I've done some more digging, The Supply Captain (just google) has a nice custom assault pack in CB for ~$130, and the ATS Cobra in CB for ~$110...I am deciding which one of these to pick up now...

They're all really just carbon clones of each other, though.  The Maxpedition Falcon 2 is on the list, but Tactical Tailor and HGSI were both too expensive from what I saw browsing their site.  I've got a top-zip assault pack right now, just don't like how things pack down into it.  I'm not a fan of how most assault packs seem to place most of the load down low, towards the center of the back, instead of up towards the shoulders.



 

Well, personal preferences aside, you're going to have a harder time finding packs built that way, because designers have recognized that ergonomically, the hip bones are better load bearing structures than the shoulders––actually the biggest bones in the body, rather than a stack of guts held in place by your ribs and collar bone. As near as I can tell, the only reason shoulder straps got more attention in military circles was because bailing out of a pack was pretty critical. That, and POOR design. The old style ALICE frame comes to mind...

Oh, yeah, I know that the hips work much better to carry the load (most of the weight of a pack should be carried on the hips, as I've always been told), but lower down and farther out tends to unbalance a pack for me.  I do better with more of the heavy weight higher up towards the shoulders, with good weight transfer down to the hips.  That said, it seems like a lot of the hip belts on .mil-style packs are more of just a flat piece of webbing, rather than a true padded and contoured load-bearing belt.  



One thing I'm sort of wondering about....do all the ALICE/MOLLE packs require the use of a frame?  My dad used an old military rucksack for a while that looks exactly like the medium ALICE pack, but it didn't have a frame, it was just the pack and the shoulder straps.  However, all the ALICE/MALICE packs I've found online say they require the frame.  I had sort of been considering them, but aside from a few specific situations, I'm not too big on external frame packs - just too bulky, and worthless for what I want right now.



The Camelbak Tri-zip looks interesting, as does this pack from Eagle (although I'm not too big on the lack of PALS webbing on it, and it's bigger than what I need, although I always have a nice list of "Things to buy eventually" going...):



http://www.eagleindustries.com/product.php?productid=661&cat=60&page=1



and this pack from Blackhawk:



http://www.blackhawk.com/product/100oz-X-1-RAPTOR-Pack,866,44.htm



Kifaru had a couple I really liked, but the price is the real kill-point.  The Zulu seems to be good, although more expensive and larger than what I wanted, but I could probably just do low-volume and squish the pack down if I was doing any plane commuting.



https://www.kifaru.net/MGzulu.htm



The X-Ray seems to be closer to the initial size that I need (1800-2000ci), and looks like you can strap a good amount of external pockets on (although I'd imagine the extra pouches add up to the price of the pack itself).  It also has the benefit of being a "zip-open guts" pack, instead of a top-load only.  I've also seen it mentioned that it fits people in the 5'-7 - 6'-0 range pretty well, which would work great for me (5'-9).



https://www.kifaru.net/MGXray.htm





I really like their Navigator pack, but a top-load pack (even with the bottom access) is just a pain in the ass to sort through if you don't want to pull everything out of a pack to find a shirt or pair of socks while traveling.  Also might be a bit large for flying.



I guess if the Arc'Teryx Charlie isn't available, I'll probably go with the X-Ray or the Camelbak Tri-zip.  TT's Malice v.2 pack looks nice, but the lack of PALS kills it - I'd rather have a smaller pack that I can expand if necessary, than have to deal with a static-layout pack.  Stupid question, but what's the resale market like for some of these packs?  As picky as I am, I'd hate to drop $300 on a Kifaru and it turn into a closet ornament because I didn't like it, especially since I can't really test-fit between some of the different packs.



 

I'm rather enamored with the tri-zip design and will be ordering a Mystery Ranch Big Sky for backpacking and whatnot in about two weeks.  That said, any of those packs ought to serve you well.  I'm not a fan of Blackhawk's stuff (save for the SERPA holster), but don't know anything about their packs.  The Maxpedition Falcon II, Camelbak/Mystery Ranch Tri-Zip, and the TAD Gear EDC are on my list of possibles for a day pack.

Yeah, looking at it, now I've also tossed the Camelbak BFM into the mix, and looking a lot harder at the Trizip.  There's a place locally that's a Camelbak dealer, and I need to stop by and put in an order for a tent footprint anyway, so I'm going to have to check them out while I'm there.  Not sure if they'll have the military packs, though.



 

If you like the Arc gear all you need to do is buy the ILBE packs. The Charlie pack is the ILBE Assault Pack and the ILBE Main Pack is the Arc Echo pack. Great gear, I love my setup, and put together is a great size for a week long excursion.

Fairly certain the main ILBE pack is the Tango, not the Echo.

Charlie Pack for sale here.

At least, they will be on 9/15.

I've got an ILBE patrol pack also, thanks to OpusXKC winning a .gov liquidation auction for a bunch of them, and it is in my opinion a great pack for its size, and cost (even at $130).  Mine is woodland marpat, and I'll probably get a MC one when they go on sale at the above link, provided they use ITW buckles.  Some of the Propper packs have Arc buckles that aren't compatible with the ITW's on my kifaru pod and other gear.  BTW, a medium kifaru pod on the back of the charlie pack is PERFECT.

I've emailed them twice and have yet to get a reply back.  Not too sure if I want to send money to a company that can't answer their emails.  Granted, it's the only place I've seen list a "Back in stock" date on them.





 

Rangermade has yet to answer my emails or phone calls too, also when signing up for their account, the page said it will "email within 30 minutes, if not get ahold of us" waited 4 days, nothing, created another account yesterday, still nothing, I said screw it and went to Quantico tactical supply (listed as a distributer at Arcteryx LEAF official site), unlike RM.us. Jason was extremely helpful and said he would make sure my order was rcv'd by the 24th for the elk hunt... I however did not buy a pack, just the leaf alpha jacket and pants. Just this week I received my EMR setup with goodies..... I will be buying a 0* slick, 6 man with liner and med stove, and a few other things here VERY shortly. I already have a pointman with 2 long pockets, but for a 2 week outing, it is a small, a EMR with XTL,  E&E, and 2 long pockets fit the bill just nice. I wish I could have picked up a 2qt for my IFAK however.

I actually drove past Quantico's store here in Kansas over the weekend.  Next time I'm out that way, I'll probably try to stop by and check out what they have on hand.



 

Came home after WAY too many hours at work... well over 24 straight. Walk up stairs to the apartment about to fall over... a box on the door mat in the wide open... what could it be..... Arcteryx drop ship via order from QTS on the label... Shame on FedEX for leaving it on the door step to a middle of downtown apartment in the wide open to anyone who walks up the street. Come in, open package.... that was fast. Big thumbs up to Quantico Tactical Supply, still a big thumbs down and if I could kick them in the nuts I would, to rangermade.us. Due to the inability to respond or take a message by rangermade I was almost certain I could not get the LEAF set by the elk hunt... QTS beat it by getting it to me 7 days prior to heading out, I will be posting this in the who sucks and who does not thread. FYI still no return call, return email, or account activity info from either account I created at Rangermade.us. I personally feel like you should avoid these guys like the dam plague. Photo time.
Arcteryx Alpha jacket and pants


With a few other tactical goodies... Arcteryx LEAF set, Patagonia R4 fleece, Tad robin hoodie, The TAD merino watchcaps and gaiter, The E&E (like it needs a introduction)

try Quantico Tactical, I've had decent luck there getting Arc' stuff.  I have a Charlie and it's a well made unit.

Well, I know they won't have the Charlie, as Arc'Teryx has confirmed it's been discontinued.  I'm going to stop on my next trip to central Kansas and check out the Trizip - recently, buying packs without being able to fingerbang and test-fit them hasn't worked out too well.



I'd really like it if some civilian-gear companies like Mountain Hardware and Kelty would start putting PALS webbing on their packs.  I want modular pockets, dammit.



 

That was one expensive box o' stuff.



I haven't gotten any sort of reply back from rangermade, either....second the "Pass on them".



 

After seeing how much you paid for all that I'd be a little pissed about it being left on my doorstep too. That's just insane. Something like that should be insured

Yeah I was upset, I would be more upset if it walked away. But it would be FedEXs fault, not the manufacturer or the seller. If I have an option I will pay more to have UPS ship. I have had issues with USPS losing knives (received am empty, re-taped box twice), and Fed Ex has left Turbos, several thousands rounds of ammo, 2 AR uppers, and a bunch of little stuff on the door in the past. Hence my displeasure with them. 1 more week and I will be able to try out the new outerwear.