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Posted: 2/20/2009 8:08:51 PM EDT
[#1]
Check out MDARMS they have various pictures and manufacture the drums that work. I just got 4 drums today in the mail.
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Posted: 2/20/2009 8:27:11 PM EDT
[#2]
My drum is soon to be on its way also
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Posted: 2/20/2009 8:40:36 PM EDT
[#3]
Quoted:
Any one have pictures of one Check out the pic thread on the SAIGA 12 forum |
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Posted: 2/20/2009 8:42:33 PM EDT
[#4]
What do I think about it:
Cool toy, not anything I'd rely on to protect my family with. |
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Posted: 2/21/2009 4:33:28 AM EDT
[#5]
thanks for the reply guys. i will be picking up one that has the conversion for 1300
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Posted: 2/21/2009 5:06:52 AM EDT
[#6]
Quoted:
What do I think about it: Cool toy, not anything I'd rely on to protect my family with. Heh, I would bet $2 that you are giving advice on a shotgun that you do not even own or probably have never fired... Being an owner of a Saiga S-12 that has had alot of rounds through fired through it, this is definately not a toy. I mean, c'mon, its a freakin' AK. Rugged and tough and just as dependable as a Russian built AK you cant go wrong. You have your shotgun Purists that spit on anything that is not a pump shotgun. YEARS ago people did the same thing about revolvers and 1911s.... Check out saiga-12.com for more info about these shotguns. LB |
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Posted: 2/21/2009 5:11:02 AM EDT
[#7]
You can save yourself about $600 or so by doing your own conversion. Saiga12.com has a great forum that can help you do it yourself. Tromix makes a trigger guard replacement that makes the pistol grip conversion simple. That was always the hard part for the DIY conversion.
You can do everything yourself with a few simple hand tools and use the rest of the money for ammo and mags.
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Posted: 2/21/2009 5:40:31 PM EDT
[#8]
Quoted:
Quoted:
What do I think about it: Cool toy, not anything I'd rely on to protect my family with. Heh, I would bet $2 that you are giving advice on a shotgun that you do not even own or probably have never fired... Being an owner of a Saiga S-12 that has had alot of rounds through fired through it, this is definately not a toy. I mean, c'mon, its a freakin' AK. Rugged and tough and just as dependable as a Russian built AK you cant go wrong. You have your shotgun Purists that spit on anything that is not a pump shotgun. YEARS ago people did the same thing about revolvers and 1911s.... Check out saiga-12.com for more info about these shotguns. LB I DO own one and I agree with MISTERWILSON. Not everyone on earth has bought into the taktikul horseshit––especially when the taktikul device does not point or handle naturally, has poor controls, and is overpriced. It's a rifle platform adapted to be a shotgun. It's inferior to purpose built shotguns 99.9% of the time, and the only advantage it has in that .1% is a detachable magazine. Expensive range toy and not much else. |
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Posted: 2/21/2009 8:38:18 PM EDT
[#9]
Im going to go with the best SG I own. My other one is an 870.
And now that it has the numerous magazine options? 
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Posted: 2/22/2009 5:09:54 AM EDT
[#10]
SAIGA-12 owner here too.
It's fun as hell at the rane but mag changes are clumsy. Storing rounds in a mag long term risks deformation and jamming problems. There is no bolt hold back. Anything above 5 round mags extend really far below the shotgun. The 10 round mags are almost comical. While I do not have a drum, I imagine the weight would really slow movement down. To me, the gun feels like a prototype and fun range toy. If it had a magwell and bolt hold back I would like it much more. |
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Posted: 2/22/2009 5:41:51 AM EDT
[#11]
Quoted:
What do I think about it: Cool toy, not anything I'd rely on to protect my family with. 
Pssstttt.... A certain military uses this 'toy' and it performed well in Georgia. Wow, look at those poor ergonomics on that range toy. |
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Posted: 2/22/2009 5:58:40 AM EDT
[#12]
Ikor, You posted in my mags and drum for sale thread on the Saiga board that you had IM'd me, but I did not get an IM. I will hold the drum for a bit, please try resending the IM.
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Posted: 2/22/2009 9:29:38 PM EDT
[#13]
you got IM on there. pleas let me know if you dont get my IM.
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Posted: 2/23/2009 3:36:54 PM EDT
[#14]
Biggest POS ever!
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Posted: 2/23/2009 5:16:48 PM EDT
[#15]
$50 magazines and shitty ergonomics as well as a safety that requires you to take your hand away from the trigger guard in order for the weapon to be fired are enough for me to stay away. I've tried to like the Kalashnikov design but it isnt for me. Perhaps you will feel otherwise, as for me I will stick with my Mossberg 590 for shotty's, my Ar's for rifles and my Glocks for handguns.
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Posted: 2/23/2009 5:24:44 PM EDT
[#16]
Quoted:
$50 magazines and shitty ergonomics as well as a safety that requires you to take your hand away from the trigger guard in order for the weapon to be fired are enough for me to stay away. I've tried to like the Kalashnikov design but it isnt for me. Perhaps you will feel otherwise, as for me I will stick with my Mossberg 590 for shotty's, my Ar's for rifles and my Glocks for handguns. Wow. I wont say Saiga> 870> 590 nor M1> Ar15 nor 1911 > Glock. I will say different strokes for different folks. 
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Posted: 2/23/2009 5:26:30 PM EDT
[#17]
Got it now and replied
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Posted: 2/23/2009 6:51:38 PM EDT
[#18]
i reply to you on saiga-12
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Posted: 2/23/2009 6:53:28 PM EDT
[#19]
i reply to you on saiga-12
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Posted: 2/24/2009 2:14:28 AM EDT
[#20]
Saiga 12 owner here.... It is a VERY VERY VERY VERY good semi-auto SHOTgun.
An 870 is a lot heavier with 6 shells then the saiga12 with 10 shells. Or that is how it feels to me. Mossy 500 is just light... But I like the saiga 12, I would protect my family with one any day. (edit all three types I would protect my family with, they are all good guns with pos. and negs to each, but NO big negs) Saiga 12, 870 and 500 are all good shotguns. Its like apples and oranges. If someone says that a Saiga12 is a toy, .. then i would reply "oh please and go buy another airsoft gun, keyboard commando dude or dudette." |
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Posted: 2/24/2009 9:04:39 AM EDT
[#21]
Crito pretty much said it! If you don't like AK type firearms you probably won't like the Saiga-12 and consider it in the "Toy" category. It is, however, based on one of the most proven firearm designs and engineered by Comrade Kalashnikov's own replacement Nikonov. The gas system is not picky and will cycle almost anything up to 3 inch magnums and doesn't kick like a mule.
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Posted: 2/24/2009 9:11:42 AM EDT
[#22]
I like them a lot. I would compare them favourably with the Remington 870.
I have never been able to justify the expense of the conversion. |
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Posted: 2/25/2009 9:50:58 PM EDT
[#23]
FWIW, I know, not think, that I WANT TWO!
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Posted: 2/26/2009 1:41:18 AM EDT
[#24]
Quoted:
If it had a magwell and bolt hold back I would like it much more. Yours doesn't have a BHO? Most of them come with them, although it's a manual bolt hold open. Not a last round BHO. The Saiga forum's store has them, but they're currently out of stock. Also, there is a magwell now. Check out: http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?showtopic=35986 So there, your 2 gripes with S12's have been nullified.
Quoted:
Biggest POS ever! Good input  . Anything else to add to your helpful comment?
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Posted: 2/26/2009 3:33:01 AM EDT
[#25]
Yeah i shoot shotguns at least once a week and one of the guys we shoot with shoots one.
The things is picky as hell about ammo, me and the other guy shoot 870 they eat anything. Its just a big piece of clunky of stamped metal others may have had good experinces with them, i didnt. He asked what i think about it. Not trying to hurt anyones feelings. |
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Posted: 2/26/2009 4:08:21 AM EDT
[#26]
It's a $200 shotgun with awful ergonomics, selling here for $600 with even worse ergonomics.
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Posted: 2/26/2009 12:49:28 PM EDT
[#27]
Quoted:
Yeah i shoot shotguns at least once a week and one of the guys we shoot with shoots one. The things is picky as hell about ammo, me and the other guy shoot 870 they eat anything. Its just a big piece of clunky of stamped metal others may have had good experinces with them, i didnt. He asked what i think about it. Not trying to hurt anyones feelings. See, that's a little more helpful to the OP. As opposed to just saying it's a junk gun, and not saying why you think that. Anyway, if it's picky on ammo, have your buddy check out how many gas ports it has. If he bought it new, chances are RAAC will pay for it to be fixed (and also for shipping), if the gas ports are messed up. There have been quite a few coming out with not enough, or blocked gas ports. He might want to check into it. RAAC has been great with taking care of its customers. They have been paying for all costs to fix the gas port problems, at zero cost to the customer (well, obviously you have to give up your gun for a little while  ).
As far as the comments on ergonomics.......it's a preference thing. Obviously, if you like and are comfortable with the AK platform, you'll like an S12. If not, then you probably won't. |
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Posted: 2/26/2009 1:34:18 PM EDT
[#28]
The Saiga-12 has made shooting 3 gun much more fun for me, and I am much more competitive with one (regardless of the division I shoot in) with it than I have been with any other shotgun.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulBn-PVq-AQ They do have their quirks, but the speed advantage reloading 10 in the same time it takes an average shooter to reload 2 shells makes up for it. |
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Posted: 2/26/2009 3:17:39 PM EDT
[#29]
Quoted:
The Saiga-12 has made shooting 3 gun much more fun for me, and I am much more competitive with one (regardless of the division I shoot in) with it than I have been with any other shotgun. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulBn-PVq-AQ They do have their quirks, but the speed advantage reloading 10 in the same time it takes an average shooter to reload 2 shells makes up for it. 
You are a fucking animal with that thing! Two different sights? Was one an Aimpoint? Whats the other one?? |
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Posted: 2/26/2009 6:54:23 PM EDT
[#30]
Quoted: The Saiga-12 has made shooting 3 gun much more fun for me, and I am much more competitive with one (regardless of the division I shoot in) with it than I have been with any other shotgun. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulBn-PVq-AQ They do have their quirks, but the speed advantage reloading 10 in the same time it takes an average shooter to reload 2 shells makes up for it. Dude, that video is bad ass. I can't wait to shoot mine. It's been sitting in the safe since Nov. 3rd. |
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Posted: 2/26/2009 9:36:26 PM EDT
[#31]
I love my saiga 12, but I haven't had it for a few months as Tony has it over at Tromix to make it an even better machine.
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Posted: 2/28/2009 4:26:35 AM EDT
[#32]
thanks guys. i have one on the build right now. keep them info coming i really appreciate it
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Posted: 3/13/2009 9:23:50 AM EDT
[#33]
I've been interested in these for a long time now. Two friends just got theirs. One is virgin stock while the other was modded AK style. The 20rnd drums are a must have.
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Posted: 3/13/2009 11:46:56 AM EDT
[#34]
I've been gearing up to buy a shotgun (an 870) for while now, for HD and hunting. If I can only get one or the other for a while, would a saiga be a good alternative? I'm a Jersey resident, so it would have to be compliant - no grip, no 10 round mag. I'm basically riding an impulse buy wave if I get one. I wasn't really considering getting a semi shotgun. Why wouldn't a just buy semi auto Remy? I dont want to get a Saiga if I have to put work and money into it to make it reliable. Any opinions on my situation?
ETA: I'm going to the Valley Forge gun show tomorrow, and I'm wondering if I should put the Saiga on top of my impulse buy list. I'm not wasting $1000 though just because its a hot item. |
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Posted: 3/13/2009 8:04:25 PM EDT
[#35]
If I was stuck with the choice between a neutered Saiga and 870, I'd take the 870. WTF is the point of the Saiga if you cant put a pistol grip on it or use detachable high-cap mags? FWIW I have a S12 and several 870's. The S12 is not a wingshooting gun for sure but it kicks major ass for 3-gun competition use. I will probably be picking another one up soon.
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Posted: 3/13/2009 8:45:41 PM EDT
[#36]
Quoted:
I've been gearing up to buy a shotgun (an 870) for while now, for HD and hunting. If I can only get one or the other for a while, would a saiga be a good alternative? I'm a Jersey resident, so it would have to be compliant - no grip, no 10 round mag. I'm basically riding an impulse buy wave if I get one. I wasn't really considering getting a semi shotgun. Why wouldn't a just buy semi auto Remy? I dont want to get a Saiga if I have to put work and money into it to make it reliable. Any opinions on my situation? ETA: I'm going to the Valley Forge gun show tomorrow, and I'm wondering if I should put the Saiga on top of my impulse buy list. I'm not wasting $1000 though just because its a hot item. Look at Sinstra's video above. Tell me you can do that with an 870. You cant. Buttstock only? Not really an issue imo. No hi caps? More frequent mag changes- same as loading a tube (quantity) except hella faster, and they are widely available and priced cheaper than Glock mags ($20). Mine required no work or money, mine didnt have the out of spec holes missing, but I understand from reading they are more than willing to take them in and fix them under warranty. The downside is 870 parts are plentiful, the upside is the AK platforms known and noted reliability. If you know someone who knows someone who has one, try to test drive it, I think it will sell itself. I have one of each, and if I had to let go of one, despite my longtime love for my 870, I would throw it in the trash before considering letting go of my Saiga12. And for no hicaps & no pistol grip allowed, no conversion needed. 500-600 for the gun and thats it, no $1000. |
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Posted: 3/13/2009 8:48:33 PM EDT
[#37]
I will (probably) be on Shooting USA/Sighting in for the Fort Benning 3 Gun episode on April 8th on the Outdoor Channel.
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Posted: 3/13/2009 9:02:54 PM EDT
[#38]
Quoted:
I've been gearing up to buy a shotgun (an 870) for while now, for HD and hunting. If I can only get one or the other for a while, would a saiga be a good alternative? I'm a Jersey resident, so it would have to be compliant - no grip, no 10 round mag. I'm basically riding an impulse buy wave if I get one. I wasn't really considering getting a semi shotgun. Why wouldn't a just buy semi auto Remy? I dont want to get a Saiga if I have to put work and money into it to make it reliable. Any opinions on my situation? ETA: I'm going to the Valley Forge gun show tomorrow, and I'm wondering if I should put the Saiga on top of my impulse buy list. I'm not wasting $1000 though just because its a hot item. If you need to put work into a Saiga to make it run, you need to send it back and get another. Yes, some guns have come in with goofy gas ports, but it can be fixed or exchanged. Swapping out the traditional stock for pistol grip and other types is an ergonomic preference and aesthetics issue, not a reliability one. The biggest problem with an out of the box Saiga is the sights suck. But most shotguns come without decent sights unless you buy a top of the line model anyway. Remington autos are no less picky about ammo than Saigas in my experience. With Remingtons you have gas ports that are too small for light loads, but will function fin with buck and slug; or are big enough for light loads, but shooting buck and slug through the gun will beat itself apart eventually. At least the Saiga has the option for gas setting. For tube fed autos, get a Benelli M1, M2, M3 for the best reliability |
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Posted: 3/22/2009 12:56:34 PM EDT
[#39]
Some new Saiga-12 videos with drum and loading on a closed bolt:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xKhn9Gb01I http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8avx3xDhkOg |
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Posted: 3/22/2009 1:15:09 PM EDT
[#40]
Quoted:
The Saiga-12 has made shooting 3 gun much more fun for me, and I am much more competitive with one (regardless of the division I shoot in) with it than I have been with any other shotgun. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulBn-PVq-AQ They do have their quirks, but the speed advantage reloading 10 in the same time it takes an average shooter to reload 2 shells makes up for it. I thought about getting one, but instead I bought a Benelli M4, I heard about the reloading quirks and that's what turned me away from the Saiga. Although now that I look at it I too am a lefty and this could give me an advantage in reloading. |
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Posted: 3/24/2009 7:18:38 AM EDT
[#41]
Quoted:
The Saiga-12 has made shooting 3 gun much more fun for me, and I am much more competitive with one (regardless of the division I shoot in) with it than I have been with any other shotgun. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulBn-PVq-AQ They do have their quirks, but the speed advantage reloading 10 in the same time it takes an average shooter to reload 2 shells makes up for it. What mags are you using in that video? Seems like not one issues using them. I just ordered a S12 and I'm having it converted. I would like to get mags that work before I pick the S12 up in a few weeks.
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Posted: 3/24/2009 8:18:32 AM EDT
[#42]
Quoted:
I thought about getting one, but instead I bought a Benelli M4, I heard about the reloading quirks and that's what turned me away from the Saiga. Although now that I look at it I too am a lefty and this could give me an advantage in reloading. I don't lock the bolt open anymore. I wore one of the BHOs out and I later found they compromised reliability of the fire control parts by not allowing the hammer spring to fully expand to both sides of the receiver. The right leg of the hammer spring could shift over and cause the trigger to lock up and not reset. I load on a closed bolt now downloading my mags by one shell, it takes about half the time of locking the bolt open. Quoted:
What mags are you using in that video? Seems like not one issues using them. I just ordered a S12 and I'm having it converted. I would like to get mags that work before I pick the S12 up in a few weeks. AGP Arms, and you are right I don't have any issues with them |
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Posted: 3/28/2009 8:21:35 AM EDT
[#43]
Quoted:
Biggest POS ever!
So what is/was your experience with the S12? Obviously you make a pretty hard opinion of it so I ask how did you come to your most informative conclusion?  
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Posted: 3/28/2009 1:44:08 PM EDT
[#44]
More Saiga-12 action!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-yJg8WMsUaI]]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-yJg8WMsUaI |
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Posted: 3/28/2009 2:33:33 PM EDT
[#45]
Vid I did the conversion myself and tweaked it a bit inside as well as out. It eats EVERYTHING. From Wallmart Federal 2 3/4 #8 to 3" buckhammer and TAP buckshot. No other shotgun even comes close. Need hard evidence? Look at what the #1 shotgun for 3 gun is. |
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Posted: 3/28/2009 3:09:08 PM EDT
[#46]
Quoted:
Need hard evidence? Look at what the #1 shotgun for 3 gun is. The Saiga isn't yet...Benellis are still king around here. In open division where Saigas are legal, they are gaining ground. |
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Posted: 3/28/2009 7:02:33 PM EDT
[#47]
I like the S-12, I really do. But, I bought an S-20. Best $180 I ever spent!
I need one of those Ace folding stocks now. Not every one's cup of tea, but I like mine, and as long as I can get the Federal #2 buck loads, yes, I would use it for self defense. I would actually take my Benelli 12 before I reached for my Saiga, and probably an AR15, or even my old Mini-14, before a shotgun, but those are different arguements. I do wish that I had bought an S-12 while they were still cheap, as well as a 7.62x39 Saiga, when they were cheap. |
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