What do you think, Russian or Bulgarian?

Indonesian Mobile Brigade policemen with rifles listen to instructions at the Jakarta police headquarters on November 28, 2002. A Jakarta police spokesman said they will deploy some 15,000 personnel on Thursday in a bid to enhance security in the capital ahead of the Muslim festival Eid al-Fitr, Christmas and New Year celebrations. REUTERS/Dadang Tri

A voice in the back of my mid is telling me they are Chinese.

Looks like a mix of AK100 series.  You can see long barrels with the AK74 style break and short barrels with the Krink style break.  They all have black folded stocks which leads me to believe the AK100 series.  Dont know if they use 7.62x39 or 5.45x39.

According to the news services on the web, Indonesia has been buying a lot of Russian stuff these days.

The mags are too straight to be 7.62.  Must be either 5.56 NATO or 5.45 Russian.

Quoted: The mags are too straight to be 7.62.  Must be either 5.56 NATO or 5.45 Russian.

Good point.  Didnt see that you could see one of the mags.  You're right.

News searches rule:

December 4, 2000

Text of report in English by Russian news agency ITAR-TASS

Jakarta, 4th December: The Russian Rosvooruzheniye Company and Indonesia have signed a contract for the delivery of four thousand Russian Kalashnikov AK-101 and AK-102 submachine-guns of 5.56 mm NATO caliber. They are to be used by the Indonesian police, ITAR-TASS was told on Monday by Russian officials responsible for deliveries of weapons to foreign countries.

The Indonesian customers, they said, are also exploring the possibility of buying Russian armoured personnel carriers and multipurpose Mi-8 helicopters.

Received from Joyo Indonesian News

Yeah, I'd say Russian.

It's good that they went with AK-102s rather than .223 krinks.

I've got a buddy that has a .223 krink and I think it's a waste of a kit and reciever.


Out of a 9 inch barrel (standard krink length) a .223 projectile is not going nearly fast enough for fragmentation.  Fragmentation is the key to .223 wounding success.  Without fragmentation, the .223 just punches little icepic holes in the target.  The 14 inch M4 barrel barely gets the velocity up to 27,000 feet per second, the borderline for reliable fragmentation, and it is only good for about 150 yards. (That's why the guys in Afghanistan are griping about the effectiveness of the M4's at extended ranges).  The AK-102 (pictured above) has a barrel length of 12 inches.

5.45, on the other hand, does not rely on fragmentation for terminal wounding, but on the air pocket in the tip of the bullet.  When the 5.45 bullet hits flesh, the core of the bullet slides forward in the pocket due to inertia.  This destabilizes the bullet and it tumbles, causing effective wounding.

I personally wouldn't want a .223 with a barrel under 14 inches.  Does anyone know of a military unit that fields a .223 with a barrel shorter than 12"?

5.45 Krinks are quite common.