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Posted: 9/30/2004 4:30:00 AM EDT
[#1]
www.ak47.net/forums/topic.html?b=4&f=64&t=64215
No. after the first production unit is produced the rest of us are screwed! |
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Posted: 9/30/2004 6:03:31 AM EDT
[#2]
Since this maybe a prob. to do how hard is it to find a 5.56 kit and can you use the same rec. as the 7.62x39?
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Posted: 9/30/2004 8:24:04 AM EDT
[#3]
I think we be screwed, I beleive a few manufactures have made 5.45mm pistol receivers here recently. Does Wolf 5.45 have a steel core or is it lead? If it is lead it should not matter correct? |
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Posted: 9/30/2004 9:37:32 AM EDT
[#4]
AFAIK, Wolf uses lead cores as does Barnaul. I would think that a lead core bullet would preform better than a steel core bullet in tissue anyways. The only reason I would want steel is for better penetration on hard targets but for that I would suggest something a little heavier than 5.45. |
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Posted: 9/30/2004 2:04:54 PM EDT
[#5]
The point as I understand it, is there are some people that are going to import alot of russian surplus ammo that does have the steel plug. Making a pistol that has it, would get all that banned. Me personally, I'd rather have alot of cheap ammo. Build one in 5.56 and you'll be good to go.
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Posted: 9/30/2004 2:15:22 PM EDT
[#6]
do NOT make a 5.45 pistol!!!!!!!!!!!
the steel plug in the MILITARY 5.45 ammunition is NOT there for penetration. it is there to accellerate tumbling in tissue. do NOT build a 5.45 pistol! future import of military ammunition stores rests on this issue. |
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Posted: 9/30/2004 2:24:26 PM EDT
[#7]
Someone needs to send a letter to any potential manufacturers.
The good thing is that K-var, the main supplier for 5.45 krinkov kits, is aware of issue. |
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Posted: 9/30/2004 3:37:20 PM EDT
[#8]
www.ak47.net/forums/topic.html?b=4&f=64&t=64215 Read this first, and if you do it, we will find you............ |
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Posted: 9/30/2004 5:06:38 PM EDT
[#9]
Make a regular krikov pistol. The 7.62X39 isnt affected by veloicty as much as other rifle rounds. Plus, its just fun :D
AMD65 pistols are fun too |
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Posted: 9/30/2004 10:42:15 PM EDT
[#10]
EVERYONE ELES THANK YOU FOR THE INFO!! P.S. I PICKED UP 2 KITS TODAY A 5.45 KRINKOV KIT AND A 7.62X39 AK KIT |
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Posted: 9/30/2004 10:52:24 PM EDT
[#11]
Emotions are running pretty high over the possiblity of something screwing up the availablity of real Russian military grade 5.45mm, and building an AKSU-74 Pistol would DEFINITELY screw everything up.
Don't do it. Build one in 5.56mm or 7.62x39mm, they are already considered "pistol" cartridges. |
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Posted: 9/30/2004 11:00:48 PM EDT
[#12]
I thought that law only applied to cartridges with a bullet larger than .22?
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Posted: 9/30/2004 11:03:07 PM EDT
[#13]
ITS CALLED A SENSE OF HUMOR---TRY FINDING ONE OVER. |
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Posted: 9/30/2004 11:12:19 PM EDT
[#14]
I found no humor in his reply Thank you! If somone is seeking info here they should not feel threatend to do so!!
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Posted: 10/1/2004 2:43:01 AM EDT
[#15]
Oh god, not another "all mods are evil" person. Sorry that you have no sense of humor. Get a clue. If your ego is that easliy brusied, and you were truly intimidated by that, go play with toy guns instead. I think you are wound up a bit too tight, relax, take some prozac. |
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Posted: 10/1/2004 3:18:52 AM EDT
[#16]
Yes, sometimes the "gentlegiant" Obe doesn't recognize his own strength. Once a person meets him you have to get past his large physical stature, and gruff exterior and see the real inner gentleman. <humor off> Sorry but I didn't take his post as a threat in any context.... |
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Posted: 10/1/2004 3:40:15 AM EDT
[#17]
We have not produced any. We will not produce any. God knows we don't need any more BS laws to worry about! Mike |
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Posted: 10/1/2004 4:55:01 AM EDT
[#18]
 you know some asshole going to fu@k it up just because they can
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Posted: 10/1/2004 5:06:11 AM EDT
[#19]
lighten up dude, all he was try ing to point out was to not build it because we will all be screwed. |
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Posted: 10/1/2004 5:17:50 AM EDT
[#20]
yeah grow up, and people that type in all caps when they want to yell have a tiny penis
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Posted: 10/1/2004 8:36:47 AM EDT
[#21]
I once wondered why I didn't feel the need to use all caps.  Now I know.
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Posted: 10/1/2004 9:54:00 AM EDT
[#22]
DAMN!...er...i mean...damn!
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Posted: 10/1/2004 2:51:16 PM EDT
[#23]
like the saying goes "the truth hurts"
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Posted: 10/1/2004 3:14:20 PM EDT
[#24]
You guys do know that OOW has produced 5.45mm receivers registered as pistols right? If I remember corectly, someone here had bought one directly from them. I know of several people who have stated they were picking one up from them, registered as a pistol. The ATF does not give a damn about the parts kits, they care about the receivers which are the firearm. If OOW has registered them as pistols then, well to late. Is all this about a new Russian surplus ammo coming in because wolf HP is not Mil-surplus SC ammo. Just my $.02
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Posted: 10/1/2004 3:28:11 PM EDT
[#25]
YES. There has already been a limited amount of milsurp 5.45 imported... As combloc countries complete their switches over from 5.45 to 5.56 (for NATO compliance), or next time they rotate reserve stores, they will put the stores up for grabs on the civie market. |
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Posted: 10/1/2004 4:28:16 PM EDT
[#26]
gotcha  However the receivers are out there as we speak. Some people have been waiting for years to build them a 5.45mm AK pistol and now they are being told not to because of the Mil spec 5.45 issue. I think it will be very very hard to stop people from building the firearm of their choice after a 10 year ban. I think we are all pissin in the wind on this one. |
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Posted: 10/1/2004 4:38:41 PM EDT
[#27]
I guess this is like saying that if you build an AR pistol you can no longer buy Lake City or other MilSurp 5.56, and may only buy PMC, Maine, and Olympic- and not even SS109.
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Posted: 10/1/2004 4:40:30 PM EDT
[#28]
It doesn't matter anyhow.
The law says anything OVER .22 cal . The 5.45 is .221 ! If the law doesn't apply to .556 nato / .223 (which it doesn't) then it won't apply to the 5.45. Anyone bought .556 ss109 ammo lately ? It is legal. EDIT : Thank You Andreuha atleast SOMEONE is paying attention !!!!!! |
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Posted: 10/1/2004 5:26:18 PM EDT
[#29]
The reason SS-109 and M855 is still legal and available is that it doesn't have enough hardened steel in it to be affected by the ban. Dedicated AP 5.56mm is.
.221 is one thousanth OVER the .22 limit....so 5.45mm would be affected! |
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Posted: 10/1/2004 5:28:05 PM EDT
[#30]
OTOH a few people could fuck up the entire ammo supply due to their projects. History has proven that one, why do it again? Personally I don't see why the fuck anyone would want an AR/AK PISTOL. Makes no G-D sense to me, to each his own I suppose, but don't fuck everyone for YOUR benefit of having something "different". JMHO |
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Posted: 10/1/2004 5:29:01 PM EDT
[#31]
Thank you for common sense.. .22= .22000000 5,45= .221 ONE THOUSANDTH of an inch. |
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Posted: 10/1/2004 5:59:30 PM EDT
[#32]
Is it true that privately produced pistols won't have an effect, but only a production run offered by a manufacturer will lead to the ban on steel core 5.45?
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Posted: 10/1/2004 6:40:34 PM EDT
[#33]
Nope. Vague law. 7.62x39 w/ steel was banned as AP because of a documented PROTOTYPE AR-pistol. BTW, as to the SS109/M855 analogy, the reason SS109/M855 is still legal is because it's very mild steel in the specs. Russian ammo isn't like that, and I can assure you, that the day the ATF gets wind of 5.45 pistols, you can kiss any hopes of imported Milsurp 5.45 goodbye. |
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Posted: 10/1/2004 6:42:00 PM EDT
[#34]
How much of this steel core ammo is in country and how much is on the way or is all this just hear say?
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Posted: 10/1/2004 6:51:33 PM EDT
[#35]
Where is all of this Stell core ammo everyone is talking about??
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Posted: 10/1/2004 8:22:20 PM EDT
[#36]
Oh My !
The Chinese/EG/ Yugo 7.62 ammo has a MILD steel core. 5.45 steel core ammo is mild steel as well.(the normal military bullet) 5.45 AP has a HARDENED steel core. Two different birds. OK from Rec.guns FAQ : 4) CONSTRUCTION - The bullet must either have a core made ENTIRELY out of one or more of the listed metals, or be a full jacketed type bullet with a jacket comprising more that 25% of its weight. Thus SS109/M855 .223 (5.56mm) bullets would not be covered, because their core is only partly steel, and partly lead. Lead is not a listed metal, and bullets with cores made partly out of lead are OK. ATF has expressly ruled that SS109/M855 bullets are not covered. |
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Posted: 10/1/2004 9:29:27 PM EDT
[#37]
The reason ss-109 and steel core 30-06 has not been bannned is because it has proven to be more accurate than lead core when used in CMP matches etc. It has nothing to do with the amount of steel content. The director of the ATF was petetioned several years ago to release this ammo. The director of the ATF has the authority to exempt any round they see fit. There is a written letter on file stating such. I know of one major importer that has a contract on approx. 3 million rounds
of true Russian steel core surplus. He is waiting to see what people ar going to do. If he buys it and someone builds a 5.45 pistol he is stuck with it. He can't get his money back. There is also a bunch more 5.45 surplus out there. Hopefully it will drop the price closer to 7.62 x 39 mm. "Don't bite the hand that feeds you." Troy Sellars IN RANGE inc. |
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Posted: 10/1/2004 11:16:50 PM EDT
[#38]
First of all I Apologize if I got little worked up see I ran out of my meds yesterday and may have lost it a few times. Any way I was thinking since I live in a class 3 state maybe I will just make the F---ing thing into a short barrel rifle and be done with it. I realing love the looks of the AK74u and just thought it would be cool as a pistol.
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Posted: 10/1/2004 11:25:53 PM EDT
[#39]
The receivers are out there as we speak and we all know the ATF says the receiver is the firearm. The day OOW made and registered the receivers as pistols was they day that a 5.45mm pistols was made according to ATF logic. It's not if someone builds it, it was built the day OOW registered it as a pistol.
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Posted: 10/2/2004 12:30:48 AM EDT
[#40]
That is unless the guns are never sold to the public. Personaly I think the AFT should just ban god damn 5.45 as a pistol round, thus solving our problem. I would support something stating what exactly is a "pistol round" becuase in my eyes 7.62X39, .223 and 5.45x39 are not pistol rounds. Personaly, to make life easy any firearm that does not have the magazine in the handel should not be a pistol...
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Posted: 10/2/2004 2:38:59 AM EDT
[#41]
"Personaly I think the AFT should just ban god damn 5.45 as a pistol round, thus solving our problem. I would support something stating what exactly is a "pistol round" becuase in my eyes 7.62X39, .223 and 5.45x39 are not pistol rounds. Personaly, to make life easy any firearm that does not have the magazine in the handel should not be a pistol... "
TO put it bluntly FUCK THAT If they want to ban steel cored ammo because someone makes a 5.45 pistol , that is far sight better than getting into another assine AWB (or in this case Assault Pistol). E Gads! |
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