If I bought a KAC SR-15, and then put a SIR on it, would that be just wrong on too many levels???

You are so wrong...

Hey, if adding more weight to your AR is what you’re into, go for it! [:D]

Gee, how long before Jack/3rdtk chimes in. LOL

Is this cat (3rdtk) the king of all shells or what. LOL.  BTW, why doesn’t the Administration here require him to disclose that he works for ARMS (in his tag line) since he answers EVERY/AND ALL posts related to ARMS in the matter of minutes??? LOL

Sorry, just could not resist. [;D]

Why mess up a nice rifle?

I'll skip my normal rant in regards to folks finding an AR heavy.

So far though, looks like I may just have to do it. [:D]

Yea that’s right, this is AR-15.com. Don't let the facts get in the way. [:D]

Which one were you thinking about getting, M4, M5, or the match rifle?

Steve.

[b]OUCH[/b] [slap]

Just out of curiosity, why would you want to do this?

[size=3][b]HAH!!![/b][/size=3]

You're the best.

Go for it.

/S2

Do what M4arc? Tell the truth? Speak my mind? Go against the grain (Clique).

To ask that question speaks volumes about the general consensus (mind set) here.

All I can say is: Pay attention, and think freely. [:D]

It would be totally right IMHO!

Go for it Hawkeye.

Uhm... I'm not looking to flame anyone but when M4arc said...



I think he was asking why Hawkeye would want to put a SIR on a KAC-15, not why you'd want to speak freely etc, etc.

/S2

Ohhh, if you were paying attention you would have noticed that he quoted me, as I am now quoting you! But hey, this is AR-15.com LOL


Perhaps I should include some history.

This morning I was browsing this site.

Every and I mean EVERY post concerning ARMS SIR's were quickly answered and all non-favorable comments (such as how the SIR is one of the heaviest rail systems) were quickly spun by Jack (3rdk)!

Now this in it's self is no big deal and actually beneficial since we all have our own options and should speak them freely (thank God)

But since Jack is an ARM's employee (and has a vested interest, with NO tag line to indicate the fact that he in fact works for ARMS) kind of puts a different twist on things.

At least SULACO2 usually indicates his affiliation.

Are we 100% "Jack" is Dick?

I am not.

Simmer down, let's all take a deap breath and count backwards from ten: 10, 9, 8...forget it [;)]

AKM - What making light of your comment because I assumed you are just playing around like you did this morning with 3rdtk (yes I saw your post earlier).  I just wanted to lighten things up a bit because these types of post/threads can turn ugly in a big hurry.  I should have put a [;)] face in there so everyone would know I was playing around.  My bad.

As for the SIR it would seem like a waste of time and money to buy a SR-15, remove the RAS and install a SIR.  But that's me and I asked Hawkeye why he would want to do this for my own curiousity.  Like what would be the advantages of this swap?

Hawkeye is a big boy and can do whatever he wants and spend his money however he wants and I'm not making any sort of judgement.  I'm just trying to figure out why he wants to do this.  That's all folks!

Oh yeah, [;)]

SULACO2 - What is your affiliation?

How come every time a SIR question is asked, the Jack is Dick thing pops up? WTF, the man hasn't even posted here yet. Why don't people get off Jack's dick.

Steve.

[ROFL2]  Very creative!

[;)]

....and you would have noticed his post said OUCH! in response to your post.   Before he asked "why would you want to do this"?  which was aimed at Hawkeye.  If you were paying attention[;)]

Why take off a perfectly good RAS?

[devil]

[size=3][b]HeeHee!![/b][size=3]  This is good!!

M4- I dunno what my affiliation is, I think they call it try-sexual, I'll try [i][u]almost[/u][/i] anything, once.  [i][u]Almost[/u][/i].[:D]
[;)]
I'm sure as hell no ARMS employee that's for sure, believe you me you'd know.  But I am definitely more familiar w/ ARMS stuff than KAC's and my "expertise" ends there.  Unfortunately.

AKM- I know M4arc qouted you, but I understood the quote pertained only to the "ouch", in good fun, 'cause you did have a pretty good one, and, the question part of M4arc's post to be directed toward Hawkeye.  
I figured you didn't realize that, so's I was trying to clear it up.

Oh and Hawk?  Sorry for hijacking your thread man.

/S2

It's your money and toy, do as you wish!  But sell me the FF RAS if you proceed [:d]

Why not just order that SR-15 with the URX installed from Excaliburarms?
http://www.biggerhammer.net/stoner/wwwboard/index.cgi?read=4581
Then you will truly be hated by everyone!!

Cheers

Or if you really wanted to [:(] [:(!] [>(] everyone off, you can buy the URX and then get that #38MOD that extends from the receiver rail out onto the RIS/RAS.  And for a grand finale, argue it doesn't add unnecessary weight and/or raise optic ht. unnecessarily!! [;)][;D][}:D]

I have spoken highly of a lot of producs as my preferance. Those include the same very ones that many others here also totaly endorse, more frequently than I,  but that doesn't mean that I or they work for that company. If you really know and understand a product and the reasons for it's development and what it accomplishes over others, then that is contributing to the forum. I comment on Colt being the original, the one that the others try to copy to an extent, the brand that got us thru many conflicts, the brand that meets military specifications totaly due to gov't requirerments that the others don't even know about. Others, other than FNMI make only a copy, and some copy's are bettr than others, but still make beleive copies, not authentic, guranteed will not pass gov't inspection, yes sometimes cheaper, but they didn't take a prototype and put it into mass production 35 years ago like COLT did.
Aimpoint is know doubt proven to be the best for many reasons, at least for military needs, which I have said time and again. I don't give a rats ass if it has throw levers or not, as someone who started all this horse manure previously rediculasly tried to indicate. What the hell does that have to do with the Eotechs poor batterie life, inability to withstand the pounding that the Aimpoint does, won't work behind the PVS-18 and 14's, etc.? The fact that the Aimpoint is standard thru out the military with few exceptions, by choice and not being replaced in any program says a lot. The eotech is fine for many things and some units have tried them, but they end up getting Aimpoints sooner or latter, usually sooner, for more reasons that will be known as more reports come in and released.
There (was) a whole lot of denials on here about how mounting rails that attach to the gun barrel are just fine, well that has proven not to be the case. The MD/NS program for spec ops is the first to recognise that fact, and shows they don't want anything but Free Float hand guard rails. Who was the companie that was the proponent and that had the first military free float system, that took the grenade launcher amoungst other things, ARMS, starting in 1999 with their SIR system. Their #40 was also somewhere in about that time frame. It is interesting how fast some people forget who did the R&D to the original design concepts like a free float rail, opposed to screwing up the barrel with over heated weapons via barrel mounting. Instead, real advanced R&D leaders take the time and their monies to develope programs that provide better weapons for our troops. I like the SIR, because it is the only one that proved we had to go free float, that it should only need to have rails where we needed them, didn't need to cover hot rails where are hands go since it was not a system that is totaly surounded by alum that attacts heat like a magnet, took wt. and stess off the barrel etc. There are a lot of new and great products out there that I like and even more that I don't care either way, not because of money anymore than most of those on here care, except how much will it cost me for what I get, not what do I get for saying I like it. I get nothing for saying I like anything, period! Finely, I'd say a SIR would compliment any good weapon, and I have complimented the KAC SR-15 several times if anyone cares to check it out.
Jack    
 

I like Aimpoints too but I hate to say that EOTECH is gaining ground in the Military more and more all the time.  Most HS Army units use them over the Swedish sight nowadays.  Since when won't it work with the 18 or 14?  Aipoint is standard through the Military because it was the next in line.  Something else will be sooner or later.  It was the reflex before that.  The battery issue is an issue for logistics only IMO.

Nyah, I think the real amusing part would be asking KAC if they could install the SIR when you ordered the gun. :)

[img]http://www.eotech-inc.com/images/aimpoint_view.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.eotech-inc.com/images/HWS_view.jpg[/img]
Aimpoint on the left, Eotech on the right ... the advantage is clearly Eotech.

[i][b]* These photographs are not altered. Both images were taken through an ITT AN/PVS-14 Night Vision Scope mounted 2” behind the optic. The camera was an equal distance from the PVS-14.[/i][/b]

I Have seen this photo on here before, but what weapon rail set up was it on? There is a rail real estate issue, amongst other things,  with the Eotech being too long to allow the PEQ-2 to fit on the top all three devices at the same time, plus the rear folding iron. Side mounting the laser is not always the choice. Side shot pics of the set two optic ups, and PVS-14 would be interesting to see.
Jack

First, let me say to Hawkeye:  The SR15 doesn't even have a chrome lined barrel, so I wouldn't even look at it.  If you already have the rifle, then sure, do what you want.  I personally don't feel its worth it.  Either sell the barrel and get a Bushy or Colt barrrel or build up a new upper with the SIR and slip it on.  If you just want a SIR on something with the KAC logo, the only people who will be shocked are the KAC nerds.  I happen to be a KAC geek myself, but I wouldn't be flustered by it.  I like the SIR.  I prefer and love the RAS products from Knight's, but I like the SIR.  It has a unique look to it.   All in all do what you want, its your gear.  Have fun!



I have to say, I have to call BS on this whole portion of your statement.  Poor battery life.  that is a relative term  3-500 hours of battery life on a couple of AAs is far from being poor.  Compared to an Aimpont, it has much less battery life, but I wouldn't call it poor.

I beleive SMGLee had some pics awhile back that proved the EOTech more than stands up to a pounding.  Some units were field tested by some high speed guys in the sandbox and came back perfect.  Well, covered in sand, but they were still perfectly functional if not clean.

The pics above dicount your statement about NV use.  As far as standard issue.  it takes a lot of time to get something new implemented above a single unit level.  The M68 is already in the pipe and works as it should.  That by no means says the EOTech is inferior in any significant way.

What units that used the EOTech switched to the Aimpoints?  More importantly, why?  Give us evidence of this.  you always tell us to go looking, but never point us towards where.  From what I have seen and heard, the units who used the EOTech liekd them very much.  A handful of individuals may have gone back to aimpoints due to personal preference (or maybe they were using a #45 or #46 SIR and had to switch optics to cowitness), but I have never heard of the EOTech failing to perform or being subpar.  That's what I have found whenever I go looking for info on the EOTech.  

The only thing I feel the EOTech is not superior to the Aimpoint is the battery life.  However, any unit that is able to supply EOTech's to the unit as a whole would take this into account and provide the necessary bateries.  This may not be ideal for the Big Army, so they stick with the issued Aimpoint.  However, to say that the aimpoint is ideal for every person in the armed forces discounts the advantages you get when you do switch to an EOTech.



P.S. I know it seems as if I have been hounding 3rdtk for the past couple of days, but i have smelled an inordinate amount of BS in his recent posts.  Maybe it is the less knowledgeable of the trio that has been posting because the other guys have been away for the holidays, but there has been a lot of crap slung by them/him/her lately.  

I have appreciated a lot of the information 3rdtk has spread in the past.  I have waded past all the ARMS worshipping and gotten to the heart of 3rd's posts.  Hoewever, with the plain disinformation of the EOTech's performance and blaming TangoDown for their grip not fitting on the SIR, well...

3rdtk, I apologize if you feel I'm being an a-hole to you lately, but I call BS when I see and smell it.  The same as you have tried to do here as well.  

I think a midlength URX might solve the real estate issue.  [;D]

IF IF IF, doesn't count to people that have weapons in combat now that they have certain equipment to mount.

I have given facts that may not be popular with certain folk, but hey, that doesn't change the facts, and time will show again that I'm right on the money reporting what I see.
Jack

I have deleted 2 posts that I took forever typing. Just cant seem to find the right way to say what I want.

I honestly did have this as an idea, but also thought maybe some guys might get a smile out of it. I see in some areas I was wrong. This one got [toilet].

Knightone, I wasnt thinking about KAC not having chromed barrels. Thanks for the reminder, as that is a must have with me. As you said, I like both KAC and ARM's stuff. I have a HARD time deciding which route to go. Both are top notch.

Hawkeye, don't worry one little bit as you did and always do just great.
Good shootin, Jack

I don't think you were wrong.  You can't be wrong because it's your time and money and no one can tell you how to use it, except your wife [;)]

BUT, what were your reasons for doing this little project?

I don't go to the Optics forum here very much, so never see it mentioned, but for myself I ditched the Holosight (Bushnell, made by Eotech) because when I don't have my glasses on, the HUD washes out totally and I have a field of red. Perhaps it's just the way my eyes work, but no other scope does it.



At least no one has accused him of working for Aimpoint yet! :)

The idea that someone who staunchly defends their personal choice is automatically an employee of the company in question means Glock must have quite a few employee's... :)

I was wrong because I THOUGHT that some folks might find it an intersting, and yet crazy idea both at the same time.

Reasons were, I really like what I have seen and read concerning KAC rifles. For my next project, I was honestly thinking of using a KAC rifle.

The URX rifles will have chrome lined barrels, though.  It would be a PITA to remove the URX, so you could swap the URX onto another lower and put a SIR equipped upper onto the Knight's lower if you would be so inclined.  

Once again I'll say that I don't think you were wrong.  A few of us here did find it interesting (or should I say intriguing?) YET crazy at the same time [;)]

Now a URX II would NOT be something I would want to remove for ANY reason. [;)]

That I am glad for. [:D]

Phew! I thought we had lost you for a moment

YEP, there a SOB to get on and or off:)

There was a question and comment portion of this thread regarding compatibility of the Eotech and the PVS 14. I use these configurations constantly and the function is perfect.

Regarding the comment on their not being enough room on the RAS for the laser option this is true...On the top rail.  I configure my RAS set up now with the laser on the side of the RAS and have since moved the Eotech fully forward onto the RAS itself.

It's pic'd and discussed in this thread here.  [url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=18&t=177072[/url]

Would you necessarily need a laser designator if you had an EOTech to use?  It would seem to be redundant.

Of course you do! That way you can stay in the fight, even after your EOTech batteries die. [devil][peep]

What do you do if your PAQ4 batts die roo?

Fix bayonet, and yell [b]BONZAI!!!!!!!!!![/b]??

DAM FUNNY! [:D]