User Panel
Posted: 10/9/2006 5:30:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Molon]
Marksman's Challenge
One of the many interesting topics that were posted on The Maryland AR15 Shooters Site was the Marksman’s Challenge. The course of fire for this challenge is to fire 20 shots from an AR-15 on an M16A2 25 meter zeroing target (which simulates a 300 meter target) within a time limit of two minutes and then post your score. Shooting can also be done from 25 yards using a similar scaled down target. Attached File Shooting may be done from any position including shooting from a bench. However, no part of the rifle may rest on anything other than your hands and shoulder; no sandbags, bi-pods, mechanical rests or using the magazine as a mono-pod. Slings and shooting coats are allowed. Also, only non-magnified sights may be used; i.e. iron sights, “red-dot” or “reflex” type sights. Any shot breaking the black outline is a hit. Any shot breaking the dashed circle counts as an X. A perfect score would be 20/20-20X. I decided to give the Marksman's Challenge a try using a free-floated 20” Colt HBAR with a NATO chamber and chrome lining. Shooting was done with elbows resting on a bench at 25 yards using a sling and shooting coat. I used an Aimpoint ML3 with a 2 MOA dot for sighting. Ammunition used was hand-loaded 52 grain Sierra MatchKings. Pics of my best targets from today's shooting session are shown below. (I actually imposed a 1 minute time limit on myself for the 20-shot strings in this run.) Attached File Attached File I’ve included links to pdf files of 25 meter and 25 yard targets that you can download and print yourself so you can give the Marksman's Challenge a try and post your results. Remember to include the barrel, sight, ammunition and position information in your post. 25 Yard Targets 25 Meter Targets Here's a pic of the rifle I used for today's Marksman's Challenge. Attached File .... 50 Yard Target For those of you using the Improved Battlesight Zero, I've scaled the E2 target for 50 yards. Use the link below to download the .pdf file of the target and print it for yourself. Give the Marksman's Challenge a try from 50 yards using this target and post your results! 50 Yards Targets Attached File Here is a refresher of the rules for the The Maryland AR15 Shooters Site Marksman’s Challenge. The concept is to fire 20 shots on an M16A2 25 meter zeroing target (which simulates a 300 meter target) within a time limit of two minutes and then post your score. Shooting can also be done from 25 yards using a similar scaled down target and now from 50 yards with the newly scaled target. Shooting may be done from any position including shooting from a bench. However, no part of the rifle may rest on anything other than your hands; no sandbags, bi-pods, mechanical rests or using the magazine as a mono-pod. Slings and shooting coats are allowed. Also, only non-magnified sights may be used; i.e. iron sights, “red-dot” or “reflex” type sights. Any shot breaking the black outline is a hit. Any shot breaking the dashed circle counts as an X. A perfect score would be 20/20-20X. Remember to include the barrel, sight, ammunition and position information when you post your results. .... |
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she's a tack driver...man good shooting
always wanted to do that test....have had the targets printed off for months now...one day.... lol |
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Nice gear and excellent results!
I'm curious who made your coat and what you think of it? I've recently shot a high-power match and discovered that I missing a couple of essential pieces of gear. |
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Ad Astra Per Aspera - To The Stars Through Adversity
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Nice Job! Clearly I'm going to have come up with a tougher challenge for you. Set up the 25y targets at 50y then report back!
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Visit www.MD-AR15.com
"All Arfcommers should wear thier multicam smoking jackets or jammies around the house in anticipation of JBT tasering/dog shooting/civil rights violation or the occasional impromptu gangbanger street theater." - m24sh |
Nice shooting! Not to take away from your skills but those scores are one reason I have started to reload. Hard to imagine shooting that well with standard ammo and I am too cheap to buy match ammo.
Seydou |
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Speak now and forever hold your piece.
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It's a Creedmoor, the gold standard. It's hard to imagine anything better for the price. |
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I'm going to have to give these a shot this weekend.
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tag
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This isn't a democracy, it's a cheerocracy !
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i'll try this tomorrow morning, and post back
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hell I cant see that target at 25 yards.....
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Follow Me!
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Nice shooting! Thanks for the target printouts. |
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Damn... I gotta try this.
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"I have had it with these motherfuckin' snakes on this motherfuckin' plane!"
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try it ..
Standing unsupported Kneeling sitting prone unsupported / Supported Not spectacular 25yd/M groups IMOP, esp using a DOT. 2 min is a loooooong time, 50 sec is still one shot every 2.5 seconds. |
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That's Damn good shooting. 60 rounds, accurate and repeatable, damn fine.
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Semper Fidelis
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You got to get them to walk before they can run. |
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Visit www.MD-AR15.com
"All Arfcommers should wear thier multicam smoking jackets or jammies around the house in anticipation of JBT tasering/dog shooting/civil rights violation or the occasional impromptu gangbanger street theater." - m24sh |
Err... the target used at 25 yd simulates a standard human target at 300m. Three hundred meters last time I checked is a "good distance" to practice at. The Marines qual at 500m and that pushes the envelope of their M16s and M855. |
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Really? I would never have guessed that. The circle on the target is rougly 6moa. If you can do that for at least 38 out of 40 rounds in 2 minutes you've pretty much met the criteria for 'Expert Rifleman' in the US Army. It's a good starting goal using 'off the rack' rifles & ammo, many just take their rifle out and blast away being satisfied if they can hit a 16" target at 25-50 yards. |
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Visit www.MD-AR15.com
"All Arfcommers should wear thier multicam smoking jackets or jammies around the house in anticipation of JBT tasering/dog shooting/civil rights violation or the occasional impromptu gangbanger street theater." - m24sh |
I don't think I have ever really been able to group that well with an AR15. I think it is really impressive shooting - so you get my kudos for what they are worth.
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Molon,
Thanks for sharing! I downloaded those targets and I'm eager to see how I stack up. I shoot service rifle across the course and rattle battle so it should be interesting to see the correlation between this reduced version and real life shooting distance 200, 300, 500 and 600 yards. Harp |
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Sorry, I meant my comment for Harv. |
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i got some of the alt-c targets, those are real fun too. or the 200, 300, 600 highpower targets reduced for 100.
heres the alt-c www.letargets.com/html/military.html |
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real men shoot bull barrels. its all about the girth.
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Molon, Based on Forest's response it looks like you are holding to around 3 MOA. Do you think your chrome lined HBAR/ammo combo would still hold 3 MOA at 300m? |
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You must be really insecure if you have to talk about your penis size in a technical thread regarding the marksman's challenge. No one is interested in your useless and unsupported comments. |
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To all who paid compliments, I say thank you.
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As JER stated in his reply , the coat is from Creedmoor. They definitely have the finest coats I have come across. You send them your measurements when you order the coat and it arrives several weeks later fitting like a glove. One of their leather coats is on my Christmas list. Molon |
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This is exactly the kind of response I was hoping to see. Be sure to post results. Thanks for replying, Molon |
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My free-floated Colt HABRs are capable of much better accuracy than 3 MOA. From a rest at 100 yards, 10-shot groups using hand-loaded 77 grain Sierra MatchKings hover right around 1 MOA. (See this thread for supporting data.) I have not had an opportunity to shoot this rifle at 300 yards, but I think maintaining 3 MOA accuracy at that distance would be far more dependent upon me the shooter than this rifle and ammo. Molon |
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Another yellow glass shooter here, who will try to shoot these targets after the carbine shoot this weekend. I feel it might be too easy with my NM A2, coat, and NM M1907 sling, so I'm going to shoot it prone with my LMT carbine using nothing but a Vickers sling for support. I'll use a mat if the firing line is concrete, if not, I'll just plop on the ground. No match handloads either, just Guatemalan ball. Sights: MI BUIS and F-base GI front. |
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Great! Be sure to post pics. |
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I'm doubting your 53 grain Matchkings would hold 3 MOA at that range unless conditions were pretty good. Heavier match stuff, that's a different animal. |
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Thanks for the targets
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You're welcome! |
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Again, impressed.
I am wondering if you could come up with rules requiring an "unsupported" standing position. The reason why I say this is that over the past year or so since I got back into shooting after years of nothing, I have gravitated more and more to shooting at 25-50 yards in a freestanding position using iron sights. I feel like this sort of shooting (for me) tends to enhance my practical accuracy as opposed to shooting with a sling prone or shooting from a bench. Problem is the targets as printed are going to be too darn small for me because I am just not that good!!! I love the challenge, but with three young children I don't have enough range time to improve. Not trying to blow smoke, but not only are you a pretty good marksman, but I found your 5 v. 10 shot groups post to be one of the most interesting and informative posts I have read on this board. Honestly thanks for your time and effort in posting this stuff. |
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Molan,
Nice shooting and thanks for taking the time to post this up. Question, have you fired these same strings, in similar conditions with off the shelf or mil surp ammo? I would very curious to see the results of that. SC |
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Never be afraid of a GOOD DUPE!!!
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these Colts, 1:9 or 1:7 ?? |
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what would Goldwater think ?
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No, I haven't, but that is a good suggestion. I have a stash of IMI M193 that would make for a good comparison. If I get some spare time next week, I'll give it a try. Molon |
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<IMG SRC=/images/smilies/anim_sniper2.gif border=0 align=middle>
Quote from HOKIE Chuck Norris named his cat 'MacGyver.' Why? Because He's a pussy كافر |
+1 But I still want to try it out. I like to try different things at the 'range' (private limestone quarry that I got the exclusives on ) |
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Dont forget to post your results! |
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Run #3
For my third run of the The Maryland AR15 Shooters Site Marksman’s Challenge I decided to follow SamColt's suggestion and use some military grade ammunition; IMI M193. The equipment used for this run was the same as used in my first run: + 20" free-floated Colt HBAR with NATO chamber and chrome lining + Aimpoint ML3 + shooting coat and sling, shooting with elbows resting on a bench at 25 yards. The results of this run are pictured below. Here is a pic of the target from this run next to a target from my first run for comparison. Be sure to note the time differences between the two runs as this is not exactly an apples to apples comparison. For my first run of the Marksman's Challenge I imposed a 1 minute time limit on myself instead of the 2 minute time limit just to "make it sporting." |
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