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Posted: 10/9/2004 4:34:33 PM EDT
[#1]
There's a small C or E clip that fits into a groove about 3/16" from the front of the pin. This keeps the rod from moving backwards and the barrel nut/delta ring keeps it from moving forwards.
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Posted: 10/9/2004 4:35:00 PM EDT
[#2]
There should be a very small cir clip or retaining ring around the end of the port cover pin up by the front of the ejection port. This keeps the whole assy from walking aft.
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Posted: 10/9/2004 4:43:21 PM EDT
[#3]
Ah ha ha! Maybe I see my "problem." I have daniel defense 9.0 forend on my midlength. The front of the ejection port cover rod contacts.... nothing! It could easily go forward far enough to come out before it would come into contact with anything else.
Is this a design flaw with this forend or am I missing something? edited to add: I do have the retaining ring to the front of the ejection port cover rod (that is, the end closest to the muzzle) but this retaining ring only prevents the rod from going to the rear too far, not from going forward too far. |
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Posted: 10/9/2004 4:53:47 PM EDT
[#4]
The rod should not be able to move toward the shooter because the C clip keeps it from doing so.
The rod should not be able to move toward the muzzle because it's stopped from that movement by the back of the delta ring/barrel nut. You might need to have the rod modded slightly. Have a gunsmith/machinist machine a SECOND groove in it, at the other end of the rod, and use a C clip on BOTH sides of it. That'll hold it for sure no matter what your rifle's configuration is. You might even be able to do the grooving yourself if you have a Dremel tool with a cutoff wheel, and some skill and patience. CJ |
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Posted: 10/9/2004 4:59:19 PM EDT
[#5]
I'd love to see a picture of this.
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Posted: 10/9/2004 5:09:07 PM EDT
[#6]
Hal9K, are you wishing to see a picture of my rifle with it's problem or the proposed solution with an additional C clip on the rear part of the rod?
As for my issue, what's happening is that the "delta ring" on my DD 9.0 isn't a delta ring at all of course. I have no idea what these parts would be called on the DD foreend, but if you have a DD 9.0 foreend you might see that there is an "outer ring' and an "inner ring." Between the two there are a ring of holes. My ejection port rod slips right over the inner ring which I believe it is supposed to contact, thus retaining the ejection port rod. I realize my description is impossible to visualize unless you have the DD foreend, but that's the best i can word it. |
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Posted: 10/9/2004 6:39:26 PM EDT
[#7]
Now I want to see a picture 'cause I can't picture what you just described!
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Posted: 10/9/2004 6:51:33 PM EDT
[#8]
I look at my M4gery, which has a DD 7.0 on it and I think I can see what you are talking about, BUT my ejection port cover rod hits a part of the barrel nut, the ledge with all the copper anti-seize on it (gotta clean that crap off
 ), so that it cannot move into the hole in the barrel nut. Differences in tolerances of all of your parts must allow just enough clearance for the rod to clear the barrel nut ledge and move forward into the barrel nut. See pic below: |
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Posted: 10/9/2004 7:55:10 PM EDT
[#9]
Mono001 hit it on the nose. His picture and description depicts exactly what is happening. The rod slip right over the ledge and into the barrel nut as it pleases.
What should i do to resolve this? |
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Posted: 10/9/2004 8:44:18 PM EDT
[#10]
They might have to change the design a bit to accomodate the tolerances differences between manufactures. Both of mine the barrel nut are not recessed too far in to not retain the ejection port door pin.
Here is my RRA upper with YHM handguard:  And Bushmaster A3: 
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Posted: 10/10/2004 5:02:20 AM EDT
[#11]
Plug the hole in the barrel nut.
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Posted: 10/10/2004 5:21:58 AM EDT
[#12]
The hole would not be the problem, the ledge needs to hold it back correct? |
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Posted: 10/10/2004 5:24:30 AM EDT
[#13]
That seems correct DM1975.
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Posted: 10/10/2004 5:26:10 AM EDT
[#14]
 Just wanted to clarify...Also, the rod isnt bent at the tip any is it? |
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Posted: 10/10/2004 5:38:51 AM EDT
[#15]
Now that your problem has been made perfectly clear, I suggest that the simplest cure for it is to groove the rod on the other end and install another C clip on it. I could do it with a cordless drill and hacksaw blade with a thin kerf in five minutes.
CJ |
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Posted: 10/10/2004 5:44:15 AM EDT
[#16]
I don't know how hard the steel is that the pin is made of, but you could try flaring the aft end of the pin with a hammer then touch up with cold blue. Looking at my M4gery there is not much pin sticking out to cut a slot for another cir clip. You might be able to cut a new slot farther up front on the pin allowing it to sit farther back, then cut a slot for a clip on the aft end. If you chuck the pin in a drill and have a small file you may be able to make a nice clean cut.
Just some off the top ideas. Edited to add: I like cmjohnson's drill/saw blade idea, didn't even see that before I posted my drill/file idea! |
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Posted: 10/10/2004 5:52:22 AM EDT
[#17]
Rod doesn't look bent any. That would certainly screw things up if it was bent away from the ledge.
As for the idea of another C-clip, that section of the rod is really short. I think you'd have to redo both ends as one of the other posters mentioned. As for the idea of bending the end of the rod down so it hits the ledge, the problem as i see it would be that if the rod spins, then the flare down would become a flare up and just go past the ledge again. I really need an ever so bigger ledge. If I could do something to build it up just a little bit where the rod is supposed to hit then it would be fine. Thanks for all the suggestions. |
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Posted: 10/10/2004 8:06:28 AM EDT
[#18]
What I mean by "flaring" is not to bend the tip down but to beat it out flat with a hammer, widening the tip so it dosent walk forward. If you have a bench vise, and the pin is not too hard, you could lay the very tip of the pin on the edge of the vise. Hitting the tip a couple of times with a hammer would flare the tip out making it wider than the hole in the receiver that it pivots in keeping it from walking out.
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Posted: 10/10/2004 8:13:17 AM EDT
[#19]
QUIB, ok i get it now.
Would I be able to install the rod once it's been flared on the end? Doesn't the rod go through the ejection port cover holes from the rear requiring the flared end to be pushed through a hole? |
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Posted: 10/10/2004 8:35:18 AM EDT
[#20]
Unless you remove the barrel. I think this is a problem with the design of the Barrel nut. |
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Posted: 10/10/2004 10:58:56 AM EDT
[#21]
You have a rod that is walking forward during firing. It is slipping past your FF's "delta ring" or "nut" up front and falling out of the rear pivot point. You stated before that the cir clip up front is present, so, you remove the cir clip and pull out the rod, removing the spring and door. Flare the aft end of the rod like I mentioned above. Re-assemble the spring and door on the rod as you slide it up from the rear mount. Re-install the clip! This way the flared portion of the rod keeps the rod from walking forward and the cir clip keeps the rod from walking aft! That is one option. The second would be the other method cmjohnson and I mentioned. Remove the rod. Install it in a drill. Using a small file or as cmjohnson stated, a hack saw blade, turn the rod as you machine a new groove in the aft portion of the rod. Now insert the rod in the upper, mark where you need to make a new groove in the forward end and repeat. If get close enough with your aft groove you may be lucky enough to be able to reuse your factory forward groove. Only draw back to this method is you need to order a second cir clip, unless you have spare parts laying around. Hope this helps. |
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Posted: 10/10/2004 12:15:16 PM EDT
[#22]
QUIB, thanks for the detailed explanation. I think you dumbed it down enough for me to be able to visualize. I was a bit turned around on which end was going in first.
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Posted: 10/10/2004 1:49:31 PM EDT
[#23]
What, had you installed the pin from the wrong direction?
The pin goes in BEFORE the barrel is put on the upper, and the clip is nearest the barrel. That is, if you don't want to fiddle with trying to install the clip afterwards, which is a bit tricky. If the barrel isn't on the upper at the time, it's easy to just put the pin in with the clip already attached. More than one person has installed it the wrong way. CJ |
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Posted: 10/10/2004 2:35:18 PM EDT
[#24]
I definitely installed everything with the barrel firmly attached. Since I have a DD 9.0 on there and I am no gunsmith, I didn't even consider removing the barrel. I can see that it would obviously be easier for me to install the this with the barrel removed, but that is beyond my current skill level. C clip is attached on the end closest to the barrel though.
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Posted: 10/10/2004 5:15:48 PM EDT
[#25]
You've probably figured out by now that on a conventional setup (as in, stock A1 or A2 setup), you couldn't install the pin from the muzzle end at all. Your setup apparently allows this, which is interesting and noteworthy.
CJ |
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Posted: 10/18/2004 11:37:33 AM EDT
[#26]
Was the little clip always in front - forward of the ejector port? I'm pretty sure it was installed correctly. I think you ended up with a barrel nut that is a cunt hair too slim to act as a stop for the rod. The easy thing to do is remove the rod buy unhooking the c clip and pulling it out toward the rear of the receiver. Put the rod in a vice and smash the end (away from the c clip) flat so it wont go through the hole any more. That or send it back, and I'll have DD send me a new barrel nut..... |
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Posted: 10/18/2004 12:09:46 PM EDT
[#27]
I just glued(loctite 262) mine to see if it would hold. I pushed it forward, and put a drop where it goes through the hole in the front, and pushed it back in place. I'll let you know if it holds in a bit.....
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Posted: 10/18/2004 1:07:25 PM EDT
[#28]
I'm definitely most interested in the loc-tite solution. I don't really have the setup to do the whole "vice smash" trick. thanks for the help.
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Posted: 10/18/2004 1:22:37 PM EDT
[#29]
loc-tite worked like champ....
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Posted: 10/18/2004 1:25:27 PM EDT
[#30]
Will give it a shot and then I'll have to test it to see if it stays together when shooting. Thanks.
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Posted: 10/18/2004 1:30:11 PM EDT
[#31]
Use 262, spin it around in there, and let it sit about an hour. I also washed out the contact areas with alcohol first. |
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