I've seen posts here asking things such as, "What will you do to your AR-15 after the AWB Sunset," and "Can't wait... xxx days and counting."

I just received my Eagle Arms lower from Quantico Arms (which, by the way, looks fantastic).  I thought of waiting until the "AWB Sunset" to buy a parts kit, hoping that at that time I'll be able to have a true A2 muzzle device, etc.  However, to be honest, I'm not convinced the AWB will sunset, and I"m purchasing my parts now.

If you go to the following website, you will find downloadable PDF files outlining two bills currently in Congress:  H.R. 2038, and S. 1034.  

http://www.candidatesonguns.org/content/policy/policy_assault.html

S. 1034 extends the AWB, and puts more restrictions on high cap magazines.  H.R. 2038 is scary has hell.  It even bans sales of "Conversion Kits", and further defines an assualt weapon as any semiautomatic rifle that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine AND has one of the following:  folding or telescoping stock, threaded barrel, pistol grip, forward grip, or barrel shroud.  So yes... if H.R. 2038 is passed into law, then you will not be able to purchase any semiautomatic rifle that can can accept a detachable magazine and pistol grip.  Oh, and by the way, H.R. 2038 also classifies any semiautomatic rifle with a fixed magazine that can accomodate more than 10 rounds into the same category.  Don't forget the conversion kit clause in here as well.  As I read the bill, it would basically make it impossible for any of us to purchase kits from places such as Model 1, M&A, J&T, etc.

So, IF any one of the two bills above turn into law, they would have the following outcomes:

Best case: S. 1034.  AWB is continued with more stringent regulations around high capacity magazines (this was created by Dianne Feinstein because it is believed to have a better chance of passing, as H.R. 2038 is more radical).

Worst case: H.R. 2038.  Say goodbye to purchasing anything with a detachable magazine and pistol grip.  Also, no more purchasing of grips for your handguards either, as those are "forward grips" that would create a banned assault weapon.  And say goodbye to purchasing any parts or parts kits that would allow you to create a "banned weapon" as well.

Anyway, I could be getting a little paranoid here, and I don't know what the chances are of these bills passing. However, I do know that if someone turns this into an election issue (which may not happen, with foreign policy taking center stage right now), you can count on no "sunset"... only a darker eclipse.

(Sorry if this topic is off subject, but with everyone here talking about what they would do after the AWB sunset, I think it's important to note that many of our elected officials are working diligently to ensure the AWB is renewed or replaced with even stricter legislation.)

The current ban will sunset.  It's just a matter of whether it will be replaced or not.  If it is replaced, let's all hope that there is a gap between the laws so when can get all our features put on.  [;)]

Finestein and the other Libs are working hard to renew the current one closing all the loopholes and making it perminate with no sunset.  Its going to be worse than what we have now if they succede.

For what it's worth I don't think it's possible to be too paranoid given the political climate we are in today.

It's refreshing to see other people fired up about this issue. Like many others I'm doing my part to help-but I'm not taking any chances either.

I just purchased four stripped lowers and parts kits, and I'll be purchasing more.

Wes Clark and John Kerry both support the AWB.

To my knowledge Dean is the only current presidential candidate with an actual chance of winning that would not actively pursue a renewal.

I still think this sunset deal isn't gonna fly.  It'll sunset, but what'll come up in it's place is what freaks me out.

I think I'm gonna go pull all my ads off the EE right now.  You guys got me freaked.

Anyone that thinks that this thing will just shrivel up and die in an election year is goofy. I have never seen a gun law get rescended after it has passed. They always get worse, not better. I don't want to be a negative Ned, but that is the way it is!

It's real interesting to see the low prices for Prebans now. I'm holding on to my four . With the "DC Sniper" case and it being a election year, I fear laws will become stricter. AR15 lovers/"Assault Rife owners are not the majority population. My 0.02.

I have a feeling that with the partial birth abortion ban fight that is upcoming, the AWB will be way off the radar screen.  Liberals love their abortions much more than taking guns away.  Must be that "Kill em while they are defenseless" train of thought...

I'm ordering a couple preban barrels now...with the bayo lug milled off cause it's useless to me anyway...that way I can always have a comp pinned.  I've got a couple lowers sitting around with nothing on em.

The website I posted the link to, while being more of an anti-gun site, has interesting information on the presidential candidates.  It lists, for all of those who have voted in Congress, their record for how they voted in firearms-related issues.  It also have verbatim quotes from each candidate on gun control laws.  Clark has a quote listed that is something like, "If you want to own an assualt weapon, join the Army."  While I do agree that service in the armed forces is a worthy and respectable path in life, the context in which Clark brings this up is basically like saying "assault weapons" are for the Army, not for private citizens (and, by assault weapons, we all know the general public considers semi-autos "assualt weapons").  

Again, I'm not necessarily trying to bring an off-topic subject into a board that is primarily equipment focused, but I read many people saying thing such as, "As soon as the ban sunsets, I'm outfitting my AR with a 4 position CAR stock, pre-ban flash hider, etc."  I really don't think this thing is going to just dry up and blow away.  Even though it may not be a primary campaign focus, people like Schumer and Feinstein (and Sarah Brady) will keep this in the public spotlight, pulling on the general public's heartstrings by any means available.

Hokie:

As far as Dean you may wish to review his stance; he may not actively seek its renewel, but he will not oppose it. Dont let that Vermont "no gun laws here" crap fool you.

Verbatim from his site:
"The Assault Weapons Ban expires next year, and it should be renewed."

[url]http://www.deanforamerica.com/site/PageServer?pagename=policy_statement_civilrights_sensiblegunlaws[/url]

Curious how you discount Bush; he has no chance of winning or would he actively pursue a renewel. Or do you not consider him a candidate since he is currently President.

With a number of Democrats vulnerable, even Daschle co-sponsored the Firearms MFG protection act, your not going to see a lot of public support for renewel or replacement. But like McClure-Volkmer, dont get complacent or you will get screwed.

Many national politicians are wary of the issue, Tennesee taught them a lesson, but the underlying philosophy still exists. Most Republicans will weather the heat they will get for not renewing, if they feel supported. Most safe Democrats will push to have it expanded, regardless. Make your feelings known, its your fight to lose.

Luck
Alac

While most of the quotes on the website mentioned above do show Howard Dean as, generally, a pro-firearms candidate, you might find the two quotes from Dean below of interest:

"The true measure of leadership is standing up to your friends when they are wrong. President Bush should use the power of the presidency to urge his fellow Republicans to do the right thing, protect American lives, and extend the assault weapons ban."

"Here's what my position is and what it would be as president. Keep the assault weapons ban. I favor that and it ought to be renewed. Keep the Brady bill, close the gun-show loophole, and then let every state decide for themselves what additional gun control they need."

In general, Dean seems to feel that more federal regulation isn't needed.  However, he does seem to support renewal of the assault weapons ban.  However, not sure if the comments above are actual sentiment or comments made to pacify his fellow Democrats.

Make sure you put all your effort into making sure that the ban expires for good. That is all you can do, just worrying doesn't accomplish much.

What if there is a new law such as the AWB against postban features (pistol grip/detach. mag/ etc.)??

Anybody thinking about taking pictures and having something notorized saying that your rifle was in this configuration before the NEW ban?

I also believe that there is an excellent chance for some extension (and further screwing of legal gun owners) of the AWB before or after the current ban sunsets. All that it will take is a major shooting incident, which coincidently always seems to happen when the anti-RKBA crowd needs "an event" to rally around.

Additionally, also keep focused on what is happening locally. Here in the PRM, there are a number of bills filed that would enact even stricter bans for subjects in this socialist state. Some of the sponsor testimony was based on "fear" that the federal AWB might sunset and leave the state "naked" with carnage in the streets. I know because I was at those gun hearings at our state house back in April this year and heard the BS as well as testified against them.

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't President Bush on record as saying he supports the Ban? Didn't Bush senior actually sign a ban into law?

Good info, thanks for posting everyone.

According to the statements above, there isn't a single politician out there that is against the renewal.

Guess we're screwed.  What are YOU guys doing about this?  I've written all my representatives on this issue - got the standard responses, from their interns.

VA-gunnut...


Wise words, friend. To this end, I refer everyone interested in helping to make a difference to... [url=www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=203989]The Essential "End the AW Ban" Contact List & Sample Letter Thread[/url]

Most major politicians are status quo. Like Dean or Bush, they claim to be against any new laws, but don't seem to be against anything someone else passes for them.

Most of the opposition is from local legislators who will vote against the ban, but ONLY if gun owners write them to tell them to vote against the ban.

It is within our power to stop the ban; all we have to do is exercise it.

Taking the pictures and getting them notorized is not a bad idea at all!

I believe that the AWB will sunset right before the presidential election, right?  If that is true, we are screwed Bush will be forced to sign a new law or face being portrayed as a gun lover by democrats.

If it sunsets after the election, and no one else goes nuts and kills a bunch of people with an AR for a while, we may just get lucky.

RenegadeX...


Amen brother!

Half the battle is getting fellow gun owners to realize that they have the power to affect a change for the better!

quote]Quoted:
I believe that the AWB will sunset right before the presidential election, right?  If that is true, we are screwed Bush will be forced to sign a new law or face being [b]portrayed as a gun lover by democrats.[/b]

If it sunsets after the election, and no one else goes nuts and kills a bunch of people with an AR for a while, we may just get lucky.[/quote]

Being rabidly anti gun sure didnt help Gore. One lesson from the 2000 elections is that being anti-gun makes you vulnerable in the south and west. It cost Al Gore states. That is the conventional wisdom on both sides - that is why you see NO ONE keying on the issue.

Look, theres a whole lot that goes into political victories, but in general, if you’re active and vocal, you will get what you want. Theres enough gunowners to form the critical mass needed. But you have to convince your relatives and friends, acquaintances and neighbors. You have to persuade. You have to convert.

You'd be surprised the number of folks, deathly afraid of guns, that I've taken to the range - and they now love ARs. Some even own their own guns now. They understand the object is not the issue. More and more Americans understand its not the plane, or the gun, or the knife - its the homicidal maniac. Thats why you see so little resonance in the public regarding gun control - therefore little media coverage as well. The tide has turned a bit - but if you wish the AB to sunset you [b]MUST[/b] contact your Senator and Representative to ensure they understand the issue - and your feelings about it.

As I and others have pointed out, it really is your fight to lose. Saddle up and get this done.

Luck
Alac

i have fears of not getting a rifle built prior to the ban. but, with a 5 1/2 month old son now i am not sure if i will get it done in time. if i were to buy the lower first, would it have to be a complete rifle at the time of the new ban in order to be a post-ban/pre-ban (or whatever it would be called)? and, if you already had the lower could you still buy the kit since it the kit itself would not be in violation?

twostepct:  

That depends.  

If the current ban is just amended to not expire or if bill S. 1034 is passed, then it should not change the restrictions on purchasing a lower and building a kit beyond those restrictions already in place today.  However, if something like H.R. 2038 passes, you're pretty much screwed, since that BANS the sale of any parts that could be used to assemble an "assault rifle."  As I read over H.R. 2038, it pretty much spells out that you won't be able to buy parts... period.

H.R. 2038 would outlaw "Conversion Kits", defined in the bill as:  "The term 'conversion kit' means any part or combination of parts designed and intended for use in converting a firearm into a semiautomatic assault weapon, and any combination of parts from which a semiautomatic assault weapon can be assembled if the parts are in the possession or under the control of a person."  

In other words, even if you buy a lower now, if H.R. 2038 passes, you won't be able to buy the parts to complete it into a rifle.  Sucks, huh?  

well I'm willing to bet some AR parts that it will sunset.  Anyone so sure that it will not sunset wanna take that bet?

For us Preban owners the bet is, sell them now while you can because the AWB is going to sunset, although prices are down vs keep your Prebans because ban will not sunset and might even be worse. I'm keeping my four Prebans and I think that's an expensive enough bet.

So when do we use the 2nd Amendment for what it was intended? These bans are a clear violation of our rights outlined in the Constitution. The 2nd Amendment was created so that we could stand up to such tyranny. I'm sick of these fucking liberals trying to tell me how to live my life and taking away my rights! I pay their taxes, I served my country, and these fucks want to take away my rights? Fuck them- I say when our guns become illegal we become outlaws! We ignore each and every gun law ever passed by these whores for votes. Should they send their minions from the alphabet agencies to try and enforce these illegal laws well then we are bound by being citizens of this country to defend our homes, our rights, and our forefathers honor.  

These politicians are treasonistic, socialist, elitists who only pass such measures so that they no longer fear whom they mean to control. These measures are only created so that the elitists have absolute and un-relenting control over us. Not one of their fucking laws has saved a single life- criminals will always get their guns one way or another. These enemies of our Constitution keep shoving their rhetoric socialist agendas down our throats but it is time we stand up and defend what is ours, take back what is ours, and restore what is lost. I swore to uphold our Constitution against all enemies both foriegn and DOMESTIC, at all costs, to give my life if so it if needed. Clearly they don't get it- there is not one word in the 2nd Amendment that implies it's about hunting or sportsmen- it's about checks and balances. The 2nd Amendment is our guarantee that if we put these jerks into office that they will represent our rights- if not then the 2nd Amendment guarantees an army of citizens that is far larger than any army ever massed on this planet. The damn thing says "SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED"- how much longer are we going to sit by and watch them desecrate the offices they hold. Our government is supposed to serve it's people and this election year we should send a message loud and clear- you touch my RIGHTS your ass is not sitting in that office. Civil disobediance on a scale like never seen before. So buy those pre-ban uppers, get those bayonets out because the ban is going to sunset any new law is a violation of our RIGHTS and those whom mean to pass such laws are enemies of our Constitution and should be dealt with as the crime of treason contends.

Sons of Liberty- your day is near..  

If assault weapons are terrorist weapons, how come the terrorist of 911 didn't have any?
hmmmmmmmm...............

Liberals don't care about the Constitution, unless it benifits them.  They are in direct violation all the time and they don't even care.  The Communist Manifesto it what they go by.

BEAUTIFULLY put, and my thoughts exactly. It is unconstitutional, so I for one do not care if they renew a more bogus "law". Though I highly doubt something like H.R. 2038 would ever be passed, many many businesses would be screwed and there would be total anarchy from the public, and a LOT of 'normal' law abiding citizens will be punished, but I believe it to be worth it. They can shoot me, or lock me up, but I will not go silently into this dark night and hand over my right as an American. You people truly are this countries finest, so I say BRING IT ON FUCKERS, we're ready.

This is already happening where I used to live (not florida) there are so many gun laws and requirements (fingerprints, photo, full registration, two week wait, mandatory handgun safety course!) to get a handgun  that most of the young people just say fuck it and buy a stolen handgun or rifle for half the price.  I like to be legal myself and went through all of that bullshit, but I can't exactly blame them.  

If anything ever goes down, the govt., just like the Nazi's has my photo, fingerprints and old physical address on file to get my guns.  But they have no info on all of the stolen or old unregistered guns, so those people are set.

All extreme gun laws do is turn people into criminals.  Extreme gun laws provide a market for stolen guns and cause people to steal our guns from our houses.  There are so many stolen guns available to people on the black market that it is unbelievable.

If we just dropped all gun laws and sold guns to felons too, then at least our legal guns wouldn't be stolen by the felons!  Gun laws do nothing.  The stupid fucking brady bill people always say how their bill stopped so many felons from buying guns last year, but this is not true at all, it just stopped them from buying legal guns! The brady bill causes our legal guns to be stolen.

Guys,

We can discuss this until we're red in the face and it's not going to change anything.  Who cares what the President or the Democratic candidates said?  Get out the keyboard and write your Senators and Representatives and we won't have worry about this making it to the President.  Follow the link that NYPatriot posted and get the letters flowing.

I will pledge here and now, and send a copy of this to my representatives, that I will not vote for ANY candidate, for ANY elected office, who votes for or signs into law an extension of the AWB or any gun law that replaces it with the same or greater restrictions.

That goes for Bush on down. ITS TIME TO HOLD THEM ALL ACCOUNTABLE.

You and I voted the Republicans control of the house, senate and the presidancy, so we wouldn't have this problem. We voted democrats out, The republicans we elected have the power to thwart any new legislation.

I don't want to hear any whining about Feinstein or any other Democrat or liberal. They aren't running the show. Our guys are. If they screw us, if they lied to us, I say 'throw the bums out!"

Who else here will pledge the same? Or are you all just going to keep voting Republican, even if they screw us, too?

Excellent post jimb100!!!

You hit the nail on the head; it's time to hold them ALL accountable.  They are all crooks in my opinion and all "vote whores" as someone already stated.  I don't care if they are Democrat or Republican they all suck and I don't trust any of them.  All I can do is let them know that I feel strongly about the AWB and that I will be voting each and every time.  I'm like a small elephant...I never forget [;)]

We have a lot of little lions roaring here....how many of you voted for either Bush?
Both of them have been worse for us than the dems.....

I agree, I consider myself a pretty staunch republican but both Bushes have been an embarassment to the party.  I'd rather have a Dem in office than a GOP who tears down what Conservatives have been spending so long building.

For all you Bush II bashers, do you think for a second that Al Gore would not be pushing hammer and tongs to get the ban renewed and strengthened? Get a clue. If you see no difference in Congress being led by people like Tom Delay rather than people like Ted Kennedy, get an even bigger clue.

Bush has half-heartedly promised to sign a RENEWAL if it reaches his desk. He has put exactly ZERO effort into pushing for action on this. There is currently no RENEWAL bill anywhere in Congress. All the proposed bills are harsher than the current ban, and Bush would sign none of them. No bill will see the light of day if we do our part and keep the pressure on our Congress critters.

I voted for Bush, truthfully I would have much rather had McCain, but the primary voters fucked that one up good.  Anyway, I mainly liked bush because of his stance on opening up all of the public lands that clinton basically banned for public use.  

The real problem with gun laws is not the govt. but the states themselves that pass these asinine gun laws.  Some states are just full of a bunch of fucking socialist gun haters and you can write letters all day to the representatives that these socialists elect and it won't do shit.  All you can do in these states is just say fuck it and do what you want.

It doesn't matter what Gore would/would not be doing, it doesn't matter who voted for whom 16 years ago, it matters what we do now.  There is really nothing to argue about here: we write, call and email our asses off or we live with some form of H.R. 2038.  PERIOD.  Don't think, not even for a second, that if it made it to Bush’s desk (if he's still in office) that he wouldn't sign it.  Don't be fooled.

Guess what? Al Gore didn't get elected!!!

Here's your clue: if we get a new AWB or a worse one, then there really isn't a rat's you now what difference.

If the best you can say is Bush is better than Al Gore, that doesn't say anything for Bush.

Take the pledge, promise you won't vote for anyone who votes for or signs into law a AWB bill.

There is an estimated 90-120 Million gun owners in this country. If only 10% of these gunowners decide to stand up then it would be the largest army ever assembled on the face of this planet. We represent all that stands in the way of liberals turning this nation into a socialist government. The liberals know this and therefore know that we must be disarmed before that can take place. It is our duty that should all measures set forth for normal democracy fail to fight these assaults on our rights then we are shall do what the 2nd Amendment entails and repeal tyrrany by force. This is not just for our gun rights but the entire balance of freedom as we know it today. Should they succeed our country, our way of life, and our great nation will be at peril. Fellow Patriots do what you can with all legal and democratic measures.

Write your representatives, vote accordingly, remain ever vigilant and remember a day may come when you are called to honor your loyalty bound by being a citizen of this nation to take up arms in its defense. Those whom served in law enforcement and those whom served in military duty remember your oath that you once swore, to uphold the Constitution of the United States against all enemies both foreign and domestic.

I hope to God this nation never turns on itself again as that would be an atrocity far greater than one could imagine but know that should these socialists pass these measures our entire way of life is at peril. We have no choice but to act accordingly.

Sons of Liberty, your time grows near..      

Blah, blah, blah. You should worry more about the so called conservatives taking away our guns. That's why I'm nervous about Bush and our republican congress and senate.

Remember, the Nazi weren't liberals and they registered and took civilian guns. The Stalinists, the faschists, the same thing.

Liberals can always be beaten, they get too twisted in their own bull... Its the other guys who scare me more than a bunch of do nothing talkers.

Looks like you hooked yourself a troll here!

All I can say is this"Governments are created to protect our inalienable rights and when it becomes desructive of these ends it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it"I will resist tyranny by the ballot box first and as a last resort by force,The constitution is only as strong as those willing to fight for it"When a man has nothing wich he is willing to fight for,nothing wich he cares about more than his own safety is a miserable creature who will never be free,Unless made and kept so by the exertions of men better than himself"I will never be one of these creatures And I will never give up my Charter rights or my guns.927 out.