I couldn't find even one mention of the Arab peace proposal ??

Did I miss it ?

I didn't post anything recently on the Tooth Fairy, either.

Notice a pattern?

Eric The(Realistic)Hun[>]:)]

I don't know - Israel pulls back its' borders - the Arab countries recognize Israel - some seem to take this seriously ?

Note the proviso that [u]all[/u] Arab nations must agree with this proposal - I can just see the look on Saddam's face when they ask him to guarantee Israel's pre-1967 borders.

And the Iranians? Even with moderate Katami, the Mullahs will never let it happen.

But even if they do, it will never work.

Jerusalem will never be settled until Messiah comes.

Eric The(AndByThenIt'sTooLate)Hun[>]:)]

But I thought HE already came ?

Does the Bible specify the borders of Israel ??

[?]

Strange words for a Christian Fundamentalist???!!! Hmmmmm!  DaMan

Post from 5subslr5 -

He did, and He will come again. To Jerusalem, to the Holy Land. His name is, was, and always will be Jesus.

How does Jesus feel about Jerusalem?

[red][b]'O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not![/b][/red] Matthew 23:37

It is HIS City. Has been, and always will be.

What did Jesus predict about Jerusalem, in the short term?

But Jesus turning unto them said, [red][b]'Daughters of Jerusalem, weep not for me, but weep for yourselves, and for your children.'[/b][/red] Luke 23:28

Within a generation of His saying this, the Armies of Titus, the Roman Emperor, utterly destroyed the City and Herod's Temple with it!

What did Jesus predict about Jerusalem for the future?

[red][b]'And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.'[/b][/red] Luke 21:24

Guess what, the Jews fought and were defeated and were led away into all nations. And His City of Jerusalem [u]was[/u] trodden down by the Gentiles, until, hmmm, June, 1967, when Israeli paratroopers finally captured the Old City, the Wailing Wall, and the Holy Mount!

So for the first time since the days of the generation that last saw Jesus the Messiah, the Jews were in control of their Holy City!

So it looks to me as if the 'time of the Gentiles' for trodding down Jerusalem has long since past! We have His word on it!

But not to worry, if by some quirk of human history, the Jews [u]are[/u] driven from Jerusalem, rest assured that He will return to make the City, the Holy Land, and the world, [u]His[/u] again!

So what do you think I meant when I said that Jerusalem will be settled when Messiah comes?

Am I certain that Jesus, the Messiah, will return? Of course, I have His word on it, as well as the word of two angels:

Which also said, 'Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? [b]this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so [u]come[/u] in like manner[/b] as ye have seen him go into heaven. Acts 1:11

I guess this is something that should have been taught in Christianity 101!

Eric The(ModernDaySimeon,Awaiting[u]HIS[/u]Appearance)Hun[>]:)]

What's magic about pre-'67 borders?  The wackos were attacking Israel from the Gaza Strip and the Golan Heights then.  That's why Israel annexed those areas in the first place.

And give away Jerusalem?  No way!

I heard an interview with the Iranian foreign minister, yesterday.

He said that he (Iran) would approve of the following "Peace Plan":

"Ask the Palestinian peolple what THEY want.  If Israel then does WHATEVER the Palestinian people demand, Iran MIGHT agree to the plan..."

Yeah...

There has never, in the history of the world, been peace, that came from anything other than VICTORY.

Hmmm, maybe I should stir up some Texans to see if we could get the pre-1845 borders of Texas recognized!

[url]http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/atlas_texas/texas_land_grants.jpg[/url]

We wouldn't have to go to Colorado to ski - we'd be there!

Or how about Louisianans' seeking to have their pre-1803 borders recognized?

[url]http://www.earlyamerica.com/earlyamerica/maps/louisianapurchase/colormap.htm[/url]

And I shudder to think what would happen if certain Native American Indian tribes sought to have their pre-1492 borders recognized!

Where will all this madness end?

Eric The(JustThinkYou'sBeInHelena,Montana,AtARealCajunRestaurant!)Hun[>]:)]

Post from Cinncinatus -

No need to ask them, their duly elected leader Yasser Arafat has always said what they wanted:

[b]'Palestine from the River to the Sea!'[/b]

He just says it in Arabic, so as not to offend anyone at CNN, etc.

Eric The(NeverHappen)Hun[>]:)]

Israel should NOT give up old Jerusalem !!!!!!!!

Has been and probably should be a shared city.

(Shared meaning ability to visit.)

I'm sure that they'll be able to get along nicely, and share Jerusalem.
After all, the Palestinians really just want Israel to retreat to the 1967 borders.
That's why they strap explosives to their bodies and try to kill Israelis...
...because they're pissed about the location of the border.
Yeah, they'll stop all of that and be friendly towards the Israelis, once this peace proposal is realized.
The Israelis will no longer have to worry about terror bombing.
Uh huh.

Eric,
if the Arab countries recognize Israel and its' continuing right to exist and the Palestinians get a country of their own "PEACE" might be the end.

Just a little time is needed for economic interdependence to be established and then no one wants to fight.

There won't be peace without there being a war, first.
It's a sad truth.
Someone wins and someone loses.

I'd like to hope that, in this case, when one side loses, that Iran, Iraq, Osama, etc., are unhappy with the outcome.
What American would want to make our enemies smile?
Not me.
I want them to be sad.

Post from 5subslr5 -

'Has been shared' since 1967! The Israelis permit the Muslim authorities to continue to oversee the 'Temple Mount.'

Before 1967, the Jordanians refused to let any Israelis come to visit their Wailing Wall!

But a few hundred Israeli paratroopers changed that one bright sunny afternoon!

See how 'fair' my beloved Israelis have been?

Probably not, the anti-Israeli drumbeat is the only way that many Middle Eastern countries continue to be headed by royal families.

The Sauds might be in a real quandry should their own citizens not have the Israeli-Palestinian issue to worry about any longer!

But, I'm certain they already know that!

This 'jihad' is the glue that binds their people together! Or maybe just the sand that blinds the people to their own predictament!

Eric The(JustAThought!)Hun[>]:)]

Eric, there is much evidence to support your position here.

I do take modest exception.

Unfortunately, the United States pays Israel to kill Palestinians.

Unfortunately the United States also keeps the royal families in power.

I sense a true chance for change - maybe a true chance for Peace. [?]

Not only the United States but much of the world is different since 9/11.

Post from 5subslr5 -

Huh? What's the bounty, then? 'Cause I think we may owe them a few more billion by now!

How do you figure we [u]pay[/u] them to kill Palestinians?

Are you talking the House of Windsor or the House of Saud? And surely you mean simply by buying their oil?

Or do you mean that the US stations troops in Saudi Arabia to protect the Saud Familiy?

Well, much of the Non-islamic world has changed. As that Gallup Poll recently showed, the Arabs/Muslims, when asked by groups not identified as Western, gave a very remarkable series of responses to what should have been very simple questions!

And yet they failed the 'test' miserably! Of course, I thought their version of [b]Palestinian Bandstand[/b] on Sept 11, provided me with all the evidence I needed that things will remain the same in Islamdom. If not get demonstrably worse!

Maybe they just simply [u]liked[/u] the tune that was playing on Sept. 11!

[b]'I give it a 85, Mr. Bin Laden. It has a good beat and it's easy to ululate to!'[/b]

Eric The(I'mReallyVerySerious)Hun[>]:)]

The Israelis have shown by there tactics that they have no intention of reaching accomodations with the Palestinians.

Sharon's effort to marginalize Arafat has backfired and provided more radical groups (like Hamas) the opportunity to strengthen their own positions.

The Israelis' use of targeted asssasinations and increasingly repressive military measures against the Palestinians in the occupied territories, has also backfired and trapped them into a war of attrition with no end in sight.

Sharon's popularity is waning and protests by reservists and other Israelis is increasing.

The Saudi peace offer, genuine or not, was timed perfectly to take advantage of the current situation and has resulted in a major PR victory for the Saudis and a black eye for Sharon.

DaMan    

Mubarak said that the Saudi peace proposal is doomed to failure because "there is nothing new in it".

Is Mubarak an Arel Sharon agent or, once in a while, it is an unbiased statement?

I think that DaMan said something right, once in a while: the peace proposal of the Saudis, if Mubarak is right, it's only smoke in our westeners eyes...

Did anyone see that USA Today article a couple of days ago that reported most of the Arabs in the Mideast do not believe Arabs/Muslims were involved in 9/11? It is also been actively reported that most Arabs/Muslims do not like America or {hate her} and hate Israel.

Next time someone on AR15.com comes up with that "don't paint them {Arabs/Muslims/Palestinians} with the same broad brush," I think they should trot out the last Middle Eastern Arabs/Muslim person left that does not have hate in their heart.

Actually, I don't think such a person can be found.

[i]Denial is not only a river in Africa[/i] [:|]

Sounds an awful lot like what a PLO spokesman would say.

RAF,
please tread carefully as you're danger close to posting unbiased facts.
[:D]

Well, [b]raf[/b], that certainly may be the case in connection with [u]Kuwait[/u], although I had thought that they had sent a lot of their Palestinian 'guest workers' home (wherever [u]that[/u] might be, heh-heh) after the Palestinian 'dancing and ululating' in the streets after Saddam's invasion of Kuwait!

(Boy, those Palestinians sure need a PR group to help them understand why some people might find them offensive! Remember when the videos of 'dancing Palestinians' first made the rounds after Sept 11? Their answer was - 'That wasn't us dancing for joy on Sept 11! That was us dancing for joy when Saddam invaded Kuwait in 1991!' How utterly clueless can you get?)

But, setting aside Kuwait for a moment, what about the others? You know the ones without a whole lot of guest workers?

Eric The(TheyAreTheDustbinOfHistory)Hun[>]:)]

Eric,
I remember the fat-lady doing the unlahlah and about six or eight kids dancing and two guys in a pick-up truck grinning.

The idea of peace making you nervous ?  Don't be too alarmed by the feeling as Sharon is nervous too.

Hey 5subslr5, do you remember the Palestinian Authority going around to Western media photographers and camermen and demanding that they stop taking pictures/videos of the dancing, ululations, posters, and t-shirts?

Do you remember the PA warning their own folks to stop dancing and putting on a show for the Western Press?

Remember the similar dancing in Cairo?

Remember the Bin Laden t-shirts in Karachi?

In Indonesia?

Do you remember how some apologists said that it was simply dancing from 1991? No? Then look here:[url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?id=52109[/url] Please look at the websites I posted in my first post in the thread.

So, yeah, I remember a lot of dancing, [b]do you?[/b]

Eric The(ApparentlyNot!)Hun[>]:)]

No

If any of you missed the news clips of Palestinians dancing in the streets after the the terrorist attacks of 09-11, don't worry!  Eric, will replay it for you [b]again and again and again[/b]!

Now why would he do that?

Should we declare WWIII on all Moslems?  

DaMan

Nope.

My Master said not to cast pearls before swine.

Eric The(Obedient)Hun[>]:)]

NO CERTAINLY NOT!

Just blast the ones that hate Israel/U.S. and actively plan our destruction.

oops! That turns out to be what, 90% or them?
Declaring your WWIII would be just returning the favor.

Of course not.

Just sit, dude, and wait until they'll do this move first... [}:D]

Feel better?

Opinion polls are bogus, in this country and abroad.  Actually, that's not true, they are probably even more bogus in other countries which lack minor amenities like telephones for every household.

Let me see, opinion polls in this country tell me that:
Everyone supports gun control.
Assault weapons should be banned.
Saturday night specials should be banned.
The populace is frightened by concealed carry.
Only Democratic Party positions are supported by the electorate.

The reality in the population and in elections is quite different.  Interestingly enough, while browsing for news of Afghanistan, I came across a newspaper web site in India, which analyzed some recent elections in that country, and how the results were completely different from what the opinion polls had projected.

And finally, so what?  Why should we care about other countries and what their people think about us?  God forbid that we start listening to the French.

I am an immigrant to the US, and let me tell you that you will find jealousy, animosity and resentment towards America in virtually every country, including our so called allies.  This is in spite of the US being amongst the most generous, giving and civilized countries in human history.  They dislike us because we are wealthy, successful, and because we don't really need them, or their opinions.  I say that this is an excellent state of affairs.