This isn't good. I guess this is why the DOW is down 200pts this morning.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - This isn't good. I guess this is why the DOW is down 200pts this morning. (Page 1 of 3)

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:32:04 AM EDT

Author: Chris Hedges
Link: http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/20090614_the_american_empire_is_bankrupt

This week marks the end of the dollar’s reign as the world’s reserve currency. It marks the start of a terrible period of economic and political decline in the United States. And it signals the last gasp of the American imperium. That’s over. It is not coming back. And what is to come will be very, very painful.

Barack Obama, and the criminal class on Wall Street, aided by a corporate media that continues to peddle fatuous gossip and trash talk as news while we endure the greatest economic crisis in our history, may have fooled us, but the rest of the world knows we are bankrupt. And these nations are damned if they are going to continue to prop up an inflated dollar and sustain the massive federal budget deficits, swollen to over $2 trillion, which fund America’s imperial expansion in Eurasia and our system of casino capitalism. They have us by the throat. They are about to squeeze.

There are meetings being held Monday and Tuesday in Yekaterinburg, Russia, (formerly Sverdlovsk) among Chinese President Hu Jintao, Russian President Dmitry Medvedev and other top officials of the six-nation Shanghai Cooperation Organization. The United States, which asked to attend, was denied admittance. Watch what happens there carefully. The gathering is, in the words of economist Michael Hudson, “the most important meeting of the 21st century so far.”

It is the first formal step by our major trading partners to replace the dollar as the world’s reserve currency. If they succeed, the dollar will dramatically plummet in value, the cost of imports, including oil, will skyrocket, interest rates will climb and jobs will hemorrhage at a rate that will make the last few months look like boom times. State and federal services will be reduced or shut down for lack of funds. The United States will begin to resemble the Weimar Republic or Zimbabwe. Obama, endowed by many with the qualities of a savior, will suddenly look pitiful, inept and weak. And the rage that has kindled a handful of shootings and hate crimes in the past few weeks will engulf vast segments of a disenfranchised and bewildered working and middle class. The people of this class will demand vengeance, radical change, order and moral renewal, which an array of proto-fascists, from the Christian right to the goons who disseminate hate talk on Fox News, will assure the country they will impose.

I called Hudson, who has an article in Monday’s Financial Times called “The Yekaterinburg Turning Point: De-Dollarization and the Ending of America’s Financial-Military Hegemony.” “Yekaterinburg,” Hudson writes, “may become known not only as the death place of the czars but of the American empire as well.” His article is worth reading, along with John Lanchester’s disturbing exposé of the world’s banking system, titled “It’s Finished,” which appeared in the May 28 issue of the London Review of Books.

“This means the end of the dollar,” Hudson told me. “It means China, Russia, India, Pakistan, Iran are forming an official financial and military area to get America out of Eurasia. The balance-of-payments deficit is mainly military in nature. Half of America’s discretionary spending is military. The deficit ends up in the hands of foreign banks, central banks. They don’t have any choice but to recycle the money to buy U.S. government debt. The Asian countries have been financing their own military encirclement. They have been forced to accept dollars that have no chance of being repaid. They are paying for America’s military aggression against them. They want to get rid of this.”

China, as Hudson points out, has already struck bilateral trade deals with Brazil and Malaysia to denominate their trade in China’s yuan rather than the dollar, pound or euro. Russia promises to begin trading in the ruble and local currencies. The governor of China’s central bank has openly called for the abandonment of the dollar as reserve currency, suggesting in its place the use of the International Monetary Fund’s Special Drawing Rights. What the new system will be remains unclear, but the flight from the dollar has clearly begun. The goal, in the words of the Russian president, is to build a “multipolar world order” which will break the economic and, by extension, military domination by the United States. China is frantically spending its dollar reserves to buy factories and property around the globe so it can unload its U.S. currency. China is frantically spending its dollar reserves to buy factories and property around the globe so it can unload its U.S. currency. This is why Aluminum Corp. of China made so many major concessions in the failed attempt to salvage its $19.5 billion alliance with the Rio Tinto mining concern in Australia. It desperately needs to shed its dollars.

“China is trying to get rid of all the dollars they can in a trash-for-resource deal,” Hudson said. “They will give the dollars to countries willing to sell off their resources since America refuses to sell any of its high-tech industries, even Unocal, to the yellow peril. It realizes these dollars are going to be worthless pretty quickly.”

The architects of this new global exchange realize that if they break the dollar they also break America’s military domination. Our military spending cannot be sustained without this cycle of heavy borrowing. The official U.S. defense budget for fiscal year 2008 is $623 billion, before we add on things like nuclear research. The next closest national military budget is China’s, at $65 billion, according to the Central Intelligence Agency.

There are three categories of the balance-of-payment deficits. America imports more than it exports. This is trade. Wall Street and American corporations buy up foreign companies. This is capital movement. The third and most important balance-of-payment deficit for the past 50 years has been Pentagon spending abroad. It is primarily military spending that has been responsible for the balance-of-payments deficit for the last five decades. Look at table five in the Balance of Payments Report, published in the Survey of Current Business quarterly, and check under military spending. There you can see the deficit.

To fund our permanent war economy, we have been flooding the world with dollars. The foreign recipients turn the dollars over to their central banks for local currency. The central banks then have a problem. If a central bank does not spend the money in the United States then the exchange rate against the dollar will go up. This will penalize exporters. This has allowed America to print money without restraint to buy imports and foreign companies, fund our military expansion and ensure that foreign nations like China continue to buy our treasury bonds. This cycle appears now to be over. Once the dollar cannot flood central banks and no one buys our treasury bonds, our empire collapses. The profligate spending on the military, some $1 trillion when everything is counted, will be unsustainable.

“We will have to finance our own military spending,” Hudson warned, “and the only way to do this will be to sharply cut back wage rates. The class war is back in business. Wall Street understands that. This is why it had Bush and Obama give it $10 trillion in a huge rip-off so it can have enough money to survive.”

The desperate effort to borrow our way out of financial collapse has promoted a level of state intervention unseen since World War II. It has also led us into uncharted territory.

“We have in effect had to declare war to get us out of the hole created by our economic system,” Lanchester wrote in the London Review of Books. “There is no model or precedent for this, and no way to argue that it’s all right really, because under such-and-such a model of capitalism ... there is no such model. It isn’t supposed to work like this, and there is no road-map for what’s happened.”

The cost of daily living, from buying food to getting medical care, will become difficult for all but a few as the dollar plunges. States and cities will see their pension funds drained and finally shut down. The government will be forced to sell off infrastructure, including roads and transport, to private corporations. We will be increasingly charged by privatized utilities—think Enron—for what was once regulated and subsidized. Commercial and private real estate will be worth less than half its current value. The negative equity that already plagues 25 percent of American homes will expand to include nearly all property owners. It will be difficult to borrow and impossible to sell real estate unless we accept massive losses. There will be block after block of empty stores and boarded-up houses. Foreclosures will be epidemic. There will be long lines at soup kitchens and many, many homeless. Our corporate-controlled media, already banal and trivial, will work overtime to anesthetize us with useless gossip, spectacles, sex, gratuitous violence, fear and tawdry junk politics. America will be composed of a large dispossessed underclass and a tiny empowered oligarchy that will run a ruthless and brutal system of neo-feudalism from secure compounds. Those who resist will be silenced, many by force. We will pay a terrible price, and we will pay this price soon, for the gross malfeasance of our power elite.

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:33:59 AM EDT

[#1]

It is only a matter of time now.

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:35:35 AM EDT

[#2]

You afraid to give the source for that little article? Cause I know who it is, and I know why you're not giving it.

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:36:01 AM EDT

[#3]

Need cliff notes.

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:36:12 AM EDT

[#4]

Quoted:
You afraid to give the source for that little article? Cause I know who it is, and I know why you're not giving it.

I think the tinfoil cut off circulation.

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:36:52 AM EDT

[#5]

Since World War 2 the two political parties have been mortgaging our future.
The future is now and its about to come due.

sigh

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:38:40 AM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:
... and the criminal class on Wall Street,

That's where I stopped reading, comrade.

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:39:10 AM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:
You afraid to give the source for that little article? Cause I know who it is, and I know why you're not giving it.

I'm not afraid of shit.

I didn't post it because I forgot to.

I don't know the author or anything about him. His name is: Chris Hedges

LInk: http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/20090614_the_american_empire_is_bankrupt

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:39:37 AM EDT

[#8]

Where's the article you cited, please?

ETA should have waited a bit, thanks.

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:39:57 AM EDT

[#9]

Quoted:

Quoted:
You afraid to give the source for that little article? Cause I know who it is, and I know why you're not giving it.

I'm not afraid of shit.

That's obvious, since you just posted quite a bit of it.

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:42:14 AM EDT

[#10]

Quoted:

Quoted:
You afraid to give the source for that little article? Cause I know who it is, and I know why you're not giving it.

I'm not afraid of shit.

That's obvious, since you just posted quite a bit of it.

I didn't write it, just posted it. But thanks for being a jerk.

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:42:21 AM EDT

[#11]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/feedarticle/8558609

YEKATERINBURG, Russia, June 15 (Reuters) - China's Development Bank opened a credit line worth $1 billion to its Russian equivalent VEB to finance investment projects by Chinese companies in Russia, VEB said.
The heads of two state banks signed the agreement in the Russian city of Yekaterinburg ahead of a meeting of the leaders of the world's biggest emerging markets –– Brazil, Russia, India and China –– on Tuesday, VEB said in a news release issued on Sunday..
China's Development Bank has also agreed to lend VEB $310 million to finance construction of a cement factory by developer LSR Group , which will create 450 new jobs in the Leningrad region in Russia's north-west.
China, which holds the world's largest gold and forex reserves, has increased lending to Russian companies in recent months.
Russian state-run oil firm Rosneft and state oil pipeline monopoly Transneft have received a $25 billion loan from the Development Bank secured by 20 years of oil supplies.
Russia's second-largest bank VTB received a seven-year, $240 million loan from Export-Import Bank of China while third largest mobile operator Megafon received a $300 million loan also from the Development Bank. * For stories on the BRIC summit of emerging powers, click on [nBRIC] (Reporting by Gleb Bryanski; Editing by Kim Coghill)

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:42:43 AM EDT

[#12]

the criminal class on Wall Street

Once I got to this I was done.

Dang it, beat to the punch!

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:44:31 AM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:

Quoted:
You afraid to give the source for that little article? Cause I know who it is, and I know why you're not giving it.

I'm not afraid of shit.

That's obvious, since you just posted quite a bit of it.

I didn't write it, just posted it. But thanks for being a jerk.

I thoroughly enjoyed all the great blogs that truthdig.com links to: Air America, Alternet, Huffington Post, TalkLeft...

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:46:18 AM EDT

[#14]

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:47:55 AM EDT

[#15]

Quoted:

Quoted:
You afraid to give the source for that little article? Cause I know who it is, and I know why you're not giving it.

I'm not afraid of shit.

That's obvious, since you just posted quite a bit of it.

I didn't write it, just posted it. But thanks for being a jerk.

I thoroughly enjoyed all the great blogs that truthdig.com links to: Air America, Alternet, Huffington Post, TalkLeft...

Look, I'm not really looking to get into with someone today, but I am curious....just because the author is a Left Winger (googled him..he's a socialist), does that mean that the article isn't factual?
People literally take politics too far when trying to discredit someone. I may not like the author or his political leanings but it doesn't mean he's lying.

I mean, if I had said Rush Limbaugh was the author, I assume you would've cashed out your 401k immediately after reading it.

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:48:05 AM EDT

[#16]

Quoted:

the criminal class on Wall Street

Once I got to this I was done.

Dang it, beat to the punch!

THIS

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:49:45 AM EDT

[#17]

Quoted:

Quoted:
You afraid to give the source for that little article? Cause I know who it is, and I know why you're not giving it.

I'm not afraid of shit.

I didn't post it because I forgot to.

I don't know the author or anything about him. His name is: Chris Hedges

LInk: http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/20090614_the_american_empire_is_bankrupt

You are obviously afraid of the truth. Or at least it just isn't exciting enough for you.

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:51:02 AM EDT

[#18]

Quoted:

Quoted:
You afraid to give the source for that little article? Cause I know who it is, and I know why you're not giving it.

I'm not afraid of shit.

That's obvious, since you just posted quite a bit of it.

I didn't write it, just posted it. But thanks for being a jerk.

I thoroughly enjoyed all the great blogs that truthdig.com links to: Air America, Alternet, Huffington Post, TalkLeft...

Look, I'm not really looking to get into with someone today, but I am curious....just because the author is a Left Winger (googled him..he's a socialist), does that mean that the article isn't factual?
People literally take politics too far when trying to discredit someone. I may not like the author or his political leanings but it doesn't mean he's lying.

I mean, if I had said Rush Limbaugh was the author, I assume you would've cashed out your 401k immediately after reading it.

Actually no I wouldn't have. I would have lost respect for Rush.

I think for myself.

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:52:34 AM EDT

[#19]

Quoted:

Quoted:
... and the criminal class on Wall Street,

That's where I stopped reading, comrade.

Don't kid yourself, the people at the top are nothing but professional thieves. White collar locusts, pillaging the country, it's people and the national treasury.

This article is mostly paranoid interpretation of certain events, but there are nuggets of truth mixed in. Anyone who at this point still doesn't realize that we have been taken to the cleaners by "The Capitalists" (which they are not by the way) is a drooling moron. It's funny though that the tables have been turned by Obama. Prior to TARP they were bitching that The Banks were being held hostage by the whims of Congress' constituents and the money need to be handed over without any further delay. Now they have the money and Obama is using it to boss them around. They want to pay off but he won't let them. I wonder how that tastes.

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:53:24 AM EDT

[#20]

Quoted:

Quoted:
You afraid to give the source for that little article? Cause I know who it is, and I know why you're not giving it.

I'm not afraid of shit.

That's obvious, since you just posted quite a bit of it.

I didn't write it, just posted it. But thanks for being a jerk.

Thanks for being a dupe. And not in the sense of posting a duplicate topic either.

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:54:17 AM EDT

[#21]

Quoted:

Quoted:
You afraid to give the source for that little article? Cause I know who it is, and I know why you're not giving it.

I'm not afraid of shit.

That's obvious, since you just posted quite a bit of it.

I didn't write it, just posted it. But thanks for being a jerk.

I thoroughly enjoyed all the great blogs that truthdig.com links to: Air America, Alternet, Huffington Post, TalkLeft...

Look, I'm not really looking to get into with someone today, but I am curious....just because the author is a Left Winger (googled him..he's a socialist), does that mean that the article isn't factual?

Pretty much, yeah.

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:54:18 AM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:

Quoted:
... and the criminal class on Wall Street,

That's where I stopped reading, comrade.

Don't kid yourself, the people at the top are nothing but professional thieves. White collar locusts, pillaging the country, it's people and the national treasury.

This article is mostly paranoid interpretation of certain events, but there are nuggets of truth mixed in. Anyone who at this point still doesn't realize that we have been taken to the cleaners by "The Capitalists" (which they are not by the way) is a drooling moron. It's funny though that the tables have been turned by Obama. Prior to TARP they were bitching that The Banks were being held hostage by the whims of Congress' constituents and the money need to be handed over without any further delay. Now they have the money and Obama is using it to boss them around. They want to pay off but he won't let them. I wonder how that tastes.

Steve, you've completely lost it. Seriously.

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:55:12 AM EDT

[#23]

So the "fascists" are christians and... Fox News?

He may not be completely fabricating the "facts" of his story - but seeing the world through hate-colored glasses didn't help anyone INTERPRET those "facts" any more accurately. He's blinded by his own jaded views and is, similarly to a bigot talking about the Bill of Rights, no longer trustworthy.

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:57:02 AM EDT

[#24]

Whoever the author of this is, they are a commie douche-bag.

This reads like something straight out of the KGB propoganda ministry.

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:58:04 AM EDT

[#25]

Quoted:
http://stupendium.com/blog/uploaded_images/OmegaRedDawn-714604.jpg

That's amusing, because he's canadian...

Posted: 6/15/2009 8:59:52 AM EDT

[#26]

Quoted:
Whoever the author of this is, they are a commie douche-bag.

This reads like something straight out of the KGB propoganda ministry.

And fruitjacket swallowed it hook, line and sinker. Which means one of two things.

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:00:14 AM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:
...

Look, I'm not really looking to get into with someone today, but I am curious....just because the author is a Left Winger (googled him..he's a socialist), does that mean that the article isn't factual?

Are you joking?

If someone is spewing anti-capitalist ideological dogma instead of making actual informed and factual arguments, is that a problem?

Um - yeah.

Check out some of the "factual statements" in the garbage you posted:

... the American imperium. ...

...the criminal class on Wall Street...

....America’s imperial expansion in Eurasia and our system of casino capitalism. ....

.... The United States will begin to resemble the Weimar Republic or Zimbabwe....

...an array of proto-fascists, from the Christian right to the goons who disseminate hate talk on Fox News, ...

...America’s military aggression ...

...the economic and, by extension, military domination by the United States. ...

... our permanent war economy,

... America will be composed of a large dispossessed underclass and a tiny empowered oligarchy that will run a ruthless and brutal system of neo-feudalism from secure compounds. Those who resist will be silenced, many by force. We will pay a terrible price, and we will pay this price soon, for the gross malfeasance of our power elite.

It's like something written by a Soviet-era propaganda hack for the Communist Party

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:01:32 AM EDT

[#28]

Quoted:

Quoted:
http://stupendium.com/blog/uploaded_images/OmegaRedDawn-714604.jpg

That's amusing, because he's canadian...

I would think the Russians would understand that the Chinese want Siberia and they can indeed take it if they wanted. We have to maintain a 3 sided triangle with the balance of power between us, China and Russia, it benefits all the parties involved IMHO. The cat is already out of the bag so now this is what we are forced to do, any side helping out one single said against another is begging for war.

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:02:59 AM EDT

[#29]

Quoted:

Quoted:
... and the criminal class on Wall Street,

That's where I stopped reading, comrade.

Don't kid yourself, the people at the top are nothing but professional thieves. White collar locusts, pillaging the country, it's people and the national treasury.

This article is mostly paranoid interpretation of certain events, but there are nuggets of truth mixed in. Anyone who at this point still doesn't realize that we have been taken to the cleaners by "The Capitalists" (which they are not by the way) is a drooling moron. It's funny though that the tables have been turned by Obama. Prior to TARP they were bitching that The Banks were being held hostage by the whims of Congress' constituents and the money need to be handed over without any further delay. Now they have the money and Obama is using it to boss them around. They want to pay off but he won't let them. I wonder how that tastes.

Steve, you've completely lost it. Seriously.

No shit. He's fucking Looney Tunes.

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:06:34 AM EDT

[#30]

Quoted:

Quoted:
... and the criminal class on Wall Street,

That's where I stopped reading, comrade.

Me, too.

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:11:24 AM EDT

[#31]

Quoted:
Author: Chris Hedges

And the rage that has kindled a handful of shootings and hate crimes in the past few weeks will engulf vast segments of a disenfranchised and bewildered working and middle class. The people of this class will demand vengeance, radical change, order and moral renewal, which an array of proto-fascists, from the Christian right to the goons who disseminate hate talk on Fox News, will assure the country they will impose.

[/span]

Make no mistake, children. THIS is the part the author wants to slam home. There are similar blogs all over the 'net...some from very well knows papers who've let the Op_Eds replace the news...and people (lefties) are paying attention and are re-posting them in a mass hysteria of, "Be afraid of all who do not drink the kool aid and follow "The One."

Conform or be cast out.~Rush (The band, not the commentator)

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:16:06 AM EDT

[#32]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Author: Chris Hedges

And the rage that has kindled a handful of shootings and hate crimes in the past few weeks will engulf vast segments of a disenfranchised and bewildered working and middle class. The people of this class will demand vengeance, radical change, order and moral renewal, which an array of proto-fascists, from the Christian right to the goons who disseminate hate talk on Fox News, will assure the country they will impose.

[/span]

Make no mistake, children. THIS is the part the author wants to slam home. There are similar blogs all over the 'net...some from very well knows papers who've let the Op_Eds replace the news...and people (lefties) are paying attention and are re-posting them in a mass hysteria of, "Be afraid of all who do not drink the kool aid and follow "The One."

Conform or be cast out.~Rush (The band, not the commentator)

Ayups. They'll keep painting all who oppose the viewpoints with the same, or similar brush, until everyone that thinks differently is painted into a corner. Though personally, I think the wheels on thier agenda will come off before then.

As for the currency issue? Wouldn't doubt it. China, Russia, Argentina, and a few others have been rumbling about doing so for a couple months now.

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:17:05 AM EDT

[#33]

Quoted:

Quoted:
... and the criminal class on Wall Street,

That's where I stopped reading, comrade.

Same here.

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:21:08 AM EDT

[#34]

which an array of proto-fascists, from the Christian right to the goons who disseminate hate talk on Fox News,

Enough for me

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:21:17 AM EDT

[#35]

which an array of proto-fascists, from the Christian right to the goons who disseminate hate talk on Fox News,

Enough for me

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:21:46 AM EDT

[#36]

Quoted:

Quoted:
... and the criminal class on Wall Street,

That's where I stopped reading, comrade.

Don't kid yourself, the people at the top are nothing but professional thieves. White collar locusts, pillaging the country, it's people and the national treasury.

This article is mostly paranoid interpretation of certain events, but there are nuggets of truth mixed in. Anyone who at this point still doesn't realize that we have been taken to the cleaners by "The Capitalists" (which they are not by the way) is a drooling moron. It's funny though that the tables have been turned by Obama. Prior to TARP they were bitching that The Banks were being held hostage by the whims of Congress' constituents and the money need to be handed over without any further delay. Now they have the money and Obama is using it to boss them around. They want to pay off but he won't let them. I wonder how that tastes.

Steve, you've completely lost it. Seriously.

Oh?

Then explain this to me:

The Banks loaned money to people who were known deadbeats. They loaned them HUGE sums of money. They concocted the interest only loan, they concocted the Adjustable Rate Mortgage, they had experts go on the radio and TV and tell us "DON'T PAY OFF YOUR HOUSE! THE RICH NEVER PAY OFF THEIR HOME, OTHERWISE THEY'D LOSE THEIR TAX SHELTER! GET AN INTEREST ONLY LOAN AND BE LIKE THE RICH!". They told us that our homes were our most stable investment, guaranteed to increase in value, home values never went down, they were better than gold or stocks or anything!

These same banks went to congress and demanded a new bankruptcy law which forced people to repay $10,000 of their outstanding debt if they filed for bankruptcy. They were sick of people borrowing money on credit cards and not paying it back.

Then the inevitable happened. People started defaulting on their homes. Bankers were shocked! People were making their credit card payments and let their mortgage payments lapse. How could this be? The Bankers didn't know what to do. All of the sudden they had a huge surplus of houses, houses prices were falling and even worse, the securities that they bought and sold to each other were now toxic! The markets crashed. Banks folded. Bankers told us that 50% of the world's wealth had evaporated, disappeared into thin air! They begged congress for money, DEMANDED money! They became enraged when they didn't get it! They told us we would have an unfathomable depression from which we would never recover if the money wasn't handed over immediately! So the money was paid. $700 Billion Dollars, plus trillions more in "Guarantees" that no one will tell us who they were given to, what they were for, how they were dispersed or anything else. TRILLIONS! And what was the first thing that the bankers did when they got this TARP money? They paid their bonuses. They bought private jets for executive use. They put together junkets. Then they filtered the money through the network of banks so that it wound up in the hands of foreign banks, banks that had already received TARP payouts and in some cases it just up and disappeared. Why? Because no one knows or cares where it went. The government wasn't paying any attention. The people in charge of TARP told us that it was none of our business.

Did TARP at least help the banks become stable? Did TARP at least avert the disaster? According to the experts who monitored the government's stress tests on the largest banks, there are two key facts. First, the stress test was a sham, nothing more than whipped cream and marshmallows. Second, none of the banks in this country are by any means stable.

And that's just the banking sector. That doesn't even begin to address the Auto Industry or the money that is going to just plain disappear from the stimulus program. Don't tell me that I've lost it. I'm seeing the situation for what it is. If you want to believe that the system is working correctly, that capitalism is alive and well or that ineptitude and insatiable greed have not driven us to the brink of destruction then be my guest. Go get your fiddle Nero.

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:23:18 AM EDT

[#37]

Quoted:
Need cliff notes.

We're going to war. And I mean a "good old fashioned war".

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:25:38 AM EDT

[#38]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Need cliff notes.

We're going to war. And I mean a "good old fashioned war".

Like muskets and trenches shit.

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:26:03 AM EDT

[#39]

The AP story has a decidedly different tone.

Link

Russia, China, Central Asian nations hold summit
By VLADIMIR ISACHENKOV – 4 hours ago

YEKATERINBURG, Russia (AP) — Leaders from Central Asia, China and Afghanistan joined Russia's President Dmitry Medvedev on Monday at a summit that underscored Moscow's determination to maintain influence in its backyard and seek a stronger voice in global economic issues.

Members of the six-nation Shanghai Cooperation Organization and leaders of observer nations are meeting in the Ural Mountains city of Yekaterinburg for two days of talks that are expected to include extensive discussions of Afghanistan.

Medvedev is also expected to meet with Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, whose country has observer status. Amid protests over the Iranian's bitterly disputed re-election, the Iranian Embassy in Moscow said shortly before Ahmadinejad's expected arrival that he was not coming Monday, but later said he would arrive Tuesday.

The Shanghai Cooperation Organization, which Moscow and Beijing have used to counter Western influence in the energy-rich region, is comprised of China, Russia, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan and Uzbekistan. In addition to Iran, Pakistan, India and Mongolia are observer nations.

Medvedev opened the summit by saying that the group would discuss regional security issues and the global financial crisis during the two days of talks.

The Shanghai group gathering will be followed late Tuesday by the first full-fledged summit of BRIC, which links large emerging economies Brazil, Russia, India and China. Medvedev may reprise Russia's call for a new global reserve currency to augment the dollar — one of the many messages Moscow has sent to the U.S. suggesting its global dominance is waning.

Medvedev was expected to meet with Afghan President Hamid Karzai and Pakistani President Asif Ali Zardari on the sidelines of the Shanghai group summit, which Kremlin aide Sergei Prikhodko said would include discussions on Afghanistan.

Amid efforts by Washington and Moscow to improve badly strained ties, the summit will be watched for signs of stronger support from Russia and its neighbors for American-led operations in Afghanistan — in turn a signal of the depth of Russia's determination to mend fences with the U.S.

While Moscow and its neighbors in the Shanghai Cooperation Organization have stressed solidarity with the West on the need for stability in Afghanistan, Kremlin critics say they have used their combined clout in the past to confound U.S. efforts.

In 2005, the Shanghai Cooperation Organization supported Uzbekistan's eviction of U.S. forces from a staging base for operations in neighboring Afghanistan, closing ranks after a violent Uzbek government crackdown on unrest drew sharp Western criticism.

Another Shanghai group member, Kyrgyzstan, announced in February that it was evicting U.S. forces from their only other Central Asian base, citing inadequate economic compensation and other complaints for a decision widely seen as influenced by Russia. U.S. forces must leave by Aug. 18, but U.S. officials say there is still hope for a deal to keep the Manas base.

Karzai appealed to Kyrgyzstan earlier this month to let coalition forces continue using the base, according to Kyrgyz officials, and the Afghan leader could meet with Kyrgyzstan's president for talks during the Yekaterinburg summit.

On Sunday, Kremlin aide Prikhodko said that the Shanghai group has seen "more transparency" from the administration of President Barack Obama on U.S. policy toward Afghanistan and Pakistan. "The niches of interaction with Western countries, including the U.S., may be widened," he said.

Russia and the Central Asian countries have already allowed the transport of non-lethal military supplies across their territory.

Prikhodko did not say what the nations might do to increase cooperation, but made it clear they want a greater say in resolving a major problem close to their borders.

"The Shanghai Cooperation Organization is taking an increasingly active part in working out recommendations for the international community and concrete steps on Afghanistan," he said.

He said the leaders will also discuss broader security issues and the global financial crisis as well as the situation on the Korean peninsula, but that no major statement on North Korea's nuclear activity was expected.

Copyright © 2009 The Associated Press. All rights reserved

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:28:33 AM EDT

[#40]

As for the end of U.S global dominance... I don't think our military is going to be superseded any time soon. The world is still a dangerous place, and it's not getting any safer.

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:30:31 AM EDT

[#41]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Author: Chris Hedges

And the rage that has kindled a handful of shootings and hate crimes in the past few weeks will engulf vast segments of a disenfranchised and bewildered working and middle class. The people of this class will demand vengeance, radical change, order and moral renewal, which an array of proto-fascists, from the Christian right to the goons who disseminate hate talk on Fox News, will assure the country they will impose.

[/span]

Make no mistake, children. THIS is the part the author wants to slam home. There are similar blogs all over the 'net...some from very well knows papers who've let the Op_Eds replace the news...and people (lefties) are paying attention and are re-posting them in a mass hysteria of, "Be afraid of all who do not drink the kool aid and follow "The One."

Conform or be cast out.~Rush (The band, not the commentator)

Ayups. They'll keep painting all who oppose the viewpoints with the same, or similar brush, until everyone that thinks differently is painted into a corner. Though personally, I think the wheels on thier agenda will come off before then.

As for the currency issue? Wouldn't doubt it. China, Russia, Argentina, and a few others have been rumbling about doing so for a couple months now.

Another one illustrating what I've said: Thread

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:33:07 AM EDT

[#42]

Quoted:
As for the end of U.S global dominance... I don't think our military is going to be superseded any time soon. The world is still a dangerous place, and it's not getting any safer.

The military doesn't function on dedication, loyalty and bravery alone. The military needs money. We're already seeing cuts to current weapons systems and developing weapons systems. Expect more in the future. Clinton downsized our military to the point that they were considering having to convert nuclear weapons to conventional weapons when we bombed Yugoslavia because we were running low on conventional munitions. You think Obama is going to keep the military strong?

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:34:23 AM EDT

[#43]

Quoted:

As for the end of U.S global dominance... I don't think our military is going to be superseded any time soon. The world is still a dangerous place, and it's not getting any safer.

If it's defunded because our economy collapses, it won't matter.

The Soviet Union had a really nice military about 20 years ago, then they went broke and it all rusted away.

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:35:58 AM EDT

[#44]

Quoted:
As for the end of U.S global dominance... I don't think our military is going to be superseded any time soon. The world is still a dangerous place, and it's not getting any safer.

It's not that it would be superseded. We just won't be able to pay for it.

ETA: Synchronicity (post 615)

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:39:39 AM EDT

[#45]

Quoted:

Quoted:
... and the criminal class on Wall Street,

That's where I stopped reading, comrade.

Don't kid yourself, the people at the top are nothing but professional thieves. White collar locusts, pillaging the country, it's people and the national treasury.

Your posts are usually pretty spot on, but I gotta say "WUT?!" to this one.

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:40:10 AM EDT

[#46]

A citizen must, in the 21st Century, have the discretion to be able to filter truth from falsehood and fact from fantasy. One must, upon reading any article, chronicle the source of the information, the facts that were used to support the allegations and the method by which the author states the premise of the article. None of what was written in the article was attributed to anyone neither were the sources used. In that case it becomes one man's opinion among many. Read all that you can about this situation and then make your own informed choice. I would not depend upon an Internet source any more than I would a manistream media outlet. After all, the major reason that anyone writes for or appears on these programs is to sell advertising or create more readers or viewers. I woud suspect anyone, at any time, who pronounces one meeting as a watershed or a deal of the century without a careful and thoughtful analysis of the global financial crisis that all countries are facing, including Russia, China, India, United States and the European Union. This was not the Yalta Conference where FDR, Churchill and Uncle Joe Stalin carved up the world post-WWII. It was a meeting of a series of financial advisers moving funds to and from certain countries for economic development. Far be it from me to tilt the tinfoil hat to the side and get a different take on the argument but when any country threatens to pull the economic plug on the world's larges economy they do so at their own economic peril. The prospect of riots in the streets is more apt after a Lakers victory than the fall of Wall Street by 200 points. Chances are that the mess on the Street will be cleaned up far quicker than the mess around the Staples Center in downtown LA.

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:40:23 AM EDT

[#47]

Quoted:

Quoted:
As for the end of U.S global dominance... I don't think our military is going to be superseded any time soon. The world is still a dangerous place, and it's not getting any safer.

It's not that it would be superseded. We just won't be able to pay for it.

We still have a rich continent. Energy reserves are not what they used to be but they're not depleted either. If push came to shove and the worlds economy were rebooted, most of the same factors that brought us to prominence over the last couple of centuries would still be in place.

Nobody is better at growing food than us. Nobody has a better defence infrastructure in place right now.

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:41:17 AM EDT

[#48]

Quoted:

This article is mostly paranoid interpretation of certain events, but there are nuggets of truth mixed in

Quite.........dont dismiss the entire article because of its source. At least not yet.

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:43:44 AM EDT

[#49]

Quoted:

Quoted:
... and the criminal class on Wall Street,

That's where I stopped reading, comrade.

Don't kid yourself, the people at the top are nothing but professional thieves. White collar locusts, pillaging the country, it's people and the national treasury.

Your posts are usually pretty spot on, but I gotta say "WUT?!" to this one.

You've forgotten about TARP already?

You've forgotten about the TRILLIONS in "guarantees" paid to private banks by the Federal Reserve that we know nothing about because they refused to tell who the money went to, even thought Congress and the Federal Government are supposed to have the power to monitor their activities?

Come on dude!

Posted: 6/15/2009 9:45:52 AM EDT

[#50]

Quoted:

Quoted:

... and the criminal class on Wall Street,

That's where I stopped reading, comrade.

Barack Obama, and the criminal class on Wall Street, aided by a corporate media that continues to peddle fatuous gossip and trash talk as news while we endure the greatest economic crisis in our history, may have fooled us, but the rest of the world knows we are bankrupt.

I read the complete sentence and had no need to read further. Anyone who puts barry obama's idiocy ahead of bush's idiocy - AT THIS MOMENT IN TIME - is a fool. To imply this financial disaster began in the last five months is incredibly stupid/ignorant.
5sub

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - This isn't good. I guess this is why the DOW is down 200pts this morning. (Page 1 of 3)

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