Stupid People love guns!!!!

Posted: 12/14/2001 12:05:05 PM EDT

I thought that would get your attention!
You will not believe what a couple of dirtbags tried in my shop just now.
They asked if I had any guns on consignment.
I told them I had a few and they asked to see them. They wanted a couple of rifles I had and we made a deal. When they paid up and I handed the guy who paid me a form 4473. He said this to me. I don't have to do a yellow sheet on a used gun. I politely informed him he was mistaken. He then said he would pay me an extra $50.00 if I would sell them to him with no paperwork. I laughed and handed him his money back.
I am wondering how often Guys try to pull that kind of Bullshit on dealers. This is the first time anybody tried it on me.
Please post some feedback and let me know what you think.

Posted: 12/14/2001 12:09:13 PM EDT

[#1]

BATF narc.

Good call, SSppy.

Posted: 12/14/2001 12:10:48 PM EDT

[#2]

Quoted:
BATF narc.

Good call, SSppy.

View Quote

for once, we agree!

Posted: 12/14/2001 12:14:28 PM EDT

[#3]

Did their van say "Flowers By Irene" or "Big Al's Trucking Firm" on the side?

Posted: 12/14/2001 12:17:56 PM EDT

[#4]

Damn right it ws the ATF,I bet it's a slow week.

If I had a FFL I would keep an eye out for more crap like that you are not the only dealer they pulled that with.

It's the same thing as when they send a high school kid in to buy a pack of smokes and sit out side to the story and see if the guys dose it.

Posted: 12/14/2001 12:19:01 PM EDT

[#5]

I would say it was a setup as well

Better to lose the sale than to lose the sale and wind up in the license plate making business...

Posted: 12/14/2001 12:27:54 PM EDT

[#6]

I had this happen twice to me when i was working retail in a gunshop. The second time the guy stuffed a $100 dollar bill in my shirt pocket. I thought about keeping it and kicking him out for a second but handed it back and asked him to leave before i retrieved one of the cops that were shooting on the indoor range 20 feet away.

Posted: 12/14/2001 12:28:03 PM EDT

[#7]

When any other agency does that, it's called "entrapment" When they do it, it's called "SOP"

Posted: 12/14/2001 12:39:39 PM EDT

[#8]

I don't know who this pair was but they won't be pulling that crap on me again.
I guess they thought I would risk my business and reputation for $50.00 bucks.
I don't think they were the Feds but I would not care to make a bet with anyone about it.

Posted: 12/14/2001 12:42:45 PM EDT

[#9]

Quoted:
... They asked if I had any guns on consignment

View Quote

... That would be your first clue that something was stinky

Posted: 12/14/2001 12:44:18 PM EDT

[#10]

Quoted:

I don't think they were the Feds ...

View Quote

What makes you say that????

Posted: 12/14/2001 12:46:27 PM EDT

[#11]

You probably saved the store from being burned down.

Posted: 12/14/2001 12:53:49 PM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
I don't think they were the Feds but I would not care to make a bet with anyone about it.

View Quote

feds or crooks. hard to tell the diff sometimes.

Posted: 12/14/2001 12:56:49 PM EDT

[#13]

If there's a next time:

Tell 'em you need to contact the consignee to see if they'll accept the offer, then call BATF and have 'em show up while you stretch out the deal timewise.

Bingo. Two less flunkies in our ranks.

[-!-!-] [:D]

Posted: 12/14/2001 12:57:22 PM EDT

[#14]

I don't know, but it seems that whenever someone mentions a potential blatant rule violation of firearms law that a member is presented with, everyone seems to think that it's a BATF 'narc'.

Personally, I think that the majority of these "tests" are from shifty types who just want to try to get away with something...

The example above is so blatant, it's unintelligent! No storefront FFL (in their right mind) would gamble their business on a $50 bribe(especially with the hoops that FFL's need to go through)- it's too simple to turn down the transaction, and the ATF knows that. If I were trying to "test" someone on laws, etc, I wouldn't test with a statement like "I don't need to fill out paperwork on a used gun." (Then again, I'm not in the ATF-maybe it's worked for them in the past!!!)

As long as you're on the up-and-up, this scenario will never be a problem...

Scumbag, yes. ATF, probably no.[peep]

Let the flames begin.

Posted: 12/14/2001 12:57:30 PM EDT

[#15]

If I an not mistaken the Federal Government has dental insurance. The one had the worst set of teeth I have ever saw. Looked like those fake Bubba teeth. The other one had several cheap tattos and both of them needed a bath in the worst way.
If they were under cover they were pretty damn good at it.

Posted: 12/14/2001 1:04:03 PM EDT

[#16]

Thats what undercover is all about.
They invented Bubba teeth.

Posted: 12/14/2001 1:10:21 PM EDT

[#17]

i know you guys don't like em. but there are SUPPOSED to be good at it. when my friend and i are doing our covert missions (i mean playing paintball) we "go dirtbag".

dressing like crap and not combing our hair. for the shitty minivan we drive we hack off the hubcabs and get it really muddy.

it sounds bad but it really works. people never give us a second look. (the first one is usually bad enough).

it's great. we can look normal too.

OffRoad

Posted: 12/14/2001 1:10:48 PM EDT

[#18]

Quoted:
BATF narc.

Good call, SSppy.

View Quote

BINGO!!!

Classic ATF entrapment technique.

Posted: 12/14/2001 1:28:34 PM EDT

[#19]

Quoted:
feds or crooks. hard to tell the diff sometimes.

View Quote

Sad, isn't it.

Perhaps these guys were not narcs based on their physical description. However, cops have tried to pull some pretty f'd up stuff here in IL.

In Illinois, you must have an FOID card (firearm owner ID) to buy a gun or ammo. A nice trick that cops like to pull at gun shows is to throw $10 on a dealer's table and grab a box of ammo. Then they just run away. Later, they come back and bust the "seller" for not checking for a FOID. Bullshit, isn't it?

I wouldn't put any of this beyond the so-called "law enforcement" in this country. Instead of busting real criminals, the legislature invents new crimes and hoops for law-abiding citizens and business owners tho jump through. Then the executive instructs the police to bust us on some bullshit technicalities. Or, in other cases, they send the cops to entrap people.

When will we say "enough is enough"?

Posted: 12/14/2001 1:29:38 PM EDT

[#20]

you mean if I wore something besides an OD Green GI tshirt, let my hair grow out, and looked at something besides SKS's, the dealers wouldn't treat me like a BATF troll? [:K]
[}:D]

Posted: 12/14/2001 1:47:45 PM EDT

[#21]

It could easily be some crook the ATF caught and has promised to reduce their sentence if they can turn someone in for violating the law.

Then if it goes sour the ATF just denies everything. Who's the media going to belive the ATF or a crook?

Posted: 12/14/2001 1:57:04 PM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:

Quoted:
feds or crooks. hard to tell the diff sometimes.

View Quote

Sad, isn't it.

Perhaps these guys were not narcs based on their physical description. However, cops have tried to pull some pretty f'd up stuff here in IL.

In Illinois, you must have an FOID card (firearm owner ID) to buy a gun or ammo. A nice trick that cops like to pull at gun shows is to throw $10 on a dealer's table and grab a box of ammo. Then they just run away. Later, they come back and bust the "seller" for not checking for a FOID. Bullshit, isn't it?

I wouldn't put any of this beyond the so-called "law enforcement" in this country. Instead of busting real criminals, the legislature invents new crimes and hoops for law-abiding citizens and business owners tho jump through. Then the executive instructs the police to bust us on some bullshit technicalities. Or, in other cases, they send the cops to entrap people.

When will we say "enough is enough"?

View Quote

I agree whole-heartedly. I interned as a community service officer when I was 19. Part of my job was to go into bars, stores, mini-marts, any place that sold liquor and try and buy booze. If I succeeded in buying, the "real" cops would swoop in and arrest the clerk and/or owner. At the time, I thought I was making a difference, but now I think it sucks that we arrested honest hard working people just because some of them forgot to ask for ID.

Posted: 12/14/2001 1:57:41 PM EDT

[#23]

Originally posted by SWIRE

It could easily be some crook the ATF caught and has promised to reduce their sentence if they can turn someone in for violating the law.

Then if it goes sour the ATF just denies everything. Who's the media going to belive the ATF or a crook?

I think you just hit the nail on the head. Thats exactly what my partner thought when he came by and I told him about it.

Posted: 12/14/2001 2:10:48 PM EDT

[#24]

ATF is thick as theives around here right now. Story I just heard concerning a local gun shop was that they took one of his regular customers, scared the hell out of him with prison threats and fines, wired him and sent him in to get the FFL to start talking. Another argument for never ever selling any of your guns.

Posted: 12/14/2001 2:17:37 PM EDT

[#25]

If not undercover BATF they very well could have been 2 dirtbags that had "caught a case" from the BATF are trying to cut a deal with them for lesser charges. They just need a some poor yutz to give up to the Federales

"bubba? ifn y'all cut me a break on this other suf we got goin on har, I happen t'know of a good ol boy down at "Sportsmans Supply" that ifin I ax him he'll sell me some firepower witout nona that there paperwork." All y'all gots to do is cut me some slack on that other stuff an he's your's."

(just like SWIRE said if I had bothered to read the posts more closely) [>:/][%|]

Posted: 12/14/2001 2:46:13 PM EDT

[#26]

I vote for Okies or Arkies. I'm from Oklahoma, while I've never even SEEN a fed, I've seen plenty how dumb most folk are 'roun here.

Posted: 12/14/2001 3:57:38 PM EDT

[#27]

ErickM, I'm from Oklahoma, too. You say you've never seen a Fed. That sounds to me like YOU are a Fed just trying to cover your trail.
[;)] [;)] [:E]

Posted: 12/14/2001 4:05:28 PM EDT

[#28]

I LOVE GUNS! Call me what you may. We'll see who the last man standing is smarty pants.

[50]Whoo woo! Is this thing dedicated to me?

Posted: 12/14/2001 8:24:36 PM EDT

[#29]

The example above is so blatant, it's unintelligent!

View Quote

.....Which means it HAD to have been the Feds!

Posted: 12/15/2001 3:09:51 AM EDT

[#30]

Our Taxes dollars at work...He!..He!..He!

Entrapment is illegal isn't it?

Posted: 2/17/2002 8:13:18 AM EDT

[#31]

Who is Dp?

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