NPR Story: Marine marries (hot) Iraqi girl, struggles to make ends meet in Ozark, MO

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - NPR Story: Marine marries (hot) Iraqi girl, struggles to make ends meet in Ozark, MO (Page 1 of 3)

Posted: 10/17/2008 9:52:57 AM EDT

Heard this story on NPR this morning, and thought it was an interesting human drama story.

The story is a little bit sensational, in that the Marine Sgt breaks his wrist at his construction job, and is unable to find a job. His wife, without a green card or anything is forced to get employment at a strip club.

Yes, she is attractive.

Being a victim of abuse, their family runs into issues when the Marine suspects his wife of abusing their kid. As of this morning, his wife's whereabouts are unknown.

NPR Story Link (With Pictures and Audio slideshow)

Munira Shahamorad was 20 years old and dressed head to toe in all-concealing black robes when she showed up at the gates of the U.S. Marine base in Fallujah, Iraq, looking for a job. She was desperate to escape her brother, who she says beat her and dragged her around by the hair.

"She came in with nothing, just the clothes on her back," said Sgt. Ivan Galvan, who worked closely with the Iraqi employees on the base. "One of the questions she was asking," Galvan recalled, "was what were we going to be able to provide for her safety."

The Americans gave the slender young woman from Fallujah a job as an interpreter and a room to live in. She earned $1,050 a month, more money than she had ever seen before. But she would never go home to see her family again. Signing on with the U.S. military could have meant a death sentence — probably in the form of an "honor killing" carried out by a male relative. To protect Shahamorad's identity, a U.S. officer gave her a nickname: Venus.

Shahamorad spent most of her salary on perfume, clothes and electronics sold at the base PX. She also started drinking alcohol, which was provided by other civilian contractors. It was on the base that Shahamorad first met the man who would one day become her husband, Sgt. Steve Campbell.

"First day I saw her, I told the guy that we were relieving, 'I'm in love, I'm gonna marry her,' " Campbell said. Soon, the Iraqi outcast and the American sergeant were having an illicit love affair on the base.

From Lovers To Husband-And-Wife

That was more then 3 years ago. After an unplanned pregnancy, Campbell's honorable discharge from the military and an arduous journey that left Shahamorad stranded in Turkey for nine months, the former Marine finally married his Iraqi Venus in Ozark, Mo.

"I couldn't afford rings when we got married, but my younger brother — he does tattoos. And he's cheap, so we got him some alcohol, and he got us permanent rings. She has one, too," Campbell said. The couple have each other's names, written in Arabic script, tattooed in ring form around their fingers.

Shahamorad's first lesson in America was to avoid telling people where she was from.

When Susan Avery learned that her neighbor was Iraqi, she admits she was frightened. "At first, it kind of scared me," Avery said. "But as far as Venus goes, she came here and straightened out a lot of thoughts that I had on the war, and a lot of thoughts that I had towards those people."

Campbell's father, Gerry, said, "People do act kind of weird when they find out she's from Iraq." He added, laughing, "She's gonna terrorize you, all right. Throw your dishes around the kitchen; cuss you in a different language."

Financial Hardships

One day at work, Campbell fell and badly broke his wrist. It cost him his job as a construction worker.

Unemployed and with his wife pregnant with their second baby, the Iraq veteran began pawning off personal belongings and even selling blood to make ends meet.

" pawned off a lot of things, I've sold plasma several times," Campbell said. "You can make a lot of money if you just keep doing it — make decent money or enough to pay a bill, pay an electric bill or get some gas in the car."

"We had to have a long talk about like, America's not easy," Campbell said of his conversations with Shahamorad. "You have to pay for everything, nothing's free. Nothing is free, not even your freedom."

For Shahamorad, the financial hardships were a wake-up call.

"Have to really work hard," Shahamorad said. "Bills — he was talking about different bills every day, and I was like, 'What is that?' I ask a lot, 'What is this? What is this?' Because I don't know. What does car insurance mean? We don't have such a thing called car insurance. We don't have like electric bills. Stuff like that."

Searching For A Job

Shahamorad cradled and rhythmically patted her newborn son, Xander, on the back as she described going door to door in Ozark looking for a job. At one point, she was excited when the fast-food chain Wendy's offered to hire her.

"They gave me a uniform!" Shahamorad said. "[But then] they were like, 'You don't have a Social Security number? Green card?' And I'm like, 'No, I've only been here a few months.' They said, 'Sorry, we cannot let you work here.' "

Eventually, the young Iraqi mother found a bar where the manager didn't ask too many questions.

"The woman there, she said she don't need a waitress, she need a dancer," Shahamorad said. "I was like, 'Wow, dancer!' I used to do belly-dancing, you mean belly-dancing? I'll put my clothes on me, but she's like, 'No, it's different kind of dance.' "

It was a strip bar. That night, Shahamorad drummed up the courage to go on stage. She came home with $350 in her pocket.

The woman who couldn't even step outside her house in Fallujah without wearing a veil began pole-dancing — topless — under the strobe lights. None of the customers who buy her drinks and throw dollars onto the stage know that the performing Venus is Iraqi.

Troubles At Home

The work brought the young family much-needed money, but it strained what was already an often tempestuous relationship. The couple fought on almost a nightly basis.

"Hated it since day one, and still do," Campbell said.

For Shahamorad, pole-dancing was a question of survival.

"Every day, I think about not going back there, that I'm no doing it any more," she said. "But then what am I gonna do? Die hungry? Not have a place to stay? I might go back to Iraq if Brad [her first child] wasn't here."

One day, Campbell came home from his new job welding cars for $10 an hour and found his wife distressed and agitated, and his 1-year-old son, Bradley, covered with bruises.

"That's one thing I won't tolerate," Campbell said. That night, he called the police and watched as they took Shahamorad away in handcuffs.

Not An Isolated Case

In court, a prosecutor threatened Shahamorad with seven years in prison for child abuse and urged her to go back to Iraq. Bradley was placed in foster care, and Shahamorad was ordered into therapy and couples' counseling with Campbell, who was diagnosed with post-traumatic stress disorder, most likely compounded by his two tours of duty in Iraq.

"I think they're a product of war," said Bonnie Vawter, a children's services worker who handled their case.

"We have two people who met each other during war. They fell in love. They're trying to make a life with each other," Vawter said. "They have a lot of obstacles, just because of their circumstances and the cultural differences and citizenship and things like that. And I don't think this is an isolated case."

In September, after months of supervised visits, the Department of Family Services finally gave Shahamorad and Campbell full custody of their talkative, smiling son Bradley.

"Venus has just finally got it together," Vawter said in a telephone interview shortly afterward. "They're good parents; they just didn't have the resources and the tools."

This month, a judge at the circuit court in Christian County, Mo., handed Shahamorad a less severe sentence than the prosecutor initially asked for: five years' supervised probation. The suspended sentence does not include a felony conviction for child abuse.

"She entered a guilty plea, but the judge was not going to convict her," said Paul Duchscherer, Shahamorad's public defender. "It is a wonderful result, and she earned it with time and effort."

Hopes Dashed

With Shahamorad's fluency in Arabic and Kurdish, and her prior experience working with the Marines, the Campbells had pinned their hopes on finding potentially lucrative work for Shahamorad as an interpreter for the U.S. government or military. They were waiting for the authorities to approve her six-month old application for a work permit.

But last Tuesday, Campbell says he returned home to once again find Bradley covered with bruises.

The former Marine immediately accused his wife of abusing the child, accusations he says Shahamorad denied. Campbell kicked her out of the house, and says he took her cell phone before she left. That was the last time Campbell saw his wife.

Bradley was hospitalized that night.

Campbell was distraught as he spoke by telephone from the pediatric ward of St. John's Hospital in Springfield, Mo., on Wednesday night. He wondered aloud whether he had been too quick to jump to conclusions by accusing Shahamorad, and added that Bradley could have been injured tumbling from the top of his new bunk bed.

The Springfield Police Department has launched an investigation into the incident.

"Nobody has been charged or anything. I can't say whether or not it's going to be criminal," said a detective from the children's division. Neither the detective nor Campbell say they have any way of reaching Shahamorad. NPR could not reach Shahamorad this week for comment.

On Thursday night, officials from the Department of Family Services took custody of both children from Campbell.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:02:22 AM EDT

[#1]

I heard that story.

There's a slide show (before the abuse stuff came up) up on NPR.

I'm trying to understand what this woman was doing to their kid.

Frankly, and I have all the respect for that serviceman in the world, but HE should have figured out a way, ANY WAY, to avoid having his wife swing on the pole.

That's just fucking horrible. She's a beautiful woman, but the degrading situation is enough to drive anyone batshit and child abuse is something she herself had to deal with, no doubt, given the background of what her brother was doing. Its not an excuse for the woman, but god damn, that's his WIFE.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:05:15 AM EDT

[#2]

Quoted:
I heard that story.

There's a slide show (before the abuse stuff came up) up on NPR.

I'm trying to understand what this woman was doing to their kid.

Frankly, and I have all the respect for that serviceman in the world, but HE should have figured out a way, ANY WAY, to avoid having his wife swing on the pole.

That's just fucking horrible. She's a beautiful woman, but the degrading situation is enough to drive anyone batshit and child abuse is something she herself had to deal with. Its not an excuse for the woman, but god damn, that's his WIFE.

She learned survival in a harsh school. She will do anything so survive. Don't blame her for the will to survive.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:05:30 AM EDT

[#3]

She gots nice beewbees.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:05:35 AM EDT

[#4]

That story is full of

.

Not sure what to say except that there's gotta be a trailer in there somewhere on this couple.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:05:47 AM EDT

[#5]

You'd have to get me to apply to a lot of places before i applied to a strip club...

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:07:53 AM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:
She gots nice beewbees.

Indeed!

But wow... she's like a poster child for the militant's claim of the West being the Great Satan.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:09:10 AM EDT

[#7]

The guy strikes me as a pussy, PTSD or not. Like Gonzo said, do something - move, re-enlist, work two jobs - anything. Men don't let their wives become pseudo-whores.

Why doesn't she have a work permit if they are married? Isn't she a U.S. citizen now?

Their kid is the real loser in this mess.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:11:37 AM EDT

[#8]

My family would be living out of a car before my wife started stripping. Dignity, respect, and honor is worth more than money.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:13:13 AM EDT

[#9]

No wonder they hate us. We went over there and took the one hot chick.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:13:32 AM EDT

[#10]

I wish I could marry a hot Iraqi girl.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:14:00 AM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:
That story is full of

.

Not sure what to say except that there's gotta be a trailer in there somewhere on this couple.

No shit. Struggling to make ends meet but they have a dog and they are eating take-out and watching TV. What did he do with his GI Bill? Why doesn't she have a work visa?

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:15:17 AM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
No wonder they hate us. We went over there and took the one hot chick.

I don't think that is true ....but it is funny as hell

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:16:23 AM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:
You'd have to get me to apply to a lot of places before i applied to a strip club...

You don't have many options when you don't have a green card.

The jobs that illegal mexicans take are far worse.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:16:34 AM EDT

[#14]

She has zero accent.

Interesting story.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:16:52 AM EDT

[#15]

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:17:23 AM EDT

[#16]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That story is full of

.

Not sure what to say except that there's gotta be a trailer in there somewhere on this couple.

No shit. Struggling to make ends meet but they have a dog and they are eating take-out and watching TV. What did he do with his GI Bill? Wh doesn't she have a work visa?

I'd guess he was dishonorably discharged for the affair. I'd suggest she's not legal. I'd suggest that the man let his little head do the thinking when he decided to marry a woman who was so brutally abused by her own brother that knocking on the door of the occupying forces seemed like her last option. To think there wouldn't be lingering issues that would impact his future family was dumb.

But he assumed responsibility and a man simply doesn't stand by and let his wife bring home the bacon while selling her flesh. God knows money is tight enough she probably turned a trick or two, just watch how it turns out. That part of it makes me sick. None of the military men I know would approve of the outcome here.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:18:09 AM EDT

[#17]

Quoted:

Quoted:
I heard that story.

There's a slide show (before the abuse stuff came up) up on NPR.

I'm trying to understand what this woman was doing to their kid.

Frankly, and I have all the respect for that serviceman in the world, but HE should have figured out a way, ANY WAY, to avoid having his wife swing on the pole.

That's just fucking horrible. She's a beautiful woman, but the degrading situation is enough to drive anyone batshit and child abuse is something she herself had to deal with. Its not an excuse for the woman, but god damn, that's his WIFE.

She learned survival in a harsh school. She will do anything so survive. Don't blame her for the will to survive.

I'd like to know how hard Mr. Husband looked for work while she was doing so.

I know that area well - work is available, employers are overjoyed to find someone who will show up on time. A bad wrist won't keep you out of most jobs.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:18:24 AM EDT

[#18]

no Pics?

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:18:53 AM EDT

[#19]

Quoted:

Quoted:
You'd have to get me to apply to a lot of places before i applied to a strip club...

You don't have many options when you don't have a green card.

The jobs that illegal mexicans take are far worse.

Worse in what way?

Many of the females get jobs as janitors, housekeepers, wait or kitchen staff. It might be hard work but the chances are pretty slim they'll get cum on them or have to jerk guys off behind the ice machine.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:19:20 AM EDT

[#20]

Quoted:
no Pics?

LInk in the first post.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:19:54 AM EDT

[#21]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That story is full of

.

Not sure what to say except that there's gotta be a trailer in there somewhere on this couple.

No shit. Struggling to make ends meet but they have a dog and they are eating take-out and watching TV. What did he do with his GI Bill? Wh doesn't she have a work visa?

I'd guess he was dishonorably discharged for the affair. I'd suggest she's not legal. I'd suggest that the man let his little head do the thinking when he decided to marry a woman who was so brutally abused by her own brother that knocking on the door of the occupying forces seemed like her last option. To think there wouldn't be lingering issues that would impact his future family was dumb.

But he assumed responsibility and a man simply doesn't stand by and let his wife bring home the bacon while selling her flesh. God knows money is tight enough she probably turned a trick or two, just watch how it turns out. That part of it makes me sick. None of the military men I know would approve of the outcome here.

According to the story, he was honorably discharged.

If I was him, I'd honestly move the fuck outta Ozark, MO, and head for a location with a bigger job market. I mean, he doesn't have to move to CA, but there are probably decent paying office jobs in the hundreds of mid sized cities in America.

Quoted:

Worse in what way?

Many of the females get jobs as janitors, housekeepers, wait or kitchen staff. It might be hard work but the chances are pretty slim they'll get cum on them or have to jerk guys off behind the ice machine.

That's a good point I guess, but I don't think it's right to assume every girl in the strip joint is a whore. I've been to the strip club many a times, and never gotten anything other than a lap dance or seen any "under the table" deals.

Old Mexican ladies with no sex appeal do grunt work. Hot ones leverage their looks. I mean we all can stand on our moral high grounds, but this woman had to support her husband and two kids... Doubt a grunt job would have paid for everything.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:20:02 AM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:
The guy strikes me as a pussy, PTSD or not. Like Gonzo said, do something - move, re-enlist, work two jobs - anything. Men don't let their wives become pseudo-whores.

Why doesn't she have a work permit if they are married? Isn't she a U.S. citizen now?

Their kid is the real loser in this mess.

Yup. Just another Obama voter for sure.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:20:25 AM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:

Quoted:
You'd have to get me to apply to a lot of places before i applied to a strip club...

You don't have many options when you don't have a green card.

The jobs that illegal mexicans take are far worse.

Cleaning hotel rooms and/or people's homes is worse for a woman than working the pole?

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:21:22 AM EDT

[#24]

The guy sounds like a real winner. "Falls in love" the first day he sees the woman, knocks her up, marries her when he can't even afford a ring... buys his brother booze so he'll tattoo rings on them, the best job he can manage is "welding cars", etc. etc.

Her situation is better here than in Iraq, but she sure ended up with a loser.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:24:16 AM EDT

[#25]

Struggling to make ends meet, but they have enough money for cigarettes.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:24:47 AM EDT

[#26]

when you're struggling to make money, you get rid of the damn dog and you don't order food like that. You make your own.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:25:42 AM EDT

[#27]

Down in the Ozarks, this is not unusual. I've seen some real deliverance shit down there. It's not pretty.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:26:19 AM EDT

[#28]

Good looking woman , HELL I'd tip her.......

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:27:03 AM EDT

[#29]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That story is full of

.

Not sure what to say except that there's gotta be a trailer in there somewhere on this couple.

No shit. Struggling to make ends meet but they have a dog and they are eating take-out and watching TV. What did he do with his GI Bill? Wh doesn't she have a work visa?

I'd guess he was dishonorably discharged for the affair. I'd suggest she's not legal. I'd suggest that the man let his little head do the thinking when he decided to marry a woman who was so brutally abused by her own brother that knocking on the door of the occupying forces seemed like her last option. To think there wouldn't be lingering issues that would impact his future family was dumb.

But he assumed responsibility and a man simply doesn't stand by and let his wife bring home the bacon while selling her flesh. God knows money is tight enough she probably turned a trick or two, just watch how it turns out. That part of it makes me sick. None of the military men I know would approve of the outcome here.

According to the story, he was honorable discharged.

If I was him, I'd honestly move the fuck outta Ozark, MO, and head for a location with a bigger job market. I mean, he doesn't have to move to CA, but there are probably decent paying office jobs in the hundreds of mid sized cities in America.

Ozark is just two highway exits away from Springfield - huge job market.

Again - there is no lack of work in that area.

I worked my way through college there - actually lived in Ozark for a spell.

My mother does day care in that very town - even that is dirt cheap. Any part time job can pay for a car and food for three, no sweat - plus child care.

Heck, the new GI bill alone can be paying for their housing and utilities, while letting our "hero" retrain into a less physically demanding field.

It sounds to me like two losers who were meant for each other, found each other.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:27:22 AM EDT

[#30]

Damn, she has nice cans a a great turd cutter

Pretty sure there is no way I would get to the point where my wife needed to strip to put food on the table though.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:28:42 AM EDT

[#31]

Quoted:

It sounds to me like two losers who were meant for each other, found each other.

Exactly.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:29:34 AM EDT

[#32]

Quoted:
I wish I could marry a hot Iraqi girl.

Seriously. She can come live with me, I'll whore MYSELF out before I let anyone but me see her goods

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:30:01 AM EDT

[#33]

Quoted:

That's a good point I guess, but I don't think it's right to assume every girl in the strip joint is a whore. I've been to the strip club many a times, and never gotten anything other than a lap dance or seen any "under the table" deals.

Old Mexican ladies with no sex appeal do grunt work. Hot ones leverage their looks. I mean we all can stand on our moral high grounds, but this woman had to support her husband and two kids... Doubt a grunt job would have paid for everything.

You didn't try hard enough. I've been to titty bars in most every state and some foreign countries. They all had one thing in common......offer the right amount and you will get laid. Now the "right amount" might be $20 or it might be $100 but the point is the ladies aren't stripping because of their moral fiber and excellent life choices.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:30:17 AM EDT

[#34]

No workers comp for a broken wrist on the job?

There is so much in this story that doesn't add up it would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

Marriage to a US citizen does not automatically/immediately result in citizenship or a green card. Sounds like the guy didn't plan very well.....

Brian

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:30:26 AM EDT

[#35]

Iraqi stripper in Missouri?

Now I have seen everything.

And damn that bitch is hot.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:30:37 AM EDT

[#36]

Quoted:

Frankly, and I have all the respect for that serviceman in the world, but HE should have figured out a way, ANY WAY, to avoid having his wife swing on the pole.

Why?

Seriously, what's so awfully wrong about pole dancing? Willing, consenting adults and all that. It isn't terribly uncommon for girls to pay their way through school by dancing. And no, they don't all become disease-ridden, drug-addicted whores. Those that do probably turned to dancing as an end in and of itself, rather than as a means to an end.

And yes, if my girlfriend could bring in more than I make by dancing, I'd have no problem with it. I might be tempted to sit and watch with a tire-checker under my coat, but that would be about the leches in the crowd, not because I figured that she was gonna start fucking every dude in sight just because she took her clothes off.

I just don't get this bizarre American prudishness about sex and nudity.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:30:38 AM EDT

[#37]

Quoted:
The guy strikes me as a pussy, PTSD or not. Like Gonzo said, do something - move, re-enlist, work two jobs - anything. Men don't let their wives become pseudo-whores.

Why doesn't she have a work permit if they are married? Isn't she a U.S. citizen now?

Their kid is the real loser in this mess.

This.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:32:02 AM EDT

[#38]

She looks pretty hot! This should not constitute BOTD, if so delete.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:32:49 AM EDT

[#39]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Frankly, and I have all the respect for that serviceman in the world, but HE should have figured out a way, ANY WAY, to avoid having his wife swing on the pole.

Why?

Seriously, what's so awfully wrong about pole dancing? Willing, consenting adults and all that. It isn't terribly uncommon for girls to pay their way through school by dancing. And no, they don't all become disease-ridden, drug-addicted whores. Those that do probably turned to dancing as an end in and of itself, rather than as a means to an end.

And yes, if my girlfriend could bring in more than I make by dancing, I'd have no problem with it. I might be tempted to sit and watch with a tire-checker under my coat, but that would be about the leches in the crowd, not because I figured that she was gonna start fucking every dude in sight just because she took her clothes off.

I just don't get this bizarre American prudishness about sex and nudity.

How many strippers have you known personally and/or dated?

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:33:31 AM EDT

[#40]

Quoted:

Cleaning hotel rooms and/or people's homes is worse for a woman than working the pole?

Sure doesn't pay nearly as well. You could work your fingers to the bone twelve hours a day, six days a week cleaning, or make the same amount dancing for a few hours a couple of times a week.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:34:25 AM EDT

[#41]

Quoted:

There is so much in this story that doesn't add up

Agree.

something isnt kosher somewhere...

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:36:42 AM EDT

[#42]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Frankly, and I have all the respect for that serviceman in the world, but HE should have figured out a way, ANY WAY, to avoid having his wife swing on the pole.

Why?

Seriously, what's so awfully wrong about pole dancing? Willing, consenting adults and all that. It isn't terribly uncommon for girls to pay their way through school by dancing. And no, they don't all become disease-ridden, drug-addicted whores. Those that do probably turned to dancing as an end in and of itself, rather than as a means to an end.

And yes, if my girlfriend could bring in more than I make by dancing, I'd have no problem with it. I might be tempted to sit and watch with a tire-checker under my coat, but that would be about the leches in the crowd, not because I figured that she was gonna start fucking every dude in sight just because she took her clothes off.

I just don't get this bizarre American prudishness about sex and nudity.

Your post is naive. Every stripper I've met is a whore, for the right price.

Luckily, I've been able to talk my last two GF's from going that route..

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:37:30 AM EDT

[#43]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Frankly, and I have all the respect for that serviceman in the world, but HE should have figured out a way, ANY WAY, to avoid having his wife swing on the pole.

Why?

Seriously, what's so awfully wrong about pole dancing? Willing, consenting adults and all that. It isn't terribly uncommon for girls to pay their way through school by dancing. And no, they don't all become disease-ridden, drug-addicted whores. Those that do probably turned to dancing as an end in and of itself, rather than as a means to an end.

And yes, if my girlfriend could bring in more than I make by dancing, I'd have no problem with it. I might be tempted to sit and watch with a tire-checker under my coat, but that would be about the leches in the crowd, not because I figured that she was gonna start fucking every dude in sight just because she took her clothes off.

I just don't get this bizarre American prudishness about sex and nudity.

How many strippers have you known personally and/or dated?

None. Don't see what that's got to do with anything. I don't hang out in strip clubs... it doesn't hold a lot of appeal for me. I figure there are two types of girls there... the ones who are strippers, which I want nothing to do with; and the ones for whom it's just a job, which I could meet anywhere. In either case, I'm not going to be paying out hundreds of dollars to drink watered-down booze and stare at some chick. My girlfriend looks good enough naked for me

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:38:50 AM EDT

[#44]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Frankly, and I have all the respect for that serviceman in the world, but HE should have figured out a way, ANY WAY, to avoid having his wife swing on the pole.

Why?

Seriously, what's so awfully wrong about pole dancing? Willing, consenting adults and all that. It isn't terribly uncommon for girls to pay their way through school by dancing. And no, they don't all become disease-ridden, drug-addicted whores. Those that do probably turned to dancing as an end in and of itself, rather than as a means to an end.

And yes, if my girlfriend could bring in more than I make by dancing, I'd have no problem with it. I might be tempted to sit and watch with a tire-checker under my coat, but that would be about the leches in the crowd, not because I figured that she was gonna start fucking every dude in sight just because she took her clothes off.

I just don't get this bizarre American prudishness about sex and nudity.

How many strippers have you known personally and/or dated?

One of the two people quoted above knows how things really work out here on Planet Earth

I heard part of that story too. She says she left home because her brother beat the fuck out of her, not exactly amazing that she beat the kid. That stuff runs in families and if she saw it as "normal" at home.

I said WTF when she started stripping and knew this was going to go south. The husband did bitch about it. I didn't get how he was out of work for so long because of a broken wrist. Even if he was under the table without worker's comp seems like a long time to be out of work when he was willing to sell blood and pawn everything he owned.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:40:38 AM EDT

[#45]

Quoted:
\

None. Don't see what that's got to do with anything. I don't hang out in strip clubs... it doesn't hold a lot of appeal for me. I figure there are two types of girls there... the ones who are strippers, which I want nothing to do with; and the ones for whom it's just a job, which I could meet anywhere. In either case, I'm not going to be paying out hundreds of dollars to drink watered-down booze and stare at some chick. My girlfriend looks good enough naked for me

Strippers are almost always a train wreck in some way or other. Most are whores and run with a rough crowd + drugs etc.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:41:11 AM EDT

[#46]

Americans corrupting her with Alcohol - CHECK
Neighbors afraid of her because she is foreign - CHECK
Former GI who served his country reduced to no job - CHECK
Degrading of Women with Sex - CHECK
Not An Isolated Case - CHECK

Yep this was NPR alright, it is George Bushes fault...

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:41:40 AM EDT

[#47]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Cleaning hotel rooms and/or people's homes is worse for a woman than working the pole?

Sure doesn't pay nearly as well. You could work your fingers to the bone twelve hours a day, six days a week cleaning, or make the same amount dancing for a few hours a couple of times a week.

Of course she can sell peddle her ass to Johns and sell drugs and make more money than a domestic worker but that isn't the point.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:42:11 AM EDT

[#48]

Quoted:

Your post is naive. Every stripper I've met is a whore, for the right price.

So you've met every girl who dances without clothing? If not, then the fact that every one you've "met" is (in your opinion) a "whore" doesn't disprove my statement.

I have a feeling my point is soaring over too many heads here. Let's try it this way... what, exactly, is "bad" about dancing without clothes? How, exactly, is it "immoral", "evil", or whatever other adjective you apply to it? Facts, please.. no emotional rhetoric.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:42:36 AM EDT

[#49]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Frankly, and I have all the respect for that serviceman in the world, but HE should have figured out a way, ANY WAY, to avoid having his wife swing on the pole.

Why?

Seriously, what's so awfully wrong about pole dancing? Willing, consenting adults and all that. It isn't terribly uncommon for girls to pay their way through school by dancing. And no, they don't all become disease-ridden, drug-addicted whores. Those that do probably turned to dancing as an end in and of itself, rather than as a means to an end.

And yes, if my girlfriend could bring in more than I make by dancing, I'd have no problem with it. I might be tempted to sit and watch with a tire-checker under my coat, but that would be about the leches in the crowd, not because I figured that she was gonna start fucking every dude in sight just because she took her clothes off.

I just don't get this bizarre American prudishness about sex and nudity.

How many strippers have you known personally and/or dated?

None. Don't see what that's got to do with anything. I don't hang out in strip clubs... it doesn't hold a lot of appeal for me. I figure there are two types of girls there... the ones who are strippers, which I want nothing to do with; and the ones for whom it's just a job, which I could meet anywhere. In either case, I'm not going to be paying out hundreds of dollars to drink watered-down booze and stare at some chick. My girlfriend looks good enough naked for me

So you don't know any strippers, never dated a stripper, don't go to strip clubs but you think you know about what goes on in them and who works there.

I hate to break it to you but generally speaking strippers are one single rung up the ladder from a corner working whore. Sometimes they're on the same rung, the stripper just has an office.

Posted: 10/17/2008 10:43:56 AM EDT

[#50]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Cleaning hotel rooms and/or people's homes is worse for a woman than working the pole?

Sure doesn't pay nearly as well. You could work your fingers to the bone twelve hours a day, six days a week cleaning, or make the same amount dancing for a few hours a couple of times a week.

Of course she can sell peddle her ass to Johns and sell drugs and make more money than a domestic worker but that isn't the point.

Two different things. Prostitution and drug dealing are illegal, dancing isn't. Prostitution and "whoring" are synonymous... dancing isn't.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - NPR Story: Marine marries (hot) Iraqi girl, struggles to make ends meet in Ozark, MO (Page 1 of 3)

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