Okay, its over. Who won? not who do you want to win, not who do you wish won. Who presented themselves in the best manner to win over likely republican primary voters.

From the other thread, my humble debate rankings:
1. Rudy
2. Fred
3. Mitt
4. McCain
5. Huckabee
5a. Hunter
7. Tancredo
8. Brownback






9. Paul

Aren't  you forgetting someone?

Quoted: Aren't  you forgetting someone?

Agree, but only 5 options possible on polls.

An afternoon debate?

Quoted: Aren't  you forgetting someone?

Not enough poll options for all the candidates.

RP came off as insane.

Fred came off as ill and fumbled some question bad. He's down to 21% in todays polls.

Rudy has really aged a lot and has that speech impediment. Not very presidential. Recall that the majority of the time in the general election the taller candidate wins. appearance matters alot to women voters.

I'm a Fred-Head, but in my opinion Hunter won it.

were all the debates as weak as this one?  it's the first one I watched...

Quoted: I'm a Fred-Head, but in my opinion Hunter won it.

Hunter did better than my man Tancredo.

Fred still needs a bit more polishing and needs to look up when he speaks.

Rudy probably took this one, not on the issues, but presentation.

Fred didn't do so great.

I couldn't watch it, and I'm looking for a video link.

Hunter did pretty well, although I disagree with him on most things

Rudy did very well, even though I disagree with him on most things

I think Romney won it though.  Yeah he doesn't answer questions, but he looks good and is quick with an answer.  Two very important qualities for good or ill.

Fred didn't do bad, but he didn't act like a front runner though.  Needs to calm down and command the stage.  

Quoted: I think Romney won it though.  Yeah he doesn't answer questions, but he looks good and is quick with an answer.  Two very important qualities for good or ill.

Thats what i thought.

Quoted: Fred still needs a bit more polishing and needs to look up when he speaks. Rudy probably took this one, not on the issues, but presentation.

Fred was looking at the moderators.  They were seated.

Man, it's not even 3:30 yet here.

Nobody cares about the Far West any more.

Quoted: Man, it's not even 3:30 yet here. Nobody cares about the Far West any more.

The nomination is often decided before California's primary.

I don't know, but Ron Paul is on CNBC right now giving nut jobs a bad name!





'Cut the Trillions that we are spending to defend our global empire!'

'Our national defense is at it's weakest ever and we're setting ourselves up for another attack with our foreign policy!'

Quoted: Man, it's not even 3:30 yet here. Nobody cares about the Far West any more.

Well, it is a Republican debate. Any chance of Cali going red this next election?


ETA: I don't know who won the debate, but I know who won page 2!

Quoted: Quoted: Man, it's not even 3:30 yet here. Nobody cares about the Far West any more. Well, it is a Republican debate. Any chance of Cali going red this next election?

Hunter and Tancrdo are both very popular here. But they both will likely drop out before the Republican primary in Cali.

We did elect a RINO governor. So McCain, Rudy and Romney have a shot at taking cali in the genral election.

Will this be online somewhere?  I couldnt catch it on TV.

Why the heck would they put this on in the middle of the day?

rr

DEARBORN, Mich. - Republican presidential hopefuls Mitt Romney and Rudy Giuliani clashed over tax and spending cuts Tuesday, each claiming greater commitment than the other in a debate in the nation’s struggling manufacturing heartland.

The government “is spending money of future generations and those yet to be born,” added Fred Thompson, making his debut on a debate stage after a late entry into the race. He said future retirees should receive smaller Social Security benefits than they have been promised.

After months of polite debate sparring, Giuliani and Romney squared off without hesitation, a reflection of their struggle for primacy in the race for their party’s presidential nomination.

“I cut taxes 23 times. I believe in tax cuts,” said Giuliani, former mayor of New York and leader in national Republican polls.

Romney initially conceded that, but quickly criticized his rival for once filing a court challenge to a law that gave President Clinton the right to veto spending items line by line. “I’m in favor of the line-item veto,” he said, adding he exercised it 844 times while governor of Massachusetts.

Romney also said that while mayor, Giuliani “fought to keep the commuter tax, which is a very substantial tax ... on consumers coming into New York.”

The former governor leads his rivals in the polls in Iowa, where caucuses will be the first contest of the campaign, and he and Giuliani are in a close race in surveys in New Hampshire, the leadoff primary state.

Romney to Giuliani: 'It's baloney'
Giuliani responded that spending fell in New York while he was mayor and rose in Massachusetts while Romney was governor.

“The point is that you’ve got to control taxes. I did it, he didn’t. ... I led, he lagged.”

“It’s baloney,” retorted Romney. “I did not increase taxes in Massachusetts. I lowered taxes.”


The exchange was among the most heated of the campaign for the Republican presidential nomination, reflecting a quickening pace as the 2008 caucuses and primaries draw close.

It also left Thompson, Sen. John McCain of Arizona and the other contenders as something of bystanders for the several moments that Romney and Giuliani went at one another.

All nine of the men on stage sought to stress their conservative economic credentials throughout the two-hour debate, held in the city that gave birth to the Ford Motor Co. more than a century ago.

McCain: 'Get wasteful spending under control'
McCain of Arizona said President Bush was right to veto a children’s health expansion bill, and he urged him to reject a multibillion-dollar public works measure as well.

“We’ve got to get wasteful spending under control,” he said.

“We have to get spending under control,” agreed Kansas Sen. Sam Brownback. No matter whether Republicans or Democrats are in control of Congress, he said, “the system is built to spend.”

Challenged to identify one government account he would cut, Brownback cited a program involving “advanced technology.”

“If you want to control federal spending you must look at Social Security and Medicare,” said Rep. Tom Tancredo of Colorado. He said he favors private Social Security accounts, or “forget the idea of ending deficit spending.”

Thompson said that without changes, Social Security would not survive. He said there should be no change for current retirees and those expected to begin drawing benefits soon. But for those retiring further in the future, benefits should not be allowed to rise as quickly as now expected...

...While maneuvering against one another, the Republicans found a minute or two to jab at Democrats.

Giuliani criticized Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton, the Democratic presidential front-runner, for a proposal to provide tax cuts of up to $1,000 to help families open 401(k) retirement accounts.

“Hillary is filled with endless ways to spend. We’re going to have to control that,” he said.

Quoted: fox news is giving it to rudy. get ready folks, 08 is the year of the libtard gun grabbers

I hope you are wrong (but I don't really believe that you are).

Quoted: fox news is giving it to rudy.

So is AR15.com. I dont know what they saw, I must have missed it. I though Romney came acrossed much more polished.

Cant stand either of them but debates are all about presentation.

Dunno what to say.

Quoted: Dunno what to say.

did you watch it?

I cant believe that 9 people think that Tancredo won.  He's a one issue candidate.

Quoted: I cant believe that 9 people think that Tancredo won.  He's a one issue candidate.

Same here. He's my candidate but there is no way he won that debate.

Quoted: I don't know, but Ron Paul is on CNBC right now giving nut jobs a bad name! 'Cut the Trillions that we are spending to defend our global empire!' 'Our national defense is at it's weakest ever and we're setting ourselves up for another attack with our foreign policy!'

Yeah, and the ron-bots said he wouldn't cut the military, and he's not an isolationist...

Quoted: fox news is giving it to rudy. get ready folks, 08 is the year of the libtard gun grabbers

Why should we care who the media likes?

Quoted: Quoted: fox news is giving it to rudy. get ready folks, 08 is the year of the libtard gun grabbers Why should we care who the media likes?

Dont confuse winning a debate with likeing a candidate. They are not the same thing. you least favorite candidate is capable of winning a debate. That is if you are honest about it.

Quoted: Quoted: fox news is giving it to rudy. get ready folks, 08 is the year of the libtard gun grabbers Why should we care who the media likes?

Because, like it or not, the media controls to a very large extent how the uninformed voting public perceives a candidate.  "We" should care because it is our duty to sway those who only get their information on such matters from Katie Couric, Bill O'Reilly, et al.  To be effective in this endeavor, we must first know the what perceptions are being created.

Who won?

1. Hunter. By far!! I really wish this guy had more support as he has good things to say, and has great ideas. He's truly for America, speaks with conviction and even looks presidential. He reminds me a little of Ronald Reagan.

2. Huckabee. Huck is well spoken and likable. He is soundly pro second amendment. Huckabee probably has the best shot of the lesser knowns. His personality shines through and he is contagiously optimistic.  Best of all he is not a Washington insider and is very credible in his debate performance.

3. Paul. While I don't agree with him on everything, he has great info and tells it like it is. He is passionate about the issues and I have to laugh when the media folks continually try to shut him up - they hate him that much (this can't be a bad thing).

4. Brownback. Kind of plain vanilla, but is well spoken and good on the issues.

5. Rudy. Can't stand the guy - I did this and that in NY.... yada yada yada.... but he has the debate performance down pat. Smooth talking politician...

6. Thompson. He got off to a shaky start, but seemed to get more comfortable through the debate. Fred is the only so called front runner than I would consider voting for, but he needs to step up the energy level and get dynamic...

7. Romney. This guy is such a slick smooth talker he should be in advertising. The problem is everything about him screams "bullshit artist!" He just isn't credible as his positions are all over the place.  The talking to attorney's comment was stupid.

8. Tancredo. I really like what he has to say, but I've watched every Republican debate so far (even the internet only ValueVoters.org debate) and he just doesn't look comfortable speaking. He stumbles too much. It's a shame because he's right on the money with the immigration issue.

8. McCain. I really think this guy has lost it. He rambles and rants and his answers aren't focused. I can't believe any conservative would even consider voting for him after McCain/Feingold and his full court press to give amnesty to all the illegals.

Quoted: Quoted: Dunno what to say. did you watch it?

Got bits and pieces of it.

Quoted: fox news is giving it to rudy. get ready folks, 08 is the year of the libtard gun grabbers

I'm afraid you're right.

While I'm a big Thompson supporter, I think that my early predictions regarding the GOP strategy and Giuliani are coming true.

I didn't see the debates, but the talking heads were arguing how well Rudy, Mitt and Fred did.

Didn't hear any mention of Huckabee until this thread.

I tried to check out his website, but it is getting slammed, so apparently, lot's of other people thought he did pretty well, too...

I watched it for a second time. At first I thought Thompson came off as bungling and weak, with the exception of the topic of the devalued dollar I think he did better than we originally thought. We expected him to shoot lightening bolts out of his ass. However the wife (who only saw the 9pm showing) thought he did a good job and that everyone else either came off as nuts (ie Ron Paul) or slick and lacking substance (see Rudy/Romney)

Thompson came off as generally positive but at the same time is realistic and isn't burying his head in the sand. I hope that he doesn't get any negative press, holds ground and fixes what went wrong for the next debate.

Also, the few sound bites I heard of Fred in the debates were very disappointing.

If he doesn't get his crap in order right now, then Rudy or Mitt will get the nomination, and I'll vote 3rd party.

Quoted: I'll vote 3rd party.

Oh come on, why not just vote for Hilary and get it over with then.

Sheshhhh

Quoted: I watched it for a second time.

You're a glutton for punishment. I'll waite for the next debate.

Of all the candidates, I think Fred would make the best President.  His manner is thoughtful and measured.  Unfortunately, that doesn't seem to be playing well with the majority, who seem to prefer sharp quips and stylish sound-bytes.  

I think Huckabee is very well spoken and does a good job.  Tancredo has a lot of good to say, but just can't get it said.  Hunter says all the right things, but he's the guy that you ask "what's his name again?"

I can't stand Rudy McRomney, and Fred is the man.  I could do a Fred/Hunter or Fred/Huckabee ticket.

Quoted: Of all the candidates, I think Fred would make the best President.  His manner is thoughtful and measured.  Unfortunately, that doesn't seem to be playing well with the majority, who seem to prefer sharp quips and stylish sound-bytes.

I don't know.  My wife said "I could listen to Fred speak for hours".  She isn't apolitical, but she isn't as into it as I am and she said it.  People these days are craving blunt honesty.  I think it might play out.  How it fairs to those who are moderates who don't pay attention until the final weeks who knows.

Quoted: Quoted: I watched it for a second time. You're a glutton for punishment. I'll waite for the next debate.

I am a political junky.  I can't help it.

Quoted: Quoted: Of all the candidates, I think Fred would make the best President.  His manner is thoughtful and measured.  Unfortunately, that doesn't seem to be playing well with the majority, who seem to prefer sharp quips and stylish sound-bytes.   I don't know.  My wife said "I could listen to Fred speak for hours".  She isn't apolitical, but she isn't as into it as I am and she said it.  People these days are craving blunt honesty.  I think it might play out.  How it fairs to those who are moderates who don't pay attention until the final weeks who knows.

I hope you're right about people craving honesty.  It's easy for me to imagine Fred addressing the nation, "My fellow Americans...".  I have trouble picturing any of the others doing so.

I think Giuliani won by everyone else's standards but Thompson did well. He's not lacking energy or passion. The way he spoke during the debate is flat out the way he talks, period. Aside from fumbling the weak dollar question, I think Fred did just fine. My support for him was renewed after this debate now that he's put more substance to his campaign and we're not just relying on his announcement speech.

Where can I watch this ?

Quoted: Quoted: Fred still needs a bit more polishing and needs to look up when he speaks. Rudy probably took this one, not on the issues, but presentation. Fred was looking at the moderators.  They were seated.

I bet the position was set like that just to make them appear to be looking down.