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Posted: 2/24/2007 4:42:52 PM EDT
[#1]
People are stupid. I saw an episode where a guy got pulled for not signalling and the officer asked him where the crack was. He dug it out of his pocket and gave it to the cop.
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Posted: 2/24/2007 4:42:54 PM EDT
[#2]
They don't show the hundreds of others that tell them to get a warrant.
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Posted: 2/24/2007 4:44:29 PM EDT
[#3]
I was watching that too.
What an idiot. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 4:45:18 PM EDT
[#4]
That chicky snack was teh dumb.....
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Posted: 2/24/2007 4:45:56 PM EDT
[#5]
Several of my LEO texts are full of stories where drug mules for the cartels said "Sure, Officer, you can search my vehicle" when they had KILOS in the trunk.
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Posted: 2/24/2007 4:46:16 PM EDT
[#6]
Because people are stupid. If you consider the fact that the last time most people learned or read the Constitution was in High School, can you even expect them to know what their constitutional rights are?
Huh? Can you reference the law in IL that states this? LEOs do not need PC or RS in order to ask to search your car. Second, if they have PC, they don't need to ask. PC is grounds to search without permission. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 4:48:17 PM EDT
[#7]
I love how the ask them if they can search them/the car in an "Oh, by the way...." manner.
Like it's no big deal. I am sure that catches a lot of mouth breathers off guard and actually fall for it. 
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:01:09 PM EDT
[#8]
In my hometown saying no to the police pretty much gave them reason to look i knows bullshit but theres not much you can do. The same cops held a gun to my head because I was shooting a paintball gun in my yard and someone called the police.
In the second episode the hookers are hott however I think they are too hot to be hookers, i should go and take care of them. after the aids test. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:01:51 PM EDT
[#9]
Never heard of that before. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:02:01 PM EDT
[#10]
That chick was kind of hot |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:03:16 PM EDT
[#11]
Mostly it isn't that they're stupid, just intimidated and scared of a uniform. Now, as far as the real dirtbag, he/she by defination is a dumbass. I can't comment about Ill. rules/laws or precedures but as far as I know any officer can ask whatever, until it reaches what amounts to the "accusatory" stage........at that point he'd better afford you access to a lawyer or he'll lose any case he might have. Far as searches go, well I was on the job for well over three decades and on principle I would NEVER agree to a search. I would not resist or oppose one forced on me, but there'd be hell to pay thereafter.....For one thing I'd immediately demand a supervisor be called to the scene, if he didn't satisfy me, I'd demand directions to the agency HQ........What most folks don't realize is that intimidation works both way, turn it to your advantage! |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:11:21 PM EDT
[#12]
2 things:
1. Here's the trick; the cops can't ask to search your car and make it a consent search while they have you stopped. They have to wait until they tell you that your free to go, then they pop the ol' "You have any drugs? Mind if I search" 2. The reason these dumbasses let them search is because if they think if they say no it makes them look guilty. It's kind of a Catch 22 for them. I'm not trying to encourage anyone to do anything illegal, but if you're ever stopped by the police and they "release" you and then ask to search, reply with: "I guess I'm not free to go then". If you show them in your mind that the detention is still in effect, then you cannot consent to search. They'll probably respond with "no, you're free to go, I just wanted to ask you I could search for drugs, blah, blah, blah." Keep asserting that the officer is detaining you and that you have no free will to leave. Talk about frustration...either they'll just cut you loose or stand there and desparately try to convince you you're free to go, but stay there so they can search you. You might think I'm anti-LE for saying this, but actually I've worked both civilian and Military LE, and no matter what, I think we all have rights, no matter what the LE might like to do. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:14:30 PM EDT
[#13]
Question: When are you FORCED to have the cop search your car? When are you required to have your car searched?
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:17:50 PM EDT
[#14]
Only 'kind of' hot?  And if I may add....no way is that chick turning into her mother in twenty years. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:21:02 PM EDT
[#15]
A few random thoughts/questions: How can a bank robbery be a crime, if the bank employees "consented" after the robber produced a gun? How can a rape be a crime if the victim "consented" after the rapist produced a knife and said "you want it the easy way or the hard way"? |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:22:51 PM EDT
[#16]
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:24:23 PM EDT
[#17]
+100000000 |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:30:09 PM EDT
[#18]
I saw the one with the blonde and the guy wearing an "MFD" cap, I believe in Brevard Fl.
She says search, and has 27 gms of MJ, and some loose pills. "I have a prescription", sure you do. They said 20+ gms of MJ was a felony. Around here that would probably be a non-criminal citation...................... |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:30:21 PM EDT
[#19]
Forced and required are really the same thing. What you're saying by using either word is that you have no say in the search. When are you forced/required: 1. Comensurate to an arrest; a police officer can search your car. 2. Traffic stop: If an officer has a reasonable suspicion (spelling Nazis, did I get it right) that you might be a danger to him they can have you step out, pat you down and search the interior of the car with the exception of locked containers. And they can only search the "lunge" area of the interior. Places were you could reasonably expect someone to grab a gun. This what's called a Terry Stop (Terry v Ohio), sometimes called a Terry frisk. Also, if an officer has probable cause to believe you have fruits of a crime in your vehicle (let's say someone called the cops and said you put a stolen TV in your trunk...it's a bit of a stretch, but I'm trying to keep this pretty basic) they can search where they would reasonably find the evidence. This is a warrantless search based on the Carroll Doctrine (Carroll v US), which allows for warrantless searches based on the idea that vehicles are inheritently mobile, and thus, and officer cannot reasonbly expect a vehicle to be sitting in the same place by the time they actually got a warrant. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:31:31 PM EDT
[#20]
So if he asks you if you mind if he searches your car and you don't answer him and walk away he can't stop you? Just walk to your car without answering him and drive away?
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:34:53 PM EDT
[#21]
Yes, actually you could. His natural reaction would probably be, "excuse me, I said do you mind..." at which time you could either continue to ignore him or like I said earlier, tell him that he's detaining you further. Another thing you could ask is, "Am I free to go?" If he says yes, then say, "then stop asking me questions" and get in your car. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:35:49 PM EDT
[#22]
They pull that shit in Illinois as well, Hoffman Estates is a big perpetrator of it.
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:45:32 PM EDT
[#23]
Be aware that laws vary from state to state. The Carroll Doctrine is not in effect in WA, for instance.
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:48:43 PM EDT
[#24]
www.state.il.us/court/OPINIONS/AppellateCourt/2002/2ndDistrict/May/Html/2001386.htm Questioning on a t/stop must remain reasonably related to the initial scope of the stop, unless the officer can reasonably articulate circumstances or facts that would indicate criminal activity apart from the initial traffic violation. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:54:24 PM EDT
[#25]
I might have missed the words of the constitution that allows the government to go ahead and perform unwarranted search if the victim "consented". |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:57:10 PM EDT
[#26]
Right, I think even SD threw that out some time ago. Basically now with cell phones and computers a person can get a telephonic warrant pretty quick |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:58:09 PM EDT
[#27]
bs16, it is the nature of our legal system that an individual may surrender almost all of their rights, if they freely and voluntarily choose to do so. As such, a search that follows an uncoerced grant of permission is generally lawful. I don't have a problem with that.
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Posted: 2/24/2007 5:59:06 PM EDT
[#28]
If you do not exercise your rights you will lose them. Exercise your ight to decline a search.
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:06:03 PM EDT
[#29]
Christ, I work there all the time and have never been stopped. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:06:15 PM EDT
[#30]
It's doper logic. they think if they say no the cops will think they are hiding something and be even more curious/supect they are dirty. Forgeting that if the cops are asking for consent to search they already think youre dirty. Then there is the probation issue. A lot of the time when someone says yes its because they are on probation with search and seizure terms and are afraid if they say no they will get a probation violation. Even when the cop doesnt know they are on probation. We only catch the dumb ones. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:06:58 PM EDT
[#31]
Can anyone show me where in the constitution it allows the government to do so? |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:08:09 PM EDT
[#32]
Common law. And common sense. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:08:57 PM EDT
[#33]
The constitution covers that people be free from unreasonable searches. SCOTUS defines what is reasonable and unreasonable. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:09:47 PM EDT
[#34]
I don't know about this. I declined a search once and they called the K9 out. I was "detained" for over an hour till the K9 showed up. Found nothing and let me go. Said I could have saved myself the hassle if I just consented. I told them I had time to kill and didn't mind. PS. If a K9 is called find out before what the "hit" signal(s) are or they will use anything as a reason that the dog "hit" on something.
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:11:52 PM EDT
[#35]
The big problem is that if you refuse 90% of cops will think you are guilty/hiding something based on that.
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:17:54 PM EDT
[#36]
Interesting. Absent any other PC or RS, one hour is well beyond the "reasonable" timeperiod. -Z |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:20:10 PM EDT
[#37]
thats not the case law everywhere. Her you can ask for consent during the stop as long as it doesnt prolong the stop. Say you stop domeone for speeding. It takes you about 20mins to contact the driver, call in the stop, run the drivers license status, fill out the ticket and get the driver to sign. If you ask for consent to search you are good as long as the search doesnt take longer than it would have taken to fill out the cite. the issue is overdetention. If a second officer arrives on scene and one does a consent search while the other fills out the cite its still good. Other juristictions may have different case law on this issue though. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:20:18 PM EDT
[#38]
Is it legal? Can you show text in the constitution that allows that? Or you are just repeating the stuff somebody told you. Ever wonder who benefits from this attitude? My rights are God given (AKA inalienable rights), the constitution does not allow the government to violate them. So called "Bill of Rights" is a set of extra restrictions on the government. Can you explain what does it mean "exercise your rights" ? |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:21:13 PM EDT
[#39]
What you experienced was not a Carroll stop search, but a Terry Stop search. You can refuse to let the police search your vehicle and they have the choice of either letting you go, or searching based on reasonable suspicion. When it comes to Terry stop searches they can make you wait 5 hours if they have to, if that's what it takes to get a dog there to sniff you car. I didn't make the rules, SCOTUS did. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:22:51 PM EDT
[#40]
Wow, florida is tough. Here thats a traffic ticket. A cite and release into traffic court. Punishbale by a $40.00 diversion class that takes about 8 hours on a saturday. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:23:24 PM EDT
[#41]
I'm very surprised to hear that. Most everywhere else the stop must be over before an officer asks, because asking before someone knows if they are going to be cited or not is or would often appear to be coercion. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:24:08 PM EDT
[#42]
I don't think we educate the Country as a whole very well on their basic individual rights...but then again that may be the master-plan.
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:25:00 PM EDT
[#43]
The nonchalant approach is interpreted unconciously as not being a threat. The response is usually "I didn't mean to agree to the search" It's an actual taught method.
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:26:33 PM EDT
[#44]
I guess I was wrong then. Sorry. No warrant from a judge needed, right? If the government decides what the constitution means, then why do we even have it written? Hey since we can't understand what constitution say, how can we understand what the SCOTUS says, then? Let's just have cops do whatever is good for us. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:27:14 PM EDT
[#45]
Hell they wouldnt be asking if they didnt already think that. I wont even stop you unless i think that. With 33,000 residents in my patrol area I'm not stopping anyone i dont think is drunk, wanted, suspended on probation or parole or riding dirty with ope or stolen property. not enough hours in the shift to waste time stopping decent people. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:27:19 PM EDT
[#46]
Five hours would almost certainly be too long. SCOTUS needs to cowboy up and put a definitive limit on what time frame turns a detention into an arrest. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:27:52 PM EDT
[#47]
My base does Random Vehicle Inspections from time to time when you enter the installation. I have been searched: 2- Coming back from the range (You can have firearms in base housing). I was given the "felony" treatment for having an AR. 4- Going to work on the other side of base. 1- Leaving the base. On the search leaving the base, they were looking for "stolen .mil equipment". The SF guy was outright pissed when I did not give consent to being searched. He had to get a warrant to do it. After they did the search (finding nothing), he threatened to give me paperwork for "obstruction of justice". I later found out that exact SF guy was "removed from service" after he was found stealing items from searched vehicles. SFS are usually the biggest group of thieves in the AF. I'm not saying there aren't cops that actually do their jobs right, but that is my observation. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:28:17 PM EDT
[#48]
Don't gripe at me...I'm just explaining how it is. If you don't like the system, fix it. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:29:28 PM EDT
[#49]
Dude, its not hard to understand. You can waive your constitutional rights. You can waive any rights. SCOTUS is pretty good since the 60s at protecting peoples rights. |
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Posted: 2/24/2007 6:37:14 PM EDT
[#50]
What so hard to understand: it is not about me, it is about the actions of government. Show me in the constitution where it allows them to do it? I understand that it is how things are these days, but what do we expect if everybody likes this new socialist point of view  I guess if there's lots of crime, then it's ok, no need to fight it, no need to even acknowledge it, it's just the way things are. |
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