He a billionair right well im guessing his money is in Swiss bank acounts maybe the Swiss should seize his money and give it to the familys of the victims as part of reperations. or what ever bank his money is in.


What do you think

Speaking of the Swiss, have you noticed that nobody has crashed any airplanes into their business districts?

I think it must have something to do with them not deposing governments, installing and propping up dictators, pouring military aid into brutal regimes, bombing pharmaceutical factories, and generally interfering with everyone else's politics.

71, the reason no one messes with the Swiss is because every man is armed. Been like that for as long as there have been guns. Pluse they are surounded by mountains.
America looks out for it's best intrests, and supports those who have the same goals. Obvioulsy, Palinistians don't have the same goal.
Remember we have supported Iran, Iraq, Afganistian, Lebenon,
Syria, Egypt, and other Muslim countries i nthe past, and we still are hated. It is about the fanitical religious who brain wash the masses. Plain and simple.
 And you wonder why people have attacked you. [rolleyes]


[smoke]

Don't you assholes say shit about swiss banking, I have all my money in one of their banks.
Its tax free. Its secret.
Don't fucking knock it.
If Osama Bin Laden has money in swiss accounts, and it is a fucking fact.
the Swiss Authorities will close the accounts
It is a law that if someone is using their funds to finance illegal activities, or receives their funds from illegal activites that their account be closed

The Swiss don't do anything.
It must be nice for them to let the rest of the world solve the problems.

We're prtty fucking heavily armed, and I don't notice us being able to drive off hijackers armed with boxcutters. . . .

The Swiss aren't hated because they don't kick over anthills.  Plain and simple.

Well, lessee.

We "supported" Iran by deposing its ruler, installing a brutal dictator, and propping him up until the entire country revolted against him (and US), threw him out, threw US out, and took the American embassy personnel hostage.

We "supported" Iraq by giving it military aid so that it could kick Iran's teeth in for about a decade, in a bloody war.  Then, when its brutal dictator, whom we'd propped up for years, decided to go against us, we bombed the shit out of him, stopped before killing him, let him kill off most of the opposition (from whom we withdrew support and refused to help get out), and imposed sanctions which have caused the deaths of a few hundred thousand Iraqi infants and young children, none of whom were old enough to understand what the hell was going on nor why they were starving to death.

Here's a passable article on Iraq sanctions and their effects:
http://[url]http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/middle_east/newsid_183000/183499.stm[/url]
Afghanistan, hmm, well, we gave them weapons until they threw the Russians out, but I don't recall us doing much since.

Lebanon?  We were looking out for Israel's interests, not our own.  What a great idea -- stick troops into the middle of a country's civil war, in which half a dozen major factions were at each others' throats.

And Syria?  You must have your head up your ass.  Syria was a Soviet ally through the Cold War.

Sooooo, hmm, yep, I guess we "supported" them and they should all love us and kiss our collective ass.

By golly, that's IT!

Why should *WE* be out solving the world's problems??

Why don't we let them solve *THEIR*OWN* problems?!

What a concept.

Wasn't Lebanon the paradise of the Mid-East, where all the movie stars vacationed until the Syrians invaded..and the PLO came...now I feel sorry for the Lebanese and the shithole their country has become because of their Islamic invaders...

their supposed brother Islamic invaders

What was the name of that town in Syria that Assad nerve gassed? I think it started with an "H".   Anyway, The "President" nerve gassed hundreds, or thousands, of his own countrymen

From Africa to the Far East, what Islamic country has a (real) elected government? NAME JUST ONE!!!  Every one is a strong man dictatorship. Which is only succeded by relatives in the event of death. Or by violent revolution and  the killing of the present leader.

The billion or so peace loving and kind hearted Islamics would be well served if they rose up and assassinated their blood loving leaders, and moved away from living in the 7th century, and become a part of the world

I'll take a stab, though my WWII Swiss history is poor.

If the Swiss were then as they are more or less now and indifferent to nationality then they are a good example.  Yes, they may have had Nazi monies, but I would bet they had other nations as well.

As to the Jewish accounts they absorbed after the War, yep they should be paying it back and I don't happen to like the fact that they fought it.  They are the institution holding the money, it isn't theirs at all.

On the political front, they keep their noses out of alot of it so nations don't view them as a threat.  The point 71 is trying to make.

Raf, I can't realy do this one justice.

Zaz

Oh, yeah.  SIG-Sauer is (was/is) Swiss.

raf, a lot of Islama bin Laden's wealth was siezed early on.  When he was kicked out of Saudi Arabia, he only had about 10-30 million dollars that he could access.  The rest of his wealth was siezed by the Saudi Government.

Being a "pauper" (nerk, nerk) he had many rich "friends" who supported him (from many different countries).

DaMan

   

After Achmed's arguments I certainly regret that the U.S. has spent my tax money in humanitarian efforts in every third world country in the world (is that redundant?).

Certainly none of it is appreciated.  I would rather have seen less of a federal deficit to the amount of however many hundreds of billions  of dollars we spent on ungrateful terrorist breeding grounds.  Somehow as perverted as it seems the global starvation which would have occured without U.S. aid seems almost desireable rather then see 20,000 U.S. human lives lost to Arab terrorists.  

Why don't you just get out of the U.S., Achmed?  Obviously, we are a heinous evil nation that must or should be intolerable for you to live in.  
Apparently you are willing to temporarily relieve your conscience to live in the comfort of the U.S. but don't feel it hypocritical to harbor deep seated resentment for our Country.  Is it your country or not?  If it isn't get out!  Your words of criticism at this time seem like a threat to national security and are highly insulting and offensive.

Your allegations give the impression that you feel the U.S. is directly trying to destroy the middle east by its policies.  From the looks of things, the middle east will do a fine job destroying itself.  Apparently, our work was done long before we got invlolved. Why don't you go help them govern themselves and assist the region in settling  century old genocidal wars and ethnic cleansing until there are no people left.  

The rest of us U.S. citizens will keep trying to get it right from our end.  I hope we never make a mistake again.  I hate being human.  Certainly, there is little humanity in the Arab terrorist world.

I really don't want to hear any more of your criticisms of U.S. foreign policy.  Just leave.

I have never felt this way before, but why don't you just get out (did I say that yet?).  We welcomed all people here with open arms, perhaps that was a mistake.  

And I always thought I had an open mind.  Somehow,  extreme mass murder of innocent people has removed all of the racial acceptance I have prided in myself over the years.  

The loss of innocence is always unfortunate.

I know a guy from Lebanon and he said it was like Monaco, Las Vegas, and the French Riviera wrapped up in one until the fundamentalists invaded and destroyed the place.

While I have always enjoyed being in Switzerland.
From a political POV, I have always likened them to that kid in high school (you know you had one or two) who was always NEUTRAL, but freinds with both sides, because there was something to gain from it.

From a money/account POV, there are actually better contries to stick your money in.

RAF the Swiss did not pay reparations. There were bankers that had to turn money over. They believe in seperation of bank and state. They have been nuetral for over a 100 years. They helped the allies with in the constraints of their law.....that is their way so leave them alone

raf,
Do you have any clue as to what libel is?  It appears you are attempting to libel the entire
Swiss Confederation.  They did not *EVER* support the Nazis.  In fact under the leadership of General Henri Guisan, there were over a dozen soldiers (17 I believe) that faced the firing squad because of Nazi contacts.  You can't get much more anti-Nazi than shooting them.  Do your homework next time you want to mouth off at an entire group of people.

Besides as long as anyone had their pass book to their account the Swiss never had a problem with handing over money.  When proof of ownership and fraud becomes problematic, people start spouting BS.  It amazes me how many of us, the much maligned gun owners, will still parrot any part of the New York Times he or she wishes, as long as it doesn't bash gun owners.  The NYT only lies about us right?

The respect and trust they endear among nations speaks volumes.  Of course the logic behind why clearly escapes you.  Don't worry just from this thread I see you have lots of like minded friends.

rDAm

Yeah especially when they aren't the ones who helped initiate the problems.  What a bunch of selfish bastards right?

When I comes to International relief efforts for refugees of war and natural disasters the Swiss are among the most giving people in the world.  When it comes to cloak and dagger coups and supporting dictators, they frown upon such.  Do yourself a favor do some research and try your best to keep our noses from other countries shit like the Swiss do, we will all be better off.

rDAm

Wow this is just freaking incredible.  The person who advocates the foreign policy of George Washington himself, is being asked to leave because he is so "Un-American".  A "Threat to National Security" if it weren't so laughable I would say it's merely juvenile, but instead you have provided much needed comic relief.

The only threat to our security is the constant state of intervention we have been perpetrating against so many people of this earth.  You don't find it the least bit disturbing that our federal government has created such monsters as the Shah of Iran, which paved the way for the "fundamentalists" that now have you pissing in your boots?  How about Noriega?, Castro?  Yep we created them too.  Saddam Hussein?  Yeah he received weapons, intel, and his very own "Bio-Chem warfare starter kit" from guess who?  (I'll give you 3 guesses)  Yes it was us again.  If you want to wipe the world clean of monsters you best start looking at yourself and this federal leviathan (fed by all of our tax money) a little bit more closely.

In 1796, Washington warned against "the illusion of an imaginary common interest in cases where no real common interest exists [the rise of] corrupted , ambitious or deluded citizens who devote themselves to the favorite nation to betray or sacrifice the interests of their own country without odium, sometimes even with popularity, gliding even with the appearances of a virtuous sense of obligation." He concluded "It is our policy to steer clear of permanent alliances it is folly in one nation to look for disinterested favors from another; it must pay with a portion of independence for whatever it may accept under that character; it is an illusion which experience must cure."
(The above goes with thanks to Dr. Soaring)

Well according to GW himself, Achmed seems to understand the founding fathers of America far better than yourself.  Congratulations Achmed.  I consider you an asset to this country.  Don't take any shit from low-life interventionalists.
rDAm

raf,

No reply to the Swiss argument?

How'd that plane miss you in D.C.?  You would have been a martyr and gone to heaven.  The rest of us low-life interventionalists then would have piece of mind.  Not being politically astute I admit that I don't really know the proper anglo saxon definition of what a low life interventionalist is  but it does certainly sound like some sort of juvenile name calling on your part.  

I am sure that George Washington would be proud to have known that such a person is quoting him some 200 years later.  

I am not really sure of the journalistic integrity of your quote... I am sure that Dr. Soaring is a well known political historian whose quote can be regarded as gospel... Personally, they taught me in law school to support factual quotes with book title, author date of publication, volume and page numbers.  I am ignorant as to George Washington quotes but would like to read the entire passage since oft times persons will miscontstrue passages to support their own biased arguments.  In fact one could take the position that Lawyers do that for a living.  Please forgive me if I am skeptical as to the veracity of your statements.

Personally,  I believe the our nation does more good and harm.  And theories that support the proposition that we, by our foreign policy, have been just begging for some Arab terrorists to run passenger planes into civilian targets is unconscionable.  I think George Washington would agree with that point(although I have to admit I have not read the works of the esteemed Dr. Soaring).  I don't think George Washington in his defense could have perceived the types of situations the U.S. has found itself involved in.  Therefore, while certainly one can construe the words of George Washington to apply to the 21st century I believe that it must be carefully approached.

Certainly, you are entitled to your opinion.  Mine is if you are not happy whay are you staying?  If you think that the U.S. deserves the latest wave of terrorism just leave.  we have left our borders open far too long.  The immigration policies must be strengthened and as I stated previosly , I wish we head never wasted our good or bad money on terrorist breeding grounds.  The U.S. was trying to make alliances in critical areas (as I recall to combat communism perhaps)  I am sure we have made mistakes.  You and Ahmed seem to imply that we have made mistakes and terrorist acts necessarily follow and are justified (that is what it sounds like to me is that what you are saying?)  I wish we could throw you out of this country for those viewpoints.  Certainly it is an opinion you have in common with the terrorists.  My threshold as to threats to national security has definetely gone way low in the last week.  

I am a little tired of rhetorical liberal criticism at this point.  

Yours Truly,

Blackholegun (alleged low life interventionalist)

Posted this very idea a few days ago....entitled "Chase the MONEY"

It is also time to impovrish the leaders of the hosting countries.

SRM

Swiss don't give a shit how puts money in their country as long as the money comes in.

SRM, I like it.
Touch them in the wallet.
And the gov surely has some xperience in it!

It would be more accurate to say that they don't go around causing problems, but that they solve problems that are forced upon them.

Of course, if you don't cause problems for others, they are less likely to cause problems for you.

If we hadn't saved the allies in WW1, there probably wouldn't have been either WW2 or a Cold War.

And if he hadn't helped the allies in WW2, likely the Germans would have defeated the Soviets.

In either case, if it wasn't for our invovlement, it is unlikely that Switzerland would have been threatened.

okay, IRAN.  they elect their president.  granted, that's all i know about it.  and granted, the religious leader (i forget what they call it, though it's on the tip of my typing fingers) probably has more real power than the president.  but the president is (theoretically) elected, nonetheless.

and BCBUD, that money's not so secret now heh?  doh!

**switching hats**  this discussion of the U.S.'s foreign policy is already taking place in another thread.  kindly let this one remain on topic.  cuz maybe, just maybe, the author is really curious about this and would like to have his question answered by those who know.

71-hour.  i understand your point of view.  and your point has been made.  i see no reason to start something just for the sake of starting something.  not to mention it's starting to sound an awful lot like a pissing contest.

Their woman are pretty, if they washed the beaver more often that would help.