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Posted: 8/26/2001 7:09:42 PM EDT
[#1]
They aren't overpriced, your underfunded!
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Posted: 8/26/2001 7:09:52 PM EDT
[#2]
Restricted importation of foreign made assault rifles. Come down to supply and demand. No supply and higher demand causes prices to go up.
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Posted: 8/26/2001 7:11:31 PM EDT
[#3]
[size=5][b]MADE IN GERMANY[/b][/size=5]
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Posted: 8/26/2001 7:13:38 PM EDT
[#4]
underfunded? is that similar to frumundacheese?
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Posted: 8/26/2001 7:17:57 PM EDT
[#5]
absolutely right lord trader sir!
scarecrow: snappy comeback, but no wash. try again. |
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Posted: 8/26/2001 7:18:37 PM EDT
[#6]
The problem isn't really with the price, it's with the service. They are definitely snobs, and arrogant too. They are Germans. What's the big suprise. They spend a lot of time doing engineering. They are very anal about it and very proud. They're so bad sometimes that they even make the French sound nice. Or maybe it's just that French sounds nicer than German. Not so harsh anyway.
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Posted: 8/26/2001 7:20:07 PM EDT
[#7]
I had an H&K USPC40. Not a horrible gun, but for what it cost, it should've been better. Creepy trigger, very sharp grips, cheesy safety parts and slide rails.
I finally traded it for a Sig 226. |
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Posted: 8/26/2001 7:27:22 PM EDT
[#8]
Ummm your topic says "why are kh's overpriced" simply put, its because german labour cost more then having some chinese slaves slapping the parts together. Even before the ban HK assault rifles werent 10$.
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Posted: 8/26/2001 7:28:44 PM EDT
[#9]
retrodog: rotflmao! hah hah. i had my german wife spell out the few words that i used. she is a good woman, but she needs to be 'put in her place' now and then. i tried spanking her but she enjoyed it too much.
willy |
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Posted: 8/26/2001 7:33:33 PM EDT
[#10]
Quoted: I had an H&K USPC40. Not a horrible gun, but for what it cost, it should've been better. Creepy trigger, very sharp grips, cheesy safety parts and slide rails. I finally traded it for a Sig 226. I thought the "creepy" trigger was a feature. I like my USP 9mm better then my Sig 226 (especially the trigger--I guess I dislike the Sig style). I have decided to eventually pick up a USP .45 and a USP .40. GunLvr |
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Posted: 8/26/2001 7:34:47 PM EDT
[#11]
Hey freewilly, glad to hear it. Spank her for me while you're at it. Two of my best friends are of German decent and I love to pick on them about it :)
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Posted: 8/26/2001 7:38:45 PM EDT
[#12]
Quoted: The problem isn't really with the price, it's with the service. They are definitely snobs, and arrogant too. They are Germans. What's the big suprise. They spend a lot of time doing engineering. They are very anal about it and very proud. They're so bad sometimes that they even make the French sound nice. Or maybe it's just that French sounds nicer than German. Not so harsh anyway. Get this HK is owned by British Aerospace. |
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Posted: 8/26/2001 7:40:21 PM EDT
[#13]
scarecrow:PEACE BROTHER. had an hk91 for 15 years. lots of fun, shot it a bunch. in those days, i allways wanted an fn, but they were about a thou. while the hk was about 5 hundred, and available. the factory .22 kit i got for the hk was 200 dollars. other accessories were more expensive then, like magazines and scope mounts. now, rifles and accessories are reasonably priced as parts kits. just the unobtainables are expensive, like lord trader sez. i guess it is price and demand. not withstanding, i still like the fn's better.
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Posted: 8/26/2001 7:43:25 PM EDT
[#14]
hey retrodog, yeah, ain't it fun?!!
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Posted: 8/26/2001 7:44:49 PM EDT
[#15]
becouse they can get it
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Posted: 8/26/2001 7:53:02 PM EDT
[#16]
Get a Glock and dont worry about HK. Much better gun anyways fewer things to go wrong. And can anyone tell me why they had to make the recoil spring and guide rod so complex? you only need 2 parts for something so simple! A spring and A ROD! WOW!!
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Posted: 8/26/2001 7:59:49 PM EDT
[#17]
I love my USP .45, best damn pistol I've ever shot.
Was it worth $800 [b]total[/b] (came to an even $800 after taxes and all the other CA charges with buying a firearm)?? Probably not... but if you want the best, you gotta pay for the best. All the plastic parts [i]feel[/i] cheap... I hear they are very tough... they just don't feel like it compared to other plastic parts I have felt. But... when you look at the slide and barrel.. now there is quality. Some of the finest machined and finished metal I've ever touched. But as far as the plastic... I took a look at an abused range rental with thousands of shots put through it without a cleaning. All plastic intact with little wear like my brand new USP. That makes me sleep better at night. Only complaint? The trigger... it doesn't suck.. but it's not good. I knew this before purchasing it. It can be improved... which is sorta a kick in the bean bag since ya just paid $800 for it. But that's life... And can anyone tell me why they had to make the recoil spring and guide rod so complex? you only need 2 parts for something so simple! A spring and A ROD! WOW!! Ever shoot one? Notice how the recoil of a .45 feels like the recoil of a 9mm? (ok so I'm fluffing that one, it's still a lot tamer than most .45's) That's why. And can you tell me why Glock chose to make feeding more reliable by just circumcising the chamber making it un-safe to shoot factory and re-loaded ammunition? Simplicity comes at a price, your safety. Complex engineering comes at a price, in the pocket book. And lets not get on accuracy of an H&K compared to a Glock. (out of the box) |
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Posted: 8/26/2001 8:02:42 PM EDT
[#18]
Since HK got bought by Brits they have become more of a "We dont like civilians" atitude and all there marketing is towards the military and LEO, not to mention prices could be better.
And freewilly, I dint know they went for so much! Here in Canada when the HK came on the market it was damn expensive compared to the FAL, I guess thats because Canada had at one time used the FAL so it was easier to come by. |
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Posted: 8/26/2001 8:10:51 PM EDT
[#19]
Speaking of the creepy trigger. Is there ANYTHING that can be done to improve on the HK USP40 trigger?
Please don't tell me to get a 1911;) shadows |
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Posted: 8/26/2001 8:12:08 PM EDT
[#20]
the SL8 is overpriced, but would you still think so if it accepted 30 rounders, folded, and had the g36 profile? the fault thier lays with someone else alltogeather.
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Posted: 8/26/2001 8:15:05 PM EDT
[#21]
Quoted: Get a Glock and dont worry about HK. Much better gun anyways fewer things to go wrong. And can anyone tell me why they had to make the recoil spring and guide rod so complex? you only need 2 parts for something so simple! A spring and A ROD! WOW!! I like Glocks too but better than an HK? I've fired loads in my HK (big mistake handloads), that would have reduced a Glock to small pieces. Concerning the complexity of the recoil spring and guide rod what the hell are you talking about? If you think that is overly complex then you must find chewing gum and walking even more complex. HK's are over priced but they are warrantied for the life of the purchaser. Glocks are warrantied for what...one year? You get what you pay for! |
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Posted: 8/26/2001 8:17:46 PM EDT
[#22]
Quoted: Get a Glock and dont worry about HK. Much better gun anyways fewer things to go wrong. And can anyone tell me why they had to make the recoil spring and guide rod so complex? you only need 2 parts for something so simple! A spring and A ROD! WOW!! I tried glocks, and IMO, They Suck !!! I tried a HK a friend had and bought one the next day. Now I own 3 !!! .45 FS, .45 compact and 40 compact. [puke]glock |
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Posted: 8/26/2001 8:22:03 PM EDT
[#23]
bro scarecrow, yes sir they did,(the fn). actually i was underpricing them. the ONLY fn that i had ever seen in those days was priced at 1,250.00!! no kidding. this, of course, was marketing at it's finest.
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Posted: 8/26/2001 8:25:15 PM EDT
[#24]
What other gun is truly equal at a better price?
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Posted: 8/26/2001 8:28:09 PM EDT
[#25]
HK USP-$800
Sig P226-$700 Springfield Match 1911-$900+ Glock 17-$650 Browning Hi-Power-$650 Raven 9mm-$150 Hipoint 9mm-$130 These price are pretty close to what I remember last time I went shopping for a new pistol. The fact is that quality cost money, and that's why HK's cost $800. But if ya don't like it then buy a Ruger or buy used and save 30-40%. sgtar15 |
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Posted: 8/26/2001 8:37:09 PM EDT
[#26]
Quoted: HK USP-$800 Sig P226-$700 Glock 17-$650 Dude are you sure about these prices?!?! Seem high to me. Glock 17 I bought in CA $480 NIB Sigs and HK USP's I have seen for around $500-650. Matter of fact when I bought the G17 I was looking at the 9mm USP Full Size @ $590. I have recently had the hots for the P7 though @ around $950 last I saw on GunsAmerica. |
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Posted: 8/26/2001 8:42:42 PM EDT
[#27]
Because "In a world of compromise, some don't"..
[img]http://communities.msn.com/_Secure/0MwCtGvQPvJG7tmFsys6!JAX9SyoIhSeoT73W0*rlMHVP4wQxP58ciUEO9MsvQiUCl4aXx1B86Yp0o!B3KOG*IA/hk51-01.jpg[/img] And for referrence a Sig550 will cost $9,000.00 and a French FAMAS will cost $5,000.00 so your point is absurd. A preban M1A N.M. will cost what a HK91 will cost and so will some preban ARs. |
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Posted: 8/26/2001 8:53:30 PM EDT
[#28]
Lordtrader, My quotes probably are on the high side, but the point was that quality cost money. However, I have never seen a Glock 17 for anywere close to $480NIB here in NorCal, if I ever do I'll buy it!!
sgtar15 |
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Posted: 8/26/2001 9:00:45 PM EDT
[#29]
Its kind of hard to put a fair price on what you might need to save yours or anothers life. HK USP's are worth every penny. I admit the double action pull is hard, but I love the single action pull on the HK USP. I don't think a full size HK USP being around $600.00 is being over priced for a Glock 17 priced around $480.00. Lifetime warranty, I believe more comfortable grip (I like the angle better on the HK), recoil reducing recoil system, a very tough finish, great barrel, many safety options. I love how there is virtually no slide to frame contact so wear is kept at minimum. I also like Glocks, Sigs, and Walthers to, but my first love is the HK USP.
No Slack! |
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Posted: 8/26/2001 9:04:30 PM EDT
[#30]
Overpriced,just like everything
made in Germany. [uzi] |
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Posted: 8/26/2001 9:06:43 PM EDT
[#31]
Oh! And I own a sweat Sig P220.
[pistol] |
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Posted: 8/26/2001 10:15:28 PM EDT
[#32]
Quoted: Overpriced,just like everything made in Germany. [uzi] Well, seeing as the HKs & SIGs are generally considered to be "the best" in equipment (rifles, subguns, & pistols) prices will be high. Of course there is nothing wrong with ARs, FNs, Glocks or 1911s... it is all about technology - progressive technology. Tyler |
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Posted: 8/26/2001 11:34:40 PM EDT
[#33]
You get what you pay for, If you want the best it will cost you.
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Posted: 8/27/2001 12:27:38 AM EDT
[#34]
FrankTheSpank - non-fully-supported chambers are not only a Glock feature - other pistols have this same characteristic.
As for the warranty - about five months ago I had a Glock17 barrel replaced for minor cosmetic reasons - pistol was almost five years old - what did Glock charge me for a new barrel? $0.00 - I'd say that's standing behind your product. Never been to an HK or Sig shoot where factory trained armorers were there to inspect, replace parts for the hefty price of $0.00. Glock sponsors the GSSF shoots nationwide. There is no more pro-shooter, pro-shooting company than Glock Inc. Personally, I haven't found the accuracy of HK pistols to be noticeably better than Glocks. Sig pistols have shown themselves to be the most accurate mass produced pistols FOR ME. That being said - I don't own any pistols that are for competition - my pistols are weapons. Glocks strictly adhere to KISS and are unsurpassed in reliability with factory loaded ammo (though I have fired gazillions of reloads through mine without incident). For shtf - teotwawki situations, the Glock can run bone dry and be completely broken down with a single punch, drill bit, or even a nail. In a surprise self defense situation, revolvers and Glocks shine. Grasp the weapon, point it, fire. I could care less if a pistol will give 3/4" tighter groups at 20 yards unsuppported. "please don't hurt me, Leroy - here - you can have my wallet - bang bang bang" Just my opinion. Tate |
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Posted: 8/27/2001 1:26:04 AM EDT
[#35]
shadow, there is something you can do about the trigger. I assume you have one of the first gen. pistols, since they are the only ones really needing any help. I have an early USP though, and mine is not bad.
If you are a do-it yourselfer, http://www.jacksonville.net/~gemarsh/hk/usptakedown/usp.html Otherwise send it to Teddy at Actions by T. His site, www.actionsbyt.com Good luck |
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Posted: 8/27/2001 2:13:57 AM EDT
[#36]
[size=6][green]HK DON'T PLAY[/green][/size=6]
Besides, they have cool proofmarks on them. |
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Posted: 8/27/2001 2:53:43 AM EDT
[#37]
Quoted: A preban M1A N.M. will cost what a HK91 will cost and so will some preban ARs. Right. Exactly. "Ya, dis is richt"! It's basically a pre-ban import with less circulation than an AR. No mystery there- LMFAO at the German jokes. Only Europeans more arrogant (with nothing to back it up) are the French. What a bunch of cheese-eating ASSH*LES! [:D) |
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Posted: 8/27/2001 3:46:26 AM EDT
[#38]
Quoted: Quoted: I have recently had the hots for the P7 though @ around $950 last I saw on GunsAmerica. Dude, screw gunsamerica on the P7, call KY Imports [http://www.kyimports.com] and get a P7M8 for under 700$ or a P7M13 for 800$ (no mags with the 13 though, they are 100$ each but worth it) Buy the P7M13 you won't be disapointed... If I could get my digital camera working I'd post a picture of it for ya. I shot my P7M13 back on Friday and came up with some obscenely small groups. Cheers. |
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Posted: 8/27/2001 5:21:25 AM EDT
[#39]
Quoted: FrankTheSpank - non-fully-supported chambers are not only a Glock feature - other pistols have this same characteristic. As for the warranty - about five months ago I had a Glock17 barrel replaced for minor cosmetic reasons - pistol was almost five years old - what did Glock charge me for a new barrel? $0.00 - I'd say that's standing behind your product. Never been to an HK or Sig shoot where factory trained armorers were there to inspect, replace parts for the hefty price of $0.00. Glock sponsors the GSSF shoots nationwide. There is no more pro-shooter, pro-shooting company than Glock Inc. Personally, I haven't found the accuracy of HK pistols to be noticeably better than Glocks. Sig pistols have shown themselves to be the most accurate mass produced pistols FOR ME. That being said - I don't own any pistols that are for competition - my pistols are weapons. Glocks strictly adhere to KISS and are unsurpassed in reliability with factory loaded ammo (though I have fired gazillions of reloads through mine without incident). For shtf - teotwawki situations, the Glock can run bone dry and be completely broken down with a single punch, drill bit, or even a nail. In a surprise self defense situation, revolvers and Glocks shine. Grasp the weapon, point it, fire. I could care less if a pistol will give 3/4" tighter groups at 20 yards unsuppported. "please don't hurt me, Leroy - here - you can have my wallet - bang bang bang" Just my opinion. Tate CAN I GET AN AMEN!!!! And a hail Gaston Glock over here. Yes Glock is the simpliest most functional pistol around. You depress the trigger and it will go bang!!! Unless of course you have no round in the chamber. Take care of it and it will take care of you. Have Glock 22 with over 1000rds [i]factory[/i] rounds thru it and not a malfunction in sight. 2000+ thru my Glock 19 and still functioning LNIB. 500rds thru my Glock 17 and still going LNIB. |
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Posted: 8/27/2001 5:31:45 AM EDT
[#40]
Quoted: Dude, screw gunsamerica on the P7, call KY Imports [http://www.kyimports.com] and get a P7M8 for under 700$ or a P7M13 for 800$ (no mags with the 13 though, they are 100$ each but worth it) Buy the P7M13 you won't be disapointed... If I could get my digital camera working I'd post a picture of it for ya. I shot my P7M13 back on Friday and came up with some obscenely small groups. Cheers. Dude thanx for the tip. I'll check em out. My dream of a P7 is closer to be reached. |
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Posted: 8/27/2001 6:01:49 AM EDT
[#41]
Speed costs money, how fast do you want to go?
Same thing with guns, you get what you pay for. About a year and a half ago I paid $615 (incl. tax) for a new USP 40f. If some of you are actually paying $800 for a regular full size, your getting screwed by the dealer. So for about a hundred dollars more than a Glock or Beretta, I get a lifetime warranty and a gun that fits my hand perfectly. Plus its a hell of a lot nicer, imho!. And some of you that don't like the trigger or grips, it must just be personal preference. The DA trigger leaves something to be desired, but I think the SA is great, and I like the bumps/spikes on the grip. It's just perfect! But that's just me. |
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Posted: 8/27/2001 6:21:17 AM EDT
[#42]
Sounds like the original poster really wants one. Why so bitter? And as far as the customer support being snotty because they are German... Customer support in the USA is people from the USA. When I had to send my USC back to them to check something on the firing pin, the people that I came into contact with were friendly and polite and they were clearly American. HK USA is fine in my book.
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Posted: 8/27/2001 6:42:17 AM EDT
[#43]
Good HELL! HKs cost $800 now? If it helps to make you sick, this is what I got a Tactical for with 2 12 round mags. My USP 45 was $635, this was about a year and a half ago- what happened?! At least the USP mags have gone down in price...
Germans snobs? HAHAHA! You haven't been to France then lately. I have. And French sounds worse, (you've been watching too many movies). HK has a good product, so do most of the west Euro imports. Take them apart, they all reek of quality. Colt has been dwindling over the years, and yes my Colt .45 (now sold) did recoil harder than my USP. Strange phenomenon. Between Sig, Glock, & HK, I'm pleased with either one. Owned 'em all, love em all. But the HK did hit a Coke can at 75 yards right out of the box with no modification... try that with a Colt! -yeah, maybe it was a lucky shot- could barely see the can! |
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Posted: 8/27/2001 6:51:14 AM EDT
[#44]
Ever see the video where an operator runs to a mud puddle, reaches in and pulls out an HK pistol (Mk23 IIRC), gives it a quick shake, then puts a 1-inch group at 25 yards?
That's what I'll pay for. No Compromise. |
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Posted: 8/27/2001 7:16:30 AM EDT
[#45]
I don't think they are over priced at all. I got a great deal on my HK USPC40. Although a buddy of mine who is with INS can get the LE version with 3 high cap mags for 400 bucks. I think I need a new job.
But what I paid was not over priced it was only slightly more than the sig and the glock(POS's) were more expencive then then USPC40. [sniper] |
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Posted: 8/27/2001 9:31:07 AM EDT
[#46]
Wow so Glock replaced your parts for free?!?! Cool!
I don't need anything replaced on my H&K.... [:D] And the price, again... $800 [b]TOTAL[/b] The sticker said like $700 or so. After taxes and all the bullshit fee's with CA DOJ it came to an even $800, actually $800 and like 23 cents or something. Again.. one more time... TOTAL. As in for me to take it out of the store that's how much I had to pull out of my ass. And the un-supported chamber not only on Glocks... well I don't buy those guns as well. Funny.. if I work hard I can find 50 pictures of KB Glocks, and different kinds of KB's, some with split chambers, blasted out triggers and magazine wells.. neat flower looking barrel splits.. etc. I saw one KB H&K, that's because some guy ported the barrel and slide with a hand drill. Even then the frame cracked, it didn't explode. And I can hear the belly aches.. "but re-loads!", go to Glock Talk and you'll find many Glocks that have KB'ed from [b]factory[/b] loads. To be honest I have a massive flinch when I shoot a Glock so I can't hit anything. Why? Cause I'm scared it's gonna go BOOM in the wrong direction!!!!!! Chopping the chamber is NOT a good idea! Instead of tackling the feeding problem another way such as H&K did using many complex parts.. Glock said "lets be lazy and just shave something, then we'll pawn it off as being simple and better!!" Fix the barrel and I'll consider buying a Glock. I have seen too many KB Glocks. And in my life I have seen one gun blow up in the hands of a shooter, not on TV, not on a webpage, in person. Can ys guess what kinda gun it was? And no... no after market barrels... that's like buying a new car and dropping in a new after market engine. |
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Posted: 8/27/2001 9:41:27 AM EDT
[#47]
its only the gloclk 40's that i would worry about
i have fired may a reload in my glock 17 no probs |
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Posted: 8/27/2001 9:09:14 PM EDT
[#48]
A better comparison, have anyone seen the fit and finish of a Mercedes or BMW made in Germany compared to any car/truck/SUV built in the US. There is no comparison as the Germans pay closer attention to detail than the American counterpart. A friend of mine purchased a 2001 Chevy Suburban K2500 from a undisclosed dealership in Pasadena, TX and loaded his travel trailer to go on vacation. On the way to his destination, the rear axle seized up on him. He took it to the dealer and they fixed it under warranty and told him that he was towing too much. A few weeks later, he again towed the trailer and the rear axle seized up again. Another dealer refused to warranty the repair claiming the vehicle was towing too much. He paid for it. Again at a later time, he towed a lighter load (18 ft. Wellcraft Eclipse) and it too seized up. The dealer claimed that he was towing too much again. He bought the boat to a weighing station and got a receipt of the weight and show the dealer. 9 months later, GM finanlly bought the vehicle back.
I would rather pay more money for stuff that is proven since my life may depend on it. I have a HK 91, 93, 94, SP89, USP 40, 45, 9, P7M8 to 1 Colt Sporter (post ban). Enough said. It also does not help that HK all over the television. |
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