So I want to sink some bucks into a super nice, high quality air rifle.  Who makes a hi-velocity fixed barrel single pump that you would recommend?  Of course, I will be putting a scope on it.

This will be for those times I get an itchy trigger finger and just don't have the time to make it out shooting.

RWS

1250 fps.

HH

bah!


who needs power and accuracy?  get a drozd!   just spray n' pray...  one of those 30 bb's is bound to hit the soda can

I have been looking for the same thing recently.
James

are you talking airsoft? check out ebaY?

airforceairguns.com/

ETA It's the evil black air gun

the rws 52 and 48 are fixed bbl , very accurate and very powerful.they are heavy though. in my experience i would go with a .22 caliber in these models because that will keep them subsonic. i dont know where you live but guns ove 1100 fps crack pretty loud.
now my latest rifle is th cats asss.its  a SAVER mod.303 made by Sam Yang ind. korea. it is a pump action 7 shot precharged .22. pre charged means it is charged by a scuba tank. mine was set at 900fps by the dealer MAC ,mcmurray&sons 310-327-3581. i bought mine in 1999 for 442.90 shipped with evreything but a tank and scope. i put a BSA 4x16x40 AO with mil dots on it . i think its more accurate than my rws rifles and i love being able to have fast repeat shots.
www.mac1airgun.com/wll.htm
www.pyramydair.com/cgi-bin/show.pl?cmd_category=show&category_id=2

Quoted: So I want to sink some bucks into a super nice, high quality air rifle.

Spend That Cash!

tag

Quoted: are you talking airsoft? check out ebaY?

Uhhhhhhhh nooooooo...I would be talking about a .177 caliber adult air rifle for taking care of pigeons and plinking in the backyard!

And here I thought my folding stock, Chinese AK-replica .177 air rifle was "the shit"......

Still.......all steel, 650fps, accurate as a mo-fo and looks like an assault rifle!   And currently only $60 at Sportsman's Guide!

Ok....so I have found a few that I like that are fixed barrel.  Does anybody know who has the best prices online?  Ariguns of Arizona and Pyramyd Air seem to be at full retail.  There has got to be some better deals out there!  Hell, even Cabelas is lower on some of the models!

Any help is appreciated

Just a note: the typical plastic cheap kids' "single-pumps" are single-pump pneumatics, where most of the "single pump" rifles you find now are spring-pistons. Single-pump pneumatics are nice because they have basically no recoil. Spring-pistons do have [reverse] recoil, and in the cheaper+higher-power models this can make them difficult to shoot accurately.

I'd suggest you not get hung up on power because accuracy is what's more important with air rifles. The cheap $250 rifles claiming 1000+ FPS are junk, they don't shoot that fast except with the lightest pellets available, and they spread shots all over.

For a "nicer" full-powered spring-piston gun, you would spend $400+ for the rifle alone.
Some field-use good choices with fixed barrels:
Air Arms TX200 series - $480 (underlever)
Weihrauch HW97K - $460 (underlever)
Diana RWS 52 - $400 (sidelever)
Diana RWS 54 - $560 (recoilless spring piston, sidelever)

Do note: you do not need a "fixed barrel" for accuracy. With higher-quality airguns, there is essentially no detectable difference in accuracy between the fixed and barrel cocking versions. Some good barrel-cockers are below:
Weihrauch HW80 - $450
Weihrauch HW90 - $525 (gas ram, less recoil+faster lock time)
Beeman--they only sell re-branded guns from other companies. Sometimes they use a different/"US-style" stock. If you find that you really want a particular Beeman airgun, then before buying--you want to find out who really makes it, and how much they sell it for.

If you really want to look bitchin' on the airgun line, Theoben makes a couple 12-ft-lb guns for $700 or so (Fenman and Evolution), and has the Eliminator for around $1000. These are all gas-rams; the Eliminator is ajustable up to about 20 ft-lbs (in 177) but I don't know if the others are rated for more than 12 ft-lbs.
-------
I have a Beeman RX (now RX-2), which is the branded version of the Weihrauch HW90 gas-ram gun. The adjustable power is a very nice feature, but I leave it at lower power most of the time. With the adjustable gas-ram, it is possible to pick one pellet and "tune" the rifle to shoot it very accurately, by adjusting the ram pressure.  
~

Quoted: So I want to sink some bucks into a super nice, high quality air rifle.  Who makes a hi-velocity fixed barrel single pump that you would recommend?  Of course, I will be putting a scope on it. This will be for those times I get an itchy trigger finger and just don't have the time to make it out shooting.

Sounds like you've already made up your mind what you want:

Fixed barrel -- why?
High Velocity -- Again, WHY? Unless you're going to hunt with it, the lower powered guns are MUCH more enjoyable to shoot. One of the biggest mistakes a new airgunner can make is to buy too powerful of a gun.
Single pump? -- What do you mean by that? Do you mean a spring gun (single "cock"?) or do you want some sort of pneumatic?

I'm going to go out on a limb and assume you mean a single-cock spring gun. It sounds like you're describing an RWS 48/52 or perhaps an Air Arms TX200. They both have fixed barrels. The RWS in particular claims high velocity figures and in both cases a single stroke cocks them.

The RWS 48/52 (same gun/different stock) rifles are very popular with well-heeled newbies and catalog junkies. They also have marginal triggers and a harsh firing behavior. But they're relatively cheap and, again, claim high velocity figures. The TX200 is a total class act. It's not so powerful but it's well built with a smooth firing behavior. It's also about twice the money of the RWS.

If you do buy a RWS 48/52 then definitely get the .22 version. That's the right pellet size for that power plant. Yes, your velocity numbers will be lower but the gun will shoot better. Plan on having it tuned -- raising the cost to about what you'll pay for a TX200. My advice, skip the RWS and get the TX200. But get it in .177. You see a lot of .22 TX offered for sale used. The .177 version is pretty scarce on the used market. People tend to hold onto them.

Another option is the Beeman R9. It's not a fixed barrel but rather a break barrel design. Most knowledable airgunners are not bothered by this in the least. The Beeman guns -- and their HW marked parents -- are well built and have great triggers. They do benefit from a good tune though.

Actually, though, I'd recommend skipping the high power stuff altogether. You can often pick up a used match rifle like an FWB 300S for $500 or so. If you're shooting indoors for pleasure you can't do much better. I have an old HW55 target gun that is PERFECT for basement shooting. Another gun I own, a HW50 has virtually the same powerplant but originally in a sporter configuration. Both are gentle shooting, extremely accurate, quiet and just a blast to shoot. The so-called magnum airguns are really quite inappropriate for indoor use. Unless they're tuned they vibrate and twang and are just not a lot of fun.

You can find lots of information about airguns at James Kitching's Airgun Forum and at the American Air Gun site. Both have classifed areas where people sell airguns used. Airgunners are relentless traders/upgraders and  you can almost always find good airguns used. Often you can find guns that have been tuned by top airgunsmiths for not much more than a stock new gun.

One more thing: expect to spend a boatload of change for a good scope if you're getting a powerful spring airgun. They're hell on scopes.

The Sheridan Silver Streak 5mm is nice.  We used to load them with Kodiak hollow points and shoot grackles.

Quoted: i45.photobucket.com/albums/f93/DragonsBloodAxe/M134MINIGUN.jpg

ahh good ole Piper!

Crossman makes good airguns.

My dad has had his since 1977.

Quoted: i45.photobucket.com/albums/f93/DragonsBloodAxe/M134MINIGUN.jpg

That sure is one cool looking BB gun.

Easy...  get a tx200 in .22 if you want to hunt, and .177 if you want to shoot targets.  Here is a picture of my .22 tx200 carbine.  Super smooth, quiet, and can outshoot some rimfires to 50 yds.

Chinese copy of RWS 48 - $135

The B21 is an excellent pellet gun, at a great price. Yea, it's Chinese.... It you can live with that, this is a very good choice.

FunSupply.com also has articles & info about many different air guns. Its worth spending some time looking through the site.

Quoted: Beeman--they only sell re-branded guns from other companies. Sometimes they use a different/"US-style" stock. If you find that you really want a particular Beeman airgun, then before buying--you want to find out who really makes it, and how much they sell it for.

This statement is largely true in most cases. In other cases there is a difference. For example, for years the HW30 came with  "Perfect" trigger while the Beeman R7 came with the better "Rekord" trigger. I've got an HW30 and wish I had an R7. Unfortunately you can't just buy the trigger as the receiver is slightly different too.

Still, when it comes to guns like the R1/HW80 (or is it 90?) I think Floppy's statement is pretty accurate. I doubt there's really much price difference though and it sure is easier to find the Beeman guns in the U.S.  

Quoted: The Sheridan Silver Streak 5mm is nice.  We used to load them with Kodiak hollow points and shoot grackles.

Quoted: Crossman makes good airguns . . .

I think we're talking a whole different level of gun here . . .

I shot a $1400 target air rifle on a marksmanship team in college similar to this one only it was a manual cylinder type action:Walther


Or there's this one:Feinwerkbau

my RWS 54.
22 cal at 900 fps verified!

Quoted: Quoted: The Sheridan Silver Streak 5mm is nice.  We used to load them with Kodiak hollow points and shoot grackles. Quoted: Crossman makes good airguns . . . I think we're talking a whole different level of gun here . . .

Heh,  Yep

I have an older Beeman R-1 in .177with a factory Beeman scope and it is a tack driver! This is the Beeman site:

www.beeman.com/sr.htm

I have to agree with the RWS.

you guys sorta got me interested in this now... does anyone make a pellet gun that actually takes a magazine or something?

so your not refilling it? after each shot?

Quoted: Ok....so I have found a few that I like that are fixed barrel.  Does anybody know who has the best prices online?  Ariguns of Arizona and Pyramyd Air seem to be at full retail.  There has got to be some better deals out there!  Hell, even Cabelas is lower on some of the models! Any help is appreciated

I never buy new so I can't personally vouch for any of the dealers but Pomona Air Guns has a really good reputation and their prices seem about as good as anyones.

Also, have  you looked at Airgun Express?

Wally World

I bought a Gamo 220 hunter there a while back for $110.  1,000 FPS and came with a 4X BSA scope.  DOn't look like they carry that anymore.

Also, for magazine fed, a crosman 1077.  Won't kill any birds but fun to shoot.  Don't ever take one apart though.  Don't ask me how I know.  Picked up a refurb online for about $30 once.

Anschutz 8002, punks!

Quoted: you guys sorta got me interested in this now... does anyone make a pellet gun that actually takes a magazine or something? so your not refilling it? after each shot?

Sure, there have been repeaters over the years but most of them are toys, or at the very least just "fun" guns. I believe FWB made a repeating target pistol at one time but, generally, serious air rifles are all single shots.

These things aren't about firepower. They're about precision.

Quoted: you guys sorta got me interested in this now... does anyone make a pellet gun that actually takes a magazine or something? so your not refilling it? after each shot?

my favorite is the crossman 1077.  i had one that saw some heavy use over a 10-11 year period.  after 10 years, one of the plastic pieces inside broke, but 30 seconds with a drill and a wood screw fixed the problem.  the internals were suprisingly simple.

it's not exactly a "tack driver", and it only puts out ~600 FPS, but it is an excellent fun gun.  mine took it's share of pests over the years.  it has a detachable plastic magazine body that accepts 12 shot rotary clips.  i picked up an extra body and a few extra clips a while back.  the CO2's are good for almost 3 clips worth of shots at good power.  you can get 50-60 shots out of a cartridge, but at a severe loss of power.


www.airgunsbbguns.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=cro1077&click=7



the price is definately right.  i just might pick up another one soon...

I have a RWS 48 and I had a Daisy Match something... The Daisy out shot the RWS.  RWS has a lot more power but you're right at 1100 ft/sec and as the pellet crosses the sound barrier it messes with the accuracy.
I found my best accuracy was when I moved to a heavier pellet which kept me subsonic.

Don't discount the Daisy, it's not a kids gun, I used mine as a practice rifle for shooting small bore during the winter.  The next summer I moved up one class in high power.

hmm :/ so the repeaters arent good enough for possible rodent killing/birdkilling

/ bear killing?

the below, is from the link above

Can you kill a bear with 1077?

YES!

If I first filed the muzzle into a sharp point and was able to thrust the gun up under the rib cage and into a vital organ...sure, I could kill a bear w/a 1077 no problem.


so there are no repeaters that are really for killing anything larger than rodents?

Edit,

another thing i meant to ask, how are all these guns shot other than with co2 canisters?

are none of them refillable by air compressor, like the one you got at home? how many psi do they use?

Quoted: Just a note: the typical plastic cheap kids' "single-pumps" are single-pump pneumatics, where most of the "single pump" rifles you find now are spring-pistons. Single-pump pneumatics are nice because they have basically no recoil. Spring-pistons do have [reverse] recoil, and in the cheaper+higher-power models this can make them difficult to shoot accurately. I'd suggest you not get hung up on power because accuracy is what's more important with air rifles. The cheap $250 rifles claiming 1000+ FPS are junk, they don't shoot that fast except with the lightest pellets available, and they spread shots all over. For a "nicer" full-powered spring-piston gun, you would spend $400+ for the rifle alone. Some field-use good choices with fixed barrels: Air Arms TX200 series - $480 (underlever) Weihrauch HW97K - $460 (underlever) Diana RWS 52 - $400 (sidelever) Diana RWS 54 - $560 (recoilless spring piston, sidelever) Do note: you do not need a "fixed barrel" for accuracy. With higher-quality airguns, there is essentially no detectable difference in accuracy between the fixed and barrel cocking versions. Some good barrel-cockers are below: Weihrauch HW80 - $450 Weihrauch HW90 - $525 (gas ram, less recoil+faster lock time) Beeman--they only sell re-branded guns from other companies. Sometimes they use a different/"US-style" stock. If you find that you really want a particular Beeman airgun, then before buying--you want to find out who really makes it, and how much they sell it for. If you really want to look bitchin' on the airgun line, Theoben makes a couple 12-ft-lb guns for $700 or so (Fenman and Evolution), and has the Eliminator for around $1000. These are all gas-rams; the Eliminator is ajustable up to about 20 ft-lbs (in 177) but I don't know if the others are rated for more than 12 ft-lbs. ------- I have a Beeman RX (now RX-2), which is the branded version of the Weihrauch HW90 gas-ram gun. The adjustable power is a very nice feature, but I leave it at lower power most of the time. With the adjustable gas-ram, it is possible to pick one pellet and "tune" the rifle to shoot it very accurately, by adjusting the ram pressure.   ~

These are pretty much the models I have narrowed it down to!  I just want the insurance of the fixed barrel always being true with the scope and not having a chance of even the slightest change in point-of-aim.  And, velocity in the 900 FPS range is fine with me.  I understand the subsonic advantage thing so I'm not out to have a 1250 FPS screamer to brag about.

It looks like I have a few more websites to research for pricing.....THANKS FOR THE INPUT, FOLKS!!!!!!!  ARFCOM is just awesome for getting feedback on other peoples trials and errors

As far as scopes go, what are the brands to stick with to ensure a long lasting scope?

This is a good place to look

http://www.pyramidair.com/


That's were I bought my Webley Patriot the most powerful spring piston pellet gun available and it's awesome

Quoted: Quoted: i45.photobucket.com/albums/f93/DragonsBloodAxe/M134MINIGUN.jpg That sure is one cool looking BB gun.

I don't think I can hold back anymore...

I'm gettin' one damn it!

Quoted: I shot a $1400 target air rifle on a marksmanship team in college similar to this one only it was a manual cylinder type action:Walther Or there's this one:Feinwerkbau

I dropped 1300 bucks on an Anschutz that i shoot on a college air rifle team.  It is  also a manual cylinder type action.  I guarantee you will hit what you are aiming at with it....  Anschutz 8002.

If you want a repeater, there are air rifles that will do it well and have enough power to whack small critters. All these guns use revolver-style "cylinders", not box or tubular magazines--and you charge them with air from a scuba tank (or a lot pf pumping).

The Theoben Rapid-12 rifles are the "classic" example, but they cost like $1500.

At least a couple other companies make cheaper ones now as well. BSA had the SuperTen, and there's some of the Career-type guns (funny looking, like over-under shotguns--but work well). The BSA was up around $600 I thinks; the Careers are $450 or so.
~

Quoted: RWS 1250 fps. HH

+1.  I bought the RWS Magnum 350 for around $400, great rifle IMHO

tag

I bought a brand new Winchester .177 air rifle ( around 1100 FPS - 1 pump ) for $39 from a local sporting goods chain here in WA. I am pretty sure they had it mismarked but I wasn't gonna ask any questions

Inside 50 yards it is extremely accurate. It's my weapon of choice in my neighborhood. 90% less crack than my Marlin Golden 39A or my Ruger 10-22.

Quoted:another thing i meant to ask, how are all these guns shot other than with co2 canisters? are none of them refillable by air compressor, like the one you got at home? how many psi do they use?

There are basically three kinds of airguns: Co2, pneumatic and spring

There are exceptions to all generalities but, generally:

Co2 guns are reasonably powerful. They're loud but their recoil is gentle. You do not need special scopes for Co2 guns. Co2 guns are made to run either on powerlets (the little cans that Crosman sells) or are filled from a bulk tank like paintball guns are. Many Co2 guns are toys or not much better though there are exceptions. A lot of the airguns designed as replicas of real firearms run on Co2. Years ago Crosman (one S in Crosman) made a line of really nice Co2 guns -- both pistols and rifles. These are very popular with airgun collectors. There are now some Chinese copies of these old guns and there's a cottage industry of people who modify and tune these guns. Co2 guns have a couple of weird quirks. When the gas cylinder runs low the power drops precipitously. Also, they're affected by outside temperture. They just don't work well when it's cold.

Pneumatics can be either multi-pump (like a Sheridan or Benjamin or Crosman 760) or single pump. THey can also be "pre-charged". These guns have an air resevoir that is filled either from a pump or a compressor. Pneumatics run the gamut from really cheap Daisy type guns all the way up to super high tech/super powerful models designed for target shooting or hunting. All the big bore airguns you see people using to hunt deer, wild boar and even bison are high-end precharged pneumatics. Some of the cheapest airguns on the market are pneumatic but so are the most expensive airguns on the market. Single stroke pneumatics pretty much are the mechanism of choice for Olympic style target shooting. Pneumatics, like the Co2 guns, can use any scope. Interestingly, Lewis and Clark carried a pre-charged pneumatics and in the 1700s, pre-charged pneumatic airguns were used by elite snipers and were considered prized arms of royalty and other wealthy sportsman.

Spring guns also run the gamut. The Daisy Red Ryder is a spring gun and so is the Beeman R1. Basically you have a piston inside a cylinder. At the end of the cylinder is a hole that lines up with the barrel on the gun. Cocking the gun -- either by "breaking" the barrel or by operating some sort of lever -- compresses the spring and pulls the piston back. A pellet is then inserted in a chamber or the breech end of the barrel and the action is closed. When the trigger is fired the piston moves forward and that small air cavity inside the cylinder compresses until pressure sends the pellet flying out the barrel. You're actually dealing with a very small quantity of air. Most of the popular German air guns use springs for propulsion. The popular RWS/Diana guns (i.e. models 34, 36, 48, 52), the Beeman/HW guns (i.e. R7, R8, R9, R11, R1, HW77, HW97, etc) and the Air Arms TX200 are all spring guns. Spring guns are great in that you get a lot of power and accuracy and you don't have to haul around a lot of accutraments to feed them (no compressors or gauges like with precharged pneumatics). Their downside is vibration and recoil. The so-called magnum high-power guns are especially twangy. These things can really rock your face when that spring flies. A huge part of serious spring gun airgunning involves tuning these guns for maximum smoothness. Usually people end up lowering the power level of the magnum guns (i.e. the R1 and the RWS 48) to settle them down. There are aftermarket springs available as well as spring guides, seals, lubricants, etc. Tuning really is a whole hobby in itself. Some spring guns, on the other hand, are known for being super gentle as well as accurate. Guns like the old HW55 are legendary for their accuracy and easy firing behavior. Needless to say these are not highpower guns. At one time Olympic grade match guns used springs for propulsion but the gun makers worked out ways to eliminate the recoil. THe FWB 300 is probably the best example of the recoilless spring gun. Spring guns will destroy a scope in no time. Scopes must be designed for the unique two-way recoil of a springer or they will self destruct in no time. A magnum spring airgun is harder on a scope than a large caliber centerfire rifle.

Bottom line advice: Start with a medium to low power spring gun to get your feet wet in airgunning. Look at the Beeman R9 and RWS 34/36 and consider sending them to someone to have tuned. A gun like this is perfect for back yard plinking and pest control. You can even hunt squirrels and rabbits with them. They're a little strong for basement shooting (paper targets or busting plastic army men or even aspirin tablets) but they're not many guns on the market designed for that kind of shooting any more. Speed sells, unfortunately.

Expect to pay between $200-$300 for a "decent" springer (i.e. a RWS 36) and another $175 for scope and rings and maybe a muzzle brake (a largly cosmetic thing to dress up the end of the barrel where the front sight was and give you something to hold onto when you cock the gun). An alternative to a scope would be a nice peep sight (about $50).

Personally I have been curious about products from Logun and AirForce.  They use paintball co2 tanks to allow high power, multi shot ability.  Paintball is somewhat gay, but imagine a droz with a 12 oz co2 tank.

Quoted: This statement is largely true in most cases. In other cases there is a difference. For example, for years the HW30 came with  "Perfect" trigger while the Beeman R7 came with the better "Rekord" trigger. I've got an HW30 and wish I had an R7. Unfortunately you can't just buy the trigger as the receiver is slightly different too. Still, when it comes to guns like the R1/HW80 (or is it 90?) I think Floppy's statement is pretty accurate. I doubt there's really much price difference though and it sure is easier to find the Beeman guns in the U.S.

I have the R1, in .20 caliber and I love it.  The other good thing is that Beeman will stand behind their guns and will fix them.  They also fix most quality guns (but they stay away from the chinese clones).  

I have been drooling over a FWB PC match grade rifle.  Too much $$$ for my blood, but it would be fun to try what the olympians use.

Geoff

Quoted: Quoted: Anschutz 8002, punks! jga.anschuetz-sport.com/pm/img_detail/164.jpg That thing probably costs more than an SSG P2K with Mk4 glass.

Easily.  This rig can hit $3K no question.   It is why I drool, but will never pull the trigger on buying one...

Geoff