So after church tonight a nice lady and her family invite us to go out to eat with them. They invite us to go to their favorite place, which happens to be a horrid dive. The greasiest of greasy spoons. The place smells faintly of armpit.

But it is an area "tradition" and for some reason people keep going there despite the fact that the place seems like a load of healthcode violations.

Anyway, we go, I choke down some of the worst hot dogs in the history of man, but I do so with a smile because the Christian ethic demands that I do all I can to fellowship with the bretheren.

We are leaving. It is about 9:00 on a Sunday night. So guess what is congregated around my vehicle?

If you said "bunch of idiot skater punks", you win the prize.

I proceed out to the vehicle in front of the rest of the group to disperse these little mongrels to avoid problems. All is going fairly well and we are almost loaded up and ready to go.

Then one of the idiots has to scream something utterly stupid about how Jesus gives people STDs.

Now the PROPER thing to do is to ignore this juvenile plea for attention from a self absorbed little snot.

But does the woman do this? No. She insists on saying "If you had a brain, you would be dangerous!"

The moment I heard this the reaction inside my brain started. "Well! Isn't THIS a fine mess! Now I have to kick skater punk a$$"

I began moving forward as the little skater snot began moving forward. I hit him with the beam from my Surefire combat light to move his focus to me. Guess what is in his front pocket? Yup! A knife!
So now I am not just faced with a mouthy skater punk, I am faced with a mouthy skater punk who has a weapon. Goodie!!! If he goes for the weapon, I will now have to kill the little scum-sucker.

I am faced with a mouthy punk with a knife who is surrounded by his buddies who expect that now they are going to have fun beating me up. There are, after all, seven of them and only one of me. So to avoid the fight, I now must turn my agressiveness level up to convince them that they do not want to mess with me.

So I turn it on.

They run their mouth some, but overall they behave exactly like the cowardly sunsabitches that they are and I manage to get everyone in their vehicles and out of the area. Apparently the concept of getting in a fight with this big intense looking bastard (namely Me....) didn't appeal to them.

But now I am madder than hell and I really WANT to kick someone's head in. Of course, the woman is in the car talking about how stupid the kids were. I am stone silent, staring out the windshield and clenching my teeth hard enough to shatter them. You know what happens now, right?

"What's the matter with you?" she asks.

She, of course, has not the slightest concept what just transpired.

"Well, what is the matter?" she persists.

Stiffling every urge I have to yell my brains out. I explain through my clenched teeth:

"You should have kept quiet and not responded to that jackass."

"He was being a jerk..."

"No, he was being a grade A, homogenized assclown desperately seeking for any sort of attention to distract him from the utter disaster that is his life. Nevertheless, you should have held your peace and ignored the dumb sucker."

"Why are you getting snippy with me?"

"Because everything was under control until you had to respond to his juvenile stupidity."

"So suddenly it is MY fault?"

"Yes."

"Well where do you..."

"Did you know the kid had a knife?"

"What?"

"He had a knife clipped in his front pocket. I saw it when I lit him up with my surefire."

"No, I..."

"How about his six buddies? Do you know how badly you can injure someone with a skateboard, not to mention God knows what other crap they were carrying?"

"I didn't..."

"No, you didn't. I did. I saw them before we left the restaurant and had evaluated the situation and had a plan on how to deal with things SPECIFICALLY to avoid a confrontation."

"Well you have a gun on, so..."

"You know I never carry A gun, I carry two. But I have no desire to get into a gunfight because of some stupid comment. I have spent hundreds of hours training for a gunfight specificalyl because I don't want to get into one."

"Well..."

"Well nothing. You didn't think the situation through. You didn't consider the ramifications of what you were doing. You didn't realize how bad it could have gotten."

"Well nothing happened!!"

"No, thankfully it didn't. But it COULD have been very nasty and if so it would have been completely un-necessary."

So now I am the bad guy who is over-reacting to everything.

And she has no idea that I won't be able to sleep because my brain is still in a$$-kicking mode and won't calm down for hours. So I turn on a little TV to try and calm down, and I instantly am bombarded by a TV show that has George Jefferson, a member of that awful band Poison, and a transvestite on it.

Hopefully posting on ARFCOM and a few episodes of Monty Python will calm me down.

Moral of the story: Ladies, please don't start trouble or contribute to any. We love you. We really do. But every now and then you make us mad enough to pull our own ears off. Don't put us in situations that we don't need to be in.

For the love of God, leave well enough alone.

Thank you.

Rant over.

You know? I do feel a bit calmer now.

Quoted: Then one of the idiots has to scream something utterly stupid about how Jesus gives people STDs.

LOL! v

I strongly suggest "The Meaning of Life".  And don't forget the machine that goes "BING".  ;)

You fell into their trap.  Dont go into their sewer.

FREAKIN WOMEN: WHY DO THEY INSIST ON GETTING US IN TROUBLE?? A rant

Did she tell you not to tip for lousy service?

Well at least you managed to avoid the gunfight overall.

Amazing that some people think that you carrying is a go ahead for them to be dumb.

Quoted: Well at least you managed to avoid the gunfight overall. Amazing that some people think that you carrying is a go ahead for them to be dumb.

Ordinarily she is a very reasonable woman. But for some reason I cannot discern, she seems to think that the gun on my hip will ward off evil.

Most likely she is just flat wrong and KNOWS it, and was just reaching for anything to avoid appearing wrong.

Not an unknown tactic for the fairer sex.

Eventually I will get an appology. Thankfully I managed to not say anything stupid or out of anger, so I shouldn't have to offer one.

Quoted:Amazing that some people think that you carrying is a go ahead for them to be dumb.

A few of my buddies still haven't figured out why I never say whether or not I'm carrying.....

Women ARE trouble. Just some of them are less so than others.

I had a girlfriend in college that ran her mouth like a retard. I am not a small guy, I know how to fight, but I have always avoided getting in them. Anyways, I got rid of her.

The woman I married thankfully is much smarter. She thinks only idiots get into fights, and would be pissed at me if I responded to some jackass's comments. Much better off with her. I carry a gun, and she feels better knowing I've got it, but I know she doesn't want me to have to use it.

Glad you avoided a conflict... a physical one at least.

Shawn

Quoted: You fell into their trap.  Dont go into their sewer.

It wasn't a trap.

It was just a group of idiot kids being their idiot selves. Like most dumba$$es they had no clue what they were screwing with.

Thankfully tonight they didn't find out.

How'd they know you were churchers?

She shouldn't know that you carry.

At least the Playboy chick on The Surreal Life is hot.

Quoted: How'd they know you were churchers?

Sunday night, folks wearing church type clothing....Not hard to figure out.

Quoted: "Well you have a gun on, so..." "You know I never carry A gun, I carry two. But I have no desire to get into a gunfight because of some stupid comment. I have spent hundreds of hours training for a gunfight specificalyl because I don't want to get into one."

Boy, ain't that the truth


I practice SPECIFICALLY to be able to AVOID trouble.(Trouble seems to evade the prepared for some reason)

Quoted: She shouldn't know that you carry.

Not exactly all that easy to hide when you live with the woman....

Nice to see some things in Vienna have not changed. BTW, I agree that the Inn should have been closed 20 years ago. Place makes me feel dirty just walking into it.

Quoted: "Well you have a gun on, so..." "You know I never carry A gun, I carry two. But I have no desire to get into a gunfight because of some stupid comment. I have spent hundreds of hours training for a gunfight specificalyl because I don't want to get into one."

This is why my wife is the only one I know that knows I have a CCW and carry. If I had my way she wouldn't know either.

Way to dress her down!  

Quoted: ...a horrid dive. The greasiest of greasy spoons. The place smells faintly of armpit. But it is an area "tradition" and for some reason people keep going there despite the fact that the place seems like a load of healthcode violations. Anyway, we go, I choke down some of the worst hot dogs in the history of man...

The Vienna Inn?

Quoted: Moral of the story: Ladies, please don't start trouble or contribute to any. We love you. We really do. But every now and then you make us mad enough to pull our own ears off. Don't put us in situations that we don't need to be in. For the love of God, leave well enough alone. Thank you. Rant over. You know? I do feel a bit calmer now.

You Sir are a model of restraint.

Multiple sources of distraction, and you still managed to stay in control of the situation.

Introducing another weapon into that situation would have made you look like the idiot, but then you knew that didn't you.

Way to go, a lot of guys would be 'splainin to the po po why they drew down on a bunch of teenage punks with attitudes about now.

I went into a greasy spoon tonight and all I got was a tweaker hitting me up for a bus pass.

The burrito was good, though.

You shoulda dropped them all where they stood!  

Quoted: "Well you have a gun on, so..." "You know I never carry A gun, I carry two. But I have no desire to get into a gunfight because of some stupid comment. I have spent hundreds of hours training for a gunfight specificalyl because I don't want to get into one."

The above is the exact reason why I never tell ANYONE that I'm packing.

Of course if it was my wife, then she'd already know what was contained in your statement to her, and she probably wouldn't have opened her mouth like she did.

Mine does it from time to time.

At least she is sorry when I explain things to her afterwards. She tries not to cause me difficulty.

Some people just don't think these things through and have little experience with how these things happen. They only know on their soap operas they are suppossed to make a snide or clever comment.

Thankfully my wife doesn't do it too much. She's been present on a few occassions where I actually drew a weapon and she knows I always carry.

She really has no interest in getting me from Point A to Point B. She's seen it before and knows it isn't as much fun as in the movies.

I guess in a way it is good that they are kinda naive about this stuff. Must be nice to live in that safer world where were you don't constantly guard against bad shit. I used to live there.

I just have a hard time believing you weren't on the hood of your car -- with both weapons out -- and the kids proned out pissing on their skateboards.  

"AND I WILL LAY MY RIGHTEOUS ANGER AND FURY UPON THEM  !!!11 "  

Just out of curiousity, what kind of church do you attend?

I thought us Apostolic Pentecostals were the only ones who got all dressed up on sunday nights...

As for the women, I has my mom verbally confront a man who flicked her off in the parking lot when he got out of his car. That type of behavior out of women is not uncommon.

Quoted: Vow right here, right now, NEVER to go take that stupid mouthy woman ANYWHERE ELSE.  She can't see that she came very close to getting hassled (at the very least) or cut up and killed (at the very worst).  She's making YOU the bad guy because you saved her stupid ass. Christian or not, I wouldn't be caught alive OR dead anywhere with that woman ever again.  YMMV.

uh... I think he posted that it was his wife

Quoted: I just have a hard time believing you weren't on the hood of your car -- with both weapons out -- and the kids proned out pissing on their skateboards.   "AND I WILL LAY MY RIGHTEOUS ANGER AND FURY UPON THEM  !!!11 "

''



now that is funny right there...

Quoted: Quoted: Well at least you managed to avoid the gunfight overall. Amazing that some people think that you carrying is a go ahead for them to be dumb. Ordinarily she is a very reasonable woman. But for some reason I cannot discern, she seems to think that the gun on my hip will ward off evil. Most likely she is just flat wrong and KNOWS it, and was just reaching for anything to avoid appearing wrong. Not an unknown tactic for the fairer sex. Eventually I will get an appology. Thankfully I managed to not say anything stupid or out of anger, so I shouldn't have to offer one.

First off, I glad that you and your party are OK.  That being said, you should lend the woman in question your copy (you do have a copy, don't you?) of "Way of the Gun".  That way she can see what can happen when a woman doesn't know when to shut the hell up.



Vulcan94

Quoted: She's been present on a few occassions where I actually drew a weapon

Drawdown story! Spill!

Why am I never in a situation like this....

Anyway, you would have been doing the little F...ers a favor by shining a light on them, attached to the rail of your gun.  Teach them just how damn lucky they are that they didn't pull crap like that on someone less stable than you.

Time to suggest that you'll "fellowship" with them if they are willing to change the venue.
I would suggest the strip club

Quoted: Quoted: She's been present on a few occassions where I actually drew a weapon Drawdown story! Spill!

Been a few. None as exciting as the car wash.

Only one worth relating.

We had just got back from an extended stay in Iowa and had an Iowa mindset. We went clubbing on South Beach. As we were rolling up I-95 at about 3am I passed a 20 something chick with a broken down car.

My first thought was "She isn't gonna last 10 minutes out here this late at night." In Iowa you help people that are in potential danger so I pulled over and backed up to see if she needed a lift to the nearest phone (this was a few years ago before cell phones were everywhere).

No sooner than I got out of my car and started walking over about four big ass black dudes piled out of her car and sprinted for me. I doubled back, reached in the window and grabbed my HK USP (it was between the seats and not "on me" as you can't take them into South Beach clubs) and drew a bead on the lead asshole who skidded to a stop about six feet in front of me and who was now looking down the barrel.

I still vividly remember being seriously pissed. All I could think about was what they would have probably done to me and my wife (then girlfriend). I was furious because only the best people who have fallen for such a ruse and stopped to help. I remember thinking how much I wanted to execute all of them (even the bitch who was bait). I'm still not sure if the only reason I didn't was because I didn't want to do something like that in front of my girlfriend. But man I could taste it. I don't think I've ever wanted a bunch of assholes dead that much in my life. I'm certain they didn't have happy plans for us.

Anyway we all kind of stood there for a minute or two. Me thinking pissed off thoughts about killing a bunch of assholes and them trying to figure out whatever the hell they were thinking. None of them had a weapon of any kind (not the the four of them couldn't fuck someone up easy).

So finally when I got a little composed I said "Ok here is what we are gonna do....I'm gonna get back in my car and you are gonna get back in your car and we are all gonna leave."

I then backed up, got in the car and left.

My gf was seriously freaked out. She didn't figure out what happened until it was almost over. I cannot adequately describe how angry I was at the whole thing. I was pissed for days. Part of it was the fact that it happened, partly because I didn't see it coming. Part of me still wishes I shot all of those fuckers.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Well at least you managed to avoid the gunfight overall. Amazing that some people think that you carrying is a go ahead for them to be dumb. Ordinarily she is a very reasonable woman. But for some reason I cannot discern, she seems to think that the gun on my hip will ward off evil. Most likely she is just flat wrong and KNOWS it, and was just reaching for anything to avoid appearing wrong. Not an unknown tactic for the fairer sex. Eventually I will get an appology. Thankfully I managed to not say anything stupid or out of anger, so I shouldn't have to offer one. First off, I glad that you and your party are OK.  That being said, you should lend the woman in question your copy (you do have a copy, don't you?) of "Way of the Gun".  That way she can see what can happen when a woman doesn't know when to shut the hell up. Vulcan94

Sarah Silverman is hot

HE GOT WEED, HE GOT WEED!!!!!!!

Quoted: Been a few. None as exciting as the car wash. Only one worth relating. We had just got back from an extended stay in Iowa and had an Iowa mindset. We went clubbing on South Beach. As we were rolling up I-95 at about 3am I passed a 20 something chick with a broken down car. My first thought was "She isn't gonna last 10 minutes out here this late at night." In Iowa you help people that are in potential danger so I pulled over and backed up to see if she needed a lift to the nearest phone (this was a few years ago before cell phones were everywhere). No sooner than I got out of my car and started walking over about four big ass black dudes piled out of her car and sprinted for me. I doubled back, reached in the window and grabbed my HK USP (it was between the seats and not "on me" as you can't take them into South Beach clubs) and drew a bead on the lead asshole who skidded to a stop about six feet in front of me and who was now looking down the barrel. I still vividly remember being seriously pissed. All I could think about was what they would have probably done to me and my wife (then girlfriend). I was furious because only the best people who have fallen for such a ruse and stopped to help. I remember thinking how much I wanted to execute all of them (even the bitch who was bait). I'm still not sure if the only reason I didn't was because I didn't want to do something like that in front of my girlfriend. But man I could taste it. I don't think I've ever wanted a bunch of assholes dead that much in my life. I'm certain they didn't have happy plans for us. Anyway we all kind of stood there for a minute or two. Me thinking pissed off thoughts about killing a bunch of assholes and them trying to figure out whatever the hell they were thinking. None of them had a weapon of any kind (not the the four of them couldn't fuck someone up easy). So finally when I got a little composed I said "Ok here is what we are gonna do....I'm gonna get back in my car and you are gonna get back in your car and we are all gonna leave." I then backed up, got in the car and left. My gf was seriously freaked out. She didn't figure out what happened until it was almost over. I cannot adequately describe how angry I was at the whole thing. I was pissed for days. Part of it was the fact that it happened, partly because I didn't see it coming. Part of me still wishes I shot all of those fuckers.

Damn, that's some scary shit.    

Quoted: HE GOT WEED, HE GOT WEED!!!!!!!

I don't think he has to worry about getting his ass kicked by the cops. He isn't Chris Rock.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: She's been present on a few occassions where I actually drew a weapon Drawdown story! Spill! Been a few. None as exciting as the car wash. Only one worth relating. We had just got back from an extended stay in Iowa and had an Iowa mindset. We went clubbing on South Beach. As we were rolling up I-95 at about 3am I passed a 20 something chick with a broken down car. My first thought was "She isn't gonna last 10 minutes out here this late at night." In Iowa you help people that are in potential danger so I pulled over and backed up to see if she needed a lift to the nearest phone (this was a few years ago before cell phones were everywhere). No sooner than I got out of my car and started walking over about four big ass black dudes piled out of her car and sprinted for me. I doubled back, reached in the window and grabbed my HK USP (it was between the seats and not "on me" as you can't take them into South Beach clubs) and drew a bead on the lead asshole who skidded to a stop about six feet in front of me and who was now looking down the barrel. I still vividly remember being seriously pissed. All I could think about was what they would have probably done to me and my wife (then girlfriend). I was furious because only the best people who have fallen for such a ruse and stopped to help. I remember thinking how much I wanted to execute all of them (even the bitch who was bait). I'm still not sure if the only reason I didn't was because I didn't want to do something like that in front of my girlfriend. But man I could taste it. I don't think I've ever wanted a bunch of assholes dead that much in my life. I'm certain they didn't have happy plans for us. Anyway we all kind of stood there for a minute or two. Me thinking pissed off thoughts about killing a bunch of assholes and them trying to figure out whatever the hell they were thinking. None of them had a weapon of any kind (not the the four of them couldn't fuck someone up easy). So finally when I got a little composed I said "Ok here is what we are gonna do....I'm gonna get back in my car and you are gonna get back in your car and we are all gonna leave." I then backed up, got in the car and left. My gf was seriously freaked out. She didn't figure out what happened until it was almost over. I cannot adequately describe how angry I was at the whole thing. I was pissed for days. Part of it was the fact that it happened, partly because I didn't see it coming. Part of me still wishes I shot all of those fuckers.

Just wow.

Thank god you were armed.

That could have had a really bad ending.

My wife had a spooky experience several years ago on a girl road trip to CA. I had got her a S&W 38 concealed hammer in a Galco purse just weeks before. She wanted to know what to look for and how to escalate force in one easy lesson. I worked a simple senario of a guy in a parking lot asking the time or some strange, trite, or inappropriate question. We walked through different possibilities and I told her that no matter what, if we had to lawyer up that was preferable to me raising the kids with no mother.

Anyway, in Reno NV the girls all stopped for a pottie break and parked at the extreme end of the parking lot for a reason that I don't remember. Lighting was poor and it was evening. A man was checking her out as well as the scene and then started toward her asking the same kind of dumb question we had rehearsed. The other girls were still inside and by the time my wife made it to the car and into the seat the guy got between the door and her. She raised the purse about a foot from his sturnum with the revolver in her hand still in the concealment pocket. As the last two seconds of the man's life lined up the girls streamed out the door of the casino and the guy looked nervous and bailed. That is our closest call yet.

Quoted: Quoted: uh... I think he posted that it was his wife well, that sucks even more.  I edited "stupid" out of my post, but left "mouthy", because it's the truth, and that hurts sometimes. I can't say my advise would be any different though.  Not until she vowed to change her ways.

Funny, I read it as the woman other than his wife, also.

Dang, now I feel the need to take another class.

Quoted: Mine does it from time to time. At least she is sorry when I explain things to her afterwards. She tries not to cause me difficulty. Some people just don't think these things through and have little experience with how these things happen. They only know on their soap operas they are suppossed to make a snide or clever comment. Thankfully my wife doesn't do it too much. She's been present on a few occassions where I actually drew a weapon and she knows I always carry. She really has no interest in getting me from Point A to Point B. She's seen it before and knows it isn't as much fun as in the movies. I guess in a way it is good that they are kinda naive about this stuff. Must be nice to live in that safer world where were you don't constantly guard against bad shit. I used to live there.

That's just the point.

In a SANE world, she is absolutely correct. What each of those little punks need is someone to give them a swift kick in the buttocks and a command to shut the heck up and stop being so damned stupid. In my Grandfather's day, kids would not behave like that to an adult, because the adult could have literally taken off their belt and beat the stuffings out of them.

And the police would have approved of that solution.

The kids were being idiots, and someone ought to have busted their tails for being so stupid. Unfortunately in our society we aren't allowed to take measures to stop punks from being punks until they try to kill us, in which case we can kill them first. Seems to me that allowing an intermediate level of a$$ kicking is a whole lot smarter than doing nothing until these kids cross the line and then killing them, but the law doesn't seem to agree.

Nevertheless, when I saw the knife all I saw in my head was a couple of kids laying on the ground bleeding to death and me standing over them with my Glock 26, and then a flash to watching them get loaded into the ambulances to be pronounced DOA, and then headlines in the paper "Man guns down teenagers".

I carry a gun and have spent a lot of time training to use my guns to defend my life if it becomes necessary. But I don't WANT to shoot anyone. The last thing I want to do is watch some dumb bastard gugrling out his last few breaths knowing that I am the one who put the bullet in his chest that is about to end his life. Especially when it is some idiot kid whose real crime seems to be stupidity in the 1st degree.

If the little bastard had pulled the knife, he would have died. And if any of his buddies weren't smart enough to leave, they would have probably ended up dead too. That wouldn't have been her fault, but still, sometimes a comment like that can be the thing that triggers these dumb sunsabitches to be REALLY dumb.

NEVER contribute gas to a flamable situation.

Quoted: I just have a hard time believing you weren't on the hood of your car -- with both weapons out -- and the kids proned out pissing on their skateboards.   "AND I WILL LAY MY RIGHTEOUS ANGER AND FURY UPON THEM  !!!11 "

Thankfully I was very calm during the events transpiring.

I didn't really get properly pissed off until after it was all over, when my system was full of adrenaline and I hadn't got to beat the living snot out of anything.

I actually had the thought that I should have pulled my gun and scared the sh*t out of those little bastards, but the rational side of my brain kept yelling "BRANDISHING!!!" and so I kept it in the holster.

Still, it would have been funny to watch those kids sh*th themselves after realizing they had picked a fight with a guy packing a gun.

Quoted: My gf was seriously freaked out. She didn't figure out what happened until it was almost over. I cannot adequately describe how angry I was at the whole thing. I was pissed for days. Part of it was the fact that it happened, partly because I didn't see it coming. Part of me still wishes I shot all of those fuckers.

And that's what happens.

When you see someone who intends to do you harm and you have time to think, you get pissed off. REALLY pissed off. And you start to think nasty thoughts like "Every one of these motherf*ckers deserves to die right here".

At times like that the only thing keeping you from pulling the trigger is the knowledge that you are going to end up in a real hassle if you do.

Folks who have never looked down the sights at a situation don't realize how unbelievably primal it gets.

Quoted: well, that sucks even more.  I edited "stupid" out of my post, but left "mouthy", because it's the truth, and that hurts sometimes. I can't say my advise would be any different though.  Not until she vowed to change her ways.

It's no big deal.

She doesn't read ARFCOM.

.

Quoted: Just out of curiousity, what kind of church do you attend? I thought us Apostolic Pentecostals were the only ones who got all dressed up on sunday nights...

I am a Pentecostal....

We weren't really all that dressed up, but at that time of night in that part of town the only people who are dressed in a presentable manner are usually church people.

As for the women, I has my mom verbally confront a man who flicked her off in the parking lot when he got out of his car. That type of behavior out of women is not uncommon.

Sometimes it seems that they just don't think about all the bad stuff that can happen when they do something like that.

My grandmother, God love her, was at a mall paying for something and pulls out this ginormous bundle of cash. (Bank? Use a bank? You can't trust banks! God fearing people keep their entire life savings on them at all times!!) Seeing some unseemly types that were near, I put myself in position to block anyone in the store from seeing that this little old lady had about four thousand dollars in her purse.

She wanted to know why I was crowding her all of a sudden.

"Because I don't want anyone to know just how much cash you have on you. You never know who is watching you." I responded.

"Well those n****ers aren't tougher than my guardian angels" she said.

And she didn't say it quiet either.

One rather large fellow who looked as if he could play for the NFL heard it and glared in my direction.

All I could see was the headline the next morning: Man shoots African American after racist comment.

Thankfully nothing came of it, but still. This is part of the reason why I wrote that rant. I have to wonder what it is about estrogen that seems to cause this phenomenon.

Quoted: Nice to see some things in Vienna have not changed. BTW, I agree that the Inn should have been closed 20 years ago. Place makes me feel dirty just walking into it.

I wasn't at the Vienna Inn, but from the sound of things I might have to go see it one time for posterity's sake....