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Posted: 2/25/2006 7:57:40 PM EDT
[#1]
I have read people making the suggestion to MOVE ..........move where ??? If this legislation passes it will spred like a cancer throughout ALL the States !!!!!!!!
If you don't take a stand before this madness gets a foot hold............... you ......no, we are all lost. IF the democrats win in 08 ...........you can bet there will be a Federal Ban on "Assault Weapons" and this time the Liberals will close most of the holes. Confiscation of people's homes under the guise of the public good to build Condo's and build Tax revenue.......... this was just the start. Loosing your rights to own firearms will be an easy leap for the Fed.s if the States already have confiscation laws. In Maryland ......Mr. O"Malley has already proposed an AWB.......and is hoping to slide it under the citizens noses by allowing a "Grandfather Clause". But once the ban is excepted........ I'll bet laws against usage will be passed. So you will be able to own the gun .....just not shoot it anywhere. And than as more and more States enact laws like Il...........Maryland will jump on the confiscation band wagon for sure. JF. |
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Posted: 2/25/2006 8:16:37 PM EDT
[#2]
Unbelieveable!! I didn't think any such place still existed in this country! |
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Posted: 2/25/2006 7:02:04 PM EDT
[#3]
What is the current status here? Any news?
TIA- --VT |
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Posted: 2/25/2006 7:09:26 PM EDT
[#4]
When states start taking away any type of legally owened firearms, it's time to go to fucking war! An unarmed citizanry is one without liberty or justice for all. If this kind of shit can really happen, people better wake the fuck up.
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Posted: 2/9/2006 8:37:13 PM EDT
[#5]
I agree if necessry resist with force of arms. Show them a prelude of what will happen if the feds try this across the entire country. If a handful make a significant stand it may spark a larger uprising.
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Posted: 2/10/2006 4:36:58 AM EDT
[#6]
I was reading in the St Louis Post Dispatch 2-9-06 about a couple of Illinois State Patrol Officers who were arrested for trainig with and possessing a F/A M4 ...wish I could have sent the article - Lexus Nexus should have it ... fuckin sad !!
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Posted: 2/9/2006 6:48:53 PM EDT
[#7]
My letters didn't include the term "weapon" but instead firearm. Even with HA 7 that was just introduced, what does it do to the manufacturers of the firerarms in the state of IL?
Looking at the fact that the Sponsor of the legislation knows that it won't pass without at least grandfathering shows that there's pressure and he knows there's not a snowball's chance in hell it would pass without "watering it down". |
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Posted: 2/9/2006 7:26:46 PM EDT
[#8]
i thought khalistan was the only separated country.. wtf
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Posted: 2/9/2006 7:30:24 PM EDT
[#9]
You simply write the legislation-
Dear Illinois Legislation, FIREARMS BANS OR CONFISCATION IS AN ACT OF WAR!!! Sorry but this is beyond writing letters if they are going to this level, esspecially those who are serving or have served as LEO or Military- you swore to uphold the Constitution against all enemies both foreign and DOMESTIC, you are obligated by your oath to react with force if necessary. Also if you are an able bodied male between the ages of 18-45 then you are also obligated to react as a member of the militia with force if necessary if any power foreign or DOMESTIC infringes upon the Constitution of the United States. Elected body should not be excluded when acting out of the confines of the law and Constitution prohibiting them from compromising your inherent rights. This is really bad and could very well in all justification become a war. Creeper |
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Posted: 2/9/2006 12:55:41 PM EDT
[#10]
Yea, I'm a little late and just saw this thread. I like Phoebus' letter. One thing that I've noticed though is that we as a group tend to use the word weapon when trying to argue pro 2nd points or when countering AWB "facts" etc. From the Merriam Webster Online Dictionary:
weapon: 1 : something (as a club, knife, or gun) used to injure, defeat, or destroy 2 : a means of contending against another vs. firearm: a weapon from which a shot is discharged by gunpowder -- usually used of small arms So, "weapon" refers to something generally held as negative. I'd even stay away from the word "arms" except when specifically citing the 2nd because even it has what might be construed as negative connotations (mainly #1 below). arms: 1 a : a means (as a weapon) of offense or defense; especially : FIREARM b : a combat branch (as of an army) c : an organized branch of national defense (as the navy) I know it's semantics, but it's the appearance that counts to lots of those anti 2nd people. We hunt/compete with rifles; bang sticks generically are firearms; long bang sticks are rifles and short ones are pistols; and we wage war with weapons and war is generally seen as bad. Unfortunately the term "weapon" while a noun, refers to an object's use and not the object itself, ie. ...victim was hit with a blunt or edged weapon (baseball bat or steak knife). Just like the other side has taken great pains in identifying and associating particular firearms with the words "assault" and "weapon" we should be as vigilant is trying to disconnect that association. If we can eliminate the distinction between particular firearms, it should be much harder to ban firearms in general than it would be to ban just what some call assault weapons. Randall |
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Posted: 2/9/2006 1:23:24 PM EDT
[#11]
Your point is taken, but don't you think it would be better and more credible if the issue was not sugar coated and watered down. The anti-2nd amendment types need to understand the real reason for it, to kill your government, if it needs killin'. This is a radical idea for the preservation of democracy, not so we can hunt or shuttle around to competitions soccer-mom style. I say this because I got into an argument with a co-worker who basically said that we don't need the 2nd amendment any more because people can get get their food from a grocery store now. Then when I brought up the idea of self-defence he said "well now we have police". He had absolutely no idea what it was actually for and no concept of checks and balances. I think it is easier to argue for the ultimate preservation of freedom than any other reason. just my opinion. 
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Posted: 2/9/2006 11:04:48 AM EDT
[#12]
iam local 1526 any openings in az?? lol they allow laterals? |
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Posted: 2/9/2006 5:52:44 AM EDT
[#13]
Amendment 7 was introduced yesterday. It includes a clause to grandfather in previously owned weapons and magazines.
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Posted: 2/8/2006 6:06:17 PM EDT
[#14]
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quoted: yes it sucks but some of you guys sound like you would go out with a "bang". there are other guns -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Yea for how long ? They just need a foot hold , then what will be next ? |
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Posted: 2/8/2006 6:30:45 PM EDT
[#16]
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Posted: 2/8/2006 6:58:09 PM EDT
[#17]
Governmenta are created to protect our inalienable rights,when it becomes destructive to these ends it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it"its not a crime to raise a militia for the common defense...people need to wake up get organized and stand up for their rights and the NRA needs to get off their ass and start spending some of their money on laywers and litigate this all the way to the supreme court if necesary.Also confiscation violates the 4th ammendment to be secure and safe in your belongings and suroundings,ilegal searches and seizures.And in the preamble to the constitution...you cannot be deprived of life,liberty or property with out due process and at the very least they would have to by law compensate you money wise for personal property taken..this opens a can of worms because if they confiscate weapons im sure some will resist to defend what is lawfully theirs and not many poeople will stand by when inocent americans are shot because they wont hand over their property.If the local government does not want a war with segments of the population they better stand down..those who would sacrafice liberty for security deserve neither.
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Posted: 2/7/2006 6:51:59 PM EDT
[#18]
Still time to contact your local legislators.... Every time it comes up it is removed from the record for discussion..
It WILL eventually come up for discussion/debate, so let your voice be heard! |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 9:59:26 PM EDT
[#19]
Having just moved from the PRK (Peepul's Republik of Kalifornia), I have witnessed all but the confiscation part... Anyone who had the banned weps BEFORE the Kalif ban had to register them (even though no registration process was in place when the deadline came & went). Confiscation is next, I believe. If you doubt me, lookit San Francisco... it is now illegal to own a handgun there... it's a downward spiral. And of course, it's a crock of horse s***. The criminals don't mind breaking the law. And the law is mostly a "looks-like" law anyway, just like the PRK's law. But Feinstein and her bearded-hippie hubby both have CCW permits! And Hanoi Jane, standing in front of her fifty-thousand dollar gun collection, said, "Oh, I don't think that ORDAINARY PEOPLE should be allowed to have guns." (Interview with Baba Wa-Wa.) |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 6:22:56 PM EDT
[#20]
Could just sell the whole thing and not turn anything in. There is a window of time to take care of it. I wouldn't turn anything in to them that is compensable. |
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Posted: 2/3/2006 11:56:17 AM EDT
[#21]
Yes and no, I was a patrol sergeant and just got promoted to Lt., so now I have a desk job. I am the supervisor over patrol and investigations. Now that I get to see the inner workings of admin, I can say for sure that certain higher ups may not approve of the bill, but politically they have to support it or they will not have a job. The last time this bill came around, I called Sen. Haine and spoke with a very delightful staff member who stated that he opposes the bill. It's not the below I-80 House members you need to worry about, its the Great State of Chicago members. The State has always been divided between both sides of the state. Look at the ILCS, some laws are only applicable to Lake and Cook Counties. It boils down to what they think is the best for us poor hill people down south. |
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Posted: 2/3/2006 8:27:09 AM EDT
[#22]
they tossed the amended version....
as of right now if it where voted on we have to get ride of them move them or have them rendered inert... we are now waiting on amendment 7........"possibly" thanks for all the support guys 
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Posted: 2/3/2006 8:45:35 AM EDT
[#23]
Ops,
Calls from out-of-state voters won't mean much to state politicians. This kind of thing is what the NRA was made for. Call them. Quickly. Michigan has the MCRGO (Michigan Coalition of Responsible Gun Owners), and they deal with this sort of thing (with the help of responsible shooters of course). If Illinois has the equivalent, get behind them and roll. Keep us posted. SP |
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Posted: 2/3/2006 8:59:06 AM EDT
[#24]
(I normally try and at least scan all posts before responding but this one has grown to seven pages and I must admit I have not read them all.) ops144, while I don't know the details I do know that ArmaLite hosted 'visitors' from your state government this week. ArmaLite's concerns are the same as yours and they have been pro-active in voicing their concerns. 5sub |
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Posted: 2/3/2006 10:57:53 AM EDT
[#25]
Maybe this has been thought of before, but it just occurred to me.
If, heaven forbid, you would have to turn in you weapons and you had no choice but to do so. Then strip that thing down to the receiver and only turn that in. Sell the rest as a "kit" on the EE and recoup some of your money. I hope it doesnt come to that for anyone, but if the stripped receiver is considered a weapon by itself by the BATF, then only turn that in. Your out 100 bucks vs. 10 times that, and someone in a FREE state can get a deal. |
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Posted: 2/3/2006 11:35:09 AM EDT
[#26]
that is good to know i know armalite supplies the illinois state police with there ar15 carbines.... we all have our fingers crossed here... there is very heavy phoneing /mailing /and emailing of our reps" going on right now...... this whole mess really blows.....i wish they would just leave us alone |
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Posted: 2/2/2006 7:18:46 PM EDT
[#27]
Forgive my igonorance at this hour, where are you seeing the amended version that has passed consideration (link)? Thanks! |
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Posted: 2/2/2006 6:23:25 PM EDT
[#28]
Write letters, email and phone calls.
God loves those crazy Tennesseans - always VOLUNTEERing for a good fight - www.jpfo.org/athens.htm (this is no BS, this actually happened!) |
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Posted: 2/2/2006 6:44:47 PM EDT
[#29]
Read the amended version. It grandfathers in weapons already owned. I'm not saying it doesn't suck.
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Posted: 2/2/2006 11:35:28 AM EDT
[#30]
That vote was for Amendment 5, not the whole bill. I cant find a list of what Amendments 3,4 & 5 are. 1 and 2 have been adopted and are listed. 5 has been voted down and I am not sure of 3 and 4. I have written, E mailed and called and voiced my stance. |
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Posted: 2/2/2006 5:18:41 AM EDT
[#31]
Politicians live in houses just like you and me: type 5 construction. You know better than I, winter is the worst time of the year to put out a fire.
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Posted: 2/2/2006 5:47:56 AM EDT
[#32]
This bill already has 45 co sponsors and is a threat. If 14 more state reps vote for it, we lose our rights. Please contact your rep and let them know how you vote, especially if live you in a district where the rep has not already been added as a co sponsor.
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Posted: 2/2/2006 6:22:03 AM EDT
[#33]
not for nothing folks but quit typing on the internet and type a letter to your representatives!
The vote appears to have been pushed back again which means they dont have the votes. When the majority pushes their bill back on the calendar it means something is going on. YOU HAVE GOT TO POUR IT ON RIGHT NOW. i HAVE BEEN HEAVILY INVOLVED IN LOBBYING FOR LEGISLATION - THEY ARE LISTENING. IT TAKES FIVE MINUTES TO WRITE A LETTER. MAIL IT OFF AND THEN SEND AN EMAIL AND FOLLOW IT UP WITH A PHONE CALL. BE RESPECTFUL AND AND ASK FOR THEIR SUPPORT OF YOUR POSITION. DONT TELL THEM WHAT TO DO ASK FOR THEIR SUPPORT..... I have no idea why I'm yelling....I just get fired up when I think people think politicians dont listen...Politicians on the state and federal level remember what happened in 94 - the House and Senate of the US Congress were gutted after the AWB. They wont admit it but grass roots efforts were responsible... |
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Posted: 2/2/2006 6:46:44 AM EDT
[#34]
I will be happy to send an email, if someone will tell me the rep to send it to (link). I am guessing the ones who are undecided or against it will be the best to solicit. I am not in IL, but they wont know it from a email, and if this gets passed in your state, mine could be next. Domino effect.
Help me, help you. |
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Posted: 2/2/2006 7:12:58 AM EDT
[#35]
I just signed up with the NRA and am composing an email to send to all of the Ill. (how fitting that is now) representatives. |
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Posted: 2/2/2006 7:13:49 AM EDT
[#36]
Here is how it was voted on in May of '05:
STATE OF ILLINOIS NINETY-FOURTH GENERAL ASSEMBLY HOUSE ROLL CALL HOUSE BILL 2414 CRIM CD-BANS SEMIAUTOMATIC FLOOR AMENDMENT NO. 5 - ACEVEDO LOST May 24, 2005 57 YEAS 58 NAYS 1 PRESENT Y Acevedo Y Delgado Y Lang Y Pihos Y Bailey N Dugan N Leitch N Poe N Bassi Y Dunkin N Lindner N Pritchard N Beaubien N Dunn Y Lyons,Eileen N Reis N Beiser N Eddy Y Lyons,Joseph N Reitz Y Bellock Y Feigenholtz N Mathias Y Rita Y Berrios N Flider N Mautino N Rose N Biggins Y Flowers Y May Y Ryg N Black N Franks Y McAuliffe N Sacia N Boland Y Fritchey Y McCarthy Y Saviano N Bost N Froehlich Y McGuire N Schmitz N Bradley,John Y Giles E McKeon N Schock Y Bradley,Richard N Gordon Y Mendoza Y Scully N Brady Y Graham N Meyer N Smith N Brauer N Granberg Y Miller N Sommer Y Brosnahan Y Hamos N Millner Y Soto Y Burke N Hannig N Mitchell,Bill N Stephens Y Chapa LaVia N Hassert N Mitchell,Jerry N Sullivan Y Chavez N Hoffman N Moffitt N Tenhouse N Churchill N Holbrook Y Molaro N Tryon Y Collins Y Howard Y Mulligan Y Turner Y Colvin N Hultgren Y Munson E Verschoore Y Coulson Y Jakobsson N Myers N Wait Y Cross Y Jefferson Y Nekritz Y Washington N Cultra N Jenisch N Osmond N Watson Y Currie P Jones Y Osterman N Winters Y D'Amico Y Joyce N Parke Y Yarbrough N Daniels Y Kelly Y Patterson Y Younge Y Davis,Monique N Kosel N Phelps Y Mr. Speaker Y Davis,William Y Krause E - Denotes Excused Absence The NRA link above is very useful is sending letters to the appropriate reps. I received (I'm sure automated) a response the day after I sent the email. You guys that are willing to help that are out of state deserve a  .
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Posted: 2/2/2006 7:14:24 AM EDT
[#37]
I feel for ya brother. I don't have time to read thru all the posts. So if this has been suggested already then do it!! Contact the NRA and GOA about this. They got clout and $$. That's all the pols understand.
Shabo |
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Posted: 2/1/2006 7:56:25 PM EDT
[#38]
The problem with just moving, is this crap can go on anywhere. Somebodie's got to fight it. Like someone else said, if these things go through in some states, it will empower other libs in other states to start pushing the same BS. Anti gunning is not just a problem in Illinois. It's a sign of the times folks, but it doesn't mean they have to win.
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Posted: 2/1/2006 9:26:04 PM EDT
[#40]
wow this sux....i just received my colt ar15 hbar II today and have only put 10 rnds thru it.....damn delay/blaggo BS!!!! what have they done for the state of IL....seriously IL politics ne more is all about the "State of Chicago"..............can ne one see a Matrix type movie setting going on in IL!?!?! seriously i can see it now.....
Us rightful gun owners all hiding in Zion lol.............ready to fight to the death.....then someone yells..the agents are coming!!!............and as soon as they break in 5000 semi auto's unleash holy hell!!! or better yet a boondock saints type theme where il duce confronts the saints and rocco in front of the house.........."and for one minute this place was armageddon!!!" lol...............okay on a more serious note........i will be writing letters soon!!! and i mean ASAP!!! i'm glad i'm getting into law enforcement but better hurry up and finish my degree and skip grad school (this is my last semester) and get on the force so i can keep my AR.............seriously i bet more ppl die in car accidents than semi auto killings.........not only that but i love how these dems contradict themselves in how they oppose bush impeding on privacy acts yet they want to CONFISCATE our rifles?!?!?! does this make sense to any one.......oh and check out the isra.com website........some big wig lady wants to ban squirt guns in IL!!!! are you kidding me ppl this is ridiculous!!! |
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Posted: 2/1/2006 9:39:41 PM EDT
[#41]
That would be HB 4132 which was amended today removing language that outright bans them and changes the language to providing criminal prosecution for using certain weapon "look alikes" in a threatening manner. It is getting a bit silly but the more reason for people ot pay attention and communicate their views. |
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Posted: 2/1/2006 9:41:35 PM EDT
[#42]
rgr that....thanks for the added info...didn't really read into it...but its still crazy to think about
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Posted: 2/1/2006 9:53:50 PM EDT
[#43]
That being the difference between LEO's who are actually out there on patrol, enforcing the law and desk cops, particularly the higher-ranking ones Always good to know that the majority of police that the public is likely to encounter supports the Constitution.
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Posted: 2/1/2006 10:09:47 PM EDT
[#44]
I love that f'ing quote and agree with it 110% |
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Posted: 2/1/2006 10:22:03 PM EDT
[#45]
I sort of skimmed through all six pages, so I may have missed it, but did anyone notice:
Introduced 2/17/2005, by Rep. Edward J. Acevedo It's not exactly a new thing. And like everybody said, all you can do is call and write...or move. I'm working on the latter  Having said that, I've also done a fair share of calling and emailing, because I'm not gone yet!
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Posted: 2/2/2006 4:10:11 AM EDT
[#46]
This is a very tough decision for anyone here in IL that owns one of the subject weapons.
MOLON LABE is a nice idea and a pure concept. But following through with that concept is impossible for anyone other than someone who is suicidal or determined to spend the rest of his life in prison. No one I know fits into either of those catagories. Also, I am sure that most people will be loathe to risk becoming a felon by the simple possession of the weapon. If it were me, I know that I would have no interest whatsoever in committing a felony. I only know one person that had to deal with that in his life, and it was no picnic. What I do want to do is question the legitimacy and fairness of a goverment that one minute tells you they are legal, and the next minute they tell you nope, sorry, we changed our minds. I'm tempted to suggest that. you want it? Here's the receipt that shows what someone paid for it. Deliver to that person every penny of that amount and sure, here you go. I know it doesn't address the real problem of literally being stripped of our rights, but again, there are only so many practical options. It's called a shit sandwich, and many will have no practical option but to take a bite. |
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Posted: 2/1/2006 5:29:29 PM EDT
[#47]
It was on the calender for today but when called it was taken off the record. Next full session is Tuesday, so there's time to contact your legislators still.
Here's one of many different letters I've sent to different legislators (this one to one of it's sponsors): NOTE: ORIGINAL AND BOOKLET SENT TO xxxxxxxx OFFICE ADDRESS January xx, 2006 The Honorable xxxxxxxx VIA FACSIMILIE Dear Representative xxxxxxx: I am opposed to HB 2414 which seeks to ban certain semi-automatic firearms and related accessories. I am aware of your sponsorship of this piece of legislation and wanted to give an alternative view on this bill. This piece of legislation seeks to ban what was previously covered under the “Federal Assault Weapons Ban” of 1994 with the difference that this legislation has the potential to make felons out of law abiding citizens who currently possess legal firearms. Reading through the notes about fiscal impact, there is “little impact” to any state department. I have one example of how there could be an impact: One reported number of FOID cards in Illinois is approximately 1,500,000. Let’s assume that only 1/3 have a weapon or accessory that would fall under HB 2414 and many are not willing to surrender high dollar weapons or accessories without compensation (as the law requires surrender, destroying or permanently making unusable). That would be 500,000 Illinois citizens. Currently the Illinois Department of Correction is housing approximately 80,000 inmates. This means that the prison system would have to be increased by 625% just to accommodate previously law abiding firearm owners. If it were to cost only $14,000 year to house a prisoner, the budget for prisons would go from $1,190,000,000 to over $9,000,000,000 a year. Even if the numbers were smaller, it would have a significant economic impact on the state and the citizens of Illinois because of this legislation. One statistic shows that so called “assault weapons” were used in a mere 1.4% of all crimes involving a firearm and only .25% of all violent crimes. How is this legislation going to make Illinois citizens safer? The proposed legislation prohibits the manufacture of prohibited firearms and accessories. This portion of the bill will have significant economic impact on several firearms manufacturers and their employees that are based in the state of Illinois. These businesses will be forced to shut down or move taking tax revenue out of the state and costing Illinois residents their jobs. These are the businesses that also supply our law enforcement agencies. One in particular is “the official supplier” to the Illinois State Police. The firearm they specifically supply is the AR-15 semi-automatic rifle which is to be banned from private ownership. The AR-15 for example is used in many sanctioned shooting sport events, drills, hunting, and defense and has legitimate private use. I urge you to take a look at the facts about firearm ownership. We need to enforce the laws already on the books and punish those that don’t obey them. We do not need to add more laws to the books and penalize those that are law abiding as it doesn’t make any real impact on crime. I have enclosed a booklet with some insights and facts about firearms. I am asking you look at it and keep an open mind before deciding the fate of millions of Illinois citizens. Thank you for your attention to this matter and I look forward to your response. Sincerely, Me... |
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Posted: 2/1/2006 5:44:57 PM EDT
[#48]
JLR:
That is a beautiful letter that really articulates all of our views on this subject. Well done, sir. |
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Posted: 2/1/2006 5:53:38 PM EDT
[#49]
Connecticut may suck but I bet any of these companies could get a great deal on the old Winchester facility! |
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Posted: 2/1/2006 5:58:19 PM EDT
[#50]
what booklet did you send... i need to send it to the local nazis in NY
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