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Posted: 2/4/2006 10:46:55 AM EDT
[#1]
Grammar can be your friend, sir. Or is this ebonics on honor of Black History Month???????? 
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Posted: 2/4/2006 10:58:33 AM EDT
[#2]
^ Not going to go there......
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Posted: 2/4/2006 11:10:29 AM EDT
[#3]
Charged with shooting?
Charged in shooting? Who knows, well here is the link (hot this time so it actually works). www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/stories.nsf/stcharles/story/31C0F0DCE07E2E508625710A001E44DB?OpenDocument And the article:
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Posted: 2/4/2006 11:59:48 AM EDT
[#4]
I guess they should have just stopped?!?!?!
Travis 
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:11:50 PM EDT
[#5]
Don't run from the Po-Po.
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:15:06 PM EDT
[#6]
EXACTLY!!! Travis 
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:18:35 PM EDT
[#7]
bad, very very bad.
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:26:07 PM EDT
[#8]
................................it pisses them off and gives them the justification they need to execute you. 
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:29:11 PM EDT
[#9]
Does running from the po-leese warrant a death sentance for driver and passengers alike?
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:29:13 PM EDT
[#10]
But, the truck was coming RIGHT AT HIM!!!
 This is why the practice of shooting at people in vehicles who are doing nothing but trying to get away is screwed up. It is human nature to take a mile when given an inch. So we say....well, it is OK to shoot this guy because he drove his car toward me when he tried to flee, and the car is a deadly weapon!!! Never mind the fact that it's generally not real hard to get out of the path of a car when it is just starting to move. Or that the person can be moving for a number of different reasons. It has become precadent that vehicle = deadly weapon + moving toward LEO = use lethal force. Like everything else, this is a concept that sooner or later someone will abuse, as in this case. If we are indeed innocent until proven guilty, and we indeed enjoy protection from various infringements via the Constitution (both are debatable, unfortunately), then affected LE policies should err on the side of the citizen, not the LEO. Oh yeah...for the guys that will throw out various SC decisions........the SC has fucked up a lot of issues, including coining the term "officer safety". It's one of the many incremental things that led to this officer thinking he could shoot these people. |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:32:28 PM EDT
[#11]
Come on, we all know that the life of a police officer is worth ten times that of a civilian. They are more important than the bulk of society and their safety cannot be mitigated, even if it means lead induced incapacitation of every suspect. |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:36:28 PM EDT
[#12]
Nope. Thats too simple. Gotta run then blaim everything that happens after that on the police and then sue the taxpayers. Personal responsibility is long dead. |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:37:37 PM EDT
[#13]
...EXACTLY.....only the guilty RUN!.....at least that's what the coppers think...... |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:37:52 PM EDT
[#14]
Better driver and passengers than uninvolved motorists and pedestrians. Pursuits present a continueing risk to everyone else on the roadway (and sidewalks). State laws should be amended to reflect that. |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:39:16 PM EDT
[#15]
Who is at fault when everyone fucks up? Yes, they should have stopped, but they should also be alive now. Nothing went right here. |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:41:50 PM EDT
[#16]
+100. Even better the officer should have just "taken the hit" from the truck....afterall his life isn't worth anymore than anyone else.... ps. 'course standing bet vehicles is a poor tactical decision...... This blows all around. |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:41:57 PM EDT
[#17]
If i read this right, the people shot were in the back of the cab, not the driver
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:42:15 PM EDT
[#18]
Which is why I dont care at all about any of them. Boo hoo, two punks are dead and a poorly trained excitable cop's life is ruined. Oh well, I guess I'll have some pizza. |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:44:02 PM EDT
[#19]
The driver and the person seated directly behind the driver. (Think extended cab truck with limo tint on the rear window). |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:46:01 PM EDT
[#20]
Simular story:
www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=433400 See a trend. you run from the police in a vehcie, then try to run them over, you might get dead. |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:46:35 PM EDT
[#21]
I don't think it's in the Missouri POST cirriculum to stand between the vehicles, EVER. In fact, I recall being trained to avoid that situation whenever possible. |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:47:57 PM EDT
[#22]
How do you know they tried to run him over? Maybe the emergency brake failed. There isn't enough information here to go on. |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:48:17 PM EDT
[#23]
This won't last long.
IBTL |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:51:32 PM EDT
[#24]
The Houston PD has rules saying that an officer cannot shoot at a vehicle that is moving towards him if he could just step out of the way. The article says the truck was 'slowly rolling' and the officer had no problem stepping out of the way
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:52:02 PM EDT
[#25]
When they started traveling towards the officer, they were no longer running. I'm often critical of the actions of many cops, but I don't see how this could be considered anything but the correct response by the officer.z |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:52:40 PM EDT
[#26]
I hope I never get pulled over on an incline, I'd be screwed. I guess I'd better tighten them brake cables. |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:53:11 PM EDT
[#27]
OMG, sounds like an outbreak of common sense occured! |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:53:51 PM EDT
[#28]
Dude, I generally like what you have to say, but you are out of your lane in calling the dead punks. The driver sounds like a fuckup, but the passenger didn't break any laws and we have no reason to believe he was a punk, other than the company he kept. Even so, being a punk does not warrant death. |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 12:56:46 PM EDT
[#29]
IBT"laydownwithdogsdefense" |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 1:41:59 PM EDT
[#30]
Yeah....that might be his downfall in court..... |
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Posted: 2/4/2006 1:58:31 PM EDT
[#31]
Oh I sure do... Driver had his foot on the brake and the truck in Neutral... While looking for his vehicle registration, his foot slips and the truck rolls. Officer asshat, who could have stepped out of the way, shoots...driver is now dead Vehicle continues to roll, dickhead continues to shoot...now the asshole has killed a passenger... Premeditated murder? Probably not....just a VERY BAD over-reaction... Manslaughter? Hell yes it is... This guys lawyer should just give him a large tub of anal lubricant... He's gonna need it where he's going. |
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Posted: 2/5/2006 8:53:10 AM EDT
[#32]
Yes, stupid people need to be thinned from the herd, IMO. |
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Posted: 2/5/2006 8:59:15 AM EDT
[#33]
Remember that next time you ride with a friend in a vehicle. If he, for whatever reason, decides to do something stupid and he is the one controlling the vehicle, you deserve to be thinned too, according to your logic. Riding with a guy you know is a thug is one thing, and you shouldn't be associating with him. Say your friend who you know has no record/is a whitebread kinda guy is driving and just wigs out for whatever reason? Road rage? |
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Posted: 2/5/2006 9:00:49 AM EDT
[#34]
Reach over, cut the ignition, jam the transimission, hit the brakes. You can do something. If you do nothing you are along for the ride. |
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Posted: 2/5/2006 9:05:31 AM EDT
[#35]
If the officer had shot a 6 month old baby situated behind the driver because he could not see thru the windows would people defend the officer then? Know what you are aiming at BEFORE you pull the trigger. If the engine revved up and the truck was put in reverse I can see shooting IF I can see what I am shooting at. If it rolled, it won't be good for the cop.
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Posted: 2/5/2006 9:07:17 AM EDT
[#36]
Would be very sad and tragic. But it was the driver who is running from the cops who put the baby in jeopardy, not the cop. |
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Posted: 2/5/2006 9:08:10 AM EDT
[#37]
We know nothing of these men except that they thought MIP laws did not apply to them, the driver thought it was okay to run from the police and he either tried to back over the cop or was incapable of safey operating and maintaning his vehicle. That article says they ran because they had booze in the car. What was the original reason for the attempted car stop? |
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Posted: 2/5/2006 9:09:16 AM EDT
[#38]
Again, another demonstration of the double standard that police and prosecutors live by. If you parked behind a vechicle and it started rolling back I think I would get out of the way. What was a officer who had just been in a chase doing, standing alone behind a truck full of ocupants? Why did he have his weapon drawn? Why didn't he wait for back-up? Why did he shoot two people dead? I wasn't there to see what really happened but, if he's is being charged it means there is probable cause to find him guilty of murder not manslaugter. The old double standard at it's best. The very thing that makes a lot of people lose respect for PO PO .
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Posted: 2/5/2006 9:11:46 AM EDT
[#39]
Not if you are already anti-LEO. |
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Posted: 2/5/2006 9:23:02 AM EDT
[#40]
True enough. I was just responding to the sentiment that because you're a passenger in a vehicle, and the driver does something stupid, that you deserve to be thinned from the herd. For all we know, a passenger could have been trying to stop the driver from backing up. Because of the tinted window, we don't know for sure. The deputy should have just moved out of the way if the vehicle was moving that slowly. I believe that if most of us non-LEOs were in the same position, we would be screwed because we didn't attempt to get out of the way. |
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Posted: 2/5/2006 9:26:42 AM EDT
[#41]
Very true, right up to the point of the officer shooting BLIND into the vehicle tho. They should not have ran. They should not have been drinking. They should have stopped immediately. But if they did finally pull over and the truck merely rolled [note: thats why I said what I did in the original reply] backwards that does not constitute a good shoot and killing a passenger is criminal unless they are attempting to help the driver or constitute a threat to the officer. |
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Posted: 2/5/2006 9:28:53 AM EDT
[#42]
True enough. I was just responding to the sentiment that because you're a passenger in a vehicle, and the driver does something stupid, that you deserve to be thinned from the herd. For all we know, a passenger could have been trying to stop the driver from backing up. Because of the tinted window, we don't know for sure. The deputy should have just moved out of the way if the vehicle was moving that slowly. I believe that if most of us non-LEOs were in the same position, we would be screwed because we didn't attempt to get out of the way.[/quote] Yep. Because it's not your job to chase down drunks who are running from the police. |
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Posted: 2/5/2006 2:06:06 PM EDT
[#43]
We know that the officer can follow three of the four rules of firearms safety, AT MOST. |
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Posted: 2/5/2006 2:12:54 PM EDT
[#44]
We don't know they tried to back over the cop. Nice try at spin, but it rings hollow. Unless you have some proof they tried to back over the cop vice the truck rolling backwards due to any number of factors? I'd like to see it. So you're just speculating, in a manner favorable to the officer, just like the rest of us. Again with the LEO crowd it's "wait for the facts, unless we're doing the speculating." ETA: Here is something that is not speculation. The officer put himself in a tactically disadvantageous position. You don't get directly behind or infront of a vehicle if you can help it; the reasons are numerous and obvious. You also approach a vehicle from the blind spot behind the driver whenever possible. This officer didn't do that. Here is something else; MIP and running from a police officer are not offenses that carry the death penalty. The only way you can justify lethal force is if they intentionally tried to run the police officer over, and the evidence that has been release as of yet, does not support either side of that position. |
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Posted: 2/5/2006 2:13:17 PM EDT
[#45]
IBTL
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Posted: 2/5/2006 2:19:14 PM EDT
[#46]
Edit for post 666:
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Posted: 2/5/2006 2:22:08 PM EDT
[#47]
This answers the question about what they were originally stopped for:
This gives me some comfort. I trust the MHP. I find them to be an incredibly professional agency, as a whole:
This is extremely interesting and probably why he was charged. He had time to issue a warning, fire a shot, issue another warning, fire another shot, and then get out of the way. Which begs the question, why not just step out of the way in the first place?
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Posted: 2/5/2006 2:27:43 PM EDT
[#48]
Look, the driver getting shot is his fault. If he had been the only one shot it would have been darwinism. But a passenger was shot too, because the officer was negligent. If he had done a couple of things right, the passenger might have lived. That is criminal, IMHO.
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Posted: 2/5/2006 6:57:14 PM EDT
[#49]
From the description in the article, it doesn't sound like the vehicle was in reverse gear.
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Posted: 2/6/2006 9:52:01 AM EDT
[#50]
It is what I would call typo.
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