Poll? How to best handle marajuana in terms of use and enforcement. - Page 2

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Poll? How to best handle marajuana in terms of use and enforcement. (Page 2 of 4)

Posted: 10/5/2005 12:20:47 PM EDT

[#1]

My 2 cents.

Legalize it. I'm not going to use it either way, but I think others should feel free to do whatever they want to themselves. I am not my brothers keeper, nor do I want to be.

If all else fails, the more people Darwin out, the better off the rest of us are.

Posted: 10/5/2005 12:22:15 PM EDT

[#2]

it doesnt hurt your body , well ok maybe kills a few brain cells but all in all i dont think its any worse then drinking. Ive never heard some one of ODing on pot. Ive heard of many people that have drank until they poisoned themselves. Just legalize it so i dont have to hide when i smoke it.

Posted: 10/5/2005 12:23:27 PM EDT

[#3]

Ideally... I say stiffen penalties. I do personally believe it's a gateway drug and it's a sin. I think that some fights are worth fighting and the war on drugs is one of them.

Realistically... I say "Confiscate and ticket". Keep it illegal but let's face it lots of people have no problem buying their bahoofus. Just take it and make the ticket like $1000.

I voted based on realism though.

Posted: 10/5/2005 12:24:33 PM EDT

[#4]

Quoted:
To LEOs preferably, but I suspect many will answer.

Oops, voted(legalize) before I saw that.

Posted: 10/5/2005 12:26:44 PM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:
Quoted:
To LEOs preferably, but I suspect many will answer.

Oops, voted(legalize) before I saw that.

I was referring to a field sobriety test for Marajuana, Anything?

To LEOs preferably, but I suspect many will answer.

I was told by a couple of LEOs the only reason they do not support legalization of Marajuana is their is no effective field sobritey test for it. In short blood tests don't tell you if they are stoned at that moment and even if they did are not applicable in the field. Your thoughts?

Posted: 10/5/2005 12:26:57 PM EDT

[#6]

I am pleasantly surprised at how the poll has turned out thus far.

If it were my way, I'd say just legalize it. It's not any more harmful than cigarettes or smoking in the long run, and there is no empirical evidence which suggests the contrary.

Realistically, I'd at least like to see a nationwide decriminalization of it. Perhaps a tax system would be in order, and if you did not pay the mj tax, then you get cited and fined. No incarceration unless illegally trafficking large amounts, such as if someone was illegally smuggling non-taxed tobacco. There are ways that the government can generate serious revenue like this, instead of just throwing everyone in prison and wasting the tax dollars.

Posted: 10/5/2005 12:29:17 PM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:
Oh good gawd I leave the site for an hour and another drug thread.

Seems like there are a bunch of them LOL

Posted: 10/5/2005 1:17:13 PM EDT

[#8]

I say legalize it, and tax it.

BAD IDEA.

If you legalize it, who the fuck will buy it? Any dirty hippie with a flower pot will grow his own.

Besides, even if scumbags bought the shit and it was taxed, the states would over-tax it; this would lead to more dirty hippies with flower pots.

In a round about way, nobody would buy it.

B_S

Posted: 10/5/2005 1:22:50 PM EDT

[#9]

Quoted:
I say legalize it, and tax it.

BAD IDEA.

If you legalize it, who the fuck will buy it? Any dirty hippie with a flower pot will grow his own.

Besides, even if scumbags bought the shit and it was taxed, the states would over-tax it; this would lead to more dirty hippies with flower pots.

In a round about way, nobody would buy it.

B_S

Agreed its a new anfle on what has been said thus far. Just make it legal anyway though. Alcohol and Drug companies will lead the fight against it though.

Posted: 10/5/2005 1:29:46 PM EDT

[#10]

Only the complete legalization of all drugs will resort in any less drug cops. If you "legalize" it but keep criminal sanctions for things like using it in schools, selling it to kids, tax or regulate it then you just continue the status quo.

I find it hypocritical to legalize the drugs hippies want, but not the drugs tweakers or junkies want. so they should all be completely legalized, as should alcohol, tobacco, and Rx meds.

Half measures like "decriminalization" and California Prop 15, Prop 36, PC1000, PC1210 are ineffective.

Posted: 10/5/2005 1:33:28 PM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:
Legalize it. It was banned under false pretenses.

Don't smoke, don't drink much at all anymore either. But I would like someone to give a rational reason why alcohol should be legal while pot isn't.

Like unkempt1 said earlier, it isn't a vote so I can do it, just a vote for freedom. Besides, think of all the libtards that chant on about saving the world and banning guns, then smoke pot and forget about it.

Posted: 10/5/2005 1:34:07 PM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
Ideally... I say stiffen penalties. I do personally believe it's a gateway drug and it's a sin. I think that some fights are worth fighting and the war on drugs is one of them.

Realistically... I say "Confiscate and ticket". Keep it illegal but let's face it lots of people have no problem buying their bahoofus. Just take it and make the ticket like $1000.

I voted based on realism though.

A plant is a sin?????

a fuckin' plant????????

what about aspirin???

coffee?????

you people are scary sometimes.

Posted: 10/5/2005 1:34:14 PM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Confiscate and ticket but do not arrest - been there, done that.

It's a ticket here for personal amounts - an ounce?

Short of legalizing it is practical and thought out and minimizes Police time wasted.

you couldnt be more wrong about the wasted time issue. The cops still have to write the same report, process the same evidence, the $40.00 fine wont even cover the overtime for booking the evidence at the end of your shift. Californias solution is the worst possible solution in that it still requires police resources but with no risk or real punishment to the "criminal".

Posted: 10/5/2005 1:35:26 PM EDT

[#14]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Ideally... I say stiffen penalties. I do personally believe it's a gateway drug and it's a sin. I think that some fights are worth fighting and the war on drugs is one of them.

Realistically... I say "Confiscate and ticket". Keep it illegal but let's face it lots of people have no problem buying their bahoofus. Just take it and make the ticket like $1000.

I voted based on realism though.

A plant is a sin?????

a fuckin' plant????????

what about aspirin???

coffee?????

you people are scary sometimes.

Boo.

Posted: 10/5/2005 1:36:25 PM EDT

[#15]

Quoted:
My guess is at leat 25% of the members here are smokers. LEGALIZE IT!

More like 50%.

Posted: 10/5/2005 1:39:57 PM EDT

[#16]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Legalize it. It was banned under false pretenses.

Don't smoke, don't drink much at all anymore either. But I would like someone to give a rational reason why alcohol should be legal while pot isn't.

Alcohol isnt legal, its very heavily regulated. The sections of law dealing with alcohol are thicker than your AR15 owners manual.

Posted: 10/5/2005 1:43:22 PM EDT

[#17]

Quoted:

Alcohol isnt legal, ......

wow... you learn sumpthin' new everyday on arfcom.

Posted: 10/5/2005 1:46:42 PM EDT

[#18]

"Hold my bong, I am going to try something"
-The new redneck

Posted: 10/5/2005 1:54:00 PM EDT

[#19]

I am very suprised by the outcome of this pole so fare, but then again not really.Alot of people you would never even suspect smoke.It should be handled just like alchohol.

Posted: 10/5/2005 1:59:52 PM EDT

[#20]

Quoted:
...
I was told by a couple of LEOs the only reason they do not support legalization of Marajuana is their is no effective field sobritey test for it. In short blood tests don't tell you if they are stoned at that moment and even if they did are not applicable in the field. Your thoughts?

If there's no effective field sobriety test for it, then maybe it doesn't impair function like alcohol does.

Or maybe the impairment is cognitive rather than motor, so they just haven't come up with an appropriate test yet.

ETA I do not think it's OK for people to drive under the influence of marijuana.

Posted: 10/5/2005 2:02:51 PM EDT

[#21]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Ideally... I say stiffen penalties. I do personally believe it's a gateway drug and it's a sin.

A plant is a sin?????

a fuckin' plant????????

what about aspirin???

coffee?????...

It's OK, I speak jive:

Many Christians including my girlfriend nominee believe that anything taken for the purpose of becoming intoxicated is spiritually incorrect, and they can cite Bible verses to support it. She is opposed to marijuana for the same reason she is opposed to hard liquor.

They often allow for the consumption of beer and wine, also citing scripture as a basis for these forms of alcohol being OK.

Posted: 10/5/2005 2:17:47 PM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:
Quoted:

If it becomes legal, only on the contingency that there be an immediate field test for it, you can bet your ass that there will be a test available by 8:00 am tommorrow morning.

note: don't smoke it, don't hang around people that do. But I don't think it's any worse than some redneck doing 20 tequila shots after work on a friday night, starting a fight, then driving home because he 'says he's fine' to drive.

The reason there isn't a field test is because the effects aren't at all like alcohol. It doesn't destroy motor coordination like alcohol does. The best research shows that the only reliable way to tell if someone is stoned on pot is to ask them.

Easy - just start a conversation with them, change the subject a couple of times, and then suddenly ask them what you were originally talking about.

Posted: 10/5/2005 2:23:35 PM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:
Marijuana is illegal because anyone with a patch of dirt and a seed can make their own with no difficulty or loss of quality. It's all about the money.

I have to disagree. the same could be said for tobacco. Marijuana can be taxed just like tobacco...the government could take its share.

My theory is that there isn't a viable roadside sobriety test. A stoner driving while intoxicated would have slower reaction skills and an obviously altered concience. A cop, with todays equipment, wouldn't be able to test his level of intoxication or at what time the drug was "ingested".
Just my 2 cents though.

Posted: 10/5/2005 2:26:53 PM EDT

[#24]

Quoted:
...
Marijuana can be taxed just like tobacco...the government could take its share....

There already is a federal tax on marijuana: $50 per ounce. It was imposed in 1934 IIRC.

Posted: 10/5/2005 2:29:43 PM EDT

[#25]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Legalize it with restrictions on consumption similar to alcohol. One exception to the alcohol parallel would be to allow homegrown.

Homegrown "Moonshine stills" are illegal still. The ATF actually still pursues this pointless cause.

That's why I said the EXCEPTION thingy.

I know that is rational and thought out thus Gov. is incapable of it. It just like Marajuana is a tax issue. Stills for >>>personal consumption<<< are legal at least to my knowledge.

Felony.

Posted: 10/5/2005 2:33:48 PM EDT

[#26]

Quoted:

My theory is that there isn't a viable roadside sobriety test. A stoner driving while intoxicated would have slower reaction skills and an obviously altered concience. A cop, with todays equipment, wouldn't be able to test his level of intoxication or at what time the drug was "ingested".
Just my 2 cents though.

Not sure I advocate driving stoned is OK, but if it does not measureably impair motor function what's the problem?

I just know there's a reason you can't drive, just, well, haven't found it yet!

Posted: 10/5/2005 5:01:21 PM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Ideally... I say stiffen penalties. I do personally believe it's a gateway drug and it's a sin.

A plant is a sin?????

a fuckin' plant????????

what about aspirin???

coffee?????...

It's OK, I speak jive:

Many Christians including my girlfriend nominee believe that anything taken for the purpose of becoming intoxicated is spiritually incorrect, and they can cite Bible verses to support it. She is opposed to marijuana for the same reason she is opposed to hard liquor.

They often allow for the consumption of beer and wine, also citing scripture as a basis for these forms of alcohol being OK.

Thank you.

"I speak jive" from one of the best comedies everrrrr....

Posted: 10/5/2005 5:03:19 PM EDT

[#28]

Death Penalty.

Posted: 10/5/2005 5:12:00 PM EDT

[#29]

treat it like alcohol

Posted: 10/5/2005 5:14:57 PM EDT

[#30]

Quoted:
Seeing how many pot-heads we have around here keeps me away from most ARFCOM shoots. Frightening.

never smoked it
never will
feel it should be legalized like alcohol

Posted: 10/5/2005 5:21:31 PM EDT

[#31]

Quoted:
Quoted:
...
Marijuana can be taxed just like tobacco...the government could take its share....

There already is a federal tax on marijuana: $50 per ounce. It was imposed in 1934 IIRC.

You are thinking of the Marihuana Tax Act of 1937. You can find the text of the act, the full transcripts of the congressional testimony, and some related papers at www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/hemp/taxact/taxact.htm

The tax was repealed in 1969 with the case of (Timothy) Leary v. US. Leary argued that the tax was unconstitutional on Fifth Amendment Grounds. The reason was that you had to have the marijuana before you paid the tax and, if you already had the marijuana, then you were admitting to breaking the law by not having paid the tax. A legal Catch-22.

Because Leary won the case, the Marihuana Tax Act, based on the Fed's taxing authority, was replaced with the Controlled Substances Act of 1970, which is based on the interstate commerce theory. No more tax.

Posted: 10/5/2005 5:24:41 PM EDT

[#32]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

What was the justification on controlling distilled spirits "for our own safety"? Safety is just an excuse for not recieving tax revenue. I assume the law is leftover from prohibition?

Disregarding the tax issue, distilling is a rather dangerous business if people are either a) careless or b) too stupid to educate themselves. If you don't distill alcohol properly, you run a very good chance of producing nothing more than a goodly amount of poison. I'm sure this factored into it, as well as the tax issue. People are allowed to make a certain amount of beer and wine tax-free for personal consumption. I don't see why distilling is any different. I dunno about it being a prohibition throwback, but I wouldn't be surprised.

Edit: Grammar.

That is wrong. No where in the process does any sort of "poison" get introduced, even if you are sloppy as hell. You may get small amounts of ketones, I've heard, but not enough to kill you, and it would taste nasty enough that you wouldn't want to drink enough to kill you.

What was the justification on controlling distilled spirits "for our own safety"? Safety is just an excuse for not recieving tax revenue. I assume the law is leftover from prohibition?

too many people going blind and dying i think. Just a guess though.

The myth about people going blind goes back to the prohibition era. Moonshiners, or dealing middle men would sometimes "cut" their booze with methanol (wood alcohol) to stretch it. Similar to how heroine and cocaine are often "cut" for sale on the street. It was the methanol from tainted supply that caused the blindness and not anything in the distilling process itself.

another source of toxins, at least according to the History channel shows I've seen, was moonshiners using old car radiators for the condensor of their still and the radiators had lead in them

edit: and of course once again I post as I go along only to find that two replies down the contents of my post are mentioned

Posted: 10/5/2005 5:40:30 PM EDT

[#33]

If you leaglize it will stop the black market for it, and real crime will go down, just like prohibition.

If you leaglize it pisons wont be so crowded and real criminals will be in prison for their full sentences.

In a free country a citizen should have the right to put what he/she wants in his body.

Watch the "Bullshit!" episode on the war on drugs season 2.

Posted: 10/5/2005 5:46:16 PM EDT

[#34]

They should just make it legal. It would be the next big cash crop. Obviously some restrictions would need to be put in place. I never saw a fighth at a weed party, or anything else violent for that matter. But at a field party, with a few kegs. Every rednack and his momma was fighting.

Roll it up.....Smoke it up........Pass it around.

Puff, Puff, Give.

Posted: 10/5/2005 6:18:18 PM EDT

[#35]

Quoted:
I say legalize it, and tax it.

...It'll happen in myt lifetime, look at LOTTO! plus their TAX on it

Posted: 10/5/2005 6:20:27 PM EDT

[#36]

if they catch you with it they should make you smoke it all right there in front of them like my parents did when i had a baggy found.

Posted: 10/5/2005 6:22:43 PM EDT

[#37]

Ancient arguement, I still say penalize.

Posted: 10/5/2005 6:31:26 PM EDT

[#38]

The "War On Drugs" is a joke.

Legalize it, sell it in 5 packs at the local India Nepalese-Mart (7/11, Sav-A-Lot, whatever) and tax the hell out of it.

Cannabis is less physiologically harmful than alcohol, and alcohol is legal, so why not?

The abuse of alcohol causes thousands of needless deaths every year, causes broken families, drunks beat their wives and kids, slam head-on into innocent drivers, alcoholics crowd hospital ICUs with their cirrhotic burned out livers.

Weed does none of this. Just makes folks smile too much.

The world would be a better place, IMNSHO, if potawanna was legal. No more wars, no more fighting, potato chip and french-onion dip sales would skyrocket!

Ten million po-pos would be out of a job, but maybe they could all go to work at pot farms!

Posted: 10/5/2005 6:49:43 PM EDT

[#39]

The best thing to do with pot is to decriminalize possesion for up to a pound or so.
Next is to decriminalize the manufacturing of it for a certain number of plants.
Keep all other laws in effect... they will eventually become useless as the
pot user will be just a pot user.
This way takes the crime out it and the money out of it and corruption out of it.

This will never happen cuz weed is big business.
Its big business for cops, its a way to make them appear to be enforcing laws and generating revenue with relatively little risk compared to crimes that really matter.
It keeps many of judges, prosecuting and defense attorneys, cops, criminals, guards etc. in business.

Then you got the whole international trade thing ie. Mexico.
They call it "smuggling" or "traffiking" or "WAR on drugs" but its just trade...
How do I know...? I have seen it. Ive seen both sides of it the legal side of it and the illegal side of it and when you get right down to it...there aint much difference between the two.

Posted: 10/5/2005 9:28:04 PM EDT

[#40]

Quoted:
If you leaglize it will stop the black market for it, and real crime will go down, just like prohibition.
Agreed

If you leaglize it pisons wont be so crowded and real criminals will be in prison for their full sentences.
Agreed MJ users should not be in jail unless they caused danger on others, i.e. driving impaired
In a free country a citizen should have the right to put what he/she wants in his body. I think more politicians and people are realizing this, however senior citiczens are still the major voting bloc that will not change

Watch the "Bullshit!" episode on the war on drugs season 2.

Seen it several times, wish more people had

Posted: 10/5/2005 9:28:44 PM EDT

[#41]

Quoted:
I say legalize it, and tax it.

BAD IDEA.

If you legalize it, who the fuck will buy it? Any dirty hippie with a flower pot will grow his own.

Besides, even if scumbags bought the shit and it was taxed, the states would over-tax it; this would lead to more dirty hippies with flower pots.

In a round about way, nobody would buy it.

B_S

Utterly false, for the following reasons.

First, if made legal, big business can spend money on R&D for the newly legalized cannabis crop, thus leading to drastically higher quality stuff than anyone in a basement can make, for presumably an affordable price.

Second, marijuana is a difficult plant to cultivate. You obviously do not possess much of a working knowledge of what it takes to grow this species of plant, and I guarantee you neither do "hippies with flowerpots". The best marijuana could be made by facilities devoted to that purpose with capital invested to the end of making a potent product.

Third, who would spend the several weeks it takes to grow a decent marijuana crop when they can simply purchase it for a fraction of the cost of growing materials and obtain it immediately? Sure, you could be growing a crop and smoking the commercially-obtained stuff until your own mj is ready, but all this takes time, effort, and an investment in botanical equipment to even come close to what could be developed by a business dedicated to the purpose. You could have more confidence that commercially-developed marijuana would be more consistent in potency than an amateur botanist's, and you wouldn't have to waste your own time trying to equal it when you can just buy it for cheap. Moreover, the commercial marijuana would not produce the worries of (or produce less worries than)street marijuana when considering whether or not the drug was cut with a harmful filler. Consider the analogy of home-brewed beer vs. commercial beer. Sure, you probably have a great home recipe that you invest your time and money in, but really, who does that? Most people buy beer, and accordingly, most people do and would buy marijuana rather than make it.

Posted: 10/5/2005 9:42:07 PM EDT

[#42]

War on drugs is a waste of time and money... We got junkies in prison overdosing on drugs of their choice every day....

Time to fix other broken areas of our system... like schools would be a great start...

Posted: 10/5/2005 9:51:55 PM EDT

[#43]

Quoted:
War on drugs is a waste of time and money... We got junkies in prison overdosing on drugs of their choice every day....

Time to fix other broken areas of our system... like schools would be a great start...

Can't change the piece of shit parents most minority-impoverished children go home to. These are the kids with no outlet or motivation to change thier situation who drag down the system for all. That said a high school diploma guarantees shit. Throwing more money at this will not change anything certainly not culture and enviornment. Thus tax credits/vouchers for private schools are a better option. Or at the least redistricting all the shit to certain schools. Agreed W.O.D. is a waste of money and A fruitless lost cause, unless you actually make it a war in the boots on the ground bombers in the air sense. Narco-Terrorism, thats where the real fun begins.

Also simple law of economics, >>where their is demand thier will be supply<<

Posted: 10/6/2005 7:05:10 AM EDT

[#44]

Quoted:
The "War On Drugs" is a joke.

Legalize it, sell it in 5 packs at the local India Nepalese-Mart (7/11, Sav-A-Lot, whatever) and tax the hell out of it.

Cannabis is less physiologically harmful than alcohol, and alcohol is legal, so why not?

The abuse of alcohol causes thousands of needless deaths every year, causes broken families, drunks beat their wives and kids, slam head-on into innocent drivers, alcoholics crowd hospital ICUs with their cirrhotic burned out livers.

Weed does none of this. Just makes folks smile too much.

The world would be a better place, IMNSHO, if potawanna was legal. No more wars, no more fighting, potato chip and french-onion dip sales would skyrocket!

Ten million po-pos would be out of a job...

That last statement really highlights your ignorance. Only the complete legalization of all drugs, meaning the absense of any regulation would result in less cops. Hell treating it like alcohol would require MORE cops than the current system.

Posted: 10/6/2005 7:56:47 AM EDT

[#45]

I've never smoked weed. As LE, I say legalize it to a certain degree such as amount you can possess or grow. Also, stiffen the penalties if you break another law while under the influence of the weed. Jack up the price of health insurance if smoke the reefer. Finally, allow employers to forbid its use if they so desire.

Posted: 10/6/2005 7:58:13 AM EDT

[#46]

Individual rights/live and let live/can't legislate morality/victimless crime/etc...

Posted: 10/6/2005 7:59:00 AM EDT

[#47]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
To LEOs preferably, but I suspect many will answer.

Oops, voted(legalize) before I saw that.

I was referring to a field sobriety test for Marajuana, Anything?

To LEOs preferably, but I suspect many will answer.

I was told by a couple of LEOs the only reason they do not support legalization of Marajuana is their is no effective field sobritey test for it. In short blood tests don't tell you if they are stoned at that moment and even if they did are not applicable in the field. Your thoughts?

So what? Take them to a hospital if you suspect it and have blood drawn. We can do it for certain crimes when alcohol is suspected.

Posted: 10/6/2005 8:04:57 AM EDT

[#48]

Quoted:
Quoted:
The "War On Drugs" is a joke.

Legalize it, sell it in 5 packs at the local India Nepalese-Mart (7/11, Sav-A-Lot, whatever) and tax the hell out of it.

Cannabis is less physiologically harmful than alcohol, and alcohol is legal, so why not?

The abuse of alcohol causes thousands of needless deaths every year, causes broken families, drunks beat their wives and kids, slam head-on into innocent drivers, alcoholics crowd hospital ICUs with their cirrhotic burned out livers.

Weed does none of this. Just makes folks smile too much.

The world would be a better place, IMNSHO, if potawanna was legal. No more wars, no more fighting, potato chip and french-onion dip sales would skyrocket!

Ten million po-pos would be out of a job...

That last statement really highlights your ignorance. Only the complete legalization of all drugs, meaning the absense of any regulation would result in less cops. Hell treating it like alcohol would require MORE cops than the current system.

OK, make a note to yourself -- you need to read up on alcohol prohibition versus the current state of affairs.

Posted: 10/6/2005 8:06:46 AM EDT

[#49]

Quoted:
I've never smoked weed. As LE, I say legalize it to a certain degree such as amount you can possess or grow. Also, stiffen the penalties if you break another law while under the influence of the weed. Jack up the price of health insurance if smoke the reefer. Finally, allow employers to forbid its use if they so desire.

There is no evidence that marijuana would have any effect on health insurance premiums. The biggest study of health records to date showed that no difference could be found between the health records of pot smokers versus non-smokers.

Employers should certainly be able to ban it on the job. Off the job is another matter.

Posted: 10/6/2005 8:08:10 AM EDT

[#50]

If it were legal, it would have to be illegal to smoke it in public. Unlike alcohol, pot can give you a contact high. I don't want more people on the road under the influence, and you cannot have a designated driver in a room full of pot smoke. Well, unless they wear a gas mask or something.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Poll? How to best handle marajuana in terms of use and enforcement. (Page 2 of 4)

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