Carpenters/builders/woodworkers: Safety question

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Carpenters/builders/woodworkers: Safety question

Posted: 9/28/2005 3:23:48 PM EDT

I'm working on a small, rustic cabin. I have some dry pine logs, about 6-8" in diameter, that I would like to machine one or two flat surfaces on, so as to use them for posts and beams. Is it safe to rip round stock on a table saw? I also have a 12" radial arm saw that could be used. I'm just concerned about it rolling and binding the blade and kicking back or something.

Posted: 9/28/2005 3:25:34 PM EDT

[#1]

Do it to it

Posted: 9/28/2005 3:27:48 PM EDT

[#2]

I’ve seen guys use a table saw but with some guides. Triangular pieces to cradle the round piece so it isn’t inclined to roll.
The guides are clamped down.

I don’t know if this makes it “safe”…I’ve just seen it and nothing bad happened.

Posted: 9/28/2005 3:36:56 PM EDT

[#3]

I doubt your table saw will raise the blade high enough to square off a round 8'' log.
Your raidial arm saw should be able to do it. You need to build a cradle for the infeed and outfeed to prevent it from rolling under the blade. Take your time setting it up and it's not really that dangerous. and don't stand behind it when your cutting.

Posted: 9/28/2005 3:49:08 PM EDT

[#4]

Quoted:
Triangular pieces to cradle the round piece so it isn’t inclined to roll.
The guides are clamped down.

I don’t know if this makes it “safe”…I’ve just seen it and nothing bad happened.

I've done that. Just take it slow.

Posted: 9/28/2005 4:02:49 PM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:
I doubt your table saw will raise the blade high enough to square off a round 8'' log.

I don't need them square, I just need enough of a straight surface to screw the siding too. I want them to be partially rounded, with beetle tunnels and axe marks showing. The corner posts, of course, need two flat surfaces.

Posted: 9/28/2005 4:08:56 PM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:
Quoted:
I doubt your table saw will raise the blade high enough to square off a round 8'' log.

I don't need them square, I just need enough of a straight surface to screw the siding too. I want them to be partially rounded, with beetle tunnels and axe marks showing. The corner posts, of course, need two flat surfaces.

i think what hes saying is that your blade will not come out of the table far enough to put a flat edge on the side of a log that big.

Posted: 9/28/2005 4:16:40 PM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I doubt your table saw will raise the blade high enough to square off a round 8'' log.

I don't need them square, I just need enough of a straight surface to screw the siding too. I want them to be partially rounded, with beetle tunnels and axe marks showing. The corner posts, of course, need two flat surfaces.

i think what hes saying is that your blade will not come out of the table far enough to put a flat edge on the side of a log that big.

+1

Posted: 9/28/2005 4:18:03 PM EDT

[#8]

Find someone with a sawmill to do it. Whatever you pay them is worth your safety. The safest way is with a horizontal mill.

Posted: 9/28/2005 4:18:27 PM EDT

[#9]

Make sure there are no nails, screws, broadheads, etc in the logs.

Posted: 9/28/2005 4:19:32 PM EDT

[#10]

Quoted:
i think what hes saying is that your blade will not come out of the table far enough to put a flat edge on the side of a log that big.

Ditto. You will need a portable bandsaw designed for millwork. You can see an ad for one in most 'outdoor' magazines and probably rent one at a large facility. The bandsaw moves on a track and the log is stationary. Very fast and safe.

Posted: 9/28/2005 4:23:51 PM EDT

[#11]

Bandsaw is the safest. You would need a 20" table saw to do that on an 8" log. Make a cradle on the logs to make them lay flat and by all means, use a fence and LOOOOONNNNNGGG pusher sticks.

Posted: 9/28/2005 4:28:29 PM EDT

[#12]

If you could locate a broad axe, an adze and a drawknife it would be a breeze and it would have a very rustic look when finished.

Posted: 9/28/2005 4:46:03 PM EDT

[#13]

I over-estimated the size of the logs. The largest is only 6 1/2" at the butt. I've taken off the bark and high spots on the logs with a draw knife. There are only about a dozen of them, all 8-footers, so it's not worth finding a mill to take them too. They probably aren't worth the gas it would take to get them there.

I also just measured the table saw blade, and you're right, it won't do.

That leaves me with my 12" radial arm saw. It's a huge thing I bought from a lumber yard years ago. I can turn the blade parallel to the fence, or even parallel to the ground. I've just never ripped with it before, and I have a tremendous amount of respect for it. I could screw a strip of plywood to each log to use as a guide.

Or am I making too big of a deal out of this?

Posted: 9/28/2005 4:47:26 PM EDT

[#14]

Quoted:
If you could locate a broad axe, an adze and a drawknife it would be a breeze and it would have a very rustic look when finished.

I've been watching the yard sales and etc. for exactly those things. We had them when I was a kid, and I tried hand-hewing beams. It was fun, but it sure wasn't a "breeze".

Posted: 9/28/2005 4:50:38 PM EDT

[#15]

I've done it with a chain saw. Tedious but it works.

Posted: 9/28/2005 5:17:49 PM EDT

[#16]

Quoted:
I over-estimated the size of the logs. The largest is only 6 1/2" at the butt. I've taken off the bark and high spots on the logs with a draw knife. There are only about a dozen of them, all 8-footers, so it's not worth finding a mill to take them too. They probably aren't worth the gas it would take to get them there.

I also just measured the table saw blade, and you're right, it won't do.

That leaves me with my 12" radial arm saw. It's a huge thing I bought from a lumber yard years ago. I can turn the blade parallel to the fence, or even parallel to the ground. I've just never ripped with it before, and I have a tremendous amount of respect for it. I could screw a strip of plywood to each log to use as a guide.

Or am I making too big of a deal out of this?

Told ya

You can do it with that radial arm. Get a new Rip blade for it. you need a long table and fence for it.

Posted: 9/28/2005 7:03:24 PM EDT

[#17]

Okay, I made a long and tall fence, and I'll pick up a rip blade next trip to Home Depot. If you never hear from me again, you'll know why

Posted: 9/28/2005 8:19:05 PM EDT

[#18]

If you're doing fairly complicated timer framing, that'd work (to flatten the sides). Simple log cabin construction really only requires notching the ends, and laying them down in an alternating pattern, with the ends notched to the corresponding course on the perpendicular wall. Got that?

Think lincoln logs.

Then, it's traditional to use some kind of "caulking" to chink the spaces between the stacked logs, often a moss of sorts (don't know what it's called).

There was an old movie I saw recently that documented this guy's log cabin build in Alaska, call "Alone in the Wilderness" - phenomenal example of what one man can do with very basic tools.

Thinking of doing something about like this?

www.dickproenneke.com/index.html

Cool guy!!

Posted: 9/29/2005 3:44:21 AM EDT

[#19]

I'm not going to be that fancy, only my corner posts and rafters will be half-round. It'll be 10x16, with a 8x12 woodshed on the north side, and an 8x8 "inhouse" attached to the east side.

He wrote a book that I've read several times. And I've heard that his cabin is still standing and in good condition.

Spaghnum moss is what was traditionally used for chinking.

Posted: 9/29/2005 3:58:11 AM EDT

[#20]

my friend, we call him "Stumpy", did it....

Posted: 9/29/2005 4:00:28 AM EDT

[#21]

Find someone who owns a planer, and borrow it. You could use mine, but you'd have to drive to Ohio to get it.

Posted: 9/29/2005 4:01:48 AM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:
Quoted:
If you could locate a broad axe, an adze and a drawknife it would be a breeze and it would have a very rustic look when finished.

I've been watching the yard sales and etc. for exactly those things. We had them when I was a kid, and I tried hand-hewing beams. It was fun, but it sure wasn't a "breeze".

yup, a lot of work.

Posted: 9/29/2005 4:11:12 AM EDT

[#23]

How long are your logs? If you have a large barn or area with a concrete floor use a 24" band saw. Build a support for the logs and put the band saw on wheels. Move the saw down the logs. This works well if you have the space, building, saw, etc.

If you don't have any of that, I have seen an edge guide like you might have for a circular saw the attaches to a chain saw and guides off the outside edge. I have never used it personally, but I have cut plenty of logs lengthwise with a chainsaw (for turning). It is hell on the blades.

Dan

Posted: 9/29/2005 4:15:13 AM EDT

[#24]

Quoted:
Find someone who owns a planer, and borrow it. You could use mine, but you'd have to drive to Ohio to get it.

+1

Super cheap at Harbor Freight.

Posted: 9/29/2005 4:24:39 AM EDT

[#25]

What about a mini-mill chainsaw attachment? Isn't that what its designed for? Nail a 2x4 onto the log, attach the metal jig to the 2x4, clamp the bar in and go. You can file your chain down to 15 degree's for a cleaner cut, or so I've heard.
$79.00 at Northerntools. Of course you need a chainsaw w/16 or 18" bar, but thats it.
www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=6970&productId=152334&R=152334

Posted: 9/29/2005 4:36:28 AM EDT

[#26]

Quoted:
Quoted:
i think what hes saying is that your blade will not come out of the table far enough to put a flat edge on the side of a log that big.

Ditto. You will need a portable bandsaw designed for millwork. You can see an ad for one in most 'outdoor' magazines and probably rent one at a large facility. The bandsaw moves on a track and the log is stationary. Very fast and safe.

\
Yep, there are two Amish mills in this area that would do the job for a very reasonable price, and do a good job too.

Posted: 9/29/2005 4:40:53 AM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Find someone who owns a planer, and borrow it. You could use mine, but you'd have to drive to Ohio to get it.

+1

Super cheap at Harbor Freight.

Jointer would be the better tool for this job
www.deltamachinery.com/index.asp?e=136&p=934
or
www.grizzly.com/products/item.cfm?itemnumber=G1018HW&&gid=D18C729D-3AA9-4F00-AA78-6EDC19F16B8D&site=grizzly
www.wmhtoolgroup.com/index.cfm?area=shop&action=vendors&vid=2&CID=78

Posted: 9/29/2005 5:44:42 AM EDT

[#28]

Quoted:
I'm not going to be that fancy, only my corner posts and rafters will be half-round. It'll be 10x16, with a 8x12 woodshed on the north side, and an 8x8 "inhouse" attached to the east side.

He wrote a book that I've read several times. And I've heard that his cabin is still standing and in good condition.

Spaghnum moss is what was traditionally used for chinking.

Exactly!
I recently ran across the movie while channel surfing, and it was amazing.

Believe it or not, the 'Bay often has tools for cheap (sometimes), or try a couple of old tools dealers.

If it was me (and I realize you're not me) I might take on the project as a way to learn how to use the old tools and methods. It might be just as fast to hack them out with the right broad axe, and simple timber framing tools, then to set up the machines, hassle with the log handling to make them work, and so forth. A couople of well recommended dealers:

Tony Seo (Lots and lots of stuff, and willing to tell you how to use them) www.oldetoolshop.com/

Sandy Moss (low key, very reasonable) www.sydnassloot.com/

Martin Donnelly ($$$$, but he's got EVERYTHING) www.mjdtools.com/

Finally, if you want to learn more about old tools, this list is phenemonal: www.frontier.iarc.uaf.edu/~cswingle/archive/

If not, just ignore my rantings. I'd imagine you'd rather have a small cabin done up quickly and ready for use than a new time-consuming hobby. You just strike me as someone who likes to make things happen with your hands.

Posted: 9/29/2005 7:37:41 AM EDT

[#29]

DScott, thanks for posting those. Good links. I have a couple old books about building with logs that I read and daydream about, too.

Just finished my first log joint, mostly as an experiment. I'm just doing a simple woodshed to start. I need to finish building my house before I get too involved with these peripheral projects. I'll take a pic and post it in another thread tonight when I'm not wasting daylight.

Posted: 9/29/2005 5:24:11 PM EDT

[#30]

Quoted:
DScott, thanks for posting those. Good links. I have a couple old books about building with logs that I read and daydream about, too.

Just finished my first log joint, mostly as an experiment. I'm just doing a simple woodshed to start. I need to finish building my house before I get too involved with these peripheral projects. I'll take a pic and post it in another thread tonight when I'm not wasting daylight.

I've seen your other "lakeside cabin"... really nice!

Pics would be great, when you get a chance!

Woodworkers gotta stick together, ya know. Well, most do, anyway!

Posted: 9/29/2005 5:30:50 PM EDT

[#31]

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=394644

Here's the link to a pic of the corner post for a woodshed I made today.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Carpenters/builders/woodworkers: Safety question

General » General Discussion

Warning

Confirm Action

About AR15.COM

Stay Connected

Newsletter

Contact Us