Societies worse off 'when they have God on their side'

By Ruth Gledhill, Religion Correspondent

RELIGIOUS belief can cause damage to a society, contributing towards high murder rates, abortion, sexual promiscuity and suicide, according to research published today.

According to the study, belief in and worship of God are not only unnecessary for a healthy society but may actually contribute to social problems.

The study counters the view of believers that religion is necessary to provide the moral and ethical foundations of a healthy society.

It compares the social peformance of relatively secular countries, such as Britain, with the US, where the majority believes in a creator rather than the theory of evolution. Many conservative evangelicals in the US consider Darwinism to be a social evil, believing that it inspires atheism and amorality.

Many liberal Christians and believers of other faiths hold that religious belief is socially beneficial, believing that it helps to lower rates of violent crime, murder, suicide, sexual promiscuity and abortion. The benefits of religious belief to a society have been described as its “spiritual capital”. But the study claims that the devotion of many in the US may actually contribute to its ills.

The paper, published in the Journal of Religion and Society, a US academic journal, reports: “Many Americans agree that their churchgoing nation is an exceptional, God-blessed, shining city on the hill that stands as an impressive example for an increasingly sceptical world.

“In general, higher rates of belief in and worship of a creator correlate with higher rates of homicide, juvenile and early adult mortality, STD infection rates, teen pregnancy and abortion in the prosperous democracies.

“The United States is almost always the most dysfunctional of the developing democracies, sometimes spectacularly so.”

Gregory Paul, the author of the study and a social scientist, used data from the International Social Survey Programme, Gallup and other research bodies to reach his conclusions.

He compared social indicators such as murder rates, abortion, suicide and teenage pregnancy.

The study concluded that the US was the world’s only prosperous democracy where murder rates were still high, and that the least devout nations were the least dysfunctional. Mr Paul said that rates of gonorrhoea in adolescents in the US were up to 300 times higher than in less devout democratic countries. The US also suffered from “ uniquely high” adolescent and adult syphilis infection rates, and adolescent abortion rates, the study suggested.

Mr Paul said: “The study shows that England, despite the social ills it has, is actually performing a good deal better than the USA in most indicators, even though it is now a much less religious nation than America.”

He said that the disparity was even greater when the US was compared with other countries, including France, Japan and the Scandinavian countries. These nations had been the most successful in reducing murder rates, early mortality, sexually transmitted diseases and abortion, he added.

Mr Paul delayed releasing the study until now because of Hurricane Katrina. He said that the evidence accumulated by a number of different studies suggested that religion might actually contribute to social ills. “I suspect that Europeans are increasingly repelled by the poor societal performance of the Christian states,” he added.

He said that most Western nations would become more religious only if the theory of evolution could be overturned and the existence of God scientifically proven. Likewise, the theory of evolution would not enjoy majority support in the US unless there was a marked decline in religious belief, Mr Paul said.

“The non-religious, proevolution democracies contradict the dictum that a society cannot enjoy good conditions unless most citizens ardently believe in a moral creator.

“The widely held fear that a Godless citizenry must experience societal disaster is therefore refuted.”

www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2-1798944,00.html

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Cool, the UK is a secular paradise.

Wow. We should be like them.

Quoted: According to the study, belief in and worship of God are not only unnecessary for a healthy society but may actually contribute to social problems. The study counters the view of believers that religion is necessary to provide the moral and ethical foundations of a healthy society.

Hey, I'll keep that in mind when the world runs out of Europeans. www.atimes.com/atimes/Front_Page/GH02Aa01.html

Infertility is killing off the secular world, a number of writers have observed, including Phillip Longman, whose 1994 book The Empty Cradle I reviewed last year. [1] In the former Soviet empire, where atheism reigned as state policy for generations, the United Nations forecasts extreme declines in population by 2050, ranging from 22% for the Russian Federation to nearly 50% for the Ukraine. Secular western Europe will lose 4% to 12% of its population, while the population of the churchgoing United States continues to grow. Is secularism at fault? The numbers do not suggest otherwise. Humankind cannot abide the terror of mortality without the promise of immortality, I have argue in the past. [2] In the absence of religion human society sinks into depressive torpor. Secular society therefore is an oxymoron, for the death of religion leads quickly enough to the death of society itself. ...

I think that is some of the stupidist stuff I have read here in a long time.

Blaming religion is just as valid a reason as anything else.

Its just not PC to blame blacks for keeping themselves down.  But it is PC to blame whites for keeping the blacks down.

Same for mexicans.

Same for the poor, can't blame them -- Blame the rich.

Can't blame muslims, so we'll blame christians.

Lets just blame everyone and tell the rest of the world to fuck off.  (Especially the French)

Remind me to make a big ol' cup of STFU for Mr. Paul this morning.  

Quoted: I think that is some of the stupidist stuff I have read here in a long time.

+1!

Godless societies are much better places. Just look at the Soviet Union and Communist China

Quoted: I think that is some of the stupidist stupidest stuff I have read here in a long time.

Fixed it for ya

I laughed hard at that.  It's "logic" is so flawed that it's comical. What an insult to our intelligence.  

Dupe.

www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=393904

Quoted: Dupe. www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=393904

Thank you for your service, I was hoping the dupe patrol would be here quickly.

TXL

Quoted: Quoted: Dupe. www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=393904 Thank you for your service, I was hoping the dupe patrol would be here quickly. TXL

Ineed, whatever would we do without the "Dupe Police"???  

it's bad enough this garbage isn't in the religion forum but we have to see it twice??? thank god fo' de d00p po-lices...

Quoted: Quoted: I think that is some of the stupidist stupidest most stupid stuff I have read here in a long time. Fixed it for ya

Fixed it for ya.

Dysfunctional, eh?

Remind me of that when this religious nation militarily kicks the shit out of the next godless regime that decides to fuck with us.

Remind me of that when this religious nation economically survives while the rest of the godless socialist paradises rot.

Blessed is the nation whose god is God!

Quoted: Societies worse off 'when they have God on their side' By Ruth Gledhill, Religion Correspondent RELIGIOUS belief can cause damage to a society, contributing towards high murder rates, abortion, sexual promiscuity and suicide, according to research published today. According to the study, belief in and worship of God are not only unnecessary for a healthy society but may actually contribute to social problems.

WOW. Apparently the Founders didn't get the memo.

The study counters the view of believers that religion is necessary to provide the moral and ethical foundations of a healthy society. It compares the social peformance of relatively secular countries, such as Britain, with the US, where the majority believes in a creator rather than the theory of evolution. Many conservative evangelicals in the US consider Darwinism to be a social evil, believing that it inspires atheism and amorality. Many liberal Christians and believers of other faiths hold that religious belief is socially beneficial, believing that it helps to lower rates of violent crime, murder, suicide, sexual promiscuity and abortion. The benefits of religious belief to a society have been described as its “spiritual capital”. But the study claims that the devotion of many in the US may actually contribute to its ills. The paper, published in the Journal of Religion and Society, a US academic journal, reports: “Many Americans agree that their churchgoing nation is an exceptional, God-blessed, shining city on the hill that stands as an impressive example for an increasingly sceptical world. “In general, higher rates of belief in and worship of a creator correlate with higher rates of homicide, juvenile and early adult mortality, STD infection rates, teen pregnancy and abortion in the prosperous democracies. “The United States is almost always the most dysfunctional of the developing democracies, sometimes spectacularly so.” Gregory Paul, the author of the study and a social scientist, used data from the International Social Survey Programme, Gallup and other research bodies to reach his conclusions. He compared social indicators such as murder rates, abortion, suicide and teenage pregnancy. The study concluded that the US was the world’s only prosperous democracy where murder rates were still high, and that the least devout nations were the least dysfunctional. Mr Paul said that rates of gonorrhoea in adolescents in the US were up to 300 times higher than in less devout democratic countries. The US also suffered from “ uniquely high” adolescent and adult syphilis infection rates, and adolescent abortion rates, the study suggested. Mr Paul said: “The study shows that England, despite the social ills it has, is actually performing a good deal better than the USA in most indicators, even though it is now a much less religious nation than America.” He said that the disparity was even greater when the US was compared with other countries, including France, Japan and the Scandinavian countries. These nations had been the most successful in reducing murder rates, early mortality, sexually transmitted diseases and abortion, he added. Mr Paul delayed releasing the study until now because of Hurricane Katrina. He said that the evidence accumulated by a number of different studies suggested that religion might actually contribute to social ills. “I suspect that Europeans are increasingly repelled by the poor societal performance of the Christian states,” he added. He said that most Western nations would become more religious only if the theory of evolution could be overturned and the existence of God scientifically proven. Likewise, the theory of evolution would not enjoy majority support in the US unless there was a marked decline in religious belief, Mr Paul said. “The non-religious, proevolution democracies contradict the dictum that a society cannot enjoy good conditions unless most citizens ardently believe in a moral creator. “The widely held fear that a Godless citizenry must experience societal disaster is therefore refuted.” www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2-1798944,00.html --------------------

See? This is why libbies should be institutionalized in insane asylumns as opposed to being taken seriously. It would be kinder for them and for us.

Quoted: Dysfunctional, eh? Remind me of that when this religious nation militarily kicks the shit out of the next godless regime that decides to fuck with us. Remind me of that when this religious nation economically survives while the rest of the godless socialist paradises rot. Blessed is the nation whose god is God!

And which god would be God?  

Your god, her god, his god, Apu's god, her goddess, their gods?

Over 10,000 different religions. Over 35,000 different Christian denominations. They all can't be right. But they all could be wrong. John Tyrrell - Patriarch  of the UCTAA

No Expert

My IO just dropped 10 points.

Max

Quoted: And which god would be God?

The Christian God

So does this article imply that those people who get up and go to church on Sundays and try to live their lives according to God's word are responsible for high crime rates?

Makes sense. Look at New Orleans- way to much christianity and worshippin' going on there. Don't know how they can stand living next door to those pagan Texans.