As I was getting ready to go to the range today, I noticed I had no .45 ACP on hand.  I decided to stop by China-Mart and get some of this Winchester white box that I read so much about.  I haven't purchased any ammo there in quite a few years.

A pack of 100 was something like $21!!!

It was good ammo, and functioned 100% in my newly built .45 though.

I had better get the press going and make some .45.


Balming

I do reload have a dillon  550 and a RCBS rock chucker
but i use them very little as i mostly shoot 9mm and 223
the commerical reloaded stuff is not a on more than i would spend reloading and my time is valuable to me
I do however use my press for about everything else
shop around and buy by the case

$180 a case isn't bad. I don't shoot as much as I should. I've only fired like 3k rounds this year, tops. I fire more 5.56 though.

Honestly, I get most of my ammunition for free. It pays to be the son of a federal agent and the nephew of a DPS officer and Coustoms agent.

I got some Wolf 45 I would sell you if you were here, dont you wish you were here now.

Man, stop compaining. I bought 100 rounds of 45. AE last week for $28.  Yesterday I stopped by a local shop and came home with 100 of PMC for $25 and change. Sounds like you got a deal to me. At what point does it pay of to start loading your own?

I buy ammunition sometimes, especially .45 schofield and when .45 auto Brass gets low.  I also buy 30-30 and 25-35, but mainly because I don't have dies for some of my calibers as yet (and I don't feel like loading .45 sch. well, or 9mm, 9mm sucks to load, and only marginally cost effective

Well, it's like when buying a fat hooker, you buy in bulk, you get it cheaper.

Quoted: Man, stop compaining. I bought 100 rounds of 45. AE last week for $28.  Yesterday I stopped by a local shop and came home with 100 of PMC for $25 and change. Sounds like you got a deal to me. At what point does it pay of to start loading your own?

At about $3 per box for nines, $4 for .45acp.  (lead)

I haven't done the math on it for a while, but currently, a quantity of 2000 fmj 230 grainers were $134 delivered from Grafs.  8 lbs of Winchester 231 is about $100.  Brass is free, primers about $12 per thousand.  Figure the equipment is just like any other tool in your toolbox, or do the math and see how quick a press will pay itself off.  

more data:  7000 grains to the pound, 4.5 grains per round.

Anybody want to calculate the per 50 price for the data above?  I am gonna get me a beer.

...had to edit, I did buy a case of WWB recently.  I wish I had just bought more boolets and powder.

I know how you feel. It only took a box or three of 10mm before the light bulb came on for me. I just loaded 3 boxes of 9mm (Gold Dots for the last stand). I get the 9mm Winchester 115gr FMJs from Wally for about 12 cents a pop. Reload them for about 6 cents. I also load .45 ACP- buy that brass and 10mm in bulk. I do most of my brass prep while watching the news or an old movie. Got 100 9mm cases from a guy at the range Saturday am. They're tumbling now and will go in my "plinker" can. Yeah, I'm tight.

I cant say

that's too much for .45 even commercial stuff
I get pmc for like $8something a box of 50

I only buy commercial loads. I've never reloaded before nor do I know where to start.

Quoted: Quoted: that's too much for .45 even commercial stuff I get pmc for like $8something a box of 50 Factory:  $0.16/round (approx) Reload (jacketed):  $0.08/round (approx) Reload (Lead SWC): $0.065/round (approx) If you shoot more than 2000 rounds/year (IDPA/IPSC/Bullseye shooters), you are a fool not to get a progressive press and roll your own! "Excellent" Press: $1,300 Pays for itself after 15,000 rounds, and then keeps going to pay for everything else after that.   The gains in the rifle area are MUCH greater and payoff with only a couple thousand rounds. 15k rounds may sound like a lot, but is actually only about 40 hours of loading, and you WILL shoot more once you realize how cheap it is, making you a better shot.

What would be a good, cheap setup for a beginner that never did reloading before. This beginner would like to reload rifle loads(.17HMR,5.56,.30-06, 8mmMauser).

I bought 1000rds on 9mm(10x 100rd winchester white box value packs) for $107($10.70 a box)+tax.

I buy them all day long at that price.

FREE

Pick up a good used single stage press and dies for one caliber. Also a LEE powder dipper measureing set. That will get you going. You can download several reloading tables free on the web.

Quoted: Pick up a good used single stage press and dies for one caliber. Also a LEE powder dipper measureing set. That will get you going. You can download several reloading tables free on the web.

I agree on the single stage, they're always handy in the future, but almost everyone I ever knew that reloaded ended up taking their "startup" equipment and throwing it in the trash or giving it away.

It's money lost, might as well start off with what you'll end up with....a Dillon 550/650 or a Hornady LNP AP.

I'm sorry I didn't.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: that's too much for .45 even commercial stuff I get pmc for like $8something a box of 50 Factory:  $0.16/round (approx) Reload (jacketed):  $0.08/round (approx) Reload (Lead SWC): $0.065/round (approx) If you shoot more than 2000 rounds/year (IDPA/IPSC/Bullseye shooters), you are a fool not to get a progressive press and roll your own! "Excellent" Press: $1,300 Pays for itself after 15,000 rounds, and then keeps going to pay for everything else after that.   The gains in the rifle area are MUCH greater and payoff with only a couple thousand rounds. 15k rounds may sound like a lot, but is actually only about 40 hours of loading, and you WILL shoot more once you realize how cheap it is, making you a better shot. What would be a good, cheap setup for a beginner that never did reloading before. This beginner would like to reload rifle loads(.17HMR,5.56,.30-06, 8mmMauser).

The guy needs a starter kit.

Get a good book such as "The ABC's of Reloading"

You do not need or even want a progressive press for rifle ammo.

You can make excellent 30-06 ammo for $20 per 100.  Kit pays for itself very quickly.

This kit is an excellent value and has exactly what you need:

RCBS master kit

Quoted: Quoted: Pick up a good used single stage press and dies for one caliber. Also a LEE powder dipper measureing set. That will get you going. You can download several reloading tables free on the web. I agree on the single stage, they're always handy in the future, but almost everyone I ever knew that reloaded ended up taking their "startup" equipment and throwing it in the trash or giving it away. It's money lost, might as well start off with what you'll end up with....a Dillon 550/650 or a Hornady LNP AP. I'm sorry I didn't.

That's odd, I have never met anyone who threw their first single stage press away, or gave it away!  I know a lot of handloaders also.

I still keep mine bolted to the bench and use it for precision rifle loads.


Balming

At the local Bi-Mart, they sell 250rd packs of 45 auto for $45.  Pretty damn cheap if you ask me.

Quoted: Primers:  $12 Brass: n/c Bullets: $67 Powder: 4.5gr = 4,500gr/1k  =$8 Total: $87 for 1,000 rds

cheapest I've found small or large pistol primers is $15/K.  pistol and rifle primers have gone up a lot over the last decade.  Surprisingly shotshell primers have held steady at about $20/K

I had several longslide glock .40's and finally built myself a ipsc limited class race gun from a box stock Para P-14 and reloaded 10's of thousands of each .40S&W and .45acp and....it was always a dirty PITA!!! LOL!!!

Annnd...after any given match (even if you marked your brass with a sharpie felt tip marker) you were fortunate to retrieve 50% of your brass.....then rinse all the dirt and sand out...then inspect each one for buldging or stress and to make certain that a 9mm brass wasn't hiding/stuck inside...then it was off to the tumbler for a few hours...then (my personal favorite) sifting'em back out of the media and final cleaning and viola...1/2 a day later your brass is ready to reload.

To sum it up?...It was cool to learn and do for about the first 10K rounds but after that?....I was ready to hire a monkey to clean the brass and an illegal alien to press the lever. LOL!!!

But that all ended for me after the birth of our 2nd of three daughters...and Big Daddy hadta give up his 3rd bedroom of a "Reloading Room" and move his reloading equipment out to the garage...and then I thought...

"Damn...kids?....thousands of primers?....LBS of powder?....and now I gotta reset up all this crap on yet another bench in my hot @$$ and humid south florida garage?"

Sump'in hadta give...and I sure was envious of those "other guys" who'd show up at matches with their 9's shooting box after box of factory fresh fodder.....some of which only cost pennies more than my Starline Brassed Reloads that I spent 1/2 a day bust'in my @$$ to reload.

I sold all my reloading equipment...a Hornady Projector 7? (i think was the name as it was years ago) that was a great press I got slightly used for a song...and passed that savings on to a friend who had no children and was a newbie to the ipsc scene...press, die plates, dies, scale, scale cal. weights, auto powder drop (and all the bushings).....Reloading Manuals, Powder, Primers, Tumbler, Tumbler Media...the works...and he loaded it up with a tight handshake and I smiled as it all left (in a "good ridence" sorta way) knowing that...I just commited myself to 9mm....cases of it!!! LOL!!!!

But that's how I afford to shoot...9mm and .223 rock.

annnnnd....leave the brass lay where it falls.

L8R, Bill.

5.56 and 7.62x39 are cheap.

WWB -9mm = $5.50/box for 50 rounds.  

I wonder about just how much I "save" by reloading.....


Box of 20 rounds of Federal Gold Medal Match is $20.95

Box of 20 rounds of my match-grade reloads (price of parts) is $8.50

Let's just say that it's $12 difference.


The equipment was free (having been donated by a friend from college when he went off to LSU and got himself a progressive setup), but I end up having to spend something like 4 hours of work per box of 50 rounds.

It's fine now, since I am a graduate student and have gobs of time on my hands w/ no money, but I'm thinking I might just go back to buying new when I get a real job again, since there's no way I'd have time to do any reloading.....

It is just like fuel economy in a car - individual for everyone.  If you drive 10000 per year (or shoot the same) it just isn't comparable for those doing 5x as much.

Crawling around in the dirt picking up brass isn't what I would call "free", especially if someone else has been there first to pick it over.  A spare room with a workbench to hold the press isn't free either.  The time thing is misleading, it's not the cash equivalent of your free time, it is the cash equivalent of what you would otherwise want to do with that free time - spending time with the kids is worth how much per hour?

Virtually no one at the range I use even keeps their brass – even though it’s indoors and all they have to do is pick it up.

Reloadable once-fired brass that I’ve picked there the past year - in addition to the usual .45ACP. 30-06 and such - has included (generally small amounts of) 5.7 X28 FN, 6.5X55 Swedish, 7.7 Jap, 7MM STW, 270 and .300 WSM, .300 Win Mag, 30-40 Krag, 348 Win, 375 H&H, 45-70, .50 Beowolf .50 AE, and .500 S&W.  

Some people seem to have more money than sense.  

Here's the dirty little secret on saving money from reloading:  You don't!

That's because you tend to crank out more ammo  Literally more bang for the buck!

When I shoot uspsa I give away my brass, and everyone looks at me like I'm nucking futz

Quoted: Here's the dirty little secret on saving money from reloading:  You don't! That's because you tend to crank out more ammo  Literally more bang for the buck!

Damn right.  You don't save money, you just shoot a lot more.

Quoted: I had several longslide glock .40's and finally built myself a ipsc limited class race gun from a box stock Para P-14 and reloaded 10's of thousands of each .40S&W and .45acp and....it was always a dirty PITA!!! LOL!!! Annnd...after any given match (even if you marked your brass with a sharpie felt tip marker) you were fortunate to retrieve 50% of your brass.....then rinse all the dirt and sand out...then inspect each one for buldging or stress and to make certain that a 9mm brass wasn't hiding/stuck inside...then it was off to the tumbler for a few hours...then (my personal favorite) sifting'em back out of the media and final cleaning and viola...1/2 a day later your brass is ready to reload. To sum it up?...It was cool to learn and do for about the first 10K rounds but after that?....I was ready to hire a monkey to clean the brass and an illegal alien to press the lever. LOL!!! But that all ended for me after the birth of our 2nd of three daughters...and Big Daddy hadta give up his 3rd bedroom of a "Reloading Room" and move his reloading equipment out to the garage...and then I thought... "Damn...kids?....thousands of primers?....LBS of powder?....and now I gotta reset up all this crap on yet another bench in my hot @$$ and humid south florida garage?" Sump'in hadta give...and I sure was envious of those "other guys" who'd show up at matches with their 9's shooting box after box of factory fresh fodder.....some of which only cost pennies more than my Starline Brassed Reloads that I spent 1/2 a day bust'in my @$$ to reload. I sold all my reloading equipment...a Hornady Projector 7? (i think was the name as it was years ago) that was a great press I got slightly used for a song...and passed that savings on to a friend who had no children and was a newbie to the ipsc scene...press, die plates, dies, scale, scale cal. weights, auto powder drop (and all the bushings).....Reloading Manuals, Powder, Primers, Tumbler, Tumbler Media...the works...and he loaded it up with a tight handshake and I smiled as it all left (in a "good ridence" sorta way) knowing that...I just commited myself to 9mm....cases of it!!! LOL!!!! But that's how I afford to shoot...9mm and .223 rock. annnnnd....leave the brass lay where it falls. L8R, Bill.

Face it FUZ1ON, your just lazy. You were probably better off selling your setup to someone who could you use it, and appreciate it. Shame on you.

Quoted: Honestly, I get most of my ammunition for free. It pays to be the son of a federal agent and the nephew of a DPS officer and Coustoms agent.

Thats cool, the Fed's can just go and sign for ammo when ever a kid needs ammo....

Quoted: As I was getting ready to go to the range today, I noticed I had no .45 ACP on hand.  I decided to stop by China-Mart and get some of this Winchester white box that I read so much about.  I haven't purchased any ammo there in quite a few years. A pack of 100 was something like $21!!! It was good ammo, and functioned 100% in my newly built .45 though. I had better get the press going and make some .45. Balming

We go to the gun show and buy S&B for $200 a case out the door.

I load 77gr SMK loads (Mk 262ish) for about $25 per hundred or $250 per thousand (once fired brass).

I've been loading M855 copy for about $17 per hundred or $170 per thousand (once fired brass).

I could probably load 45 ACP for about $5-6 per hundred or $50-60 per thousand.

The best I have done is .38 Special for about $4.50 per hundred or $45 per thousand.

Dang! How do non handloaders afford to shoot!  

Originally Posted By Daytona955i Well, it's like when buying a fat hooker, you buy in bulk, you get it cheaper.

+1

Making a lot of money doesn't hurt either.

Quoted: I wonder about just how much I "save" by reloading..... Box of 20 rounds of Federal Gold Medal Match is $20.95 Box of 20 rounds of my match-grade reloads (price of parts) is $8.50 Let's just say that it's $12 difference. The equipment was free (having been donated by a friend from college when he went off to LSU and got himself a progressive setup), but I end up having to spend something like 4 hours of work per box of 50 rounds. It's fine now, since I am a graduate student and have gobs of time on my hands w/ no money, but I'm thinking I might just go back to buying new when I get a real job again, since there's no way I'd have time to do any reloading.....

I save a ton on match rifle rounds...21cents for a 69gr Sierra Matchking loaded round. A comparable Federal Match round is between 80-90 cents. But yes, it's a ton of labor making 100 rds - about 3.5-4hrs.

I still reload .45ACP, but as for 9mm - no way. The savings on 9mm are too small to justify it for me (I have a Glock, so FMJ reloads are a must, and I don't save all that much vs Winchster White box @ $5.50/50).

And yes, I use a single-stage press for everything. Been doing it that way for about 9 years. But I have no kids, have plenty of spare time and I try to reserve the serious reloading sessions for bad weather days or winter. I prep brass way in advance so as to have a ton ready for powder and slugs. Work up loads before the weather gets too cold to shoot, and then load 'em up all winter.

Quoted: What would be a good, cheap setup for a beginner that never did reloading before. This beginner would like to reload rifle loads(.17HMR,5.56,.30-06, 8mmMauser).

Reloading is easy, and much to my surprise I also found it to be fun.

Start out with the Lee Anniversary Kit.  Under $100 for most everything you need.  Buy a Lyman manual and some components and you're off to the races.  Dies are around $20 as well.

This makes great sense for rifle calibers.   When you can churn out a box of .30-06 for $4 instead of paying $20 for it,  it pays for itself very quickly.

Don't bother with a progressive setup unless you are a pistol shooter who does a lot of shooting.   They are more expensive to add calibers.  You can always add one later if you decide you need it, but the Lee single stage press will never not be useful.

Quoted: Honestly, I get most of my ammunition for free. It pays to be the son of a federal agent and the nephew of a DPS officer and Coustoms agent.

So the providers of law and order are stealing ammo and giving it to you???? I guess the below applies to cops as well.



"Only about 21% of employees are basically honest and will never steal."

STUDIES SHOW 13% OF EMPLOYEES ARE "FUNDAMENTALLY" DISHONEST

Studies show that not only do employees steal, but also they outsteal shoplifters.

Employees readily admitted to stealing cash and stock and those surveyed indicated that these practices are increasing at an alarming rate. Only about 21% of employees are basically honest and will never steal. 13% are fundamentally dishonest and undoubtedly attempt theft, and the remaining 66% are encouraged to steal if they see others doing it without repercussion.

Amongst those surveyed were employees who admitted stealing from their present or former employers, yet few of these employees, less than 5%, had a criminal record of any kind for a theft related offence. They were asked to explain the reasons behind their theft and what made an otherwise loyal and honest individual feel the need to steal when placed in a work environment.

For some questioned the reason for theft was pure greed, for others it was vindictiveness, and surprisingly for only a small percentage it was need.

These findings support RPS’s strategy which has always been to identify and target the employees that will always steal in order to create a real deterrent to persuade the majority to remain honest. It also highlights why a pro-active approach is the only way to tackle the issue of workplace fraud.

* Source – Kessler Survey 1999, reproduced courtesy of Michael G. Kessler & Associates, Ltd. – www.investigation.com.

I shoot maybe 3000 rounds a year. I buy all my ammo by the case. Paying these pricing for new high-quality FMJ, how much could I save by reloading? Even if I could save a few cents a round, it's simply not worth all the time it takes to clean the brass, reload it, and all the crawling around looking for my brass.

9mm: $110 per thousand (S&B)
.45ACP: $185 per thousand (S&B)
.223: $200 per thousand (Federal XM193)
.308: $180 per thousand (Aussy F4)
.357 Sig: $200 per thousand (S&B)

Prices include frieght

Quoted: Quoted: What would be a good, cheap setup for a beginner that never did reloading before. This beginner would like to reload rifle loads(.17HMR,5.56,.30-06, 8mmMauser). Reloading is easy, and much to my surprise I also found it to be fun. Start out with the Lee Anniversary Kit.  Under $100 for most everything you need.  Buy a Lyman manual and some components and you're off to the races.  Dies are around $20 as well. This makes great sense for rifle calibers.   When you can churn out a box of .30-06 for $4 instead of paying $20 for it,  it pays for itself very quickly. Don't bother with a progressive setup unless you are a pistol shooter who does a lot of shooting.   They are more expensive to add calibers.  You can always add one later if you decide you need it, but the Lee single stage press will never not be useful.

I started off with that LEE kit, and ended up replacing everything in it with better parts, except the powder funnel and their crimp die. Spend the extra money and start off right. Get an RCBS setup. Probably cost ya $250ish (haven't kept up with the price). Better to do that than get cheapo stuff and have to replace it all with higher quality.

I have used the single stage setup exclusively. While it isn't as fast as a progressive, I think the quality can be higher.

Quoted: I started off with that LEE kit, and ended up replacing everything in it with better parts, except the powder funnel and their crimp die. Spend the extra money and start off right. Get an RCBS setup. Probably cost ya $250ish (haven't kept up with the price). Better to do that than get cheapo stuff and have to replace it all with higher quality. I have used the single stage setup exclusively. While it isn't as fast as a progressive, I think the quality can be higher.

Certainly you can replace everything in the kit, but I never found it necessary.  It's a functional kit and it works well for the money.   Many of my friends reload exclusively on the Anniversary kit after I suggested it.  It's a fine choice for the casual reloader, who may load a couple thousand rounds a year at most.  For anything more intense I'd suggest RCBS, but the Lee will certainly work if you're on a tight budget (like the poster mentioned.)

Most of my time is spent on a Dillon 550, but I still use the Lee for the bolt-action rifle cartridges.  If it's a semi-auto, I usually invest in a conversion kit for the Dillon though.

We get jobs that don't require us to wear dorky uniforms and ask the customer "Would you like to Super Size that "?

Quoted: Well, it's like when buying a fat hooker, you buy in bulk, you get it cheaper.

That is the funnest thing I heard all day.

I don't have the time or space to reload .  I shoot a lot of Milsurp or Russian stuff .  Wolf , Silver Bear ,
Brown Bear , etc ., all function quite well in my guns and they don't break the bank .  The only expensive round that I shoot is the 7.5 mm Swiss , and I don't shoot much of that anyway .

The major advantage for me isn't price, it's quality.

I can buy cheap bulk .223 ammo - and shoot 4-6MOA (or worse) out of my custom-built bull-barrel AR.

Or, I can pay for premium ammo that will shoot sub-MOA.

Or, I can roll my own, and shoot a lot more that's sub-MOA.

With pistol, I can build a highly accurate 200gr. Speer Gold Dot .45ACP load for far less than half of what the commercial version goes for.

But when I start running low on brass, I buy a case of hardball.

For my S&W 25 .45LC, I am working on a 900fps 300gr. load.  You can't buy that load.

Have you seen anyone that builds a .357 Magnum cartridge using 200 grain .35 Remington bullets?  That's what I use in my Contender.  They sure as hell won't fit in a standard cylinder. Sure, I can buy commercial ammo for my 3" Model 60 (and I do) but I also handload for it.

Have you seen the price for commercial 7BR ammo?  Commercial .303 British?  (I really like using the 125 grain .311" softpoints in this cartridge.  Nobody makes it commercially.)  Or 6.5x55 Mauser?  Ouch!  And I LOVE playing with different bullets and powders in .30-06 for both my Garand and my 1917 Enfield.

Is it all time consuming?  Certainly.  And if I shot 10,000 rounds of .45 a year, I'd consider just going with hardball and buying commercial, but I'm more of a hobby shooter, and reloading is just part of the hobby for me.

First on my list right now is a good safe. After that, I'm going to look into reloading.

I support my habit the same way I did during my junkie days.


Steal and deal.