Hey,
It really buggs me, politicians treat the space program like a redheaded step child. NASA and the national labs are the single biggest reeason for us being an economic super power and even thoght they aren't cutting the budget anymore, the paltry increases they've gotten are a joke with our surplus. Then they use it as a wellfare organization to russia by turning the space station international. (it would be done this year if they would have not broght the russians into it) Then the aword contracts (eg X-33) not to the best design but the most politicaly located contractor. They deep six inportant technology because there vendors dont like it (TransHab) and they ignore usful technology (RTG's and NTR's) because they aren't willing to fight the enviro-freaks. I am happy that commercial intrests are finaly starting to step up to the plate cause NASA's dead. I have a running bet with my uncle at JPL that the first manned craft to land on mars will have a Mars Society logo on the side instead of the NASA meatball. Mars is the new world for my genoration and next and the way I see things going here I am willing to bet inside of fifty years we will see a group of colonist, armed with the most forward thinking of their time transmitting, we hold these truths self evident....


Sorry, Rant mode off.
(the Mars stuff is not actualy very realistic I recomend the book The Case for Mars by Robert Zubrin)

[rail]

Armed, it bothers me too that our government spends more on "welfare" for foreign countries than our space program. I feel that space is the future for our future gererations and the time to prepare is now. To know that an American has stepped foot on the moon is such a proud, patriotic feeling it gives me chills when I look at the moon sometimes. Sure, some say we should take care of our problems here on earth first but if we would cut out all the wasteful, liberal giveaways we could spend the needed funds on the Mars program.

We need power, we need raw materials, and we need to relieve the population stresses on the planet.  Everything we need is out there.  So where are we 32 years after setting foot on the moon?  Barely in low Earth orbit.

If we wait until the "problems down here" are fixed, we won't be going anywhere, ever.

Space travel, like trans-oceanic travel in the 1600's, is expensive and dangerous.  However, we're now so wussified that we fear taking any risks.  This does not bode well for any expansion of our space program.  Make no mistake - whatever country actually bites the bullet and moves to exploit space will be the next great superpower as long as the other countries don't join up to pull it down.  

It should be us.  There ain't no bigger dog on the porch.  Unfortunately we seem to be occupied with licking ourselves.

[sniper]

It is inevitable that if you give the government enough time they will skrew up anything.

Space travel will not become commonplace until corporations see a benefit in it.

...where's my God-Damned flying car???!!!

It's 2001 for God's sake.
C'mon!

I say we have to shit or get off the pot with the space program.  The United States made leaps and bounds in the 60's but hasn't done anything since.  We need to continue making progress or stop entirely.  

I totally agree ArmedScientist.  The future of mankind is in space and if we don't get out there while there's still time, we may have no future.

So, what's your guess as to when we land on Mars?
I don't see it happening before 2035.

Yeah, where the hell is my transporter? Damn it! I could be living in Arizona right now, shooting class-3 all day, and then transport to my job in CA. I can only dream...

My guess for Mars is the 2015-2020 time frame. Althoght I doubt it will be NASA. My guess is either the Mars Society or a corporate consortium. I suspect we will have a permant base there shortly after just because of the architeture of Mars Direct/Semi-Direct

[rail]

I agree - Sub-Saharan or Equatorial Africa, for example, is basically a money pit that will never be improved regardless of how much is spent. I hate to say it, but we have to cut them loose and let them die off like nature obviously intends if the rest of us want to progress. With the money we've thrown away trying to feed them, we could have been on Mars a logn time ago and doing something productive, instead of fooling ourselves into believing that the dead patient will recover if we just hook up enough life-support machines.

Space, really is "the final frontier"

NH2112-- Wasn't it Sam Kinnison who said about those people in Africa, "move out of the fuckin desert".

I just noticed this, on my origional post I meant the mars stuff is very realistic. LOL. Kinda said the opposite of what I meant. Seems like you got what I was saying thoght.

I have a theory about why Africa is the way it is. We now know that man first evolved in Africa, and that was our evolves niche, those of members of Homo Sapien who moved north and east in a harsher enviroment had to develop clothes and tools when there african counter parts were lazily enjoying the savana. so they were stagnant while we advanced. The same is true for the America Indian. I am not a rasist but from a historical standpoint it seams to make sense, expand or die.

[rail]

SPECIES 8472................[dracula]

If advancement results from migration, then the American Indians should have had the most advanced society on the planet.

Armed and the rest,

Essentially the point in question seems to be, 'Why have we not returned to the moon or established a colony on Mars?'

The answer seems simple:

No good economic reason for it!

It seems to me that the reason for the space race and the moon landing was political/national pride. There was no real economic purpose just national pride and hence we have not returned. We planted our flag first and so the game was/is over.

As for NASA I wish for it's quick demise and the start up of private space firms. As long as the NASA monopoly exists there will be a barrier stifling true space exploration.

Only after such a demise will any lasting or needed space advancement take place, based of course on marketplace demand.

Hephaistos