www.journalstar.com/articles/2004/09/14/top_story/10055010.txt

Confederate flag causes flap

BY MATTHEW HANSEN / Lincoln Journal Star

Drive north on 17th Street, look left and up, and there it is.

It's a three-by-five-foot cut of polyester made in Taiwan, bought in Virginia and displayed in a North Carolinan's University of Nebraska-Lincoln dorm room.

It's a piece of U.S. history linking our nation's only Civil War to George Wallace standing in a schoolhouse doorway to the bumper stickers and T-shirts you could buy last week at the Nebraska State Fair.

Today, nearly a century and a half after it was first flown by the Confederate Army during battle, it continues to entangle two UNL students and the university inside its red background, white trim and blue cross.

On one side of this particular Confederate flag stands Kasey Montgomery, the University of Nebraska-Lincoln sophomore from a Carolina map dot who chooses to fly the flag.

On the other side stands Angel Jennings, a sophomore from the urban sprawl of northeast Virginia, who chooses to oppose it.

In the middle stand the rest of us, looking up and left, trying to decide whether the polyester means one thing, or the other thing, or nothing at all.

The flag's owner says it's about pride. He says this while looking at his tennis shoes.

Montgomery is a shy type, not the sort of student you'd expect to ignite controversy.

But that's exactly what he did - unintentionally, he says - when he forked over $20 for two Confederate flags at a Virginia gift shop this summer.

They came along when he returned from his hometown of King, N.C., for his sophomore year at UNL.

He hung one up on the bedroom wall of the new Husker Courtyards dorm room he shares with three other students, all Nebraskans. He hung the second flag in his bedroom window.

"I thought maybe some people wouldn't like it," the architecture student says. "Ididn't know anybody would get upset."

People don't get upset about the Rebel flag in King, N.C., he says.

The town of about 7,000 people, and "about 97 percent white,"Montgomery says, are used to seeing it hanging in front of neighbors' houses.

The flag comes second - after the American flag, before the state flag - in the town's annual parade.

"My dad flies one,"Montgomery says. "He's not a racist."

So the sophomore said he was surprised when a Husker Courtyards resident assistant approached him and asked him to take the flag out of his window mere days after he put it up.

A black student, Jennings, had gone to the university, upset about its presence.

Further meetings with various university officials followed, Montgomery says, meetings with one underlying theme: We'd like you to take the flag down, but we can't make you.

"They talked about how I'd be a great person for taking it down,"he says. "So does that make me a bad person for having it up in the first place?"

Chancellor Harvey Perlman and James Griesen, vice chancellor for student affairs, both say they don't like the message the flag sends to the university, the city or the state.

They also say Montgomery has the First Amendment right to display the flag in his window.

"Isuppose that, as a landlord, we could say there's to be no visible sign in any windows,"Griesen said. "Then we'd be in a situation where someone wouldn't be able to put up Christmas lights, or a Husker flag.

"Ijust don't think we want to go there."

Montgomery's friends and roommates say he's got more than the First Amendment on his side.

They say the flag can have positive connotations, like rebelling against authority and pride in one's heritage.

They say Montgomery is the last person anyone would call racist if he didn't fly a Confederate flag in his window.

"Ithink he should keep it up,"says Montgomery's roommate Aaron Callaway, a North Platte sophomore. "I'd never thought twice about it before people started bringing it up. To me, and to a lot of us, it's just a flag.

"That's it."

To Montgomery, the flag means rolling hills and lush Carolina valleys. It means King, where he knows everyone and everyone knows him.

It's collard greens, grits with butter and a friendly wave from a front porch as you drive by, he says.

It's the South he knows and loves.

"When I look at it, I think of home."

Angel Jennings is from the South, too, raised in the melting pot of Alexandria, Va.

Like Montgomery, she struggled for a time to adjust to the surroundings of Nebraska, a place so very far from home.

Unlike Montgomery, the Confederate flag signifies to her the worst part of the South she hails from, and the country in which she lives.

"- (I)t is a shameful reminder of slavery, segregation and hundreds of years of oppression,"she wrote in a Aug. 30 guest editorial in the Daily Nebraskan, UNL's student newspaper.

The journalism student sat at a computer writing that editorial for five or six hours, she says, breaking only to cry.

The final draft left out the part about the time the manager of a towing service sicked his pit bull on her, laughing while she screamed in fear.

It left out the the friendly Wal-Mart greeter who turned sullen when she walked in and the Village Inn waitress jovial with other customers but nasty to the black women in the corner booth. It omitted all the other times she wondered, or didn't have to wonder, if it was rudeness or racism.

How do you explain that to a predominately white campus in an predominately white state?

How do you explain how it all ties together and comes to be embodied by the red background, white trim, blue cross?

"Sometimes I just say, OK, maybe Ishould take a step back and it's not racism,"Jennings says, the words tumbling out of her. "But I feel it in Nebraska, more sometimes than I did in the South -

"Ijust decided I had to write this for me - I was just going to let it all out. I'm not going to fight every battle. The ones I fight, I'm going to try to win."

Jennings says she decided to fight the battle against the flag the day she looked up and left and saw it in a Husker Courtyards window.

She has history on her side, according to Patrick Jones, a UNLAfrican-American studies professor who specializes in the history of the Civil Rights movement.

Jones, a self-professed "white guy from the North," says the use of what was once a Confederate battle flag has always been tied to racism.

The "Southern Cross"rose to post-Civil War prominence around the turn of the 20th century, at the same time many Reconstruction-era reforms were being eroded by Southern state governments, he says.

It rose again during the 1960s, when those opposing the Civil Rights movement used it as a symbol of defiance against the federally mandated integration of schools.

The Strom Thurmond-led Dixiecrat party adopted it when it broke from the Democrats during the early stages of the Civil Rights struggle.

So have countless white supremacy groups, including the Ku Klux Klan.

"As a historian, Ifind it difficult to untangle the symbol from racial inequality,"Jones says. "To say this flag isn't linked to slavery - That's a historically inaccurate statement if we're honest about it."

Jennings didn't have to consult a history book to believe the Confederate flag had something to do with racism.

She scheduled a meeting with Doug Zatechka, director of UNL's housing. Not satisfied with the result, she then met with Griesen, who assured her the student would be asked, but not told, to take the flag down.

The Daily Nebraskan ran an Aug. 30 story saying Montgomery decided to remove the flag from public view. Jennings then sent her fellow sophomore a note thanking him for taking the flag down.

Montgomery denies he ever agreed to take the flag down. He says he only promised to consider it before deciding he'd hide it when he was away at class, and display it when in his dorm room.

Jennings thinks Montgomery said one thing then did another, evidence that he's making a statement beyond Southern pride.

The sophomores have never talked about this. They've never met, instead linked only by the red, white and blue flag one flies and the other loathes.

This particular Confederate flag has a message easily readable from the inside of Montgomery's room.

"Heritage Not Hate,"it says.

To Montgomery, this is everything. To Jennings, this means nothing.

To passersby, it's simply confusing.

The three words blur together, almost impossible to read as you whiz by in a car, glancing up and left.

Reach Matthew Hansen at 473-7245 or [email protected].

OMG, get off it people.  The 1800's are over and so are the 60's.  If I fly a confederate flag it's because I am damn proud of the service and ideals that my great-great grandfather fought for in the CSA.  NOT because I dislike anyone of another race, or because I don't love my country.  And for the record, the other acquantences and friends of mine who portray the flag do and feel the same way.

*edited to add:  it's a damn shame what happened to some people during the earlier periods in our history.  We should never forget that lest we make the same mistake again, just as we should never forget those soldiers of the Confederacy, nor the symbols that they chose for the cause

Quoted: OMG, get off it people.  The 1800's are over and so are the 60's.  I fly a confederate flag at my house because I am damn proud of the service and ideals that my great-great grandfather fought for in the CSA.  NOT because I dislike anyone of another race, or because I don't love my country.  And for the record, the other acquantences and friends of mine who portray the flag do and feel the same way.

Exactly!

I don't own or fly a Confederate Flag. But that doesn't mean I'm not proud of my great-great grandfather either.

Sometimes I wish the south would rise again!

Did you ever notice that "Freedom of [fill in the blank]" only applies to liberals?

Quoted: Quoted: OMG, get off it people.  The 1800's are over and so are the 60's.  I fly a confederate flag at my house because I am damn proud of the service and ideals that my great-great grandfather fought for in the CSA.  NOT because I dislike anyone of another race, or because I don't love my country.  And for the record, the other acquantences and friends of mine who portray the flag do and feel the same way. Exactly! I don't own or fly a Confederate Flag. But that doesn't mean I'm not proud of my great-great grandfather either.

Some choose to display their pride in different ways.  It's also a shame that various groups have used the confederate flag as a symbol for their own agendas.

It irritates me to no end that "progressive" people and groups want to do away with certain historical icons because it might be offensive to someone.  And eliminate grading in schools because it might offend the children who are a little farther behind, and eliminate evil rifle features because how scary it looks might offend someone...

Quoted: Sometimes I wish the south would rise again!

Unfortunately, a sizeable chunk of the Deep South is about to get smacked down - not by a Grant, but by an Ivan.  Go figure...

Quoted: A black student, Jennings, had gone to the university, upset about its presence. The journalism student sat at a computer writing that editorial for five or six hours, she says, breaking only to cry.

Wha! Wha! Wha!

Funny that the US flag was(and still is) used in Klan rallies WAAAY before they 'adopted' the Confederate flag, hell they even have their own flag, but does anyone have a problem with that?!?!

If this guy was waving it and spewing racial bullshit, it would be a whole different story.


ByteTheBullet  (-:

I have 7 in my family tree that fought For 7Th South Carolina Calvary.I fly the First National Flag of The Confederacy.Very few people even knows what it is.  The old saying is,To the victors,go the spoils,Remember they also write the History Books

Not to mention just about all of the ships that carried those slaves to America, flew either the union jack of Great Britan, or the United States of America stars and stripes.....

I dont recall reading of any of those ships flying the stars and bars....

I am pretty sure that this poor mistreated abused black girl HAS NEVER BEEN A SLAVE.....


Pilk

My family's origin in this country are in North Carolina.  I am PROUD of the fact we were on the RIGHT side of The War of Northern Agression  

This thread is worthless without pics!

My family came from Poland in the 1930's - I just don't get why everyone is all worked up.

I favor flying the Confederate flag for pride - when Poland was wiped off the map of Europe, people still flew Polish flags and considered themselfs Polish. Seems to be the same way in the Southern US.

Av.

Halalooooooya.

I have a Confederate battle flag in the window of my truck and I work/drive in north St. Louis. I do this for three reasons, first is I have many ancestors who fought for the south and I respect them for their sacrifice, second I am in total agreement with the states rights the confederacy was fighting for and finally I love to piss off those worthless welfare scamming, criminally inclined locals...

Quoted: I have a Confederate battle flag in the window of my truck and I work/drive in north St. Louis. I do this for three reasons, first is I have many ancestors who fought for the south and I respect them for their sacrifice, second I am in total agreement with the states rights the confederacy was fighting for and finally I love to piss off those worthless welfare scamming, criminally inclined locals...

Good call, and I hear you on that, but go armed or your nuts....

Yeah, Freedom as long as it doesn't hurt any liberals feelings......fuckem, we have the guns....

well said drew..well said!!

You can't fly the Confederate battle flag because it is offensive to some...Well if that is the case, then why can homosexuals parade and flaunt their deviant nature in front of everyone and we're supposed to appreciate their diversity? WTF!!! I think it incredibly ironic that liberals preach tolerance but are the most intolerant SOBs if you think differently than them!!

well said countiemountie!!

Quoted: Is she going to think that every guy who has one of those is in the Klan?

If she does, she wont be anywhere near alone.

Funny thing about stereotypes, they cut both ways.





P.S. The South wont rise again, and I aint bailin no fucking cotton.

Quoted: My family's origin in this country are in North Carolina.  I am PROUD of the fact we were on the RIGHT side of The War of Northern Agression

Black anchorwoman on the local news channel here in AR actually called it that -- The War of Northern Aggression on the air.

"The journalism student sat at a computer writing that editorial for five or six hours, she says, breaking only to cry."

Give me a fucking break...Oh the agony! Oh my god! Drama Queen! Just vote for Kerry and STFU!

Hahaha! Bailing cotton?



This flag was erected in front of Beauvoir in Biloxi, MS after the liberals tried to change our state flag. They got owned 70/30 for keeping the old flag. It will be awhile before they try that again.

Save your Confederate money boys....the South will rise again.

I lost several ancestors to the yankees and had a First National Flag on my car for a  while, nobody knows what it is.  Remember though, the Third National Flag is the current Official Flag of the Confederacy (until the Confederate Congress meets again and changes it).

Quoted:
Funny that the US flag was(and still is) used in Klan rallies WAAAY before they 'adopted' the Confederate flag, hell they even have their own flag, but does anyone have a problem with that?!?!


The only flags that are "authorized" by the constitution and bylaws of the United Klan's of America (the last real National Klan) are the American and Christian banners. Of course there is no more UKA and all of the Klan's that are out there today are individual groups and have various bylaws.
If you have seen them on TV you must agree they are not much of a threat to anything but their own freedom.

I find it rather amusing that there people are so fast to attack the flags of the Confederacy and don't stop to realize the many symbols of racists in our culture everyday.

What about the $20 bill Andrew Jackson? He was determined to eradicate the Native Americans.

What about the $50 bill U.S. Grant? Quoted as saying: "If I thought this war was to abolish slavery, I would resign my commission, and offer my sword to the other side." --- Ulysses S. Grant

What about the $5 bill Old Abe himself? Quotes:
"My first impulse would be to free all the slaves, and send them to Liberia, to their own native land. But a moment's reflection would convince me, that whatever of high hope(as I think there is) there may be in this, in the long run, it's sudden execution is impossible. What then? Free them, and keep them among us as underlings? Is it quite certain that this betters their condition? I think I would not hold one in slavery, at any rate, yet the point is not clear enough for me to denounce people on. What then? Free them, and make them politically and socially our equals? MY own feelings will not admit of this; and if mine would, we well know that those of the great mass of white people will not...A universal feeling, whether well or ill-founded, cannot be safely disregarded." --- Abraham Lincoln

"I am not in favor of making voters or jurors of Negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office..." --- Abraham Lincoln, 9/15/1858 campaign speech

"I have no purpose, directly or indirectly, to interfere with the institution of slavery in the States where it exists. I believe I have no lawful right to do so, and I have no inclination to do so." --- Abraham Lincoln, 3/14/1861 First Inaugural Speech

"I am a little uneasy about the abolishment of slavery in this District [of Columbia]..." --- Abraham Lincoln, 3/24/1862 letter to Horace Greeley, New York Tribune editor

Do Mexicans hate the Texas flag? After all, they claim we stole Texas from Mexico.

I recently petitioned the school board to remove the Mexican flag from the cafeteria and school rooms. And won when they could not reply with "why" they were there. Yet the school is named after Col Ashbel Smith, the commander of the 2nd Texas Infantry, CSA. And his painting is displayed right there as you walk in the door!

Where does it all end?

It doesn't, I am looking forward to the MLK half dollar.

If these people want to attack something, they should attack the Dutch and English, as they were the ones that brought them to America for sale after being bought by their own dammed people!

And BTW, the importation of slaves was illegal during the life of the Confederate States of America.

I have not said enough, but have spoken my peace. I am a Southern American and dammed proud of it....and yes I have the Battle Flag of the Confederacy displayed on both of our trucks!

I leave you with these word:

"Nothing fills me with deeper sadness than to see a Southern man apologizing for the defense we made of our inheritance. Our cause was so just, so sacred, that had I known all that has come to pass, had I known what was to be inflicted upon me, all that my country was to suffer, all that our posterity was to endure, I would do it all over again.'' --- President Jeff Davis, C.S.A.

Renee<----proud Texan Southern American and American

Please pray for our troops.

Quoted: You can't fly the Confederate battle flag because it is offensive to some...Well if that is the case, then why can homosexuals parade and flaunt their deviant nature in front of everyone and we're supposed to appreciate their diversity? WTF!!! I think it incredibly ironic that liberals preach tolerance but are the most intolerant SOBs if you think differently than them!!

So the American flag would be offensive to Native Americans?

Renee
Pray for our troops

Quoted: Quoted: Save your Confederate money boys....the South will rise surrender again. Fixed that for ya In a way the south has risen again, the crappy taxes and insurance rates for businesses in the northeast (plus air conditioning!) has drawn a lot of guys to the south from up here to work

You're right, I am surrounded by northerners who bitch about the weather, the roads, the drivers, the bugs, but not about their employment.

Quoted: Quoted: Is she going to think that every guy who has one of those is in the Klan? If she does, she wont be anywhere near alone.

Well, there are a lot of fools in the world.

BTW, while I would have to do the numbers to be 100%, I'm pretty sure that taken in total, there was far more slavetrading & far more massacres/oppression commited under the USA flag than under the CSA flag. Bad things have happened in the past, get over it.

All of us have only two things to remember:

1) Only whites are racists.

2) Whites are not allowed to be offended.



Also, the poor black girl's tales of woe make no mention of the Confederate battle flag being present at any of her injustices.    Unless I missed it...

Flag of the Swamp Angles Camp #2029 SCV
Liberty County, Texas

Quoted: Quoted: Save your Confederate money boys....the South will rise surrender again. Fixed that for ya In a way the south has risen again, the crappy taxes and insurance rates for businesses in the northeast (plus air conditioning!) has drawn a lot of guys to the south from up here to work

Perhaps more than you think. Already the south has given you NY'ers bill and hillary, you don't think more than a few good ol' boys are laughing there asses off at you for that?

Quoted: img.photobucket.com/albums/v78/ladyrt007/finalswamp00.jpg Flag of the Swamp Angles Camp #2029 SCV Liberty County, Texas

Is that an actual historical flag?  I'm asking because I've never seen it and I've seen representations of most (I had thought all. ) historical Texas flags.

Quoted: Quoted: Save your Confederate money boys....the South will rise surrender again. Fixed that for ya No, fixed that for you In a way the south has risen again, the crappy taxes and insurance rates for businesses in the northeast (plus air conditioning!) has drawn a lot of guys to the south from up here to work

Do you want to know the difference between a yankee and a damn yankee?  

A yankee only comes down South to vacation in a nicer place than they live;
A damn yankee comes to stay!

ANYTHING for black people to feel special and stand out. They dont want to be equal or treated the same.
They MUST keep the hatred alive at all costs. If they are equal or the same they are just another nameless face in the crowd and they cant have that.  

Think about what the blacks have to lose if they are equal. ALL those special intrest groups. AL sharpton, Jesse jackson, NAACP, national black cacus, black history month.....etc...etc the list goes on and on and on.

THE HATRED MUST LIVE ON FOR THEM TO FEEL SPECIAL. The black man has doomed himself for eternity.

Quoted: Sometimes I wish the south would rise again!

Not as long as WWF/NASCAR has 34 races a year!

Quoted: ANYTHING for black people to feel special and stand out. They dont want to be equal or treated the same. They MUST keep the hatred alive at all costs. If they are equal or the same they are just another nameless face in the crowd and they cant have that.   Think about what the blacks have to lose if they are equal. ALL those special intrest groups. AL sharpton, Jesse jackson, NAACP, national black cacus, black history month.....etc...etc the list goes on and on and on. THE HATRED MUST LIVE ON FOR THEM TO FEEL SPECIAL. The black man has doomed himself for eternity.

I totally agree. They shoot themsleves in the foot and don't even know it....

Now this is from a Floirda boy at heart.

I thought it was a sad day when georgia change their flag to the solid blue peice of wammy that they have now because of this s**T.

Let people display what they want to display.  Remember when all of the brothers had the crowns on their dashbroards or rear windows?

and who has seen the cow bells and bull's balls hangind under the rear bumppers(sp) latly?

Rant off,

Badredfish

Quoted: ...AL sharpton, Jesse jackson, NAACP, national black cacus, black history month.....etc...etc the list goes on and on and on.

I truly believe that the above mentioned people/entities cause more racism than they prevent or end.  People who might be on the fence about blacks might eventually get sick and tired of their rhetoric and become racists.  

Quoted: Quoted: ...AL sharpton, Jesse jackson, NAACP, national black cacus, black history month.....etc...etc the list goes on and on and on. I truly believe that the above mentioned people/entities cause more racism than they prevent or end.  People who might be on the fence about blacks might eventually get sick and tired of their rhetoric and become racists.

Truer words haven't been spoken in a long time.

By all means.. fly the flag of whatever defeated army you want

Yankee by birth, Copperhead by choice here.

History folks, history.

If you believe the origins of the "Civil War" or the "War of Northern Agression" had to do with racism or slavery, you must have been educated in a public school north of the Mason-Dixon line, or asleep during the lecture.

On July 4th, I don't fly "Old Glory", though I defer at all other times.  Instead, I fly the "Stars and Bars", as it truly represents the principals our Founding Father's believed in.

For the Yankees, trash, and ignorant, the flag of the Army of Northern Virginia or the Navy jack  (the Confederate flags previously previously depicted) is NOT the "Stars and Bars", this is:



As far as not liking racist symbols, I don't.  I drop every penny I can in the little tray at the check out counter.

Well good for you .  said the donut maker ! .......Lot's of good fellas died under Lee's command . Lee was as patriotic as any Man that ever lived . The Civil War was over Money ...........Do ya find that hard to believe ?

Quoted: Quoted: ...AL sharpton, Jesse jackson, NAACP, national black cacus, black history month.....etc...etc the list goes on and on and on. I truly believe that the above mentioned people/entities cause more racism than they prevent or end.  People who might be on the fence about blacks might eventually get sick and tired of their rhetoric and become racists.

EXACTLY my point.

interesting responses, some of them make me believe the posters ARE racist.

Personally I have no problem with displaying the confederate flag, but I also understand why someone who does would be suspected of racism.

If you fly a rainbow colored flag at your house I'll assume your gay.
If you fly a nazi flag over your house I'll assume your a nazi.

The simple fact is that the Confederate flag has been coopted by a fringe element of racist hate mongers and if you choose to fly it you risk being lumped in with them.

The "its my heritage" defense is also used by the racist assholes who sully that flag by flying it.

Its my heritage as well, but I choose not to fly that flag because its divisive and the last thing we need in this day and age is increasing racial tension.  

Quoted: EXACTLY my point.

Living in Kalifornia, I just gave up on the notion of flying the Start and Bars proudly and hang this nice alternative on Flag days, and whenever the notion strikes:

Quoted: interesting responses, some of them make me believe the posters ARE racist. Personally I have no problem with displaying the confederate flag, but I also understand why someone who does would be suspected of racism. If you fly a rainbow colored flag at your house I'll assume your gay. If you fly a nazi flag over your house I'll assume your a nazi. The simple fact is that the Confederate flag has been coopted by a fringe element of racist hate mongers and if you choose to fly it you risk being lumped in with them. The "its my heritage" defense is also used by the racist assholes who sully that flag by flying it. Its my heritage as well, but I choose not to fly that flag because its divisive and the last thing we need in this day and age is increasing racial tension.

A yankee speaking here.

Although it may be true that flying a Confederate flag may lump you in with people that are racist in some peoples eyes,, that doesnt mean that anyone should stop flying it. That's like saying that you should'nt put an NRA sticker on your car because the DEMS will lump you in with psycho's and criminals.[%

We preach that we need more education in the public eye as far as firearms go, and that is true. We also need to do that with the history of this country. But hiding in a corner based on what other s might SAY or THINK, will only lead to further division, not harmony.

Be who you are, not what you think others want you to be!

Quoted: Sometimes I wish the south would rise again!

I also wish it would also,,and there just might be more well North Sates to fly it ,,my family fought on both sides , We maintain property in Virginia,are Rossers on my Mom's side you know the Cavalry genious who even the Soviets studied and a my Daddy's side actually had a C.O that fought against said Rosser once,,the out come was in favor of the Federals,,,,not the Cavalry's fault,,My Uncle is a member of The Son's of the Confederation in Va. I fly the Confederate flag the USMC and American flag at equal heights on my front lawn,,,,gotta tell ya,,in 91 I was pulled over on my way to a beach dive in far rockaway (101) 2 black P.o.'s saw my Conferate flag on my truck, pulled me over,,,said they liked my flag,,they were full of it,,asked for my shield,,wich contrary to their's was gold, I gave them a quick lesson in history.....and sent sent their asses on their way..................