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Posted: 8/23/2004 10:35:45 AM EDT
[#1]
Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't.
I disagree that the ads should be stopped. You mean people shouldn't be able to air their opinions on candidates for public office? |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 10:36:22 AM EDT
[#2]
This is good. Now when the attacks continue (as they have already said they will not stop even if Bush asks them too), Kerry will have to deal with the attackers straight up. He won't have Bush to blame it on this time. And if he does that, well, that will show the voters one more time what a whiny crying baby fuck he really is.
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Posted: 8/23/2004 10:40:13 AM EDT
[#3]
Too bad the republican party can't get a candidate that will tell the democrats to go to hell.
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Posted: 8/23/2004 10:40:56 AM EDT
[#4]
It's also good thing because the Swift Vets are having their stories torn to shreds. For example the Swift Vet who got a Bronze Star had his request for the award also say there was enemy fire at the event he said there was no enemy fire. Whether there was or wasn't isn't the point but this guy acts like he didn't know what the paperwork for the bronze star said when he was called on the discrepancy. They lose a ton of credibility with mistakes like that. So seperating GW from this group is a good thing.
But they have served their purpose. They forced the Kerry campaign to use part of their limited budget between now and November to respond to the ads. |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 10:45:49 AM EDT
[#5]
apnews.myway.com/article/20040823/D84L30100.html
Why does this statement disturb me so much? Who the fuck should be able to tell ANYONE how to express their political opinion (as long as it's non-violent)? This is BULLSHIT. "...bad for the system"? What the fuck is bad for the system when people can organize and speak out? If it's slander or libel then there are laws in place to handle that, you don't shut people up in this country because of what they have to say. This whole thing is VERY disturbing to me. 
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Posted: 8/23/2004 10:47:06 AM EDT
[#6]
Bush Denounces Ads by Outside Groups
this is the appropriate title. You missed the point....It is not the SwiftVets only that he denounced...he called an end to all independent (527) ads. O'Niel has already said that if Bush called on him to stop advertising that he (O'Niel) would not stop. This is a no lose situation for Bush because Soros and MoveOn.org has spent 62 million on these ads and KerryCo has not wispered a peep of desent until SwiftVets spent a measly 500k. Kerry is a hypocrite and a whiner. |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 10:51:19 AM EDT
[#7]
It is bad for the system in the sense that ONLY 527 groups can run political advertising within 60 days of an election. Groups that are not organized under 527 may NOT run any ads what so ever. Groups such as the NRA, GOA and even the VPC may not run any ads. I think the whole thing is bullshit, but if MoveOn.org can run an ad, so should the NRA.... I also like how they are trying to link Swift Vets to Bush by saying they have some common financial donors. Yeah, I bet MoveOn.org doesn't have ANY Kerry supporters sending them money. Oh puh-leeeeze.... |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 10:51:44 AM EDT
[#8]
I saw Bush say he "Condems" all these smear advts...Now the Dem's won't accept his condemation. Monomanical assholes that they are. They just dont get it.
It's the senate testimony that he gave that is the real issue...his medal lies just led up to the lying testimony he gave. |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 10:52:31 AM EDT
[#9]
What he said! |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 10:53:27 AM EDT
[#10]
Exactly....it has to do with 527 orgs. Bomber |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 10:54:05 AM EDT
[#11]
The elitist boobs in washington can't have us lowly civilians exposing their lies. I posted here yesterday that Bush would do this.
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Posted: 8/23/2004 10:54:21 AM EDT
[#12]
+1  |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 10:55:46 AM EDT
[#13]
You are correct and sKerry will not condemn them.  ]BigDozer66 |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 10:56:26 AM EDT
[#14]
yep i agree. money well spent. now kerry will look like even more of a hippocrate if the moveon.org tools continue to air ads. |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 10:56:48 AM EDT
[#15]
Exactly what is the definition of a 527???
lemme guess....arfcom has an answer in <5 minutes....Hell it is Monday morning afterall...... |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 10:56:59 AM EDT
[#16]
Thanks Scollins for the clarification.
Goddamned McCain-Finegold act is the worst abomination that has been foisted on the country in decades.  When the world looks back at the smoking ruin that the United States has become I think that this law will be marked as one of the turning points. The fact that SCOTUS ruled that free speech under the First Amendment can be limited if it's in the greater interest of the government to do so.  
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Posted: 8/23/2004 10:57:57 AM EDT
[#17]
Swire, The only problem with your statement is that the guy never requested the award. It was given based on the after action reports (or some kind of report), and the group claims Kerry filled out the reports. None of this will ever get any clear answers, but that was his argument (Thurlow I believe it was; I'm getting them all mixed). |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:10:22 AM EDT
[#18]
Yep, it's as bad as the AWB in my opinion. And to use some of the words of our adversaries..... Close the 527 loophole! |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:10:40 AM EDT
[#19]
I can't believe that any of you idiots support a President that will tell vetrans, who fought for their country that they cannot excercise their first amendment rights! McCain-Feingold is unconstitutional, and I do not care if SCOTUS says otherwise!
The swifties fought, bled and died for this nation, and now an American President has told them that they should stop expressing their opinion of a cantidate for the presidency! I think that Bush should shut the fuck up this time! He didn't go to Vietnam, he didn't fight for his country, and neither Bush nor Kerry have any right whatsoever to tell American hero's and vetrans to pull an ad! BTW...I don't care if this is a political ploy that is actually advantageous for Bush, I don't care if he is just mugging for the cameras, I don't care! Bush voiced support for renewing the AWB, now he is voicing support for silencing combat vetrans! When is President Bush going to start voicing support for his base! When does Bush start vocalizing support for the people who put him in office! This may be the final nail in Bush's coffin for me! He may have just driven me to vote 3rd party!
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:14:39 AM EDT
[#20]
Is Kerry still running the ads that blame Nixon for what LBJ did?
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:15:42 AM EDT
[#21]
George Soros spent millions to help pass the soft money reform, all the while knowing that he had a loophole. He setup moveon.org and dumped some 10's of millions into the group, which in turn rewards startup 527s with a few million each. It was just reported that the RNC has spent $200M and the DNC $180M, but then factor in the additional $60-80M that Soros is funneling through the 527s. |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:17:57 AM EDT
[#22]
HAH!
Bush & ROVE got them with the "rope a dope" again. Problem: Kerry's folks have MILLIONS in 527 dollars and have been outspending Bush like mad in that sector. Then Kerry has a problem with a 527 groups and asks Bush to condemn them. Bush says: "Hey, lets get rid of all the 527 ads. I hope my opponent will agree." In doing that, he forces the press to look to the Swifties when the ads continue (hard to prove colusion with Bush when they won't listen to Bush). PLUS, as an added bonus, Kerry is now in the position where he has to try and muzzle the 527's or he looks (or is) a hypocrite. |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:20:00 AM EDT
[#23]
I'm glad you see it that way. I see an American President that just told a group of combat vetrans to shut the fuck up!
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:20:31 AM EDT
[#24]
Last week a Swiftee rep was on H&C and was asked what they would do if Bush called on them to stop the ads.
He said it wouldn't make any difference because they aren't part of the Bush campaign, and they aren't doing it to promote Bush, they feel a duty to tell the truth about Kerry. |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:26:44 AM EDT
[#25]
Um, sKerry does not care if he looks like a hypocrite. He IS one so looking like it is no big deal. Every time he gets caught he just weaves more lies to try and get out of it.
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:31:26 AM EDT
[#26]
+3 (or is it +4?) Bush can now reasonably suggest that Kerry denounce moveon.org ads!! An even more important benefit is that Kerry will look like a hypocrite when he tries to bring up GWB’s military service (say in the debates). Kerry plain and simply walked into this one. This is a brilliant move, IMHO. |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:32:13 AM EDT
[#27]
Kerry denounced the latest moveon.org ad the day that it came out! |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:35:32 AM EDT
[#28]
Well actually Dick Cheney did already. If more Republican lawmakers exposed the democrats for the whiney pussies they are I think more people with R's after their names would be elected. |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:40:11 AM EDT
[#29]
+1
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:41:41 AM EDT
[#30]
I agree, it's good for Bush to separate himself from them. But I think they should push on. In regards to the guy that also got the Bronze Star that said there wasn't any enemy fire, you have to ask yourself, "Who wrote the report up?" Answer? John Kerry. Everyone else said there wasn't enemy fire. There was gun fire going on, but it was from the swift boats after the #3 boat hit a mine. They all opened up on the river banks just in case they were about to get ambushed. Well, all of them except Kerry's boat. He pushed the throttle to full ahead, turned, throwing the guy out of the boat that he so herorically went back and rescued. If hadn't ran the guy never would have ended up in the water! ETA: Have you ever recieved a medal? I've gotten a couple and when they read the citation, several months after it had been writen, while presenting it to me, I was thinking, "Damn! What a load of b.s.!!!" But what are you to do? You just take the damn medal and shut up because someone else thought you deserved it and it getts you points for your next promotion. I'm not saying that I didn't deserve the medal, but the way they wrote it up made it sound like I was able to walk on water. Ask Paul about his Navy Retirement.  |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:42:29 AM EDT
[#31]
I see this also.
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:44:21 AM EDT
[#32]
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:51:10 AM EDT
[#33]
Politics my boy, politics. ...and if you vote 3rd party, who will it be? The Constitution Party? I doubt they will even be on the ballot in your state. I know they aren't here in GA. The Libertarian Party? Their candidate is more or less right along the lines of Kerry when it comes to the War on Terror. I've come to the realization that right now, in this particular day and time, I'm going to have to hold my nose and vote for Bush. Let's get this thing over with and work on getting that 3rd party a legitimate base by getting them into Congress and state level offices like the Libertarians are doing, then worry about voting 3rd party for POTUS. ...doubt I'll ever see that day though. |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:58:55 AM EDT
[#34]
Oh, bet you a couple of things here. Just like Kerry is denouncing moveon.org ads he's probably saying "Keep it up!" behind the scene and Bush is probably doing the same thing with the SwiftBoat Vet ads.
And I bet Bush wishes he never signed that "unconstitutional" bill in to law now. |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:59:42 AM EDT
[#35]
I guess I missed that. So – did they stop?? |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 11:59:56 AM EDT
[#36]
How far do I have to go with Bush before enough is enough? He's already: - Given $15 Billion dollars of OUR money to fight AIDS in sub-saharan Africa - Given $500 Tax refunds to people who didn't pay taxes to apease the left - Committed to re-authorizing the 1994 AWB if it makes it to his desk - Signed into law the McCain-Feingold act to silence groups like the NRA which are responsible for putting him in office! - Created a $45 Billion dollar prescription drug entitlement program - Promised that Iraq would pay for the cost of the war, and then forced congress to make the entire $150 Billion dollar expenditure a give away - Opened the door for more aliens to enter this country, while we are at war and Americans are forced to sacrifice their privacy rights Now he is telling combat vetrans that they should stop expressing their opinions. How much am I supposed to take? How long do I have to stay loyal to a President that does not represent the values that I hold? |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 12:04:58 PM EDT
[#37]
I don't think so. |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 12:05:16 PM EDT
[#38]
Excellent point. Bravo. |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 12:19:46 PM EDT
[#39]
Fear not. They'll have to push on. Otherwise it will look like they're taking orders from Bush Campaign HQ, which is exactly what the Libs are accusing them of now. 
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Posted: 8/23/2004 12:21:53 PM EDT
[#40]
And sKerry is a better representative of your values? Would he be a better choice for POTUS? I don't think so.... |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 12:24:09 PM EDT
[#41]
It's becoming a jog to Socialism and Totalitarianism with Bush and a sprint to Socialism and Totalitarianism with Kerry.
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Posted: 8/23/2004 12:28:45 PM EDT
[#42]
smart politics as usual from the President's campaign. all along Bush has been outspoken against 527's
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Posted: 8/23/2004 12:33:06 PM EDT
[#43]
Then you would appear to have a comprehension poblem. He said 527 Orgs were bad for the process. And they are. That was a backhanded way of saying that the M-F bill was bad. ------ Also, wrt: the Thurlow "hypocrisy", he's stated that the award was given to him based on write-ups and AAR's he never saw and his medal was given to him after he separated. |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 12:35:05 PM EDT
[#44]
Yeah, McCain-Feingold was so bad that he had to sign it into law, and then brag about signing it into law when he told the swifties to pull their add! 
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Posted: 8/23/2004 12:38:45 PM EDT
[#45]
Agree with every thing you've sighted above. My only deciding factor right now though is, who's better at keeping this country safe from Islamic extremist. As sad as it is, Bush is the only choice right now because I sure as hell don't want Kerry in charge right now...or ever for that matter. |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 12:42:12 PM EDT
[#46]
You're right about protecting this country from Islamics, Bush is the only man in this race for the job. I just wonder how much of this country is going to be left when he's through!
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Posted: 8/23/2004 12:43:57 PM EDT
[#47]
These veterans are going to great lengths, and taking enormous abuse, trying to warn this country about John Kerry. They’re doing this since they want Kerry stopped!! The best way to support them, in my view at least, is to help them accomplish that goal!! I really don’t care too much for Bush myself. But I absolutely want to see Kerry stopped, and I almost don’t care who does it. Frankly, if this contest were solely between Kerry and Hillary, I’d vote for Hillary!!  |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 12:44:54 PM EDT
[#48]
Maybe you guys should read what he actually said instead of just the headline. ... no? ummm ok. |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 12:51:30 PM EDT
[#49]
I know the feeling. However, for the next four years with Bush, the best thing you can do is stay in contact with your Representative. That's the only way we citizens can keep the POTUS in check. |
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Posted: 8/23/2004 12:56:36 PM EDT
[#50]
Bush is not telling the SBVT's to STFU, he is telling Kerry to STFU. Basically saying to JFK to cut off his own biggest support group if he thinks that 527's are bad. It's a put up or shut up move.
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