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Posted: 5/29/2001 2:39:10 PM EDT
[#1]
Very Possible!
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Posted: 5/29/2001 2:40:18 PM EDT
[#2]
The Air Force I believe ordered theirs w/o forward assists and some of the carbon ones are that way to reduce machining time.
Some believe the forward assist should never be used. I myself use it every now and then. Hope I helped a little. |
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Posted: 5/29/2001 2:40:57 PM EDT
[#3]
The original 1960's AR's didn't have a forward assist. It was added later along with a few other things like a chromed bore to help improve reliability.
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Posted: 5/29/2001 2:40:59 PM EDT
[#4]
He may be right. The early AR15s and even very early M16s didn't have them. Teething problems with the M16 in Viet Nam brought about the change. I've never felt good about forcing a cartridge into the chamber that doesn't fit. In an extreme emergency, maybe. Not everyone feels that this is an actual improvement.
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Posted: 5/29/2001 2:41:20 PM EDT
[#5]
All early AR-15 models lacked a forward assist. It was only after the Army demanded it that it was added. Your neighbor's rifle is likely a Colt AR-15 SP-1 model.
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Posted: 5/29/2001 2:42:14 PM EDT
[#6]
Looks like Colt made lot's of variant w/out the forward assist.
Check out the chart at [url]http://www.biggerhammer.net/ar15/variants/[/url] |
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Posted: 5/29/2001 2:44:42 PM EDT
[#7]
Quoted: The Air Force I believe ordered theirs w/o forward assists and some of the carbon ones are that way to reduce machining time. Some believe the forward assist should never be used. I myself use it every now and then. Hope I helped a little. |
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Posted: 5/29/2001 2:48:11 PM EDT
[#8]
What exactly is a forward assist?
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Posted: 5/29/2001 2:50:50 PM EDT
[#9]
Originally Posted By Captain Obvious: What exactly is a forward assist? |
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Posted: 5/29/2001 3:10:29 PM EDT
[#10]
- Lock&Load -
Had two Colt AR's back in the late 70'ties ( 1 20" - 1 Car 15 ) ( I think they are now referred to as SP1's ) Don't know when Colt modified with FA. Many of them are still out there! - Captain Obvious - a forward assist is a small rod on the right side of the rifle which when pushed - makes sure the bolt is fully in battery - This device was developed by the Military to alleviate the problem of dirty rifles / bad ammo - causing jams during the Nam . |
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Posted: 5/29/2001 3:13:19 PM EDT
[#11]
Thanks, guys! I checked out the link from Fight4yourrights and the guy said that was the one his father has.
I had forgotten that Duncan Long mentioned in the AR-15/M16 Sourcebook that the Air Force didn't want the forward assist. I referred to page #23. |
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Posted: 5/29/2001 3:32:15 PM EDT
[#12]
Colt was still building AR-15 A2 Sporter II's in 1984 without a FA.
Has anyone ever used a forward assist? |
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Posted: 5/29/2001 3:43:50 PM EDT
[#13]
Captain Obvious: What exactly is a forward assist? [img]http://www.usgunparts.com/a2upprec.jpg[/img] It's a solution in search of an anticipated problem. # 22, along with the lump on the rear starboard side of the receiver. Unlike pistols where you just push the slide forward, or auto rifles with a bolt handle (Mini-14, M-1 Garand, AKs, etc.) AR/M16 "slab sides" didn't have any way to force the bolt forward in case it doesn't go into full battery. Kinda like a spare tire (& you need it about as often). If you ever DO need it, it's time to inspect (probably clean) your damned rifle. It's just there for combat emergencies, & to make someone in the 60s more "comfortable" with the rifle in V.N. conditions. Like the port cover, it really doesn't need to be there at all. |
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Posted: 5/29/2001 3:52:26 PM EDT
[#14]
rkbar15: Has anyone ever used a forward assist? I don't think I have, not for what they were made for anyway. Sometimes I use them on brand new rifles, just to make sure the bolt's locked all the way. That doesn't make much sense, but I'd bet most of us do that? |
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Posted: 5/29/2001 3:55:00 PM EDT
[#15]
Quoted: rkbar15: Has anyone ever used a forward assist? I don't think I have, not for what they were made for anyway. Sometimes I use them on brand new rifles, just to make sure the bolt's locked all the way. That doesn't make much sense, but I'd bet most of us do that? |
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Posted: 5/29/2001 4:38:27 PM EDT
[#16]
My SP1 was a flatside, it had no forward assist.
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Posted: 5/29/2001 5:32:09 PM EDT
[#17]
I was confused the first time I saw a forward assist. All of the ARs I ever used were slicksides. I had to ask the guy in the gun store what it was for.
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Posted: 5/29/2001 5:38:34 PM EDT
[#18]
AR-10s, both the new ones and the originals, do not have forward assists either.
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Posted: 5/30/2001 3:03:50 AM EDT
[#19]
What is a mini 15?
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Posted: 5/30/2001 3:31:58 AM EDT
[#20]
Sounds like a Mini-14 plus one more? [:)]
I first picked up a black rifle in '66 in the Air Force. The first M-16s (actual designation "M-16") had no forward assist in any of the services. When the M-16A1 came out it had that funny growth on the side. The AF instructors at the time ('69?) told us it was for forcing a dirty cartridge to chamber on the idea that the rifle would fire & extract anything that was fully chambered. Being younger & dumber, I believed them. Since then, I've learned that jamming anything is a recipe for disaster. If a cartridge won't chamber under normal bolt action, extract it immediately as it will only get stuck harder. It will never fully chamber and you'll just make a jammed up mess to pound apart later. Norm |
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Posted: 5/30/2001 9:09:09 AM EDT
[#21]
cpermd: What is a mini 15? ---------------------------------------------------------- Norm G: Sounds like a Mini-14 plus one more? Huh? What are you two talking about? [;D] |
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Posted: 5/30/2001 9:17:09 AM EDT
[#22]
The forward assist allows you to close the bolt if it gets stuck out of battery. Otherwise you need to pull back the charging handle or take the gun apart.
I've used the assist just to check that the gun is in battery when I'm shooting single loaded rounds off a bench. The other item this gun probably lacks is the hump behind the ejection port that keeps the brass out of the face of the southpaws. Stoner specified a chromed barrel in the original design. The Dept. of Defense decided the gun didn't need one. Wrong! Forward assist came about around the same time as the chrome barrel issue. The guns were jamming up in combat -- because the barrel wasn't chromed, and also because the contractor for ammo used powder that fouled badly and caused the gun to jam. I love it when contractors skimp on defense items in order to line their pocket [-!-] |
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Posted: 5/30/2001 9:17:56 AM EDT
[#23]
If you want to ease the bolt carrier forward without making the distinctive chambering sound, sometimes you need the forward assist to ensure complete locking.
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Posted: 5/30/2001 9:22:15 AM EDT
[#24]
I have a Colt upper with neither forward assist nor brass deflector.
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Posted: 5/30/2001 9:44:28 AM EDT
[#25]
Two good reasons to use your forward assist:
1) If curriosity gets the better of you and you press check your AR/M16 you can make sure the bolt locks back up with GENTLE pressure on FA. 2) If you need to silently chamber a round from a mag. You can slowly ride the charging handle forward (otherwise a poor manipulation) to strip a round from the mag and use the FA to actually chamber the round. With practice this can be done with no noise. Hunter out... |
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Posted: 5/30/2001 10:03:53 AM EDT
[#26]
I was told that the forward assist was added because if the .22 caliber M16 was submerged in water, the water did not drain from the barrel due to the small bore size. This had not been a problem with .30 caliber weapons. I certainly wouldn't want to fire a round in an obstructed barrel!
So, once you took a dunking with your M16 (with round chambered), you needed to pull the charging handle back enough to let a little air through the chamber to let the water drain out, but not enough to eject the round. As many of you know, if you let the charging handle go at this point, the bolt will not go into battery because of the lack of momentum. Hence the addition of the forward assist. Anybody else hear this somewhere along the line? Jeff |
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Posted: 5/30/2001 10:26:02 AM EDT
[#27]
I've never heard the water story, although the FA certainly serves in that regard. It was aded due to trouble chambering dirty ammo, or for when the chamnber/bolt/bolt carrier are dirty. I used mine this Friday past. Russian ammo started jamming.
Remember that America's greatet fighting rifle, the mighty M-1, has a built in forward assist, and I've used it a few times, too. Tim |
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