If it's going to be so bad, why aren't we:

1.  Going to a 4-day 10-hour work-week for the summer?

2.  Closing retail establishments one day a week, say Sunday?

3.  Turning off thousands of little white lights making the Bay Bridge pretty?

4.  Turning off those exterior aesthetic lights on high-rise office buildings?

5.  Pushing water conservation more, to conserve it for hydroelectric reserves?


[/soapbox]


[red]PRK

What's missing...Intelligence and reason. And to all the Republicans and conservatives in Kalifornia, and you do number many, why don't you have the GUTS to stand up and unite against the pondscum running thiangs?

Did you guys hear the sound bites from Governor Davis the other day?

He was responding to President Bush's energy report from the previous day.  The governor was critical of Bush for not implementing some type of price controls in order to help his state.  He also implored Bush to get with his "friends" in the energy business and tell them to stop making large profits.

I have a couple of questions:

Why should the government be involved in price-fixing a freely-traded commodity?  Didn't price controls cause the Kali energy crisis to begin with?

Why do people see that the prices of everything else rises,(groceries, real estate, wages, durable goods, etc.) but the price of energy should always remain the same?  Why do Americans feel that they're entitled to $1.00/gallon gasoline.

I'm certainly not advocating expensive energy, but when everything else changes, why should energy remain the same?

This so-called 'power shortage' reminds me of the gas lines of the 70's. Do you honestly believe that this is a surprise??  Or is it a managed crisis a la Hegel?  (thesis, antithesis, synthesis) This whole thing is a stage managed cluster-f**k.  What do you think will happen in July and August, when blackouts are widespread?  Riots, looting, etc..  See how it works?  What new 'laws' will be passed further curtailing your rights?  

kingcleophus,
  You are preaching to the choir my friend. But when you say stand up and unite, do you mean vote the idiots out? We are trying to do just that.


  This "power crisis" just may be the issue that seals the governors fate.

operator error, I mean just that, and to regularly verbally abuse them to as many people as possible, in any appropriate venue of discussion, debate, or demonstration. Dedicate as much free time to a cause of counter abuse. The socialists demonstrate in a most nasty fashion---reverse their abuse, most vividly. Fight, charge, win. They are the ENEMY.

Missing?-power plants thanks eco nazis and democraps

All this crap started with Jerry Brown and continued through Wilson, Duke, and now Davis. These guys would not stand up to the environmentalists, or to NIMBY CA homeowners, and the result is what we're seeing today.

Davis blames Bush for not offering price controls and CA Republicans for not supporting his price control measures. The PUC blames wholesalers for over-charging. The Democrats in the legislature blame Republicans.

The fact of the matter is we left ourselves open to get screwed by depending on out-of-state suppliers. Had we built new power plants all along, I doubt we would be in this situation today.

I blame the politicians for listening to the tree huggers and NIMBY CA homeowners.

I blame the environmentalists for promoting anti-growth and anti-infrastructure measurers, yet ignoring the issue of immigration, which they cannot stop. They don't even address it.

I blame NIMBY CA homeowners for basing everything they do on how it will affect their home value.

I blame CA Democrats for basing everything they do on how it affects the Spotted Owl or pet, feel-good programs.

As the Greeks say, "Don't walk bare ass among the ass fu*kers".

It looks like we all have our asses in the air these days and it's our own damn fault.

Get rid of the treehuggers and built some power plants before it's too late.

My take on this problem is that the Democrats are in control of the Calif. legislature for the past 15 years or so, those folks have no concept of how complicated the electrical system is.  Their attitude is, "if we make a mistake, we'll make adjustments later." BUT this is like changing the rules in the middle of the game, and it will have great ramifications.

Up until the power crisis, Gov Davis' stay in office has been a walk in the park, now he has to really work, and is hoping the Feds would cap wholesale electrical prices in the short term because it will probably cause him to cut some of the Democrats favorite welfare programs.  Some of the democrats maybe looking for a new job in 2 years.

6. Make starbucks operate on a 50% on 50% off daily schedule. Hell, I take that back,  make starbucks run completely off their own generators.

7. Make all goatee heads either shave off their stupid facial hair or dress up like the person they are trying to idolize: Colonel Sanders.

None of these would do any good, since they wouldn't reduce demand across the board.  Instead, they'd just push peak-load times around a little (#1), do nothing for reducing peak load (#3, #4), shift demand (#2), and do basically nothing in California (#5).

Peak load happens in afternoon and evening, when temperatures are high and people are using power both at home and in offices.  Turning off lights at night reduces power consumption at night, but you can't save it for the next afternoon -- it doesn't work that way. . . .

California's problem is a perfect example of what happens when tree huggers have too much influence.  No new power plants of any kind in ages.  They make stupid statements about nuclear power plants because that renowned nuclear physicist Jane Fonda made a movie about it and told them what would happen.  Nuke plants are the most non polluting forms of energy and the plants are safe.  Look at the Navy.  Carriers and subs using nuke power plants with no problems.  The greenies are always pushing alternive power sources but have no feasible answers.

Then you have people who say they don't want power lines anywhere near their homes, but they do want the energy.  Another legacy of the Clinton era, I want something for nothing.

Ok, I'm gonna offer up a personal opinion here:

I believe that this power shortage will actually, in time, be a good thing for California.  Why?  Because California politicians are going to be forced to re-think how they've been doing things.  In the next ten years, California MUST build new power plants.  If the politicians in power don't see that, they are bound to be replaced by some that do.  Either way, the political landscape is due for a serious change in fundamental thinking.

(As a side note:  Fear has a great way of causing people to see reality, and right now I bet there are some seriously scared politicians in California)

I don't want to sound like an enviro-nazi, but it seems to me that everyone seems to ignore the conservation issue.  People need to use less,  if there's a shortage of power, don't turn on your air conditioner.  People seem to think that money will pay for everything, even with prices sky rocketing, if the energy isn't there, [i]it's just not there[/i], and no amount of money will change that.  Who here leaves their computer on, even when they're away from it for most of the day?  Who leaves lights on in empty rooms?  People seem to ignore these common sense things.

As far as gas prices being so high, I don't think it's a bad thing.  There is a limited amount of fossil fuel in this world, and I'd like to make sure it lasts.  I want to be able to drive my car when I want to, I also want medial/fire help to have motors that get them to me quick, that don't require charging their batteries.

I happen to support public transit, the less money I spend on gas commuting, the more I can spend on driving for fun.  Unfortunately it seems most people won't give up the daily commuting grind unless there is some incentive, and it seems to take $3 a gallon gas prices to get the point across.

Sorry for ranting.

I think people are already conserving pretty good where I am.  At work, half the lights are out, people use the stairs instead of the elevator if they are only going 1 floor, and they shut down some of the less critical servers.  My neighbors turn off unused appliances while they are at work, and are pretty thrifty with the AC.  

I honestly don't think we can conserve our way out of this mess.  

If you're talking about the rate freeze, that was put in place because of fears that the "free market" experiment would backfire, as it seems to have done.  It seems the textbook market efficiency is tainted by some questionable practices by suppliers that - guess what - preceded spikes in market prices

[url]http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2001/05/19/MN27574.DTL[/url]

I agree that we should be conserving as much as possible and build more plants.

It does tee me off to see the gas prices going up so much.  I ride my bike to work and when that's not possible, I'm on mass transit.  My driving is about 1/4 what it used to be.  But when I want to head to the mountains, the cheapest I can get is $2.09 a gallon.  Not going to the mountains much anymore.   Guess what?  Refineries have been off-line during critical periods.  Seems like they are breaking down more than they used to.  Is there a pattern here?

[red]PRK

Capro- People in California conserve more than almost any other state per capita.  There are just a hell of a lot of people here and more every day.  The problem is the lack of a free market.  If there is a shortage, it raises prices and compells conservation, but supply is always met at some price level.  Plus, electricity isn't some sort of energy that is conserved.  It isn't stored in batteries when not in use.  It is constantly flowing, which is why conservation is mostly important during peak periods.  If it could be stored that wouldn't be an issue.

There are plenty of fossil fuels in the world. Sure we will eventually run out but it will be after your lifetime, and by that time some other technology will be in place.  Everyone is bitching about drilling in Alaska.  A buddy of mine, who works for the EPA, says that where they would be drilling is not beautifull wilderness but basically arctic wasteland. And the problem with California is that all our supply of gas must come from Cali refineries (so we can add cancer causing agents that get into the water supply), so when one goes down it can have a great influence on supply.  If we were able to buy the "dirty" gas like other states our prices would be much cheaper.

The reason people don't use public transportation is that it sucks.  It is expensive, crowded, doesn't get you where you want to go, and is slow.  Luckily I don't have to commute far now but when I did it was all on the motorbike.  Cheap, easy to park, gets me where I want to go quickly.  Public transit is for sucks.

Free economy is the best way to allocate resources.  The govt. messing with that is what got us in the problems we have now.

The current demo-socialists, for the last 20 year, have had the selfish "me me" attitude.  Pass useless bills to only promote your name, and no long term goals.

The news was jumping on Davis, for ragging on Bush for not doing the quick fix price regulating.  NY had a similar power problem a year ago and they built some small generator plants to remedy the situation.

Poor Davis, like the other socialists, shoot from the hip rather than thinking.

treehuggers hate them selves and the human race... to wit...treehuggers thinking=if beaver build a dam its nature and beaver is expanding. if man builds a dam its man destroying nature. the beaver dosnt care if the tree it just used was the last of its kind.....

6. State-wide siesta from 12:00 - 4:00 PM.

As for patterns, the one I've noticed is that socialist governors seem to attract nicknames. First, it was "Moonbeam" Brown. Now it's "Black-out" Davis.

You want to know what's missing?  Summary execution for all Democrats and eco-terrorists in this state.