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Posted: 5/2/2017 12:59:29 AM EDT
[#1]
Which 1911 should I buy?
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Posted: 5/2/2017 1:01:58 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
“At the time of my initial statement to the media, I was ill-informed of the ramifications of this bill and its detrimental effects to the Second Amendment, which I have personally fought to protect my entire life. I can tell you now, we at Springfield Armory are unequivocally 100 percent against this bill and will continue to work with the NRA and others to ensure that it is defeated,” said Dennis Reese, Chief Executive Officer, Springfield Armory. OK, then why was the 'review' section of FB shut down on Saturday and statement released at 5:45 on Monday? |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 1:04:46 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
He probably found out how many orders have been canceled and is in OH SHIT mode trying to backpedal. You and RRA are the only fucking members of IFMA how the fuck do you not know what YOUR bought and paid for lobbyist is doing and why have you not shitcanned him? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
“At the time of my initial statement to the media, I was ill-informed of the ramifications of this bill and its detrimental effects to the Second Amendment, which I have personally fought to protect my entire life. I can tell you now, we at Springfield Armory are unequivocally 100 percent against this bill and will continue to work with the NRA and others to ensure that it is defeated,” said Dennis Reese, Chief Executive Officer, Springfield Armory. OK, then why was the 'review' section of FB shut down on Saturday and statement released at 5:45 on Monday? |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 1:06:51 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
https://www.opensecrets.org/527s/527cmtedetail_donors.php?ein=464628447&cycle=2016 $50,000 Rock River Arms Colona IL 05/31/2016 $50,000 Springfield Armory Geneseo IL 05/31/2016 $50,000 Rock River Arms Colona IL 06/05/2015 $50,000 Springfield Armory Geneseo IL 05/25/2015 Since 2014, both companies donated $50k annually into the IFMA and the best they can do is a damage control statement? What a load of crap. $150k from each company into the organization (to date) and they aren't aware of the organization's actions? Not buying it. |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 1:08:21 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
https://www.opensecrets.org/527s/527cmtedetail_donors.php?ein=464628447&cycle=2016 $50,000 Rock River Arms Colona IL 05/31/2016 $50,000 Springfield Armory Geneseo IL 05/31/2016 $50,000 Rock River Arms Colona IL 06/05/2015 $50,000 Springfield Armory Geneseo IL 05/25/2015 Since 2014, both companies donated $50k annually into the IFMA and the best they can do is a damage control statement? What a load of crap. $150k from each company into the organization (to date) and they aren't aware of the organization's actions? Not buying it. That kind of money isn't given out without caveats. |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 1:11:04 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
https://forms.irs.gov/app/pod/basicSearch/search?execution=e5s3&pacid=50494 https://forms.irs.gov/app/pod/basicSearch/search?_eventId_displayForm=true&formId=464628447-990POL-02&formtype=p990&execution=e5s3 Dennis Reese - Director Tom Reese - Director Jay Keller - Executive Director Chuck Larson - Director (edited to add: if the links stop working the IRS Employer Identification Number (EIN) is: #46-4628447, Illinois Firearms Manufacturers Association, Form 990 has listed key employees) Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I wonder how many people are employed at the lobbying firm. 1? 100k in donations doesn't seem like a lot. https://forms.irs.gov/app/pod/basicSearch/search?_eventId_displayForm=true&formId=464628447-990POL-02&formtype=p990&execution=e5s3 Dennis Reese - Director Tom Reese - Director Jay Keller - Executive Director Chuck Larson - Director (edited to add: if the links stop working the IRS Employer Identification Number (EIN) is: #46-4628447, Illinois Firearms Manufacturers Association, Form 990 has listed key employees) |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 1:11:21 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
https://forms.irs.gov/app/pod/basicSearch/search?execution=e5s3&pacid=50494 https://forms.irs.gov/app/pod/basicSearch/search?_eventId_displayForm=true&formId=464628447-990POL-02&formtype=p990&execution=e5s3 Dennis Reese - Director Tom Reese - Director Jay Keller - Executive Director Chuck Larson - Director (edited to add: if the links stop working the IRS Employer Identification Number (EIN) is: #46-4628447, Illinois Firearms Manufacturers Association, Form 990 has listed key employees) |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 1:14:03 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There you go.... Good work Evintos |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 1:21:55 AM EDT
[#9]
What scum bags. Should have known. Everything in that state is dirty...
Fuck you Springfield Armory |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 1:22:16 AM EDT
[#10]
I posted Envito's findings on SA's FB page and it was promptly deleted.
We should hit their page hard with the IRS info on IFMA. |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 1:25:02 AM EDT
[#11]
For posterity
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Posted: 5/2/2017 1:27:43 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I posted Envito's findings on SA's FB page and it was promptly deleted. We should hit their page hard with the IRS info on IFMA. |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 1:39:25 AM EDT
[#13]
Jay Keller email
[email protected] Has been a lobbyist in Illinois since 1989. Lobbyist for SA as early as 2008 http://edgarcountywatchdogs.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/2008-RFPs-Recieved.pdf |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 1:45:54 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes, outstanding Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
There you go.... Good work Evintos Very nice! When the NPO that was supposed to be leading the fight against the bill, turns out to be the lobbyist group for the owners of both involved companies, and the lobbyist for that organization is basically their direct employee, there is little doubt left about their motives (corporate exemption). The only other plausible explaination would be if Jay Keller threw them under the bus. If that's the case, then both companies should be pointing that out now, and then find out who paid him enough to cut his own proverbial throat. GUILTY |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 1:55:25 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote Historyweaponized autism woooo :)
This is the damning evidence for sure.... |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 4:24:54 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I agree, they are either really stupid in regards to their donations or liars. That kind of money isn't given out without caveats. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
https://www.opensecrets.org/527s/527cmtedetail_donors.php?ein=464628447&cycle=2016 $50,000 Rock River Arms Colona IL 05/31/2016 $50,000 Springfield Armory Geneseo IL 05/31/2016 $50,000 Rock River Arms Colona IL 06/05/2015 $50,000 Springfield Armory Geneseo IL 05/25/2015 Since 2014, both companies donated $50k annually into the IFMA and the best they can do is a damage control statement? What a load of crap. $150k from each company into the organization (to date) and they aren't aware of the organization's actions? Not buying it. That kind of money isn't given out without caveats. Also, I can easily see both companies having yearly donations setup to go out automatically to IFMA without giving it a second thought or really paying any attention to what that organization is up to. Lastly, lets not forget that the source that broke this over the weekend/last week is the same firearms blog that said you don't have to engrave a Form 1'd lower. http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2016/01/foghorn/do-you-need-to-engrave-your-form-1ed-sbr/ |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 5:19:43 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I like "“At the time of my initial statement to the media, I was ill-informed of the ramifications of this bill and its detrimental effects to the Second Amendment, which I have personally fought to protect my entire life. I can tell you now, we at Springfield Armory are unequivocally 100 percent against this bill and will continue to work with the NRA and others to ensure that it is defeated,” said Dennis Reese, Chief Executive Officer, Springfield Armory." I translate as "We got our exemption so while we still oppose it in theory we've thrown you guys overboard and we have a plan B. Fuck all of you." Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Statement from SA http://blog.springfield-armory.com/springfield-armory-statement-regarding-gun-dealer-licensing-act-sb1657 I translate as "We got our exemption so while we still oppose it in theory we've thrown you guys overboard and we have a plan B. Fuck all of you." |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 7:30:45 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Which 1911 should I buy? |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 7:48:16 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes Very nice! When the NPO that was supposed to be leading the fight against the bill, turns out to be the lobbyist group for the owners of both involved companies, and the lobbyist for that organization is basically their direct employee, there is little doubt left about their motives (corporate exemption). The only other plausible explaination would be if Jay Keller threw them under the bus. If that's the case, then both companies should be pointing that out now, and then find out who paid him enough to cut his own proverbial throat. GUILTY |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 8:34:56 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
50k is chump change to both SA and RRA. Also, I can easily see both companies having yearly donations setup to go out automatically to IFMA without giving it a second thought or really paying any attention to what that organization is up to. Lastly, lets not forget that the source that broke this over the weekend/last week is the same firearms blog that said you don't have to engrave a Form 1'd lower. http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2016/01/foghorn/do-you-need-to-engrave-your-form-1ed-sbr/ |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 8:40:04 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Which 1911 should I buy? |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 8:48:56 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They are exempt, but how do they expect to sell anything if the retailers are run out of business? Well, there are dealers in 49 other states... The B&M FFL's in IL have got to be flipping pissed. I wouldn't carry their products any more. And if I were a retailer sitting on a bunch of RRA or SA inventory I'd be sweating bullets right about now. |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 8:53:22 AM EDT
[#23]
AFAIK, IL Dems still have a supermajority in the house.
This bill WILL pass the IL House if Madigan wants it to. |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 8:56:20 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I wonder how many people are employed at the lobbying firm. 1? 100k in donations doesn't seem like a lot. ETA: I should have read down before replying. 
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Posted: 5/2/2017 9:10:30 AM EDT
[#25]
SA and RRA can back pedal all they want. They created this lobbying group. They give it little oversight. They don't want to accept fault.
Until they accept full responsibility for their actions and make this right, I'll never a use a new SA part in my M1A. Nor will I buy any new RRA part. If the bill is signed into law, I'll never use their brands(new/used) again. http://www.captainsjournal.com/2017/05/01/springfield-armory-rock-river-arms-and-the-illinois-firearms-manufacturers-association-licensing-scheme/ |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 9:14:09 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I read that there are 4. not sure if the info was accurate, but 2 are SA employees/owners 1 is RRA and the other is the lobbyist. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I wonder how many people are employed at the lobbying firm. 1? 100k in donations doesn't seem like a lot. So I would have been somewhat understanding if SA/RRA came right out and said oh holy shit, we got preoccupied and trusted our lobbyist who's apparently a drunk or going through a divorce or something and thought he was helping us, we're very sorry and that dude is so fired and we're doing this and this and that immediately to fight the legislation (although that would have been amazingly negligent). Alas, the response was slow and the vibe is weaselly. |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 9:20:07 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Dan Wesson Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Which 1911 should I buy? |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 9:26:27 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
When you know how deals are cut in IL. its makes this even more hilarious. ANY firearm related business has its finger on the pulse of firearm legislation in IL. so hard it hurts the artery. They have millions at risk, their entire livelihoods, their entire business's, the food for their kids table at risk in a state Legislature infamous for trying to sneak thru stupid gun Laws that at least gives the appearance they are doing something about crime in the violent crime capitol of the country. Which is Chicago and collar towns. Then you have Rockford and Joliet and others. To even think they didnt know what the Lobbying group they pay for was doing for two years, on a bill that so deeply affected them, after an agreement is negotiated that benefits them so greatly? is simply INSANE! You'd really have to be a moron to believe it. Not even the people in The Land of Linco...<suckers> would believe it.
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Posted: 5/2/2017 9:43:52 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So to believe what they have said in their press releases the lobby went off the reservation and took a course of action never discussed with either SA or RRA. That doesn't happen. Ever. |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 9:46:58 AM EDT
[#30]
To be fair, their ineptitude and ignorance in coming out with this measly mind numbing response is proof that maybe they are so inept and ignorant of their lobbying...
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Posted: 5/2/2017 9:59:15 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
AFAIK, IL Dems still have a supermajority in the house. This bill WILL pass the IL House if Madigan wants it to. In general, a simple majority vote is required to pass a bill - 30 in Senate and 60 in House.. After May 31, bills that are to take effect before June 1 of the following year must receive a three-fifths majority vote in order to pass - 36 Senate / 71 House |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 10:00:36 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
To be fair, their ineptitude and ignorance in coming out with this measly mind numbing response is proof that maybe they are so inept and ignorant of their lobbying... 
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Posted: 5/2/2017 10:35:32 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They are exempt, but how do they expect to sell anything if the retailers are run out of business? they really should get into the entertainment business Americans give them a pass for the most heinous anti American products... |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 11:05:22 AM EDT
[#34]
We are expected to believe this
 are you kidding me!
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Posted: 5/2/2017 11:21:44 AM EDT
[#35]
Shouldn't be very long now before someone creates a 'Hiter is pissed' or 'Mexicaan Laughing Guy' video
about this. |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 11:27:23 AM EDT
[#36]
Daily bump
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Posted: 5/2/2017 11:40:01 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
50k is chump change to both SA and RRA. Also, I can easily see both companies having yearly donations setup to go out automatically to IFMA without giving it a second thought or really paying any attention to what that organization is up to. Lastly, lets not forget that the source that broke this over the weekend/last week is the same firearms blog that said you don't have to engrave a Form 1'd lower. http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2016/01/foghorn/do-you-need-to-engrave-your-form-1ed-sbr/ Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
https://www.opensecrets.org/527s/527cmtedetail_donors.php?ein=464628447&cycle=2016 $50,000 Rock River Arms Colona IL 05/31/2016 $50,000 Springfield Armory Geneseo IL 05/31/2016 $50,000 Rock River Arms Colona IL 06/05/2015 $50,000 Springfield Armory Geneseo IL 05/25/2015 Since 2014, both companies donated $50k annually into the IFMA and the best they can do is a damage control statement? What a load of crap. $150k from each company into the organization (to date) and they aren't aware of the organization's actions? Not buying it. That kind of money isn't given out without caveats. Also, I can easily see both companies having yearly donations setup to go out automatically to IFMA without giving it a second thought or really paying any attention to what that organization is up to. Lastly, lets not forget that the source that broke this over the weekend/last week is the same firearms blog that said you don't have to engrave a Form 1'd lower. http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2016/01/foghorn/do-you-need-to-engrave-your-form-1ed-sbr/ With this kind of legislation being voted on, I think I can dedicate time out of my schedule to ensure lobbyists knew my views and I had a clear understanding with them on how they plan to represent my interests. Ignorance is not an excuse. Especially after you miraculously end up benefiting from the situation. |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 11:40:59 AM EDT
[#38]
And it just gets better...
https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2017/05/john-boch/springfield-armory-rock-river-arms-made-campaign-contributions-to-anti-gun-rights-politicians/ ..."The gun community continues to react to news of a deal made by Springfield Armory and Rock River Arms to carve out an exemption from a state licensing scheme (SB-1657). Both Springfield and Rock River Arms have issued statements denying any knowledge of the deal negotiated on their behalf by the lobbyist for the Illinois Firearms Manufacturing Association (IFMA). An organization funded by Springfield Armory and Rock River Arms. We can now reveal that Springfield and Rock River have, through IFMA, donated tens of thousands of dollars to Illinois anti-gun politicians over the last several years."... |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 11:47:35 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And it just gets better... https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2017/05/john-boch/springfield-armory-rock-river-arms-made-campaign-contributions-to-anti-gun-rights-politicians/ ..."The gun community continues to react to news of a deal made by Springfield Armory and Rock River Arms to carve out an exemption from a state licensing scheme (SB-1657). Both Springfield and Rock River Arms have issued statements denying any knowledge of the deal negotiated on their behalf by the lobbyist for the Illinois Firearms Manufacturing Association (IFMA). An organization funded by Springfield Armory and Rock River Arms. We can now reveal that Springfield and Rock River have, through IFMA, donated tens of thousands of dollars to Illinois anti-gun politicians over the last several years."... 
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Posted: 5/2/2017 11:49:06 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
https://forms.irs.gov/app/pod/basicSearch/search?execution=e5s3&pacid=50494 https://forms.irs.gov/app/pod/basicSearch/search?_eventId_displayForm=true&formId=464628447-990POL-02&formtype=p990&execution=e5s3 Dennis Reese - Director Tom Reese - Director Jay Keller - Executive Director Chuck Larson - Director (edited to add: if the links stop working the IRS Employer Identification Number (EIN) is: #46-4628447, Illinois Firearms Manufacturers Association, Form 990 has listed key employees) |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 11:50:09 AM EDT
[#41]
Can someone make a copy of the meme where the 3 guys are laughing and throwing their heads back.
saying - Springfield Armory and RRA really cares! |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 12:03:36 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And it just gets better... https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2017/05/john-boch/springfield-armory-rock-river-arms-made-campaign-contributions-to-anti-gun-rights-politicians/ ..."The gun community continues to react to news of a deal made by Springfield Armory and Rock River Arms to carve out an exemption from a state licensing scheme (SB-1657). Both Springfield and Rock River Arms have issued statements denying any knowledge of the deal negotiated on their behalf by the lobbyist for the Illinois Firearms Manufacturing Association (IFMA). An organization funded by Springfield Armory and Rock River Arms. We can now reveal that Springfield and Rock River have, through IFMA, donated tens of thousands of dollars to Illinois anti-gun politicians over the last several years."... These people at these companies have been undermining our rights for YEARS! What we've seen lately in just the tip of the proverbial iceberg 
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Posted: 5/2/2017 12:12:08 PM EDT
[#43]
Never owned any of their products but was thinking of buying a SA auto and another AR. Scratch that idea off my list. I'm spending my money on a Sig now and buy an AR-15 from someone else. I prefer to do business with more reputable companies. Getting a free knife in the back isn't how I do business.
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Posted: 5/2/2017 12:14:25 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You HAVE to hit that link & read the WHOLE article!!! These people at these companies have been undermining our rights for YEARS! What we've seen lately in just the tip of the proverbial iceberg The two biggest anti gun assholes who consistently fuck us over on gun rights at every turn. Holes getting even fucking deeper.
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Posted: 5/2/2017 12:18:59 PM EDT
[#45]
Hey now, how can we expect Springfield and RRA to keep track of the tens of thousands of dollars their pet lobbyist has been giving to the worst state level anti-gun politicians in the nation on their behalf since 2012?
Miscommunications, miscommunications everywhere. |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 12:21:17 PM EDT
[#46]
Maybe they are planning to take this to the state supreme court and getting an exemption now lets them stay in business long enough to do that.
. |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 12:22:38 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And it just gets better... https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2017/05/john-boch/springfield-armory-rock-river-arms-made-campaign-contributions-to-anti-gun-rights-politicians/ ..."The gun community continues to react to news of a deal made by Springfield Armory and Rock River Arms to carve out an exemption from a state licensing scheme (SB-1657). Both Springfield and Rock River Arms have issued statements denying any knowledge of the deal negotiated on their behalf by the lobbyist for the Illinois Firearms Manufacturing Association (IFMA). An organization funded by Springfield Armory and Rock River Arms. We can now reveal that Springfield and Rock River have, through IFMA, donated tens of thousands of dollars to Illinois anti-gun politicians over the last several years."... |
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Posted: 5/2/2017 12:24:25 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And it just gets better... https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2017/05/john-boch/springfield-armory-rock-river-arms-made-campaign-contributions-to-anti-gun-rights-politicians/ ..."The gun community continues to react to news of a deal made by Springfield Armory and Rock River Arms to carve out an exemption from a state licensing scheme (SB-1657). Both Springfield and Rock River Arms have issued statements denying any knowledge of the deal negotiated on their behalf by the lobbyist for the Illinois Firearms Manufacturing Association (IFMA). An organization funded by Springfield Armory and Rock River Arms. We can now reveal that Springfield and Rock River have, through IFMA, donated tens of thousands of dollars to Illinois anti-gun politicians over the last several years."...
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Posted: 5/2/2017 12:26:05 PM EDT
[#49]
This is utterly disgusting. They should be shunned by the entire firearms community, manufacturing industry, and every red blooded American who believes in freedom and the Constitution.
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